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Disappeared and Abducted Children and Young Adults => Madeleine McCann (3) disappeared from her parent's holiday apartment at Ocean Club, Praia da Luz, Portugal on 3 May 2007. No trace of her has ever been found. => Topic started by: Heriberto Janosch on April 23, 2013, 12:05:11 PM
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http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/210032/Madeleine-McCann-Did-the-camera-hold-vital-clue (http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/210032/Madeleine-McCann-Did-the-camera-hold-vital-clue)
Madeleine McCann: Did the camera hold vital clue?
By: James Murray
Published: Sun, November 7, 2010
THE detective who led the initial investigation into Madeleine McCann’s disappearance believes her abductor was caught on camera – but revealed that the film was wiped before detectives saw it.
Yesterday controversial figure Goncalo Amaral backed Kate and Gerry McCann’s demand for a review and reopening of the investigation.
The Sunday Express took Mr Amaral, whose book Maddy: The Truth Of The Lie was banned briefly from bookstores, to Praia da Luz to ask him to reveal where mistakes were made.
He walked the route he believes the person who snatched Madeleine took. It begins at apartment 5A of the Ocean Club, from where the three-year-old disappeared on May 3, 2007.
Mr Amaral believes the person would have crossed a road leading to a poorly lit road alongside waste ground.
Standing at an entrance to the waste ground, Mr Amaral said: “This area was thoroughly searched.”
He walked a few steps and looked up at a CCTV camera and sighed loudly. The camera belongs to the Estrela da Luz resort hotel. “I believe that the person carrying a child in his arms was captured on film from that very camera,” he said.
“I asked my officers to gather all the CCTV footage in Luz but, by the time they got to this hotel, the film from this camera had been wiped over. It was a mistake and I will always regret it. I do feel Madeleine was let down.”
Walking alongside the waste ground, he enters a narrow street called Rua da Escola Primaria. “This is where there was a significant sighting of a man carrying a child in his arms,” he said. “He was seen by a witness, Martin Smith from Ireland.”
The man with the child continued down the hill and would have come to a crossroads. Opposite the junction is an empty villa with a large garden. The wooden door leading to the garden is open.
“It was open at the time and the villa is still empty,” Mr Amaral said. “My officers spent a lot of time here.”
Mr Amaral concludes that any new investigation should fully consider the statement of Mr Smith. “I hope this is seriously examined because it is an important aspect of the case,” he said.
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The bolds in the article are mine.
Did you see the report of the searches inside the villa in the PJ Files?
Did you see the witness statements of the owners or caregivers of the villa in the PJ Files?
In reality the villa is composed of two properties. I was approached by the owners or caregivers when I was looking at the villa, who gave me the sales price of the two properties believing I was interested in buying them. The villa is empty, the owners or caregivers living crossing the road.
I consider this a very interesting point.
Thanks in advance for answer my questions! Heri.
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Nobody answered my two questions. Do you know the answers?
Heri.
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Hi Heri
I haven't seen them. How do I see them? Are they in English?
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Hi Heri
I haven't seen them. How do I see them? Are they in English?
I do not know, that is why I am asking you ...
Amaral: The man with the child continued down the hill [Smiths sighting] and would have come to a crossroads. Opposite the junction is an empty villa with a large garden. The wooden door leading to the garden is open.
“It was open at the time and the villa is still empty,” Mr Amaral said. “My officers spent a lot of time here.”
My questions:
Did you see the report of the searches inside the villa in the PJ Files?
Did you see the witness statements of the owners or caregivers of the villa in the PJ Files?
Heri.
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Well, I must admit there is nothing on the PJ Files about the "Villa" ...
Thanks, Heri.
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Hi Heri
I haven't seen them. How do I see them? Are they in English?
I do not know, that is why I am asking you ...
Amaral: The man with the child continued down the hill [Smiths sighting] and would have come to a crossroads. Opposite the junction is an empty villa with a large garden. The wooden door leading to the garden is open.
