Alleged Miscarriages of Justice => Jeremy Bamber and the callous murder of his father, mother, sister and twin nephews. Case effectively CLOSED by CCRC on basis of NO APPEAL REFERRAL. => Topic started by: Tim Invictus on March 02, 2012, 03:13:57 PM
Title: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 02, 2012, 03:13:57 PM
ITV's tonight programme will feature a 20min segment of the case on 15th March. Let's hope it will be fair and balanced.
Watch the Bamber propaganda on YouTube...
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV - 15th March
Post by: John on March 02, 2012, 03:16:06 PM
ITV's tonight programme will feature a 20min segment of the case on 15th March. Let's hope it will be fair and balanced.
Thanks for that Tim. Haven't had much time for TV these last few days, admin won't give me a break!
Maybe you can remind us all closer to the time in case we forget?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV - 15th March
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 02, 2012, 03:38:08 PM
Looks interesting: Vidvic says the programme:
Centres on the new Arizona tests. I'm surprised campaign team haven't mentioned it. I would expect ccrc decision within days afterwards. Might be they've had a tip off from ccrc or they're just guessing on the timing.
Family members, ex police officers, farm staff, etc etc. have been involved so hopefully it won't be too biased.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV - 15th March
Post by: Weety on March 03, 2012, 03:03:02 PM
It has apparently been put off until the 29th now, something about teeth is apparently taking priority.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV - 15th March
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 03, 2012, 05:57:36 PM
That's right Weety and there is another 'secret' documentary that only Jackie knows about although they maybe the same one. Then there's some chap called Gunga doing a new documentary. Let's hope they are fair and balanced.
Personally I think any new ones may have missed the boat as the CCRC will sink Bamber's boat for good if they confirm their rejection of his appeal application in the next few weeks.
Of course Tesko says he is holding back yet more 'evidence' he will use if Bamber does get finally binned!!! ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV - 15th March
Post by: Weety on March 03, 2012, 06:26:07 PM
I imagine the two documentaries are one and the same.
MT still has the rest of the alphabet to go through I suppose.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV - 15th March
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 16, 2012, 07:03:33 PM
Judas Preece is creaming herself over an half hour documentary that will be shown on 29th March about Bamber ..... should be interesting:
Rochy Mark has had to be very careful because of legal matters but I am sure everything is ok on that score because of Simon
Rochy the points you put forward are so good and so strong why don't you send him a message I bet he would like to talk to you
He doesn't want to miss anything Logged
John can you email me the posts where Jackie admits stalking Andrea by email and says where she got Andi's info from .... I think Mark at ITV and Simon McKay should see what an odious crank they are dealing with don't you? 8)--))
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV - 15th March
Post by: John on March 16, 2012, 07:35:40 PM
Judas Preece is creaming herself over an half hour documentary that will be shown on 29th March about Bamber ..... should be interesting:
Rochy Mark has had to be very careful because of legal matters but I am sure everything is ok on that score because of Simon
Rochy the points you put forward are so good and so strong why don't you send him a message I bet he would like to talk to you
He doesn't want to miss anything Logged
John can you email me the posts where Jackie admits stalking Andrea by email and says where she got Andi's info from .... I think Mark at ITV and Simon McKay should see what an odious crank they are dealing with don't you? 8)--))
If anyone has this Mark (if he exists) details at ITV please pass them on. I feel he needs to get a few pointers.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV - 15th March
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 16, 2012, 09:13:16 PM
It won't be difficult to get his details from ITV .... I will get in touch with them on Monday @)(++(*
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV - 15th March
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 20, 2012, 08:10:58 PM
Simon McKay announces Bamber programme
ITV1, 29 March 2012 19:30 hours.
Bamber - The New Evidence: Tonight Episode 1 Jeremy Bamber, one of Britain's most notorious killers, was convicted in 1986 of the mass murder of his entire family. He was sentenced to life behind bars but has always protested his innocence. In this programme, former detective Mark Williams-Thomas is given exclusive access to new evidence that could lead to the case being referred back to the Court of Appeal. SUB Thursday 29th March on ITV1 from 7:30pm to 8:00pm Also: at least one repeat.
Should be interesting, I hope it's balanced. Has anyone heard of Mark Williams-Thomas?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV - 15th March
Post by: puglove on March 20, 2012, 08:30:13 PM
Buster2 is Jackie Preece
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV - 15th March
Post by: puglove on March 20, 2012, 08:46:27 PM
It will be fascinating, Tim, but another ordeal for the family. Not sure how much can be crammed into half an hour (minus ad break). I'd be more concerned if it was an hour long.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV - 15th March
Post by: John on March 20, 2012, 08:54:18 PM
It will be fascinating, Tim, but another ordeal for the family. Not sure how much can be crammed into half an hour (minus ad break). I'd be more concerned if it was an hour long.
It will be amusing to see what fantasy Simon McKay has dreamt up now after 26 years. I will say one thing for him, he does like the lost causes.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV - 15th March
Post by: puglove on March 20, 2012, 09:09:46 PM
Well, it will get a few more people interested for a while. Hopefully they will read up and realise that Sheila showed no physical signs, and they can be confident that JB is in the right place. And hopefully they'll find Mike's forum, and suss out the calibre of his supporters!! Job done!!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV - 15th March
Post by: Milly on March 20, 2012, 09:28:48 PM
Well, it will get a few more people interested for a while. Hopefully they will read up and realise that Sheila showed no physical signs, and they can be confident that JB is in the right place. And hopefully they'll find Mike's forum, and suss out the calibre of his supporters!! Job done!!
Hi all. Given what we already know about the state of Sheila and her clothing which completely clears her of any involvement and also taking into account that Jeremy implicated her in the deed, it will be somewhat interesting to see what spin Mckay is trying to put on this case. Do you think that teskos recent attempts to change the words have anything to do with it?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV - 15th March
Post by: puglove on March 20, 2012, 09:35:05 PM
Sure of it, Milly. He's backtracking like crazy. It really doesn't help JB's cause, to do what he's doing.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV - 15th March
Post by: John on March 20, 2012, 09:40:42 PM
Well, it will get a few more people interested for a while. Hopefully they will read up and realise that Sheila showed no physical signs, and they can be confident that JB is in the right place. And hopefully they'll find Mike's forum, and suss out the calibre of his supporters!! Job done!!
Hi all. Given what we already know about the state of Sheila and her clothing which completely clears her of any involvement and also taking into account that Jeremy implicated her in the deed, it will be somewhat interesting to see what spin Mckay is trying to put on this case. Do you think that teskos recent attempts to change the words have anything to do with it?
Well spotted. There is definitely something brewing and it isn't my evening cuppa. If a TV documentary contained any realistic proof whatsoever of Bamber's innocence it would be seized by the CCRC. On the other hand, providing evidence to ITV ahead of the CCRC decision is unethical but then again why am I not surprised. 8(0(*
This new evidence amounts to yet another stunt, a cry for attention and bloody fools ITV fell for it. What a bunch of sops!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Admin on March 20, 2012, 10:33:10 PM
Simon McKay has just tweeted us to confirm that the new evidence being looked at in the Tonight Programme was supplied to the CCRC in January. We asked the question was it ethical to air such a programme in advance of the CCRC decision.
We await a reply!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 21, 2012, 12:00:04 AM
TV Presenter-Criminologist & Child Protection Expert- Prog's-On the Run (Exposure)Bullies Online,Lost Detective,To Catch a Paedophile(series)&Waking the Dead
http://www.williams-thomas.co.uk
https://twitter.com/#!/mwilliamsthomas
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Angelo222 on March 21, 2012, 08:43:00 AM
8-)(--) I might be wrong in saying this but I find it very hard to believe that any Eatons or Boutflours or even Pargeters would take part in any programme which in any way attempts to vindicate Jeremy Bamber when he has at every opportunity called for police to arrest Ann and Peter for conspiracy to pervert the course of justice. Bambers position is crystal clear in that he claims he was framed by them. In addition there is an outstanding allegation of theft made by former farm secretary Barbara Wilson against Peter Eaton which has still to be resolved. Their participation in any video TV documentary would be highly improbable.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Angelo222 on March 21, 2012, 08:45:00 AM
Admin, can you ask the presenter on Twitter if any of the family took part please?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 21, 2012, 11:13:43 AM
I wouldn't be too worried about this new documentary ..... there is no way that ITV can do a one sided propaganda piece on behalf of a convicted child murderer. If it's not balanced they will get a ton of complaints to the broadcasting authorites.
Let's see what McKay has concocted and how he explains the facts that mean Sheila couldn't have done it in my opinion.
The CCRC aren't stupid and I think the programme will be a damp squib. But if it has some substance it will be interesting. If the evidence is rubbish but it does get Bamber to the CoA then I will campaign against Bamber.
The funniest thought is what if the moon is actually made of cheese and Bamber is innocent after all? Impossible in my opinion but stranger things have happened! Personally I would think that quite funny .... Bamber is such an arrogant s..mbag it couldn't have happened to a more deserving person! I know how bad that sounds but at least I am honest! @)(++(*
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Admin on March 21, 2012, 04:57:24 PM
We asked Mark Williams-Thomas today whether any of Jeremy Bambers relatives took part in the documentary?
He replied: Morning - I can't at this stage say who is in the programme. It is however very balanced in regards to who has been spoken with.
Why all the secrecy? He says spoken with but that does not necessarily imply any of them have chosen to appear on camera. I think we will pursue this a bit further with our family contacts.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Claudia on March 21, 2012, 05:20:36 PM
We asked Mark Williams-Thomas today whether any of Jeremy Bambers relatives took part in the documentary?
He replied: Morning - I can't at this stage say who is in the programme. It is however very balanced in regards to who has been spoken with.
Why all the secrecy? He says spoken with but that does not necessarily imply any of them have chosen to appear on camera. I think we will pursue this a bit further with our family contacts.
David is right in what he posted earlier today. The family would be foolish to allow any media exposure at this time so close to the CCRC decision unless that decision has already been made. The way I see it is that they would only speak out if the case was not going to be referred to the appeal court. Time will tell though.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Admin on March 21, 2012, 05:43:57 PM
We asked Mark Williams-Thomas today whether any of Jeremy Bambers relatives took part in the documentary?
He replied: Morning - I can't at this stage say who is in the programme. It is however very balanced in regards to who has been spoken with.
Why all the secrecy? He says spoken with but that does not necessarily imply any of them have chosen to appear on camera. I think we will pursue this a bit further with our family contacts.
David is right in what he posted earlier today. The family would be foolish to allow any media exposure at this time so close to the CCRC decision unless that decision has already been made. The way I see it is that they would only speak out if the case was not going to be referred to the appeal court. Time will tell though.
Maybe the CCRC have already decided, they would have to let the family know in advance of any public announcement. Remember that the CCRC are not obliged to publish any refusals to refer a case to the Court of Appeal.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 21, 2012, 06:15:46 PM
I think someone in the family should tell a prime time terrestrial channe documentaryl their opinion that there is no doubt Bamber is guilty. I much prefer that to a statement that the family were asked to comment but declined to do so.
Also I don't see why Vidvic would lie when he said they filmed at WHF and interviewed a few people. He knew it was ITV before Tesko Towers did!
I am glad to see the presenter say the piece is balanced and I don't think anyone should be unduly worried that this is Bamber propaganda. The BBC Simon McKay interview had Bob Woffinden for balance and he was far more impressive on radio than McKay imo.
I could do a Gladys Belton here and state a pretentious oneliner like 'The Truth Need Not Fear Publicity. @)(++(*
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Harvey on March 21, 2012, 09:52:20 PM
I agree that it would be wholly inappropriate for any of the family to comment ahead of the Commissions ruling on any referral to the courts. If it so happened that Jeremy was magically cleared there would be an avalanche of civil cases to be sorted out and neither the Eatons or the Boutflours or anyone else is going to do anything which will effect that possible eventuality. I noted a comment on the twitter site today when someone tweeted that if Bamber were ever realeased that Mugford and the rest of them would be in dire danger....a bloodbath they said.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 22, 2012, 03:50:14 AM
We asked Mark Williams-Thomas today whether any of Jeremy Bambers relatives took part in the documentary?
He replied: Morning - I can't at this stage say who is in the programme. It is however very balanced in regards to who has been spoken with.
Why all the secrecy? He says spoken with but that does not necessarily imply any of them have chosen to appear on camera. I think we will pursue this a bit further with our family contacts.
No need admin, I spoke to them yesterday. It is quite obvious that they wouldn't want to take part in such a programme. McKay was the one behind the promotion of this short film, it offers nothing to the family. Its sole purpose is to make Bamber look good in advance of any possible appeal. This is what Bamber feeds on, take it away and he is a nothing, a non entity. We all know the facts in this case and no fantasy video will ever change them.
Jeremy Bamber is guilty as charged!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Angelo222 on March 22, 2012, 04:09:26 PM
Thank you for asking Mr Williams Thomas about who took part in the film and his response is noted. What is with all the secrecy is this film, I would have thought if they had managed to get any significant family member to speak on camera that it would have been quite a scoop for them but from my reading of it that just isn't the case. I have a feeling they got permission to film some background shots at the farm but that is all. The programme will only be about 22 minutes in length so that itself says much about what sort of detail it could ever go into in such a short period of time. My own view is that there will be yet another big yawn at the end of it with the Bamber lot all congratulating each other on yet another piece of fantasy well publicised. In the final analysis it will make no difference to Bambers situation.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Admin on March 22, 2012, 04:36:14 PM
Thank you for asking Mr Williams Thomas about who took part in the film and his response is noted. What is with all the secrecy is this film, I would have thought if they had managed to get any significant family member to speak on camera that it would have been quite a scoop for them but from my reading of it that just isn't the case. I have a feeling they got permission to film some background shots at the farm but that is all. The programme will only be about 22 minutes in length so that itself says much about what sort of detail it could ever go into in such a short period of time. My own view is that there will be yet another big yawn at the end of it with the Bamber lot all congratulating each other on yet another piece of fantasy well publicised. In the final analysis it will make no difference to Bambers situation.
We can report that Simon McKay never responded to our questions about the evidence in the Bamber case or why he considers him to be innocent. This is not at all surprising given the way lawyers operate.
On the basis of his reluctance to answer some very straight forward questions we can only assume that Simon McKay is not convinced of Bamber's innocence and is most certainly not prepared to put his head on the block because of him.
Another Bamber forum illusion dispelled in one full swoop! ?>)()<
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Weety on March 22, 2012, 05:19:16 PM
Neil has said somewhere that David Boutflour has given an interview for the programme.
Admin, come on, you didn't really expect McKay to answer those sort of questions did you? He's hardly going to embark on a 'trial by Twitter' with the CCRC decision pending.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Admin on March 22, 2012, 06:39:09 PM
Neil has said somewhere that David Boutflour has given an interview for the programme.
Admin, come on, you didn't really expect McKay to answer those sort of questions did you? He's hardly going to embark on a 'trial by Twitter' with the CCRC decision pending.
We never saw that post by Rochford but then again we aren't inclined to read what he posts in any event. David seems to be the only member of the family who has spoken to the media so if he did give a short comment it wouldn't come as any surprise.
You're right Weety, we didn't expect McKay to answer them because at the end of the day he is a lawyer with all that goes with that label and to expect a lawyer to give a straight answer would be to ask the impossible.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 22, 2012, 11:17:34 PM
Neil has said somewhere that David Boutflour has given an interview for the programme.
Admin, come on, you didn't really expect McKay to answer those sort of questions did you? He's hardly going to embark on a 'trial by Twitter' with the CCRC decision pending.
I'm sorry if I'm being dim, but is this documentary going to be 22 minutes of balanced material? And the accomplice theory? It's going to have to cover an awful lot of ground in a relatively short space of time. Personally, I think that JB's behaviour after the murders would influence many, as would underlining the condition of Sheila's body and an expert opinion of the damage done by the first shot. Not long to wait, anyway.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 22, 2012, 11:28:54 PM
I hear that the "coded note from Sheila" has been discussed on Mike's forum today. Yes, I have seen it, from what I remember it looked like a writing exercise for the boys. Is there any chance it could be posted up on here?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: abs on March 23, 2012, 12:02:25 AM
Here, shona.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 23, 2012, 12:05:47 AM
Neil has said somewhere that David Boutflour has given an interview for the programme.
Admin, come on, you didn't really expect McKay to answer those sort of questions did you? He's hardly going to embark on a 'trial by Twitter' with the CCRC decision pending.
I'm sorry if I'm being dim, but is this documentary going to be 22 minutes of balanced material? And the accomplice theory? It's going to have to cover an awful lot of ground in a relatively short space of time. Personally, I think that JB's behaviour after the murders would influence many, as would underlining the condition of Sheila's body and an expert opinion of the damage done by the first shot. Not long to wait, anyway.
There can't be much in it Shona but I believe it is mostly to do with the Arizona tests. They best be careful because if live fire tests were carried out they will have the Animal Rights people all over them.
Shooting dead pig flesh isn't exactly duplication of the events so we will see.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 23, 2012, 12:08:43 AM
I'm guessing that if it's early evening, on ITV, it would have to balanced. Do they have to use live pigs, to get the best results? I bloody hope not.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Claudia on March 23, 2012, 12:34:48 AM
I like the short videos, are you going to introduce them as a permanent feature from now on?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 23, 2012, 01:24:48 AM
There is so much to relate - JM's diaries, the newspaper deal that JB was trying to sort out after he was arrested, just before he was convicted, the endless evidence of his dodgy behaviour before and after the funerals, the selling of everything from the locket, the valuables, to Sheila's early private photos.....it just goes on and on.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: abs on March 23, 2012, 01:33:12 AM
Shona, no, I can´t see the documentary here - i hope it will be online (it will.)
Claudia, what short videos?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 23, 2012, 01:42:30 AM
Shona, no, I can´t see the documentary here - i hope it will be online (it will.)
Claudia, what short videos?
Your short videos!! Me and smiffy getting it on!! Let me know what you think about the JB doc once you've seen it. I hope it's fair and balanced.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: abs on March 23, 2012, 01:56:08 AM
They will have intepol chase me down if I make another video about Smiffs, and then they will all suffer heart attacks over the horrendous abuse I subjected them to with the cartoon! 8)><( Better leave that alone. 8(0(* I will make a new one in time - NOT about Smiffy though! Besides, he doesnt deserve the attention, does he? He should have been thankful for me spending some time on starring him in TWO movies! ?>)()<
_________________ I am counting on you guys to post links to the docu! And of course I´ll let you know what I think.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 23, 2012, 02:00:50 AM
OK, Abs. Catch you soon. XXX
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 23, 2012, 08:26:16 AM
Shona, no, I can´t see the documentary here - i hope it will be online (it will.)
Claudia, what short videos?
Abs pop down to Luxembourg in your VW Beetle .... I will have the Bamber video recorded and you can watch it anytime! @)(++(* Actually perhaps one of our kind members could put the video on youtube so Abs can see it and we all can comment on it there.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 23, 2012, 08:34:32 AM
Shona, no, I can´t see the documentary here - i hope it will be online (it will.)
Claudia, what short videos?
Abs pop down to Luxembourg in your VW Beetle .... I will have the Bamber video recorded and you can watch it anytime! @)(++(* Actually perhaps one of our kind members could put the video on youtube so Abs can see it and we all can comment on it there.
Will it be a documentary though or a work of some fiction. We could be in danger of giving too much credibility to a film which is simply looking at theories in the Bamber case and ignoring all the other evidence.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 23, 2012, 08:47:50 AM
Shona, no, I can´t see the documentary here - i hope it will be online (it will.)
Claudia, what short videos?
I believe Claudia is referring to the short videos which have been added in the video library section.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: stevo on March 26, 2012, 04:15:34 PM
How the hell has this been given a prime time slot on ITV1? I know for a fact Jeremy has spoken about a 'deal being done' and has disbanded his campaign team. Does anybody else think a deal really has been done? ITV did put this programme back 2 weeks and I was wondering if this has been timed to coincide with the CCRC decision and they already know the result? Maybe Jeremy is just being overconfident as he always thinks he will be out soon. If it got referred, I think it would be thrown out at the Court Of Appeal. Trouble is, Simon McKay would have got what he wanted from this case by then unfortunately. On a different matter, I'd just like to say that Jackie Preece is a nasty piece of work. I got banned from the other forum after one post for saying that! I know she reads what is written here so I'd just like to say to her that you will never get to meet Jeremy so please STOP emailing him as he has nothing to do with you anymore and says you are nothing more than an obsessed stalker who needs to get a life. Even Mckay thinks you're a trollop! Could someone give me her email address so I can write to her in person? Thanks!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 26, 2012, 04:18:26 PM
Welcome to the forum Stevo. When you get a chance would you like to introduce yourself to us all here (http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?board=3.0) and tell us why you are interested in the cases. Thanks.
I have a meeting soon so maybe Tim will respond.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 27, 2012, 03:43:12 PM
Been a busy morning in north London today, good god I couldn't cope with this traffic every day, thank goodness I live in such beautiful surrounds. I had a lovely visit with some of my old muckers from the past who hold some pretty senior posts. They are quite confident that the Bamber case will not be reopened, rather he will fade into obscurity eventually and never be heard of or taken seriously ever again. I must admit i did agree with them.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Mr Justice K on March 27, 2012, 03:48:23 PM
Been a busy morning in north London today, good god I couldn't cope with this traffic every day, thank goodness I live in such beautiful surrounds. I had a lovely visit with some of my old muckers from the past who hold some pretty senior posts. They are quite confident that the Bamber case will not be reopened, rather he will fade into obscurity eventually and never be heard of or taken seriously ever again. I must admit i did agree with them.
I take it you will be visiting a few places on your business trip relevant to the Bamber case?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Matthew Wyse on March 29, 2012, 09:36:06 AM
8(>(( I am so looking forward to this latest "new evidence" in the Bamber case according to his deluded supporters. Will it be yet another false dawn, yet another attempt to pull the wool over the public's eyes? I get the distinct feeling that the public have had quite enough of Bamber and are bored with this case.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 29, 2012, 09:43:04 AM
8(>(( I am so looking forward to this latest "new evidence" in the Bamber case according to his deluded supporters. Will it be yet another false dawn, yet another attempt to pull the wool over the public's eyes? I get the distinct feeling that the public have had quite enough of Bamber and are bored with this case.
Isn't it gong to be hilarious if and when the CCRC boot Bamber out .... watch Tesko implode and Miss P. get even more demented! 8)-)))
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: tescoman on March 29, 2012, 03:41:05 PM
The ccrc have no option but to boot his case out. On the subject of tonights tv prog though I will sacrifice an episode of corrie just to watch the latest garbage. I have a feeling benny hill will win though on the comedy front. @)(++(*
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 29, 2012, 03:56:56 PM
So now we have some meat on the bones of the Bamber documentary tonight .... thank's Eleanor. I think this should be discussed seriously rather than used as a tool for baiting the Bamberettes!
The first mistake noted is that June and Nevill did not own White House Farm as stated; not a crucial mistake though:
ITV 1 'Tonight' - Thursday 29th March 19.30
Bamber: Then New Evidence By Mark Williams-Thomas
The scene that greeted the police officers on their entry into the farmhouse was one of blood-soaked carnage. In the kitchen on the ground floor, they found the body of Neville Bamber, dressed in his pyjamas and slumped over a chair. He had been shot eight times, with six of the bullets fired at close range into his head. But it seemed clear that he had put up a fierce struggle against his lethal assailant, for not only was his face severely bruised but also around his corpse lay the evidence of a fight, including broken crockery, a smashed ceiling light and upturned furniture.
The trail of murderous violence extended upstairs. In one bedroom with tragic poignancy, were the bodies of six-year-old twins Daniel and Nicholas Caffell . Eight bullets, all delivered from very close range, had accounted for them as they slept. In the master bedroom lay the heavily blood-stained body of June Bamber who had been shot seven times, once through her forehead right between her eyes. FINALLY there was the body of Sheila Caffell and the mother of the murdered twins, who had two bullet wounds in her neck, a rifle across her chest and a bible at her side.
Altogether 25 rounds had been fired during this massacre, which took place during the early hours of 7th August 1985 at White House farm in rural Essex. It was a crime that shook the nation in its savagery and its extraordinary circumstances. Initially the police and the media were certain that the bloodbath had been perpetrated by Sheila Caffell during some kind of frenzied breakdown. She was a vulnerable ex-model with a long history of mental illness. All the victims were members of her immediate family, her adoptive parents, Neville and June, the owners of White house Farm and her twin sons, Daniel and Nicholas. The pattern of killing suggested that Sheila had killed the other four and then shot herself in a deranged murder-suicide.
But then the saga took a bizarre twist. A few weeks after the crime, the spotlight of suspicion began to fall on Sheila’s brother Jeremy, who had also been adopted by the Bambers and lived in a rented cottage near the farm. Gradually, the police built up a case against him. Having been charged with the murders, Bamber was put on trial in October 1986 and after a very high profile court case lasting 19 days, was found guilty. He has been in prison ever since, one of the few lifers in Britain who has been told that he will never be released because of the gravity of his crimes.
After all these years behind bars, Bamber continues to maintain his innocence. And in the subsequent 26 years since the trial, doubts have grown about his guilt. This case has attracted considerable attention and continues with opinions split between those who believe Jeremy Bamber is innocent and those that firmly believe he is guilty. It is accepted by the original police team that vital evidence was lost, and enquires and forensic examinations were not carried out properly. Vital material was destroyed or ignored. The crime scene was never secured properly. These are all failings that would not be accepted in any murder enquiry today. But we must remember this is 1985 and policing has changed massively since then.
I write as a criminologist and former detective myself with much experience of working on high profile cases and subsequently studying many more. The White House Farm murders have only recently attracted my attention but having looked in depth at the evidence, it is clear that Bamber’s new legal team have identified some very significant points which need to be carefully considered.
Tonight, in an ITV documentary special, I have been given exclusive access to a lot of previously unseen documents and have set out to challenge the new evidence by Bambers legal team and see if it stands up under separate scrutiny.
The essence of the prosecution case is that Bamber was a cunning manipulator who loathed his adoptive parents and staged the massacre so that he could inherit the family farm and fortune. According to this narrative, Bamber climbed into the White House Farm on the night of 7th August, took one of his father’s rifles, complete with a silencer on it, and embarked on the murders. But in this account, two unforeseen problems almost ruined the deadly scheme. First of all, his father Neville put up powerful resistance despite having sustained a number of bullet wounds. That, said the prosecutors, was why he was battered so badly. Second, Bamber discovered that, with the silencer on the rifle, it would have been physically impossible for Sheila to have shot herself because her arms were simply not long enough to stretch to the trigger while holding the muzzle under her chin. So, according to the prosecutors, Bamber removed the silencer after killing her and left the now shorter rifle on her chest. Having placed the silencer in the gun cupboard downstairs, the illusion of suicide was complete.
So this object was absolutely crucial to the prosecution case. The silencer was the key single piece of evidence in this case . In fact, the judge in the original trial said that “on its own, it could lead the jury to believe that the defendant is guilty.” Given its strength however to the case it is important to note that the silencer was not found by the police at all during their initial search of White House Farm.
Instead, it was uncovered by members of the wider Bamber family days after the police had finished their work at the crime scene. It was the discovery of the silencer that suddenly turned Jeremy Bamber into the suspect.
The evidence that a silencer was definitely used when Sheila was killed has always has been the prosecutions case, yet this is now where Bamber's lawyers have obtained evidence to challenge this view. In preparing to mount a renewed appeal to the Criminal Cases Review Commission, his legal team ordered one of the world’s leading ballistics experts, based in the USA, to conduct tests with a rifle and ammunition exactly the same as that used at White House Farm. This expert’s findings, based on detailed photographs taken of Sheila's two gunshot wounds is that in his opinion, one of the wounds was consistent with the rifle without a silencer attached. Just as importantly, in the police photos of Neville’s body, there are a number of small, circular burn marks on his back. Again Bambers's legal team have now obtained expert evidence which concludes that the three marks are consistent with the artificially heated muzzle of a rifle without a silencer.