“It was open at the time and the villa is still empty,” Mr Amaral said. “My officers spent a lot of time here.”
My questions:
Did you see the report of the searches inside the villa in the PJ Files?
Did you see the witness statements of the owners or caregivers of the villa in the PJ Files?
Heri.
I have no idea what that could concern. I don't recall anything in the files about what that may relate to.
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Hi Heri
I haven't seen them. How do I see them? Are they in English?
I do not know, that is why I am asking you ...
Amaral: The man with the child continued down the hill [Smiths sighting] and would have come to a crossroads. Opposite the junction is an empty villa with a large garden. The wooden door leading to the garden is open.
“It was open at the time and the villa is still empty,” Mr Amaral said. “My officers spent a lot of time here.”
My questions:
Did you see the report of the searches inside the villa in the PJ Files?
Did you see the witness statements of the owners or caregivers of the villa in the PJ Files?
Heri.
I have no idea what that could concern. I don't recall anything in the files about what that may relate to.
This map (well below) could help ...
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http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/210032/Madeleine-McCann-Did-the-camera-hold-vital-clue
Madeleine McCann: Did the camera hold vital clue?
By: James Murray
Published: Sun, November 7, 2010
THE detective who led the initial investigation into Madeleine McCann’s disappearance believes her abductor was caught on camera – but revealed that the film was wiped before detectives saw it.
Yesterday controversial figure Goncalo Amaral backed Kate and Gerry McCann’s demand for a review and reopening of the investigation.
The Sunday Express took Mr Amaral, whose book Maddy: The Truth Of The Lie was banned briefly from bookstores, to Praia da Luz to ask him to reveal where mistakes were made.
He walked the route he believes the person who snatched Madeleine took. It begins at apartment 5A of the Ocean Club, from where the three-year-old disappeared on May 3, 2007.
Mr Amaral believes the person would have crossed a road leading to a poorly lit road alongside waste ground.
Standing at an entrance to the waste ground, Mr Amaral said: “This area was thoroughly searched.”
He walked a few steps and looked up at a CCTV camera and sighed loudly. The camera belongs to the Estrela da Luz resort hotel. “I believe that the person carrying a child in his arms was captured on film from that very camera,” he said.
“I asked my officers to gather all the CCTV footage in Luz but, by the time they got to this hotel, the film from this camera had been wiped over. It was a mistake and I will always regret it. I do feel Madeleine was let down.”
Walking alongside the waste ground, he enters a narrow street called Rua da Escola Primaria. “This is where there was a significant sighting of a man carrying a child in his arms,” he said. “He was seen by a witness, Martin Smith from Ireland.”
The man with the child continued down the hill and would have come to a crossroads. Opposite the junction is an empty villa with a large garden. The wooden door leading to the garden is open.
“It was open at the time and the villa is still empty,” Mr Amaral said. “My officers spent a lot of time here.”
Mr Amaral concludes that any new investigation should fully consider the statement of Mr Smith. “I hope this is seriously examined because it is an important aspect of the case,” he said.
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Is this what you are looking for Heri? Not in the files though. But it is the villa he pointed to. The large gate he referred to though, is only like a stable gate. How would he know it was open on the night, Madeleine was abducted, as he says?
(http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn315/itsonlyme_08/ampic3.jpg)
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Thanks DCI.
No, I am not looking for a place, I know the place of the Villa, see the map.
This pic of Amaral you put is in the Estrella da Luz apart-hotel, 100+ meters to the North of the Smiths sighting place.
My two questions are:
Did you see the report of the searches inside the villa in the PJ Files?
Did you see the witness statements of the owners or caregivers of the villa in the PJ Files?
Heri.
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Thanks DCI.
No, I am not looking for a place, I know the place of the Villa, see the map.
This pic of Amaral you put is in the Estrella da Luz apart-hotel, 100+ meters to the North of the Smiths sighting place.
My two questions are:
Did you see the report of the searches inside the villa in the PJ Files?