For the TV documentary tonight, we replicated precisely the firearms tests from the USA and achieved exactly the same results. One crucial point which has troubled me is how no residue, lead or gun oil was ever found on Sheila, despite having fired 25 rounds, which would have entailed reloading the .22 rifle at least twice. Furthermore her manicured nails were undamaged. Although no proper forensic tests were carried out; to the naked eye no residue was visible on her hands. So I tested this and loaded the bullets into the magazine . I found that I could easily load the first 9 bullets into the magazine and use the pads of my finger, leaving no residue on my fingers. And if i did get any residue on my fingers it was easily removed simply by wiping my hands on clothing.
The programme also looks at other evidence crucial to Bamber’s conviction. One is the fact that his former girlfriend, Julie Mugford, was paid £25,000 for her story by the News of the World. She played a crucial role for the prosecution. After initially supporting Bamber in the wake of the killings, she turned against him and told the police that he had confessed he was planning to kill his parents. “Tonight or never”, she claimed he said on the day of the murders. But the jury never learnt of her dealings with the media. In our programme tonight, we have tape of Bamber saying, more with regret than anger, “I think there is no question that Sheila was responsible”
Even after 27 years this case still attracts massive public opinion and attention . Whatever your view - ultimately the decision sits with the Commission as to whether this case will be referred back to the court of Appeal for the second time. A decision which I am told is imminent.
Twitter @mwilliamsthomas
My immediate reaction is this seems to be reasonably balanced.
Questions: Are they saying the silencer wasn't used for any of the 25 shots or for some of the 25 shots?
It appears of the two shots to Sheila, one could have been made without the silencer fitted and the other could not be determined? How on earth does this exonerate Bamber ... he could have realised Sheila wasn't dieing after he put the silencer away and made the second shot without the silencer. So what?
There's possible burn marks to Nevill made by the muzzle end of the gun minus the silencer. Again so what? Nevill could have been killed first downstairs before Bamber had a chance to fit the silencer to the gun. How does this suggest bamber's innocence?
It is vary vague as to whether they are saying the silencer was never used or was used only for some shots. If it was never used then the billion dollar question is how on earth did proven blood from the victims get inside the silencer?
If they are saying the silencer was only used for some shots and a logical mind between shots decided to get the silencer and use it then surely this is huge circumstantial evidence that a logical mind was at work and not "Sheila going berserk with a gun"? Why on earth would Sheila, in a psychotic state as suggested, care at all whether a silencer should or sould not be used?
I also don't buy gun shot residue only on Sheila's fingertips being easily wiped off on clothing and leaving no trace. And surely she should have had gun shot residue on her fingers from the final two suicide shots to herself ... she couldn't have wiped off that gun shot residue could she?
Wasn't Sheila's clothing also testing for GSR and found to be clean? Where's the wiped residue on her clothing that's being suggested?
What about Sheila's clean feet? No blood or debris from the fight with Nevill?
What about Sheila's clean manicured, unchipped fingernails?
What about Sheila having no damage or injuries from the violent life or death struggle with Nevill?
The Julie Mugford NOTW deal? Julie herself said she was being hounded by the press on a daily basis and her solicitor suggested the best thing to do is make one deal with one newspaper and she should leave it in his hands? True or not that's what Sheila said happened and she was unaware of the details of the deal at the time of the trial.
Julie did not know there would be any newspaper money went she went to the police to expose Bamber? They are saying she lied because of money and yet when she approached the police with the truth she knew nothing of any possible money!
And finally these new experts are working from crime scene photographs. My understanding is that evidence from forensic experts at the scene and at the coroner's office is always relied upon over contradicting photographs that may or may not give an accurate picture (!) of the facts.
I tried to approach this with an open mind and yet find myself pulling it apart (imho) ..... so far I see nothing that makes my opinion waiver.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 29, 2012, 04:52:31 PM
I completely agree Tim, I find the piece to be rather amateurish for such an important case. Some points which need addressing...
Mr Williams-Thomas failed to point out that the police initially thought that Sheila had done it because Jeremy Bamber had written the script that way from the very first moment he contacted the police. When the police arrived he went to great pains to emphasise that his mad sister was responsible. The plan was in full swing!
Jeremy didn't live in a rented cottage. He lived in a cottage owned by his father which he had free use of.
Doubts have not grown about his guilt. He is a guilty today as he was 26 years ago and any properly charged jury would come to the same conclusion.
Bamber did not take one of his fathers rifles complete with silencer on it. The rifle did not have a silencer on it, Bamber had to retrieve it from the cupboard and fit it.
It was not the discovery of the silencer which turned Jeremy Bamber into a suspect. He was a suspect from the moment DS Stan Jones overheard him laughing with Julie Mugford just hours after the murders took place.
So what if Sheila was shot once with a rifle that did not have a silencer attached, Bamber obviously had removed the silencer to replace it in the gun cupboard after making a mess of trying to clean it. He obviously put another round in the unsilenced rifle and shot Sheila a second time when he realised she was not dead and could live until police arrived.
I think Mr Williams-Thomas needs to do some more homework!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: tescoman on March 29, 2012, 05:52:33 PM
I completely agree Tim, I find the piece to be rather amateurish for such an important case. Some points which need addressing...
Mr Williams-Thomas failed to point out that the police initially thought that Sheila had done it because Jeremy Bamber had written the script that way from the very first moment he contacted the police. When the police arrived he went to great pains to emphasise that his mad sister was responsible. The plan was in full swing!
Jeremy didn't live in a rented cottage. He lived in a cottage owned by his father which he had free use of.
Doubts have not grown about his guilt. He is a guilty today as he was 26 years ago and any properly charged jury would come to the same conclusion.
Bamber did not take one of his fathers rifles complete with silencer on it. The rifle did not have a silencer on it, Bamber had to retrieve it from the cupboard and fit it.
It was not the discovery of the silencer which turned Jeremy Bamber into a suspect. He was a suspect from the moment DS Stan Jones overheard him laughing with Julie Mugford just hours after the murders took place.
So what if Sheila was shot once with a rifle that did not have a silencer attached, Bamber obviously had removed the silencer to replace it in the gun cupboard after making a mess of trying to clean it. He obviously put another round in the unsilenced rifle and shot Sheila a second time when he realised she was not dead and could live until police arrived.
I think Mr Williams-Thomas needs to do some more homework!
I was under the impression a Company like ITV would at least get the basics right but sadly they cannot even do that. I must say I am disappointed in this article so who knows what sort of rubbish will be in the documentary.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 29, 2012, 06:55:25 PM
I completely agree Tim, I find the piece to be rather amateurish for such an important case. Some points which need addressing...
Mr Williams-Thomas failed to point out that the police initially thought that Sheila had done it because Jeremy Bamber had written the script that way from the very first moment he contacted the police. When the police arrived he went to great pains to emphasise that his mad sister was responsible. The plan was in full swing!
Jeremy didn't live in a rented cottage. He lived in a cottage owned by his father which he had free use of.
Doubts have not grown about his guilt. He is a guilty today as he was 26 years ago and any properly charged jury would come to the same conclusion.
Bamber did not take one of his fathers rifles complete with silencer on it. The rifle did not have a silencer on it, Bamber had to retrieve it from the cupboard and fit it.
It was not the discovery of the silencer which turned Jeremy Bamber into a suspect. He was a suspect from the moment DS Stan Jones overheard him laughing with Julie Mugford just hours after the murders took place.
So what if Sheila was shot once with a rifle that did not have a silencer attached, Bamber obviously had removed the silencer to replace it in the gun cupboard after making a mess of trying to clean it. He obviously put another round in the unsilenced rifle and shot Sheila a second time when he realised she was not dead and could live until police arrived.
I think Mr Williams-Thomas needs to do some more homework!
Good points John and I would say you're looking at it fairly too. We have only addressed the issues and supposed new evidence that Bamber's defense are bringing up now.
The trial judge gave the jury 3 points to consider and on which they could find Bamber guilty or innocent. McKay and his team seem to suggest the jury found Bamber guilty on the silencer evidence alone which is not accurate. We haven't mentioned a litany of other evidence that screams Bamber's guilt. I look forward to the programme with interest.
One thing that I think even the Bamberettes will agree on now; if the CCRC reject Bamber after all this then he is dead and buried. He will die in prison!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 29, 2012, 07:09:00 PM
I completely agree Tim, I find the piece to be rather amateurish for such an important case. Some points which need addressing...
Mr Williams-Thomas failed to point out that the police initially thought that Sheila had done it because Jeremy Bamber had written the script that way from the very first moment he contacted the police. When the police arrived he went to great pains to emphasise that his mad sister was responsible. The plan was in full swing!
Jeremy didn't live in a rented cottage. He lived in a cottage owned by his father which he had free use of.
Doubts have not grown about his guilt. He is a guilty today as he was 26 years ago and any properly charged jury would come to the same conclusion.
Bamber did not take one of his fathers rifles complete with silencer on it. The rifle did not have a silencer on it, Bamber had to retrieve it from the cupboard and fit it.
It was not the discovery of the silencer which turned Jeremy Bamber into a suspect. He was a suspect from the moment DS Stan Jones overheard him laughing with Julie Mugford just hours after the murders took place.
So what if Sheila was shot once with a rifle that did not have a silencer attached, Bamber obviously had removed the silencer to replace it in the gun cupboard after making a mess of trying to clean it. He obviously put another round in the unsilenced rifle and shot Sheila a second time when he realised she was not dead and could live until police arrived.
I think Mr Williams-Thomas needs to do some more homework!
Good points John and I would say you're looking at it fairly too. We have only addressed the issues and supposed new evidence that Bamber's defense are bringing up now.
The trial judge gave the jury 3 points to consider and on which they could find Bamber guilty or innocent. McKay and his team seem to suggest the jury found Bamber guilty on the silencer evidence alone which is not accurate. We haven't mentioned a litany of other evidence that screams Bamber's guilt. I look forward to the programme with interest.
One thing that I think even the Bamberettes will agree on now; if the CCRC reject Bamber after all this then he is dead and buried. He will die in prison!
I have always said that I look at the cases from the perspective of the evidence. That is why I changed my opinion entirely in the Luke Mitchell case when the evidence actually pointed towards him being guilty. That said, I would be the first to welcome the slightest glimmer of hope in relation to Bamber. The hard part for me though is that in most cases there is evidence which can support innocence but it is so obviously missing in this instance. Wishful theories and long sagas about police incompetence and documents being held under PII do nothing to alter this situation. The CCRC would have had access to everything in the Bamber cases and even they find that there isn't anything which supports his position that he is innocence.
I fear Mark Williams-Thomas has done nothing but muddy the water and I told him so earlier this afternoon when it was pointed out to him that his article was factually wrong on several counts. I note that he has not bothered to answer my criticisms. If someone is going to do a TV programme about Bamber should be done properly and not look like an episode from The Bill.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 29, 2012, 07:15:05 PM
Good point ... 25 minutes is way too short. Both camps are going to come out of this saying this and that wasn't mentioned.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 29, 2012, 07:57:37 PM
Well there we have it.
(http://i.imgur.com/M1lqH.jpg)
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 29, 2012, 07:58:41 PM
David Boutflour had the final word and its very true...
"Its time it stopped!"
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Weety on March 29, 2012, 08:06:50 PM
OK, so they heated the rifle / silencer with a blow torch to 200 degrees in order to reproduce those marks, but then found that the rifle did not become hot enough just by firing it. What is Sheila supposed to have done, stuck in the Aga for a bit? And they still haven't explained how human blood of Sheila's group got in the silencer.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Admin on March 29, 2012, 08:09:21 PM
We have now got some nice stills of quite a few characters for future reference.
Well done to our insider who was spot on about the Eaton's not taking part. David Boutflour became the family spokesperson yet again and told it as it was. Well done David! You reference to Sheila lying dead with hardly a hair out of place, her perfectly manicured nails intact and no blood on her was spot on.
The UK tests also proved that the rifle could never have got so hot so as to burn skin even after firing a dozen bullets...yet another theory gone up in smoke Mr McKay!
Julie Smerchanski (Mugford) rightly would not take part in such a charade.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Admin on March 29, 2012, 08:14:28 PM
OK, so they heated the rifle / silencer with a blow torch to 200 degrees in order to reproduce those marks, but then found that the rifle did not become hot enough just by firing it. What is Sheila supposed to have done, stuck in the Aga for a bit? And they still haven't explained how human blood of Sheila's group got in the silencer.
Exactly Weety, you can fool some of the people some of the time.... 8((()*/
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Andrea on March 29, 2012, 08:18:06 PM
Was the doc any good? i missed it, i have just got in from work.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Angelo222 on March 29, 2012, 08:20:25 PM
Was that it>??? I gave up an episode of Eastenders for that waffle??
So to summarise, the brill new evidence according to guru McKay is that according to tests conducted by our American cousins Sheila was shot twice with a unsilenced weapon?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Angelo222 on March 29, 2012, 08:20:42 PM
Was the doc any good? i missed it, i have just got in from work.
It was interesting Andrea, but it didn't really tell us anything we didn't know. Can you watch it on plus 1?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Angelo222 on March 29, 2012, 08:23:24 PM
Did anyone notice that former police sergeant Chris Bews said this time that it was Jeremy who said that he saw movement at an upstairs window. I must check but I am nearly positive that in the other video on U tube he said it was a police constable who said it??
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 29, 2012, 08:24:31 PM
Jesus Christ the report mark whatshisame said Sheila was shot in the neck with two SHOTGUN shots ..... how amateur is that!
Agreed Weety if the rifle never got that hot than the tests are irrelevent ..... and shooting the pig skin only made the huge silencer ring around the woulnd because it was pressed hard onto the skin. How the hell do they know it was pressed hard onto the skin... it could have been merely touching it or a millimeter off the skin.
That programme was truly rubbish .... if lay people on a forum can pull it apart then the CCRC will laugh at it!
IT'S TIME THIS STOPPED!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Weety on March 29, 2012, 08:27:20 PM
Jesus Christ the report mark whatshisame said Sheila was shot in the neck with two SHOTGUN shots ..... how amateur is that!
Agreed Weety if the rifle never got that hot than the tests are irrelevent ..... and shooting the pig skin only made the huge silencer ring around the woulnd because it was pressed hard onto the skin. How the hell do they know it was pressed hard onto the skin... it could have been merely touching it or a millimeter off the skin.
That programme was truly rubbish .... if lay people on a forum can pull it apart then the CCRC will laugh at it!
IT'S TIME THIS STOPPED!
Yes, I was thinking the same thing about the large rings.
Do you think DB's final comment was intended as a message for JB?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 29, 2012, 08:27:30 PM
Did anyone notice that former police sergeant Chris Bews said this time that it was Jeremy who said that he saw movement at an upstairs window. I must check but I am nearly positive that in the other video on U tube he said it was a police constable who said it??
Perfectly correct Dave. Bews said it was PC Steve Myles who said he thought he saw someone move in the last interview but in tonight's programme he has changed it to it was Jeremy who said it.
It just goes to show what a bunch of amateurs we are dealing with here that nobody actually picked up on that before.
Previous video with Bews interview at 4.00 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EDp_tqUysI)
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: abs on March 29, 2012, 08:28:07 PM
I can´t watch it on plus 1 - only for viewers within the United Kingdom. I am hoping it will appear on Youtube soon, if it isn´t there already. So I would like to ask, what is the name of the docu, so I can search?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Weety on March 29, 2012, 08:29:08 PM
Did anyone notice that former police sergeant Chris Bews said this time that it was Jeremy who said that he saw movement at an upstairs window. I must check but I am nearly positive that in the other video on U tube he said it was a police constable who said it??
I did notice that yes. I can't recall exactly what Bewes said before but I don't think he said it was JB - I think I would have remembered that?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Weety on March 29, 2012, 08:30:45 PM
I can´t watch it on plus 1 - only for viewers within the United Kingdom. I am hoping it will appear on Youtube soon, if it isn´t there already. So I would like to ask, what is the name of the docu, so I can search?
It was the 'Tonight' programme and it was called 'Bamber - the new evidence' abs.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: abs on March 29, 2012, 08:31:17 PM
Thanks, Weety!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 29, 2012, 08:35:13 PM
The Bamberettes are still in shock!! Just wait until the CCRC lands the biggy. @)(++(*
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 29, 2012, 08:38:04 PM
Have you not seen it yet Tim?
Simon McKay never said that Jeremy Bamber was innocent. Just the usual lawyer speak for, "The conviction was not sound"!
I must say, ITV has certainly gone down the tubes as far as documentary making is concerned. My 14-year-old could have done a better job!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 29, 2012, 08:41:49 PM
Hey girls, the programme is repeated at 2.30am tonight on ITV1 or
You can watch it on ITV player now on http://www.itv.com/itvplayer/video/?Filter=313869
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Weety on March 29, 2012, 08:44:36 PM
Jesus Christ the report mark whatshisame said Sheila was shot in the neck with two SHOTGUN shots ..... how amateur is that!
Agreed Weety if the rifle never got that hot than the tests are irrelevent ..... and shooting the pig skin only made the huge silencer ring around the woulnd because it was pressed hard onto the skin. How the hell do they know it was pressed hard onto the skin... it could have been merely touching it or a millimeter off the skin.
That programme was truly rubbish .... if lay people on a forum can pull it apart then the CCRC will laugh at it!
IT'S TIME THIS STOPPED!
Yes, I was thinking the same thing about the large rings.
Do you think DB's final comment was intended as a message for JB?
Oh and another thing while I think of it, the tests were done on a flat piece of quite thick pigskin - that might compare with Neville's back but try find a patch like that on the front of a skinny girl's neck.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Andrea on March 29, 2012, 08:49:53 PM
Have they forgot that living people were shot with this gun and not dead pig skin? MASSIVE difference.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 29, 2012, 08:54:43 PM
It's called Bamber - The New Evidence Abs .... good luck with finding it
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 29, 2012, 08:54:59 PM
Here are some stills from the programme.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 29, 2012, 08:57:34 PM
Did anyone notice that former police sergeant Chris Bews said this time that it was Jeremy who said that he saw movement at an upstairs window. I must check but I am nearly positive that in the other video on U tube he said it was a police constable who said it??
I did notice that yes. I can't recall exactly what Bewes said before but I don't think he said it was JB - I think I would have remembered that?
I recall it was Bamber who pointed to the window in the priginal statement. @)(++(*
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: abs on March 29, 2012, 08:57:58 PM
Thanks Tim, I will find it.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Weety on March 29, 2012, 08:59:06 PM
Did anyone notice that former police sergeant Chris Bews said this time that it was Jeremy who said that he saw movement at an upstairs window. I must check but I am nearly positive that in the other video on U tube he said it was a police constable who said it??
I did notice that yes. I can't recall exactly what Bewes said before but I don't think he said it was JB - I think I would have remembered that?
I recall it was Bamber who pointed to the window in the priginal statement. @)(++(*
Whose original statement?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 29, 2012, 09:09:57 PM
I recall Bewes saying in a TV programme that Bamber had pointed to a window and seen movement. It was a room with no light on .... Bewes looked with another copper and originally thought he saw something. Then he found by moving side to side they could replicate it and it was a reflection ... trick of the light.
I haven't read any statements to that effect though. Programme may have been Crimes That Shocked Britian ... I am not sure.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 29, 2012, 09:13:18 PM
Barbara Wilson the farm secretary said,
"He just wasn't sad in any way...I didn't see him sad ever and I went on the Friday after the killings to his home to pick up the wages and the money and he was as happy as a lark!"
(http://i.imgur.com/y97If.jpg)
Former farm secretary - Barbara Wilson
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 29, 2012, 09:15:32 PM
I was far less impressed with Simon McKay than I expected to be. The only one I thought was a bit dodgy was Eric Allison of The Guardian ... I found him distateful and a little creepy ... I bit like Tesko. Seemed more of a Bamberette than a serious reporter!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: abs on March 29, 2012, 09:19:55 PM
I recall Bewes saying in a TV programme that Bamber had pointed to a window and seen movement. It was a room with no light on .... Bewes looked with another copper and originally thought he saw something. Then he found by moving side to side they could replicate it and it was a reflection ... trick of the light.
I haven't read any statements to that effect though. Programme may have been Crimes That Shocked Britian ... I am not sure.
It is here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-EDp_tqUysI
I think they ran to the police cars when they thought they saw movement, they didn't stand still checking the reflection. Who wouldn't have run with a possible armed and dangerous person inside?After this they called the firearms team, which BTW didn't have the guts to go inside to possibly save two little kids, but waited outside for hours and hours. I mean, they had no idea whether people inside were dead, alive or wounded. I have always wondered about this waiting for hours. But I digress.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 29, 2012, 09:22:37 PM
Meet the lawyer, Mr Simon McKay.
(http://i.imgur.com/POCx2.jpg)
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Weety on March 29, 2012, 09:24:01 PM
I was far less impressed with Simon McKay than I expected to be. The only one I thought was a bit dodgy was Eric Allison of The Guardian ... I found him distateful and a little creepy ... I bit like Tesko. Seemed more of a Bamberette than a serious reporter!
He was the reporter that interviewed JB in prison wasn't he? I wonder how much of his opinion is a result of looking at the evidence, and how much it is influenced by having met him.
Well done on the stills John, can you get one of the NOWT story?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 29, 2012, 09:32:11 PM
Former Det Inspector Ron Cook says the investigation was like a ship without a rower.
(http://i.imgur.com/dCznj.jpg)
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 29, 2012, 09:33:16 PM
I was far less impressed with Simon McKay than I expected to be. The only one I thought was a bit dodgy was Eric Allison of The Guardian ... I found him distateful and a little creepy ... I bit like Tesko. Seemed more of a Bamberette than a serious reporter!
I was just thinking that myself, I wonder what his true agenda was in all of this? That Guardian article published today was full of bullshit as well.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 29, 2012, 09:36:48 PM
And (Z) still remains silent! @)(++(*
Doesn't that programme expose Tesko for the absolute crank fruitcake he is .... 24/7 365 a year he 'works' to get his fabtasy idol Bamber free and no one takes a blind bit of notice of his drivel?
@)(++(* @)(++(* @)(++(*
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 29, 2012, 09:44:09 PM
Here is a photograph of the pig skin into which an identical rifle was fired. Notice the marks left by the rifle with the sound moderator fitted on the right while on the left are the marks left by the rifle without any sound moderator fitted.
(http://i.imgur.com/0fGNq.jpg)
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: abs on March 29, 2012, 09:45:43 PM
Interesting. Thanks for the photos, John!!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 29, 2012, 09:49:30 PM
Screen-shot of the News of the World article.
(http://i.imgur.com/T4qDY.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/93ciY.jpg)
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: abs on March 29, 2012, 09:58:43 PM
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 29, 2012, 10:04:23 PM
Retired Det Supt Mick Gradwell (left) discusses the case with presenter and former detective Mark Williams-Thomas.
(http://i.imgur.com/K0fDO.jpg)
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: tescoman on March 29, 2012, 10:08:18 PM
I must say I was really disappointed in that program as I thought they would at least have discovered something important after all this time. I like the photographs. They will be a convenient reminder of the ITV tonight show.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Harvey on March 29, 2012, 10:14:31 PM
It is a good job it is on ITV Player as I missed it earlier. It is also on at 2.30am if anyone wants to watch it on the box again.
It all seems to boil down to the two shots to Sheila neck then? Does McKay think he will get Bamber off just because the original prosecution may have got it slightly wrong? Does it matter that she was shot with an unsilenced weapon because as far as I can see it doesn't.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 29, 2012, 10:19:21 PM
I swear I hadn't read this when I said Eric Allison looked dodgy:
Eric Allison is a former career criminal who was found guilty of conspiring to defraud Barclays Bank, and ‘did time’ in Strangeways and a number of other prisons. A ‘difficult’ prisoner, he spoke out about the abuse suffered at the hands of the authorities, and lent his support during the Strangeways Prison Revolt of 1990. In total he spent 16 years behind bars, 7 of which were for the Barclays job which netted £1 million and was to be his last hurrah.
Eric is currently the Guardian prison correspondent, a campaigning journalist whose mantra is that “we don’t know what goes on in our prisons.” He is a trustee of the Shannon Trust, a charity focused on improving literacy amongst the prison population, and speaks widely on crime, prisons, prisoners’ families and victims of crime at conferences, universities and charity events.
It's a bit like Myra Hindley putting in a good word for Ian Brady! Looks like he really is another Tesko .... spent time with Bamber playing hide the sauasage perhaps? Great choice ITV!
(Thank you to the good friend who point this info out to me btw 8@??)()
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 29, 2012, 10:23:54 PM
It is a good job it is on ITV Player as I missed it earlier. It is also on at 2.30am if anyone wants to watch it on the box again.
It all seems to boil down to the two shots to Sheila neck then? Does McKay think he will get Bamber off just because the original prosecution may have got it slightly wrong? Does it matter that she was shot with an unsilenced weapon because as far as I can see it doesn't.
I think it matters. Evidence (which BTW had been tampered with and shouldn't have been allowed as evidence in the first place) was used in court and the jury took it into their considerations, so JB was convicted on wrong/false evidence. There wasn't much more than that to convict him on apart from Julie Mumford's (the one who tried to smother/kill Jeremy) hearsay type testimony. That is not a lot, in my opinion - and certainly not enough to lock up a man for life. Jeremy Bamber should at least have a new trial. How about Sheila's blood being in the silencer if it wasn't used to shoot her? How did THAT happen?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 29, 2012, 10:34:30 PM
That's a very good question Abs how did Sheila and June's blood get in the silencer ... that is something Bamber and McKay have to answer now. At the trial it was the prosecution who had to establish the facts ... if Bamber wants to establish his innocence he now has to answer those questions.
You say the silencer is evidence that has been tampered with ... I don't believe there is any proof of that therefore surely that's just your opinion?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: abs on March 29, 2012, 10:41:13 PM
That's a very good question Abs how did Sheila and June's blood get in the silencer ... that is something Bamber and McKay have to answer now. At the trial it was the prosecution who had to establish the facts ... if Bamber wants to establish his innocence he now has to answer those questions.
You say the silencer is evidence that has been tampered with ... I don't believe there is any proof of that therefore surely that's just your opinion?
It isn't just my opinion. First of all, upon finding the silencer in the cupboard, why wasn't it immediately brought to the attention of the police? Why bring it home? How many people handled it? According to David Boutflour´s own admission, he scraped a flake of blood off the silence because it "fascinated him". That is tampering - not just my opinion. I don't know what else was done to it, perhaps nothing, but the creepy scraping off blood is a fact.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 29, 2012, 10:53:08 PM
That's a very good question Abs how did Sheila and June's blood get in the silencer ... that is something Bamber and McKay have to answer now. At the trial it was the prosecution who had to establish the facts ... if Bamber wants to establish his innocence he now has to answer those questions.
You say the silencer is evidence that has been tampered with ... I don't believe there is any proof of that therefore surely that's just your opinion?
It isn't just my opinion. First of all, upon finding the silencer in the cupboard, why wasn't it immediately brought to the attention of the police? Why bring it home? How many people handled it? According to David Boutflour´s own admission, he scraped a flake of blood off the silence because it "fascinated him". That is tampering - not just my opinion. I don't know what else was done to it, perhaps nothing, but the creepy scraping off blood is a fact.
They took it to Ann Eatons house because they considered it important evidence and they didn't want Bamber going back to the house and perhaps removing it ... they already didn't believe Bamber at this stage. When they saw blood and paint on the silencer they called the police straight away. The police took 2 days to pick it up.
You may consider inspecting the silencer to be tampering .... I don't agree with that terminology and I don't think there is anything 'creepy' in it either. You are obviously implying the relatives fabricated the evidence and I don't believe they did.