Did you see the witness statements of the owners or caregivers of the villa in the PJ Files?
Heri.
What is the name of the villa? That might help.
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Thanks DCI.
No, I am not looking for a place, I know the place of the Villa, see the map.
This pic of Amaral you put is in the Estrella da Luz apart-hotel, 100+ meters to the North of the Smiths sighting place.
My two questions are:
Did you see the report of the searches inside the villa in the PJ Files?
Did you see the witness statements of the owners or caregivers of the villa in the PJ Files?
Heri.
What is the name of the villa? That might help.
I do not know if it has a name. Maybe some pics taken by me could help.
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More pics taken by me ...
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And from Google ...
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What a lot of work you have done, Heri 8@??)(
I recognise most of the places, but not all.
We must remain open minded >@@(*&)
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Heriberto
I think I may have been dismissive of your contribution in the past ... I do apologise
It is proving invaluable ( many thanks )
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Thanks sadie and icabodcrane.
?{)(**
Anybody knows the answer to my questions?
Amaral in the article: The man with the child continued down the hill [Smiths sighting] and would have come to a crossroads. Opposite the junction is an empty villa with a large garden. The wooden door leading to the garden is open.
“It was open at the time and the villa is still empty,” Mr Amaral said. “My officers spent a lot of time here.”
My questions:
Did you see the report of the searches inside the villa in the PJ Files?
Did you see the witness statements of the owners or caregivers of the villa in the PJ Files?
Heri.
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There is no statements in the files from the owners of the villa. I must check something first before i post anything if they were interviewed about it.
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Is the villa "Casa Ao Pescareza", Heri?
If so there is only one person that mentions this, in a statement.
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There is no statements in the files from the owners of the villa. I must check something first before i post anything if they were interviewed about it.
It didn't happen. There was no interview with the Villa Owners. Amaral simply hoped to have caught Gerry McCann on that video, which is what he impugned.
I could see what Amaral was getting at, if no one else could.
Oh Dear, I nearly caught Gerry McCann disposing of his daughter. Sorry that my Officers weren't as good as I am. Phfft.
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Is the villa "Casa Ao Pescareza", Heri?
If so there is only one person that mentions this, in a statement.
Have you the reference to the statement?
Thanks DCI and Eleanor.
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There is no statements in the files from the owners of the villa. I must check something first before i post anything if they were interviewed about it.
Thanks, muratfan.
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Is the villa "Casa Ao Pescareza", Heri?
If so there is only one person that mentions this, in a statement.
There is nothing in the files mentioning that. A google search throws up obscure sites and blogs though.
http://rosaleen-thewhistler.blogspot.co.uk/2009/05/jenifer-murat-more-surprises-sights.html
The files mention an unoccupied house that was searched by one of the searchers and another person but it is no where near where the Smiths sighting happened. likewise, many villas were along the routes the cadaver dog searched, but, again, nowhere near that spot.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARIA_PIRES.htm
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/DOGS_INSPECTION.htm
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Is the villa "Casa Ao Pescareza", Heri?
If so there is only one person that mentions this, in a statement.
Have you the reference to the statement?
Thanks DCI and Eleanor.
Sorry Heri, this is statements in the press, not in her statement as I can find, yet! Still looking.
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THANKS TO ALL!
Heri ?{)(**
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THANKS TO ALL!
Heri ?{)(**
Nothing in the PJ files. Now why is that, when Amaral say's
“My officers spent a lot of time here.”
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THANKS TO ALL!
Heri ?{)(**
Nothing in the PJ files. Now why is that, when Amaral say's
[size=12
Nothing in The Files that says Amaral's Officers followed the British Police Officers, but Amaral says that they did.
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Derelict Villa and Gardens
I have shown both front and rear aspect photos of the derelict villa which fronts onto Rua 25 de Abril in Praia da Luz.