I respect your opinion and agree that it is not ideal handling of evidence but I think you're taking a massive leap to a conclusion for which there isn't a shred of proof to support it.
I can't for the life of me imagine how this 'creepy tampering' by the relatives could have got June and Sheila's blood inside the silencer? How do you think they could possibly have done that?
Or shall we just agree to disagree? 8)-)))
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: simong on March 29, 2012, 10:55:35 PM
Evening, I thought the documentary was very good. I know that is probably not the reaction you want on here but hey ho.
The Bews part of the documentary was pointless as he repeated pretty much word for word what he has said before. I would have been more interested to have heard from the other officer present, Myall i think his name was.
The burn marks are interesting. I don't know if there is a link on here to Nevill Bambers post mortem. I thought that the burn marks to Nevills back, were of different sizes.
With regard to the pig skin shooting tests. I will watch again to confirm but he seemed to me to pushing the gun quite hard into the skin and firing. I presume it would be hard to push a rifle into your own neck with force. Added to that is the fact that Sheila had a severed jugular from the first shot and firing a rifle into Pig skin layed out flat directly in front of you would not replicate accurately the circumstances in which Sheila is supposed to have killed herself. Maybe i am wrong, maybe i am being a little pedantic.
Anyway, just a few thoughts.
It was good to see some fresh material about the case. I apologise for any inaccuracies in my post (I should really put this in my signature)
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 29, 2012, 11:05:32 PM
Evening, I thought the documentary was very good. I know that is probably not the reaction you want on here but hey ho.
The Bews part of the documentary was pointless as he repeated pretty much word for word what he has said before. I would have been more interested to have heard from the other officer present, Myall i think his name was.
The burn marks are interesting. I don't know if there is a link on here to Nevill Bambers post mortem. I thought that the burn marks to Nevills back, were of different sizes.
With regard to the pig skin shooting tests. I will watch again to confirm but he seemed to me to pushing the gun quite hard into the skin and firing. I presume it would be hard to push a rifle into your own neck with force. Added to that is the fact that Sheila had a severed jugular from the first shot and firing a rifle into Pig skin layed out flat directly in front of you would not replicate accurately the circumstances in which Sheila is supposed to have killed herself. Maybe i am wrong, maybe i am being a little pedantic.
Anyway, just a few thoughts.
It was good to see some fresh material about the case. I apologise for any inaccuracies in my post (I should really put this in my signature)
Hi Simon. I thought the programme was very good for those who consider Bamber guilty and I am not just saying that because I am one of those people!
The burn mark evidence was made pointless when at the end of that piece they stated that the gun didn't get anywhere near that hot by firing bullets!
I agree with you that the gun shot marks were produced by pushing the rifle hard against the slab of meat ... they can't possibly know Sheila did that and as you say with her first wound it is very doubtful she would have done that!
What did you think of David Boutflour ... I thought as I always have that he is a very decent man and he too is a victim in this tragedy?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: simong on March 29, 2012, 11:17:28 PM
That was the first time i had ever seen David Boutflour, so i will give my opinion on him on that basis if that is ok.
He doesn't come across as someone who is going to stitch up someone for financial gain. Seems to me that Boutflour would be, one of life's achievers (financially) whether he inherited money or not from the conviction of JB. I feel it is less likely that all the family members allegedly fitted up Jeremy for the money, having seen and heard him speak. If anything i would say they acted in the way the did because they were vehement in their belief in his guilt.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 29, 2012, 11:24:33 PM
It was better than I expected, slightly more polished, certainly more balanced. Barbara Wilson, David and JM were IMO totally convincing, the shonky mock-ups of the house and the spinning top (still spinning!) were cheap and superfluos, the gun experiments were like something out of Look Around You, and McKay was unimpressive. The fact that David was given the last word will influence people who are new to the case. It's ironic that it aired on the same night as the well-made and comprehensive Panorama investigation into the Dewani case.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 29, 2012, 11:40:17 PM
It was better than I expected, slightly more polished, certainly more balanced. Barbara Wilson, David and JM were IMO totally convincing, the shonky mock-ups of the house and the spinning top (still spinning!) were cheap and superfluos, the gun experiments were like something out of Look Around You, and McKay was unimpressive. The fact that David was given the last word will influence people who are new to the case. It's ironic that it aired on the same night as the well-made and comprehensive Panorama investigation into the Dewani case.
Shoan The Wise 8@??)(
David Boutflour was definitley the memorable person in the programme and I agree it wasn't a patch on Dabid Vine's excellent and balanced Dewanii programme. I can't believe Mark whatshisname said Sheila died from two SHOTGUN blasts to the neck ... he obviously just picked this case up for the publicity rather than studiy it closely.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: abs on March 30, 2012, 01:05:38 AM
That's a very good question Abs how did Sheila and June's blood get in the silencer ... that is something Bamber and McKay have to answer now. At the trial it was the prosecution who had to establish the facts ... if Bamber wants to establish his innocence he now has to answer those questions.
You say the silencer is evidence that has been tampered with ... I don't believe there is any proof of that therefore surely that's just your opinion?
It isn't just my opinion. First of all, upon finding the silencer in the cupboard, why wasn't it immediately brought to the attention of the police? Why bring it home? How many people handled it? According to David Boutflour´s own admission, he scraped a flake of blood off the silence because it "fascinated him". That is tampering - not just my opinion. I don't know what else was done to it, perhaps nothing, but the creepy scraping off blood is a fact.
They took it to Ann Eatons house because they considered it important evidence and they didn't want Bamber going back to the house and perhaps removing it ... they already didn't believe Bamber at this stage. When they saw blood and paint on the silencer they called the police straight away. The police took 2 days to pick it up.
You may consider inspecting the silencer to be tampering .... I don't agree with that terminology and I don't think there is anything 'creepy' in it either. You are obviously implying the relatives fabricated the evidence and I don't believe they did.
I respect your opinion and agree that it is not ideal handling of evidence but I think you're taking a massive leap to a conclusion for which there isn't a shred of proof to support it.
I can't for the life of me imagine how this 'creepy tampering' by the relatives could have got June and Sheila's blood inside the silencer? How do you think they could possibly have done that?
Or shall we just agree to disagree? 8)-)))
Sure. I am not going to stalk and harass you for it! 8)-)))
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Admin on March 30, 2012, 01:17:41 AM
I swear I hadn't read this when I said Eric Allison looked dodgy:
Eric Allison is a former career criminal who was found guilty of conspiring to defraud Barclays Bank, and ‘did time’ in Strangeways and a number of other prisons. A ‘difficult’ prisoner, he spoke out about the abuse suffered at the hands of the authorities, and lent his support during the Strangeways Prison Revolt of 1990. In total he spent 16 years behind bars, 7 of which were for the Barclays job which netted £1 million and was to be his last hurrah.
Eric is currently the Guardian prison correspondent, a campaigning journalist whose mantra is that “we don’t know what goes on in our prisons.” He is a trustee of the Shannon Trust, a charity focused on improving literacy amongst the prison population, and speaks widely on crime, prisons, prisoners’ families and victims of crime at conferences, universities and charity events.
It's a bit like Myra Hindley putting in a good word for Ian Brady! Looks like he really is another Tesko .... spent time with Bamber playing hide the sauasage perhaps? Great choice ITV!
(Thank you to the good friend who point this info out to me btw 8@??)()
Good post Tim and well done whoever passed this on to you. There was something just not right with the comments he made, as you said earlier it reminded us of Mike Teskowski. Allison like Teskowski will have a grudge against the forces of law and order and that proverbial chip on his shoulder. That article in the Guardian today was a disgrace for such a newspaper, maybe we should have a word with the editor in chief.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 30, 2012, 01:31:08 AM
That was the first time i had ever seen David Boutflour, so i will give my opinion on him on that basis if that is ok.
He doesn't come across as someone who is going to stitch up someone for financial gain. Seems to me that Boutflour would be, one of life's achievers (financially) whether he inherited money or not from the conviction of JB. I feel it is less likely that all the family members allegedly fitted up Jeremy for the money, having seen and heard him speak. If anything i would say they acted in the way the did because they were vehement in their belief in his guilt.
Nice reply Simon .... I agree David Boutflour seems a gentleman to me . I hope the CCRC do the right thing and put an end to all this!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 30, 2012, 01:42:03 AM
That's a very good question Abs how did Sheila and June's blood get in the silencer ... that is something Bamber and McKay have to answer now. At the trial it was the prosecution who had to establish the facts ... if Bamber wants to establish his innocence he now has to answer those questions.
You say the silencer is evidence that has been tampered with ... I don't believe there is any proof of that therefore surely that's just your opinion?
It isn't just my opinion. First of all, upon finding the silencer in the cupboard, why wasn't it immediately brought to the attention of the police? Why bring it home? How many people handled it? According to David Boutflour´s own admission, he scraped a flake of blood off the silence because it "fascinated him". That is tampering - not just my opinion. I don't know what else was done to it, perhaps nothing, but the creepy scraping off blood is a fact.
They took it to Ann Eatons house because they considered it important evidence and they didn't want Bamber going back to the house and perhaps removing it ... they already didn't believe Bamber at this stage. When they saw blood and paint on the silencer they called the police straight away. The police took 2 days to pick it up.
You may consider inspecting the silencer to be tampering .... I don't agree with that terminology and I don't think there is anything 'creepy' in it either. You are obviously implying the relatives fabricated the evidence and I don't believe they did.
I respect your opinion and agree that it is not ideal handling of evidence but I think you're taking a massive leap to a conclusion for which there isn't a shred of proof to support it.
I can't for the life of me imagine how this 'creepy tampering' by the relatives could have got June and Sheila's blood inside the silencer? How do you think they could possibly have done that?
Or shall we just agree to disagree? 8)-)))
Sure. I am not going to stalk and harass you for it! 8)-)))
I don't mind being stalked as long as the stalker is vaguely female. Preece stalking me is an enterely different kettle of fish!
I think our respective opinions of the relatives behaviour and motives is verydifferent Abs and neither of us is likely to change their mind or the others ... agreeing to disagree seemed the best option!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 30, 2012, 01:47:51 AM
It is a good job it is on ITV Player as I missed it earlier. It is also on at 2.30am if anyone wants to watch it on the box again.
It all seems to boil down to the two shots to Sheila neck then? Does McKay think he will get Bamber off just because the original prosecution may have got it slightly wrong? Does it matter that she was shot with an unsilenced weapon because as far as I can see it doesn't.
I think it matters. Evidence (which BTW had been tampered with and shouldn't have been allowed as evidence in the first place) was used in court and the jury took it into their considerations, so JB was convicted on wrong/false evidence. There wasn't much more than that to convict him on apart from Julie Mumford's (the one who tried to smother/kill Jeremy) hearsay type testimony. That is not a lot, in my opinion - and certainly not enough to lock up a man for life. Jeremy Bamber should at least have a new trial. How about Sheila's blood being in the silencer if it wasn't used to shoot her? How did THAT happen?
There you go again with the old default story about evidence being tampered with. What evidence is this abs and who on earth had any reason to do such a thing other than the one and only Jeremy Bamber?
You have to look beyond the evidence that pointed to Jeremy. He was convicted on the fact that it was him or Sheila because of what he said his father told him on the phone but Sheila was proven to be an innocent victim. It wasn't necessary to find a mountain of evidence against Jeremy, all the prosecution required to do was to clear Sheila.
Julie Mugford's testimony was the icing on the cake, the final nail in the coffin.
We are left with the fact that there was blood belonging to Nevill, June and Sheila on or in the sound moderator. There are several ways that their blood could have got there but I will keep those for later today.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 30, 2012, 01:54:58 AM
John Abs is of the opinion that the evidence was tampered with than so be it ... she has promised no stalking @)(++(* and we in turn promise polite, respectful conversation! She has already left one forum because of their moronic behaviour ... we aren't going down the same route! 8((()*/
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 30, 2012, 02:13:24 AM
How did you think the programme went Tim? I have a feeling it is too little too late and not even Simon McKay's stated position that his review of the evidence inexorably leads him to the conclusion that the conviction was not safe will help Bamber.
I personally found it interesting that he did not say that Bamber was innocent which is completely different to that claimed of him by the Bamber crankies.
I honestly don't know what evidence McKay has been looking at, I sometimes wonder if we are looking at the same case. Is he being purposely obtuse or is it that like so many before him and including our Mr Williams-Thomas, he just hasn't properly studied all the facts in this case?
Abs will have to provide substance to her claims otherwise they will not stand up to scrutiny.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 30, 2012, 02:29:01 AM
8((()*/ Look!!
Teskowski has even brought sicko smiffy out of retirement and what does he do but put his feet right in it up to his neck.
Quote from: smiffy the bum
that .22 rifle was fairly quiet...nothing more than clicks...without the silencer...it would be easy to envisage someone being shot in the kitchen downstairs and those upstairs not being woken by the sound of it being fired.
The general public...out of ignorance would expect the rifle to be louder... no doubt the jury never got to hear the rifle (or another one) being fired so they could make a proper judgement of the claimed evidence and that basically there was never any need for a silencer to be used by the killer/s.
Hint smiffy. Do read the facts before you open your bake! Look and learn smiffy!!
The jury were taken to a firing range and heard the rifle being fired with and without a silencer fitted. Jeremy Bamber elected not to go to the firing range. 8(0(*
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: insider on March 30, 2012, 02:54:26 AM
Did anyone notice the made up spiel which was posted by Tesko pretending to be Ron Cook immediately after the program? What a load of dribble and tripe. If that is the best you can do Tesko you best retire right now son. @)(++(*
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: insider on March 30, 2012, 02:57:57 AM
Strange how these "employees" at the farm never materialised as didn't any of the Eaton's. Looks like its back to the drawing board for you Viddy Vic!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Harvey on March 30, 2012, 03:15:14 AM
Strange how these "employees" at the farm never materialised as didn't any of the Eaton's. Looks like its back to the drawing board for you Viddy Vic!