This property has featured quite prominently in the search for Madeleine McCann according to coordinator Gonçalo Amaral. It should also be noted that this villa is adjacent to where the Smith family recall seeing a man carrying a child on the night of Madeleine's disappearance.
The PJ spent a lot of time checking out this property and gardens behind it so what were they looking for and more importantly, what did they find if anything?
(http://i.imgur.com/VupGDas.jpg?1)
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The Sunday Express took Mr Amaral, whose book Maddy: The Truth Of The Lie was banned briefly from book stores, to Praia da Luz to ask him to reveal where mistakes were made.
He walked the route he believes the person who snatched Madeleine took. It begins at apartment 5A of the Ocean Club, from where the three-year-old disappeared on May 3, 2007.
Mr Amaral believes the person would have crossed a road leading to a poorly lit road alongside waste ground.
Standing at an entrance to the waste ground, Mr Amaral said: “This area was thoroughly searched.”
He walked a few steps and looked up at a CCTV camera and sighed loudly. The camera belongs to the Estrela da Luz resort hotel. “I believe that the person carrying a child in his arms was captured on film from that very camera,” he said.
“I asked my officers to gather all the CCTV footage in Luz but, by the time they got to this hotel, the film from this camera had been wiped over. It was a mistake and I will always regret it. I do feel Madeleine was let down.”
Walking alongside the waste ground, he enters a narrow street called Rua da Escola Primaria. “This is where there was a significant sighting of a man carrying a child in his arms,” he said. “He was seen by a witness, Martin Smith from Ireland.”
The man with the child continued down the hill and would have come to a crossroads. Opposite the junction is an empty villa with a large garden. The wooden door leading to the garden is open.
“It was open at the time and the villa is still empty,” Mr Amaral said. “My officers spent a lot of time here.”
Mr Amaral concludes that any new investigation should fully consider the statement of Mr Smith. “I hope this is seriously examined because it is an important aspect of the case,” he said.
Link (http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/210032/Madeleine-McCann-Did-the-camera-hold-vital-clue)
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Just to update everyone, Heriberto raised the question some days ago about the derelict villa and overgrown gardens which Amaral spent so much time investigating. This villa is located right beside where the Smith family last saw the man carrying a child in his arms.
This derelict property is not Casa Ao Pescareza.
I have attached a map showing where the two properties are located. You can see that they are quite some distance apart.
(http://i.imgur.com/kwCLXUU.jpg)
Green dot = Ocean Club resort Red dot = Casa Ao Pescareza Blue dot = Derelict villa
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No John, it seems it is called TRAVESSA DAS ESCADINHAS.
(http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn315/itsonlyme_08/Gonc%20crap/Heri.jpg)
Opposite the property is the road the Smiths passed the person carrying a child.
(http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn315/itsonlyme_08/Gonc%20crap/Villa1.png)
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Correct, the old derelict villa is located at the junction of Rua 25 de Abril and Travessa das Escadinhas as you have shown on the photo. I don't believe anyone has come up with the name of the villa yet?
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Correct, the old derelict villa is located at the junction of Rua 25 de Abril and Travessa das Escadinhas as you have shown on the photo. I don't believe anyone has come up with the name of the villa yet?
Google helps, John ?{)(** I hadn't gone far enough, when Heri asked about it.
Not sure, but I think the steps that the Smiths came up are down that side of the villa. Will have another go tomorrow.
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That's correct, Heriberto posted several photos at the beginning of this thread and the steps can be seen in the one labelled Apart. 215
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=1390.msg38574#msg38574
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Amaral told the Sunday Express...
The wooden door leading to the garden is open.
“It was open at the time and the villa is still empty,” Mr Amaral said. “My officers spent a lot of time here.”
I take it this is the door that Amaral was referring to?
(http://i.imgur.com/Frkktn1.jpg)
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Amaral told the Sunday Express...
The wooden door leading to the garden is open.
“It was open at the time and the villa is still empty,” Mr Amaral said. “My officers spent a lot of time here.”
I take it this is the door that Amaral was referring to?
(http://i.imgur.com/Frkktn1.jpg)
Amaral is of the belief that Madeleine died in an accident and that her parents hid, and then disposed of her little body, ( after staging an abduction )
Does Amaral's mention of the villa, therefore, imply that it may have been used as a 'hiding place' for the missing child's dead body, before eventual disposal ?
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Amaral told the Sunday Express...
The wooden door leading to the garden is open.
“It was open at the time and the villa is still empty,” Mr Amaral said. “My officers spent a lot of time here.”
I take it this is the door that Amaral was referring to?
(http://i.imgur.com/Frkktn1.jpg)
Amaral is of the belief that Madeleine died in an accident and that her parents hid, and then disposed of her little body, ( after staging an abduction )
Does Amaral's mention of the villa, therefore, imply that it may have been used as a 'hiding place' for the missing child's dead body, before eventual disposal ?
Yes he does. But in 2010, he reckons a hotel probably caught the abducter on CCTV. Now which is it?
(http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn315/itsonlyme_08/Gonc%20crap/ampic3.jpg) >@@(*&)
(http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn315/itsonlyme_08/Gonc%20crap/Gates.jpg)
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Amaral told the Sunday Express...
The wooden door leading to the garden is open.
“It was open at the time and the villa is still empty,” Mr Amaral said. “My officers spent a lot of time here.”
I take it this is the door that Amaral was referring to?
(http://i.imgur.com/Frkktn1.jpg)
Amaral is of the belief that Madeleine died in an accident and that her parents hid, and then disposed of her little body, ( after staging an abduction )
Does Amaral's mention of the villa, therefore, imply that it may have been used as a 'hiding place' for the missing child's dead body, before eventual disposal ?
Yes he does. But in 2010, he reckons a hotel probably caught the abducter on CCTV. Now which is it?
(http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn315/itsonlyme_08/Gonc%20crap/ampic3.jpg) >@@(*&)
(http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn315/itsonlyme_08/Gonc%20crap/Gates.jpg)
Why would the missing CCTV footage Amaral mentions contradict the possibility that the missing child's body was hidden in the villa we are looking at in this thread ?
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icabodcrane
Amaral says, the door to the garden was open last week, just as it was on that fateful night.
He's saying this in an interview in 2010, when there was no mention of it in 2007.
Seems odd he knew the abductor's route.
The Estrela Hotel apartments, just happen to be where the Smiths owned theirs.
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According to Amaral's theory, the map below depicts the route taken by the man carrying the child. This would of course preclude the sighting by Jane Tanner.
A long way to carry a child and not be seen by anyone else? 8-)(--)
(http://i.imgur.com/b3RUFwb.jpg)
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Correct, the old derelict villa is located at the junction of Rua 25 de Abril and Travessa das Escadinhas as you have shown on the photo. I don't believe anyone has come up with the name of the villa yet?
Google helps, John ?{)(** I hadn't gone far enough, when Heri asked about it.
Not sure, but I think the steps that the Smiths came up are down that side of the villa. Will have another go tomorrow.
Pic of the steps, the Smiths came up.
(http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn315/itsonlyme_08/Gonc%20crap/Heristeps.jpg)
From the files
(http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn315/itsonlyme_08/Gonc%20crap/smith1.jpg)
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icabodcrane
Amaral says, the door to the garden was open last week, just as it was on that fateful night.
He's saying this in an interview in 2010, when there was no mention of it in 2007.
Seems odd he knew the abductor's route.
The Estrela Hotel apartments, just happen to be where the Smiths owned theirs.
You mean like there was film in the camera, which got viewed, handed to Police and then it got wiped...accidently of course
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icabodcrane
Amaral says, the door to the garden was open last week, just as it was on that fateful night.
He's saying this in an interview in 2010, when there was no mention of it in 2007.
Seems odd he knew the abductor's route.
The Estrela Hotel apartments, just happen to be where the Smiths owned theirs.