Morning insider. Predictably predictable as you suggested some weeks ago. I must say I thought the whole programme was somewhat stale. ITV must be going through a bad patch to produce such a poor piece of investigative journalism. That guy from the Guardian was a typical anti establishment muppet didn't Tim say he had served 16 years or something earlier. Just the sort of nice guy you ask to give an unbiased opinion on yet another nice guy like Bamber. 8@??)(
The more they squirm and howl the more guilty I believe Bamber is. David Boutflour was right when he said at the very beginning and at the end of the film that Jeremy Bamber is a guilty party, he is not an innocent person!
Who would you believe, David Boutflour who grew up with Bamber or Eric Allison who has probably never met him?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 30, 2012, 08:19:18 AM
Oh dear! ...what a farce that ITV programme was yesterday evening if its title "Jeremy Bamber - the new evidence" was anything to go by! Even poor Poppy Ann Miller had to go to bed early in disgust after falling out with nice Mr McKay. And while on the subject of Mr Dream Team, I am reliably informed that he is at this very moment on his way to meet Jeremy at HMP Full Sutton in order to break the news to him about the film. Oh to be a fly on that wall!!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 30, 2012, 08:53:18 AM
Oh dear! ...what a farce that ITV programme was yesterday evening if its title "Jeremy Bamber - the new evidence" was anything to go by! Even poor Poppy Ann Miller had to go to bed early in disgust after falling out with nice Mr McKay. And while on the subject of Mr Dream Team, I am reliably informed that he is at this very moment on his way to meet Jeremy at HMP Full Sutton in order to break the news to him about the film. Oh to be a fly on that wall!!
Is that what all the fuss has been about? What a damp squib, and very amateurish. It will have achieved nothing. I notice Bamber's forum found very little to be positive about, some even appeared dismayed at the content. Bamber must feel crushed.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 30, 2012, 09:14:37 AM
The fact that two people who knew Jeremy Bamber really well speak of his guilt is powerful stuff. Mrs Wilson was dismayed at Bambers complete lack of any sadness or grief, if evidence of the psychopath was ever needed, this was it. David Boutflour for his part was upfront and left everbody in absolutely no doubt that Jeremy was not an innocently party and was as guilty as hell!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 30, 2012, 09:14:44 AM
How did you think the programme went Tim? I have a feeling it is too little too late and not even Simon McKay's stated position that his review of the evidence inexorably leads him to the conclusion that the conviction was not safe will help Bamber.
I personally found it interesting that he did not say that Bamber was innocent which is completely different to that claimed of him by the Bamber crankies.
I honestly don't know what evidence McKay has been looking at, I sometimes wonder if we are looking at the same case. Is he being purposely obtuse or is it that like so many before him and including our Mr Williams-Thomas, he just hasn't properly studied all the facts in this case?
Abs will have to provide substance to her claims otherwise they will not stand up to scrutiny.
Mornin' John. I was delighted with the programme. I did wonder if the Dream Team were going to hit us with evidence that was so compelling that we have to seriously evaluate our positions I was quite shocked that the New Evidence is nothing but a trap for fools set by a bunch of chancers!
The silencer was rammed into the dead pig flesh like a spear to get the contact wound circles. Totally unrealistic and cheating to get the result they wanted. Even worse the rifle could not reach the tempreture to cause the burn marks to poor Nevill ... why on earth was it shown if not to mislead.
Have you seen the rifle got cooked in the Aga theory from Tesko and the quite extrordinary confirmation from Nelly 1006 that this joke is actually part of the CCRC submission? Shame on these people for using any meaans possible to try and get the results they want to see!
How the f**k does a rifle get cooked whilst 'leaning against the aga' during a frenzid murder spree and Nevill's life or death struggle.
Dream Team? ... Dream Up Anything To Free Bamber Glory Hunting Team
(Great work getting the stills from the programme btw John ... appreciate that)
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Angelo222 on March 30, 2012, 09:39:02 AM
How did you think the programme went Tim? I have a feeling it is too little too late and not even Simon McKay's stated position that his review of the evidence inexorably leads him to the conclusion that the conviction was not safe will help Bamber.
I personally found it interesting that he did not say that Bamber was innocent which is completely different to that claimed of him by the Bamber crankies.
I honestly don't know what evidence McKay has been looking at, I sometimes wonder if we are looking at the same case. Is he being purposely obtuse or is it that like so many before him and including our Mr Williams-Thomas, he just hasn't properly studied all the facts in this case?
Abs will have to provide substance to her claims otherwise they will not stand up to scrutiny.
Mornin' John. I was delighted with the programme. I did wonder if the Dream Team were going to hit us with evidence that was so compelling that we have to seriously evaluate our positions I was quite shocked that the New Evidence is nothing but a trap for fools set by a bunch of chancers!
The silencer was rammed into the dead pig flesh like a spear to get the contact wound circles. Totally unrealistic and cheating to get the result they wanted. Even worse the rifle could not reach the tempreture to cause the burn marks to poor Nevill ... why on earth was it shown if not to mislead.
Have you seen the rifle got cooked in the Aga theory from Tesko and the quite extrordinary confirmation from Nelly 1006 that this joke is actually part of the CCRC submission? Shame on these people for using any meaans possible to try and get the results they want to see!
How the f**k does a rifle get cooked whilst 'leaning against the aga' during a frenzid murder spree and Nevill's life or death struggle.
Dream Team? ... Dream Up Anything To Free Bamber Glory Hunting Team
(Great work getting the stills from the programme btw John ... appreciate that)
I had to have a chuckle at the Aga theory. A hot Aga in the month of August and in the middle of the night? What a load of old bollocks.
The truth is that the Aga wasn't even lit.
As for the ramming of a rifle into a piece of dead pig skin that again was exaggerated as you so correctly pointed out Tim. All in all a pretty poor show but then it is audience numbers that ITV wants and not the truth and the public should be made aware of this.
If I were Bamber I would be worried...VERY WORRIED.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 30, 2012, 09:54:49 AM
How did you think the programme went Tim? I have a feeling it is too little too late and not even Simon McKay's stated position that his review of the evidence inexorably leads him to the conclusion that the conviction was not safe will help Bamber.
I personally found it interesting that he did not say that Bamber was innocent which is completely different to that claimed of him by the Bamber crankies.
I honestly don't know what evidence McKay has been looking at, I sometimes wonder if we are looking at the same case. Is he being purposely obtuse or is it that like so many before him and including our Mr Williams-Thomas, he just hasn't properly studied all the facts in this case?
Abs will have to provide substance to her claims otherwise they will not stand up to scrutiny.
Mornin' John. I was delighted with the programme. I did wonder if the Dream Team were going to hit us with evidence that was so compelling that we have to seriously evaluate our positions I was quite shocked that the New Evidence is nothing but a trap for fools set by a bunch of chancers!
The silencer was rammed into the dead pig flesh like a spear to get the contact wound circles. Totally unrealistic and cheating to get the result they wanted. Even worse the rifle could not reach the tempreture to cause the burn marks to poor Nevill ... why on earth was it shown if not to mislead.
Have you seen the rifle got cooked in the Aga theory from Tesko and the quite extrordinary confirmation from Nelly 1006 that this joke is actually part of the CCRC submission? Shame on these people for using any meaans possible to try and get the results they want to see!
How the f**k does a rifle get cooked whilst 'leaning against the aga' during a frenzid murder spree and Nevill's life or death struggle.
Dream Team? ... Dream Up Anything To Free Bamber Glory Hunting Team
(Great work getting the stills from the programme btw John ... appreciate that)
I will have another go at the film later today as there are a few other comments and pictures that I want to capture before we move on. I agree about the Aga, I don't think it was even lit at that time of year as it would have made the house too warm. You see Tesko wouldn't know such things as only someone brought up on a farm with an Aga like me would know.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 30, 2012, 09:57:29 AM
And the Julie Mugford vielled accusations of lying for money from the NOTW was very, very weak. Julie didn't have a News Of The World deal when she walked into the police station and expsoed Bamber. Her trial testimony was just her original statement evidence put to the jury and tested in cross examination.
Even if Julie's solicitor did arrange the NOTW deal before the trial that does not mean she lied and the jury obviously believed her. Her story didn't change at all from her original statement describing Bamber's long held and various plans to kill off his family.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 30, 2012, 10:13:56 AM
Did you hear what she said in the old interview that she was not scared of Bamber until the moment came when she realised that he was scared of her. I bet she got cold shivers at that very moment in time when she realised that he could kill her as well.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Weety on March 30, 2012, 10:15:30 AM
How did you think the programme went Tim? I have a feeling it is too little too late and not even Simon McKay's stated position that his review of the evidence inexorably leads him to the conclusion that the conviction was not safe will help Bamber.
I personally found it interesting that he did not say that Bamber was innocent which is completely different to that claimed of him by the Bamber crankies.
I honestly don't know what evidence McKay has been looking at, I sometimes wonder if we are looking at the same case. Is he being purposely obtuse or is it that like so many before him and including our Mr Williams-Thomas, he just hasn't properly studied all the facts in this case?
Abs will have to provide substance to her claims otherwise they will not stand up to scrutiny.
Mornin' John. I was delighted with the programme. I did wonder if the Dream Team were going to hit us with evidence that was so compelling that we have to seriously evaluate our positions I was quite shocked that the New Evidence is nothing but a trap for fools set by a bunch of chancers!
The silencer was rammed into the dead pig flesh like a spear to get the contact wound circles. Totally unrealistic and cheating to get the result they wanted. Even worse the rifle could not reach the tempreture to cause the burn marks to poor Nevill ... why on earth was it shown if not to mislead.
Have you seen the rifle got cooked in the Aga theory from Tesko and the quite extrordinary confirmation from Nelly 1006 that this joke is actually part of the CCRC submission? Shame on these people for using any meaans possible to try and get the results they want to see!
How the f**k does a rifle get cooked whilst 'leaning against the aga' during a frenzid murder spree and Nevill's life or death struggle.
Dream Team? ... Dream Up Anything To Free Bamber Glory Hunting Team
(Great work getting the stills from the programme btw John ... appreciate that)
I thought he'd stolen that theory off of me until I saw NGB's comment. He has an Aga, even he must know that that would be completely impossible! Also, if that was a part of the CCRC submission (which Mark Whatshisname said he had seen) why wasn't that theory included in the documentary? Too far fetched for him perhaps?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 30, 2012, 10:29:40 AM
Boutflour came across as a decent, solid bloke. i laughed out loud when the little film ended with him @)(++(* 8@??)(
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 30, 2012, 10:58:26 AM
I've said it before .... thank heavens for Julie Mugford. What a brave woman.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 30, 2012, 11:26:26 AM
I've said it before .... thank heavens for Julie Mugford. What a brave woman.
Who knows how many lives Julie saved? If bamber had got away with murdering his family it would have given him carte blanche to kill again, anyone else he thought stood in his way. A psychopath has been kept safely from the world for 26 years. Let's hope that remains the case.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: abs on March 30, 2012, 11:30:40 AM
Quote
I don't mind being stalked as long as the stalker is vaguely female. Preece stalking me is an enterely different kettle of fish!
I think our respective opinions of the relatives behaviour and motives is verydifferent Abs and neither of us is likely to change their mind or the others ... agreeing to disagree seemed the best option!
I have to say that I do find it strange that David Boutflour took a razor blade and scraped off a flake of blood. His relatives had just been savagely murdered, and he found the blood "fascinating". Maybe I am misunderstanding something. I am not the worst "relative basher" BTW.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 30, 2012, 12:19:56 PM
I don't mind being stalked as long as the stalker is vaguely female. Preece stalking me is an enterely different kettle of fish!
I think our respective opinions of the relatives behaviour and motives is verydifferent Abs and neither of us is likely to change their mind or the others ... agreeing to disagree seemed the best option!
I have to say that I do find it strange that David Boutflour took a razor blade and scraped off a flake of blood. His relatives had just been savagely murdered, and he found the blood "fascinating". Maybe I am misunderstanding something. I am not the worst "relative basher" BTW.
Abs I welcome your views as we don't want to be a closed shop! Let me ask you something ... if the relatives were 'tampering' with the evidence or even falsiifying ecidence do you really think they would admit using a razor blade to scrape off a flake of blood?
Don't you think if they were acting with such malice aforethought they would have come up with a better story? I do!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: abs on March 30, 2012, 12:55:36 PM
I don´t know, but yes, you´d think so.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 30, 2012, 02:31:29 PM
I've said it before .... thank heavens for Julie Mugford. What a brave woman.
ive always said Julie Mugfords a top bird. Did what was right and stuck to her guns 8@??)( 8@??)( 8@??)(
Agree with those sentiments 1000% Dan. She knew the game was up when she saw fear in Bambers eyes. She knew whatever she felt for him that she had to go to the police. That is why Bamber was arrested as soon as he drove off the ferry from France.
Did you all know that Bamber had police surveillance on him after the murders?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 30, 2012, 02:48:36 PM
Just to update you all. Simon McKay had his planned visit with Bamber this morning and reports...
Jeremy Bamber, despite being in his 27th year of imprisonment, mentally strong during my visit with him this morning. CCRC decision awaited
Happy days! 8@??)(
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Admin on March 30, 2012, 02:54:38 PM
Just to update you all. Simon McKay had his planned visit with Bamber this morning and reports...
Jeremy Bamber, despite being in his 27th year of imprisonment, mentally strong during my visit with him this morning. CCRC decision awaited
Happy days! 8@??)(
Thank you for pointing that out. We have upset Mr Mckays mini celebration to advise him in a Tweet that the evidence against Bamber far outweighs anything that he has brought to the table and pointing out that unsound does not mean innocent. We will keep you advised if he has the balls to answer us.
ps good to have you back John, hope you had a pleasant trip?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 30, 2012, 03:10:36 PM
Just to update you all. Simon McKay had his planned visit with Bamber this morning and reports...
Jeremy Bamber, despite being in his 27th year of imprisonment, mentally strong during my visit with him this morning. CCRC decision awaited
Happy days! 8@??)(
Thank you for pointing that out. We have upset Mr Mckays mini celebration to advise him in a Tweet that the evidence against Bamber far outweighs anything that he has brought to the table and pointing out that unsound does not mean innocent. We will keep you advised if he has the balls to answer us.
ps good to have you back John, hope you had a pleasant trip?