You mean like there was film in the camera, which got viewed, handed to Police and then it got wiped...accidently of course
Yes, but why didn't they get it recovered, as long as it wasn't recorded over, they could have done this with a video forensics specialist .
Funny he comes up with that excuse after 3 years, don't you think?
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What type of equipment would have been in use back then?
Equipment / recording devices may have been installed circa 2004, perhaps.
I remember that a few little restaurants, for example, at the time would record CCTV images onto VHS tapes (for those who remember what they were) and, if no incident had been signalled, the tape would be re-used.
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icabodcrane
Amaral says, the door to the garden was open last week, just as it was on that fateful night.
He's saying this in an interview in 2010, when there was no mention of it in 2007.
Seems odd he knew the abductor's route.
The Estrela Hotel apartments, just happen to be where the Smiths owned theirs.
You mean like there was film in the camera, which got viewed, handed to Police and then it got wiped...accidently of course
Pathetic
Do back up your stupid speculation, u are also saying mr amaral and the police might have had abductor on video Nd deleited it are you stupid or what?
The smiths also came forward too long after a tape would have been kept
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Strange how he KNEW what route the abductor took, how would he know that, as nobody had sightings that way.
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Strange how he KNEW what route the abductor took, how would he know that, as nobody had sightings that way.
Amaral has no evidence to back up anything he says. He is simply assuming this is the route someone would have taken if they had set out from the Ocean Club and had passed the Smiths.
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icabodcrane
Amaral says, the door to the garden was open last week, just as it was on that fateful night.
He's saying this in an interview in 2010, when there was no mention of it in 2007.
Seems odd he knew the abductor's route.
The Estrela Hotel apartments, just happen to be where the Smiths owned theirs.
You mean like there was film in the camera, which got viewed, handed to Police and then it got wiped...accidently of course
Pathetic
Do back up your stupid speculation, u are also saying mr amaral and the police might have had abductor on video Nd deleited it are you stupid or what?
The smiths also came forward too long after a tape would have been kept
Insult all you like, Blossom. Makes no odds to me.
Amaral had all the information in May 2007 from the Smiths, so how was The smiths info too long after a tape would have been kept, and why didn't he act on the CCTV sooner?.
He even put a map of 2 routes that could have been taken, in his book. This route is not in the original files, just in his book.
Aerial view of possible routes
This photograph shows the two possible routes to R. da Escola, if the starting point was Apartment 5A.
The red route is the route already indicated on the map above. The yellow route is the route taken by going straight down R. Primeiro da Maio and then turning right into R. da Escola.
(http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn315/itsonlyme_08/Gonc%20crap/smithsighting7.jpg)
R. da Escola, leads directly to The Estrela Hotel apartments, in a straight line.
There's also no mention of Mary Smith, making a statement, nor is her initial on the pic's in the files, on the route map.
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Quote
Amaral had all the information in May 2007 from the Smiths, so how was The smiths info too long after a tape would have been kept, and why didn't he act on the CCTV sooner?.
Unquote
The Smiths contacted the Irish police in the middle of May to say they had spotted a man but it was not Murat,as they had read that he had been made arguido after Jane Tanners sighting, as they knew him and relatex it all back to what they saw.The Smiths were not interviewed by the Pj until near the end of May. In a month, I think a tape might be recorded over many times, that is all. So how was Mr amaral supposed to get hold of cctv from that night early on?
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Quote
Amaral had all the information in May 2007 from the Smiths, so how was The smiths info too long after a tape would have been kept, and why didn't he act on the CCTV sooner?.
Unquote
The Smiths contacted the Irish police in the middle of May to say they had spotted a man but it was not Murat,as they had read that he had been made arguido after Jane Tanners sighting, as they knew him and relatex it all back to what they saw.The Smiths were not interviewed by the Pj until near the end of May. In a month, I think a tape might be recorded over many times, that is all. So how was Mr amaral supposed to get hold of cctv from that night early on?
good work - how much of what you said is true?