I certainly did and met some lovely people in the process. Unfortunately I wasn't able to fit in everything that I had planned to do but that will keep until after the CCRC decision.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 30, 2012, 03:26:51 PM
Do the members of bamber's forum think that they are helping him? I can't believe that he would want anyone reading that lunacy and libel.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 30, 2012, 03:36:38 PM
Do the members of bamber's forum think that they are helping him? I can't believe that he would want anyone reading that lunacy and libel.
You being a country person will know that a trapped animal will attack and that is exactly the position the Bamber campaign is at now. They have absolutely nowhere to go. Their best theories have been rubbished by our members to the extent that they have to resort to fantasy characters in order keep their forum alive. Best stand back and watch them self-destruct. 8((()*/
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Admin on March 30, 2012, 03:48:15 PM
Credit where credit is due, Mark Williams-Thomas has responded to our point and tweets.....
Mark Williams-Thomas @mwilliamsthomas @Justice_forum Am very happy to have a sensible debate- you are convinced Bamber is guilty & that is fine ....
@Justice_forum But you need to consider the evidence in relation to the 3 aspects the trial judge said were at the center of the case ..
To us this would indicate that they are attempting to get Bamber out on a technicality rather than evidence of his innocence.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 30, 2012, 03:53:01 PM
Credit where credit is due, Mark Williams-Thomas has responded to our point and tweets.....
Mark Williams-Thomas @mwilliamsthomas @Justice_forum Am very happy to have a sensible debate- you are convinced Bamber is guilty & that is fine ....
@Justice_forum But you need to consider the evidence in relation to the 3 aspects the trial judge said were at the center of the case ..
To us this would indicate that they are attempting to get Bamber out on a technicality rather than evidence of his innocence.
This is the danger when you apply modern day science to an early 1980's case. They have had nearly 27 years to do tests on some poor old dead porky carcass but chose never to do so.
In the final analysis however, the evidence which clears Sheila is overwhelming rendering Bambr guilty by default. Had he not told the police that his father had told him that Sheila had the gun he might just have got away with it.
Fatal mistake indeed boyo!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 30, 2012, 04:20:07 PM
How do these people lsleep knowing they are accusing a murdered girl of abusing the dead body of the father she adored. It is quite shameful.
Any intelligent person looking at the evidence can easily see Sheila couldn't have committed those murders.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 30, 2012, 04:44:42 PM
Former Essex Police Sergeant Chris Bews explains to interviewer Mark Williams-Thomas how Jeremy Bamber told him as they walked around the perimeter of the farmhouse that he had seen movement at an upstairs window.
Bews stated that he thought it was merely a reflection from a window pane on one of the upper floors. He was quite satisfied that there was no movement.
(http://i.imgur.com/ffhna.jpg)
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 30, 2012, 05:00:52 PM
Former Essex Police detective Inspector and Scene of Crimes Officer Ronald Cook entered the farmhouse at around 9.20am on the morning of the murders.
He recalls that Nevill Bamber was in the kitchen near the fire. Upstairs in the main bedroom June Bambers body was lying in the doorway and on the far side of the bed was Sheila Caffell's body and in an adjoining bedroom were the body of the two twins. It was quite apparent that they had all suffered a number of wounds caused by bullets.
(http://i.imgur.com/JP4ut.jpg)
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 30, 2012, 05:05:30 PM
(http://i.imgur.com/dg9Qo.jpg)
Sheila, June and the twins in happier times.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 30, 2012, 05:25:36 PM
(http://i.imgur.com/IIBsO.jpg)
At Jeremy Bamber's trial, the judge in his summing up directed the jury to three crucial questions...
1. Did they believe Julie Mugford or Jeremy Bamber?
2. Did they believe that Nevill Bamber had made a phone call to his son Jeremy in the early hours.
3. And were they sure that Sheila did not kill the others before committing suicide and in particular did they believe a silencer was used?
If so they could conclude Jeremy was guilty.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 30, 2012, 05:38:10 PM
Preece has obviously been warned after last night's odious outbursts. It won't last.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 30, 2012, 05:41:31 PM
Former convicted fraudster and now Guardian prisons reporter Eric Allison stated that it cannot be more significant the judge in summing up told the jury that on the evidence of the silencer alone you may find Mr Bamber guilty.
(http://i.imgur.com/zyzIm.jpg)
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 30, 2012, 05:42:28 PM
Preece has obviously been warned after last night's odious outbursts. It won't last.
It never does Alfonso. What did she say last night anyway as I was far too busy to look at fantasy forum.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Matthew Wyse on March 30, 2012, 05:53:01 PM
Some excellent quotes on this thread chaps, it is quite remarkable how much you don't take in on one viewing alone. The more I watch the programme the more i believe that Jeremy is the schizophrenic and not his sister as he attempted to claim in the film.
Here is the link for anyone wanting to view it today.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_i2CjYDJGTo
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 30, 2012, 06:05:55 PM
Preece has obviously been warned after last night's odious outbursts. It won't last.
It never does Alfonso. What did she say last night anyway as I was far too busy to look at fantasy forum.
The usual bitter, jealous, personal insults aimed at Julie Mugford. Would that Preece had a millionth of Julie's grace and dignity.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 30, 2012, 06:18:39 PM
Big surprise .... Gladys, Buddy and The Roach are all agreed that the programme was crap for the Bamberettes! I congratulate these three for being honest ... unlike Nelly 1006 (who is actively involved in trying to free The Beast) who think's the programme was excellent.
There was an excellent programme on a notorious murder last night but it was David Vine's piece on the Annie Dewani murder! That's how it's done ITV.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 30, 2012, 06:21:50 PM
Preece has obviously been warned after last night's odious outbursts. It won't last.
It never does Alfonso. What did she say last night anyway as I was far too busy to look at fantasy forum.
The usual bitter, jealous, personal insults aimed at Julie Mugford. Would that Preece had a millionth of Julie's grace and dignity.
Hear, hear. Nicely put!
Why is it she has it in for all the women in this case? Ann and Julie were her initial targets and then she started on our very own Shona and Andrea. Jeremy is lucky to have such a wonderful woman on his side. I am sure he will be grateful for all she has done as he spends the next 25 years behind bars because the silly cow cannot hold her tongue.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 30, 2012, 06:43:26 PM
Preece has obviously been warned after last night's odious outbursts. It won't last.
It never does Alfonso. What did she say last night anyway as I was far too busy to look at fantasy forum.
The usual bitter, jealous, personal insults aimed at Julie Mugford. Would that Preece had a millionth of Julie's grace and dignity.
Hear, hear. Nicely put!
Why is it she has it in for all the women in this case? Ann and Julie were her initial targets and then she started on our very own Shona and Andrea. Jeremy is lucky to have such a wonderful woman on his side. I am sure he will be grateful for all she has done as he spends the next 25 years behind bars because the silly cow cannot hold her tongue.
Don't forget Ann's daughter, Danielle Hammond and all the other women Bamber has ever known, the mutts in the Campaign Shed, Weety and Aunt Agatha .... the sad life a desperately lonely Bamber stalker!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Mr Justice K on March 30, 2012, 08:02:51 PM
Then there was Stephanie Hall whom she abused a few days ago. Where is she by the way? 8-)(--)
I found this quote by Jackie Preece on the Bamber forum....
"She is a sad desperate women obsessed with Jeremy like Sarah Hanover and the washed up page 3 model Daniele Hammond."
She is most certainly a bad omen for any miscarriage of justice campaign.
On the issue of the referral to the Court of Appeal I can see no evidence which can in any way lead a judge to the decision that there may have been a miscarriage of justice. I have no doubt whatsoever that the CCRC will not refer his case on the basis that there just is no evidence of wrongful conviction to support such a referral. The Court of Appeal will always uphold a conviction and err on safety unless substantial new evidence is forthcoming and within a reasonable time. In the Bamber case this does not hold true.
I also feel that the actions of Jeremy Bamber activists has had a negative impact on his campaign and since the public are very unforgiving when it comes to such things, this will inevitably detract from the work being done by his legal team.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 30, 2012, 10:09:23 PM
Anyone else noticed that packagebuilder has suddenly forgotten that he usually writes like lady c? That lot can't get anything right! @)(++(* @)(++(* @)(++(*
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 30, 2012, 11:05:02 PM
Hi, everyone, interesting forum, you've got some real comedians on here! I follow the other forum too, but as I'm not a supporter there's no point in my posting on there. I've seen what happens! It seems like last night's documentary has generated no new interest in Jeremy Bamber. Does anyone on here know how it was financed?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: la la land on March 30, 2012, 11:23:23 PM
hey ade.
Im not sure who financed it. But it was crap so it does not matter @)(++(*
Bamber going no where fast, are you aware of his top groupie?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 30, 2012, 11:48:37 PM
Hi, everyone, interesting forum, you've got some real comedians on here! I follow the other forum too, but as I'm not a supporter there's no point in my posting on there. I've seen what happens! It seems like last night's documentary has generated no new interest in Jeremy Bamber. Does anyone on here know how it was financed?
It was privately financed with no legal aid. I believe Bamber supporters paid for the USA research. ITV probably funded the programme.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Tim Invictus on March 30, 2012, 11:50:56 PM
I thought the ITV prime time programme might give the case a massive boost ..... I just wasn't expecting it to be for the guilty camp!
8((()*/ 8((()*/
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 31, 2012, 12:07:31 AM
I thought the ITV prime time programme might give the case a massive boost ..... I just wasn't expecting it to be for the guilty camp!
8((()*/ 8((()*/
I believe they all thought that as well thus when it went pear shaped they all went to bed early. It is clear to see that if that is the very best Simon McKay can come up with then it looks like the end game for cinders.
Just for the record, I have got some additional quotes to polish off from the film so that all these brave sentiments of innocence by certain professionals can be viewed further down the line.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Admin on March 31, 2012, 12:15:31 AM
I thought the ITV prime time programme might give the case a massive boost ..... I just wasn't expecting it to be for the guilty camp!
8((()*/ 8((()*/
I believe they all thought that as well thus when it went pear shaped they all went to bed early. It is clear to see that if that is the very best Simon McKay can come up with then it looks like the end game for cinders.
Just for the record, I have got some additional quotes to polish off from the film so that all these brave sentiments of innocence by certain professionals can be viewed further down the line.
We have had a nice steady run on questions on Twitter today, some public and some private. It never ceases to surprise us how many people are scared to post openly about this case. Threats of violences and intimidation seem to be the order of the day.
Are we going to let these bullies scare us into submission? Are we hell! 8((()*/
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 31, 2012, 12:18:52 AM
Well Jackie Preece and Grahame Belton seem to believe that they can threaten and intimidate posters without suffering the consequences of such actions. I can assure every single member of this forum that I have had talks with Brentwood Police about these people and they are well aware of their activities at a senior level.
If anyone wants to have contact with these officers all you have to do is to pm me.
The writing, as they say, is on the wall! 8@??)(
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: joey on March 31, 2012, 03:09:34 AM
you guys are awesome at exposing those sleaze balls and everything they stand for. keep up the great work. 8((()*/
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 31, 2012, 07:50:45 AM
Im not sure who financed it. But it was crap so it does not matter @)(++(*
Bamber going no where fast, are you aware of his top groupie?
I sure am! I've watched posters such as Petey try to have a reasonable discussion with her, I'm afraid I'm not interested in being accused of being a family member. The lady members over there on the whole are quite aggressive! I must admit I enjoyed the documentary, it was pretty fair, but far too much in it for someone new to the case, I feel that they would have lost interest during the firearms experiments. Very suprised that it ended as it did, on such a negative note for Jeremy.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 31, 2012, 04:53:16 PM
Absolutely no new interest over on the Bamber forum since the documentary. You'd expect some? It wasn't THAT bad.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 31, 2012, 05:17:12 PM
Absolutely no new interest over on the Bamber forum since the documentary. You'd expect some? It wasn't THAT bad.
well lets face it, that forum is pretty much a closed shop. i think the images used in the doc didn't help - it seems that it is impossible to find a picture of bamber not looking haughty or arrogant.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on March 31, 2012, 09:21:28 PM
I found it interesting that Julie Smerchanski wouldn't cooperate with them and didn't even acknowledge their approaches. I have Julie's contact details in Canada and will try and see if she will give me a comment. I have a feeling she may want to have her say at this stage in the proceedings. I will of course be bringing to her attention the libel effectively made against her by Jackie Preece and others.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 31, 2012, 10:54:39 PM
I found it interesting that Julie Smerchanski wouldn't cooperate with them and didn't even acknowledge their approaches. I have Julie's contact details in Canada and will try and see if she will give me a comment. I have a feeling she may want to have her say at this stage in the proceedings. I will of course be bringing to her attention the libel effectively made against her by Jackie Preece and others.
After the disappointment of the documentary it would seem that the Jeremy Bamber forum is in it's death throes. I wonder how many of them will defeat graciously when it comes?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on March 31, 2012, 11:08:39 PM
I think the writing has been on the wall for a long time now, Agnes - I doubt if the last few die-hards will change their minds. They'll just keep on keeping on, endlessly re-hashing. I'm not really suprised that bamber has cut them loose.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Claudia on April 01, 2012, 08:53:53 PM
He would appear to have ostracised Mike T by the looks of things following his ali bongo and agent z mischief on the forum. Jeremy was concerned for Tesko's mental health and his ability to make proper judgements in the case. By the looks of it his concerns were warranted. And it was going so well at one stage for them all. Shame 8)><(
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on April 01, 2012, 10:23:57 PM
Mark Williams-Thomas made a very bad mistake at 6.00 in the film when he stated that Sheila Caffell had been killed by two shotgun wounds to her throat when we know that there were no shotgun cartridges fired that morning at the farmhouse and the only gun which was fired was a Anschütz .22 calibre semi-automatic rifle.
I cannot believe that in such a program about a real life murder that an experienced former detective could have made such an obvious error. Do they not check these documentaries before they transmit them?
Very poor show ITV1. (http://www.katzy.dsl.pipex.com/Smileys/c001.gif)
Jeremy Bamber - the New Evidence video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_i2CjYDJGTo)
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Admin on April 01, 2012, 10:29:38 PM
Mark Williams-Thomas made a very bad mistake at 6.00 in the film when he stated that Sheila Caffell had been killed by two shotgun wounds to her throat when we know that there were no shotgun cartridges fired that morning at the farmhouse and the only gun which was fired was a Anschütz .22 calibre semi-automatic rifle.
I cannot believe that in such a program about a real life murder that an experienced former detective could have made such an obvious error. Do they not check these documentaries before they transmit them?
Very poor show ITV1. (http://www.katzy.dsl.pipex.com/Smileys/c001.gif)
Jeremy Bamber - the New Evidence video (http://www.itv.com/itvplayer/video/?Filter=313869)
FYI We have asked Mr Williams-Thomas for an explanation for this so we will post his response when it arrives.
Just to update you on the questions we asked Simon McKay last week about the case, lets say we are not surprised that he has chosen to not reply. Says it all really!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Milly on April 02, 2012, 12:11:31 PM
Mark Williams-Thomas made a very bad mistake at 6.00 in the film when he stated that Sheila Caffell had been killed by two shotgun wounds to her throat when we know that there were no shotgun cartridges fired that morning at the farmhouse and the only gun which was fired was a Anschütz .22 calibre semi-automatic rifle.
I cannot believe that in such a program about a real life murder that an experienced former detective could have made such an obvious error. Do they not check these documentaries before they transmit them?
Very poor show ITV1. (http://www.katzy.dsl.pipex.com/Smileys/c001.gif)
Jeremy Bamber - the New Evidence video (http://www.itv.com/itvplayer/video/?Filter=313869)
I find myself asking the question what was the intention of the tonight program? If it was intended as a serious attempt to look at the Jeremy Bamber conviction then I think it failed terribly. IMO passing on the information that the CCRC decision would be made in April was a breach of legal etiquette as far as McKay was concerned and quite extraordinary. His gun ho approach to law is somewhat bizarre.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Admin on April 02, 2012, 12:47:37 PM
Watch the Tonight Programme now on YouTube...
Just ignore the wrongly convicted propaganda!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_i2CjYDJGTo
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 02, 2012, 05:10:36 PM
the documentary just didn't cut it, none of it was striking or memorable. it won't have helped Bamber in the slightest way. I don't think he's going anywhere, and no more money should be wasted on him. He's had his chance.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on April 02, 2012, 05:16:27 PM
the documentary just didn't cut it, none of it was striking or memorable. it won't have helped Bamber in the slightest way. I don't think he's going anywhere, and no more money should be wasted on him. He's had his chance.
Indeed Oakley. A bit of an own goal for Simon McKay me thinks! (http://www.katzy.dsl.pipex.com/Smileys/c001.gif)
I must have watched it about 20 times over the last few days in order to copy the script and get screen shots and the more I do the less I am impressed with any of it. The story line was appalling and I see that Mark Williams-Thomas hasn't answered the criticism about saying that Sheila was shot twice by shotgun. The most notable part of the whole video is at the very end where David Boutflour comments that it must end now! 8@??)(
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: abs on April 02, 2012, 08:08:10 PM
Part I (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=YSK5Vhhisko)
Part II (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kgmImKHTimI&list=UU1UbYVDDLDwl9S0L6-6w3FA&index=1&feature=plcp)
THANKS!! 8((()*/ Now I can finally see it!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Angelo222 on April 03, 2012, 02:49:53 PM
The vast majority of viewers won't know that they have been suckered. It just goes to show that if a national company like ITV can broadcast erroneous information in this case how many of their other programs in the case are similarly flawed. In my opinion we should write to the ITV and demand they correct the basic errors they made in the film.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on April 03, 2012, 03:10:16 PM
The vast majority of viewers won't know that they have been suckered. It just goes to show that if a national company like ITV can broadcast erroneous information in this case how many of their other programs in the case are similarly flawed. In my opinion we should write to the ITV and demand they correct the basic errors they made in the film.
That is an excellent suggestion Dave. ITV should be left in no doubt that their programme was tainted wit errors. They might think that they can get away with this in some drama but in a true life situation such errors are so unprofessional.
Maybe admin can start a Twitter campaign to highlight the flaws in the Tonight programme?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 03, 2012, 03:11:11 PM
The vast majority of viewers won't know that they have been suckered. It just goes to show that if a national company like ITV can broadcast erroneous information in this case how many of their other programs in the case are similarly flawed. In my opinion we should write to the ITV and demand they correct the basic errors they made in the film.
I might be wrong, but is thick, dead pigs hide the same as human skin?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on April 03, 2012, 03:23:26 PM
The vast majority of viewers won't know that they have been suckered. It just goes to show that if a national company like ITV can broadcast erroneous information in this case how many of their other programs in the case are similarly flawed. In my opinion we should write to the ITV and demand they correct the basic errors they made in the film.
I might be wrong, but is thick, dead pigs hide the same as human skin?
You are right of course, it is not the same. In fact dead pig skin will behave or react differently from live pig skin. I wonder is McKay trying to prove that Sheila was shot the second time after she was already dead because that is what he has done. Has he in fact scored an OWN GOAL ??????
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Angelo222 on April 03, 2012, 03:30:11 PM
The vast majority of viewers won't know that they have been suckered. It just goes to show that if a national company like ITV can broadcast erroneous information in this case how many of their other programs in the case are similarly flawed. In my opinion we should write to the ITV and demand they correct the basic errors they made in the film.
I might be wrong, but is thick, dead pigs hide the same as human skin?
You are right of course, it is not the same. In fact dead pig skin will behave or react differently from live pig skin. I wonder is McKay trying to prove that Sheila was shot the second time after she was already dead because that is what he has done. Has he in fact scored an OWN GOAL ??????
Well spotted guys. So what Simon McKay has actually proven is that Sheila may have been shot when she was dead. I would love to see Tesko and Roach try to explain that one. I cannot believe he could have been so stupid as to not have seen that for himself. They do say justice is blind.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Angelo222 on April 03, 2012, 03:42:48 PM
The vast majority of viewers won't know that they have been suckered. It just goes to show that if a national company like ITV can broadcast erroneous information in this case how many of their other programs in the case are similarly flawed. In my opinion we should write to the ITV and demand they correct the basic errors they made in the film.
That is an excellent suggestion Dave. ITV should be left in no doubt that their programme was tainted wit errors. They might think that they can get away with this in some drama but in a true life situation such errors are so unprofessional.
Maybe admin can start a Twitter campaign to highlight the flaws in the Tonight programme?
I feel that it is to important to let slide. Mark Williams Thomas clearly stated in the film that Sheila was shot twice in the throat with a shotgun. This was an unforgivable error to make in such a program which was broadcast to some 8 million viewers. ITV should come out and explain why they allowed such a mistake to have been made. Were the lab tests they arranged just as incompetent?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 03, 2012, 03:47:23 PM
I doubt if anyone really thinks that Sheila shot herself twice. Whatever they say. And she looks like she just got out of bed. (Or was taken from her bed)
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Angelo222 on April 03, 2012, 05:51:24 PM
I doubt if anyone really thinks that Sheila shot herself twice. Whatever they say. And she looks like she just got out of bed. (Or was taken from her bed)
I don't believe there is any evidence that she was shot anywhere other than where she was found but there is every reason to believe that she may have been rendered unconscious before being carried there. The evidence for this though would be difficult to establish but her calm appearance certainly suggests such a scenario.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 03, 2012, 06:22:11 PM
I have to ask - why does the other forum keep writing such nonsense? Do they want Bamber freed, or do they want to make him a laughing stock?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: goatboy on April 03, 2012, 06:37:37 PM
Also isn't part of the problem with their new evidence that the end of the rifle couldn't possibly have heated up to 200 degrees (which they acknowledged) so the tests are irrelevant anyway?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 03, 2012, 06:44:24 PM
Also isn't part of the problem with their new evidence that the end of the rifle couldn't possibly have heated up to 200 degrees (which they acknowledged) so the tests are irrelevant anyway?
Heated up in the Aga apparently, for some bizarre reason yet to be fully explained. I think that many posters on the Tesko forum write because they have nothing else to do. Hence the nonsense.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Weety on April 03, 2012, 07:42:11 PM
You have to wonder as well, how they're going to get this past the 'new evidence' test required for an appeal. There was nothing in those tests that couldn't have been done 26 years ago.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on April 03, 2012, 10:33:46 PM
I have to ask - why does the other forum keep writing such nonsense? Do they want Bamber freed, or do they want to make him a laughing stock?
That's a good point Smokey. By all accounts the latter if what has been posted there in the last 6 weeks is anything to go by. I have said it many times that I think Jeremy should be pitied if anything as those who profess to be his supporters are little better than a bunch of football hooligans. Actually, I think the football supporters are probably better behaved if the truth be known. @)(++(*
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on April 04, 2012, 09:15:19 PM
Some great news tonight.
One of the radio stations wants me to brief them on the evidence against Jeremy Bamber. Seems they are so impressed by this forum and all that we do together. Well done everyone!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Jerry on April 04, 2012, 09:41:22 PM
I take it this is a response to what Simon McKay was promoting last week on ITV and on the radio at the weekend?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: goatboy on April 04, 2012, 10:23:26 PM
Transcripts of Bamber's interviews with police under caution. My interpretation of this is that Jeremy comes across as very slippery and evasive-particularly in the way he refuses to answer certain questions (not wanting to incriminate himself by telling the truth perhaps?). In fact he comes across so badly I cannot believe it was posted on Tesko's forum.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on April 04, 2012, 10:46:22 PM
I take it this is a response to what Simon McKay was promoting last week on ITV and on the radio at the weekend?
Yes Jerry, as you are probably aware the forum is conducting a campaign on Twitter in respect of various cases. There has been an amazing response with nearly 3,500 followers in the few weeks since going live. The vast majority of these followers are law professionals, writers, journalists and TV producers from all over the UK and further afield.
It was only a matter of time before the Press got wind of what was really going on in the Bamber case and I intend to set them straight.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on April 04, 2012, 10:56:51 PM
Transcripts of Bamber's interviews with police under caution. My interpretation of this is that Jeremy comes across as very slippery and evasive-particularly in the way he refuses to answer certain questions (not wanting to incriminate himself by telling the truth perhaps?). In fact he comes across so badly I cannot believe it was posted on Tesko's forum.
A liar is always caught out in the end. Jeremy could even remember who he telephoned first on the morning of the murders because he said one thing to the press and something else to the police.
I can tell you that he telephoned Julie Mugford at 3am but he didn't telephone the police until after 3.26am. So why was he telling some people that he telephoned Julie after having telephoned the police. He was caught out in his own web of deceit.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Admin on April 04, 2012, 11:13:02 PM
Transcripts of Bamber's interviews with police under caution. My interpretation of this is that Jeremy comes across as very slippery and evasive-particularly in the way he refuses to answer certain questions (not wanting to incriminate himself by telling the truth perhaps?). In fact he comes across so badly I cannot believe it was posted on Tesko's forum.
Thanks for reminding of those statements goatboy. When we finish putting up the remainder of Julie Mugfords diary we will post those statements for everyone to read here.
Nice one on the radio interview John! 8@??)(
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 04, 2012, 11:16:28 PM
Welcome to the forum, Fred. I hope you find it interesting.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 05, 2012, 08:43:11 AM
however hard I try I just cannot make head or tail of Mike tesko's posts, he contradicts himself 100 times a day (I hesitate to use the term lie). his head seems to be full of magic. he would earn more respect if he came clean and admitted that he is as puzzled about the case as everyone else. my apologies if all this are the consequences of an illness, but if that is the case he should walk away for a while and concentrate on himself. i fear he is damaging any chance that Jeremy Bamber has of being taken seriously. it just looks like a confused man's obsession.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 05, 2012, 10:34:47 AM
if the officers huddled round the body on the floor for half an hour, in a pickle, at what stage was the body on the bed? Mike Tesko says he has seen a picture of the body on the bed. I'm not saying that he's making it up as he goes along but i am confused, and dare not ask questions on his forum because of abrasive members.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 05, 2012, 10:59:53 AM
i wonder how many officers mike tesko is including in his suggested cover-up conspiracy? wouldn't it have been like ripples in a pond?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 05, 2012, 11:01:26 AM
by his own admission many officers were traipsing through the house that morning
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 05, 2012, 12:02:03 PM
and is mike tesko still running with his theory from a few days ago, that June sat in bed, plotting and scheming, and it was her who shot the family?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Angelo222 on April 05, 2012, 01:03:26 PM
if the officers huddled round the body on the floor for half an hour, in a pickle, at what stage was the body on the bed? Mike Tesko says he has seen a picture of the body on the bed. I'm not saying that he's making it up as he goes along but i am confused, and dare not ask questions on his forum because of abrasive members.
It is so simple really. The people who lifted the body probably laid her out on the bed before removal to the mortuary. The most obvious explanations are sometimes the hardest to comprehend.
Mike Tesko has lost all credibility, even Jeremy Bamber doesn't believe his nonsense any more. It is quite true what a senior police officer wrote of Tesko many years ago that Jeremy Bamber would have been freed on parole by now if it hadn't been for Tesko filling his head with nonsense. Jeremy must now realise this and resent him all the more for it.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 05, 2012, 01:07:56 PM
Make no mistake. Bamber is exactly where Tesko and Preece want him to be.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Harvey on April 05, 2012, 01:08:55 PM
if the officers huddled round the body on the floor for half an hour, in a pickle, at what stage was the body on the bed? Mike Tesko says he has seen a picture of the body on the bed. I'm not saying that he's making it up as he goes along but i am confused, and dare not ask questions on his forum because of abrasive members.
It is so simple really. The people who lifted the body probably laid her out on the bed before removal to the mortuary. The most obvious explanations are sometimes the hardest to comprehend.
Mike Tesko has lost all credibility, even Jeremy Bamber doesn't believe his nonsense any more. It is quite true what a senior police officer wrote of Tesko many years ago that Jeremy Bamber would have been freed on parole by now if it hadn't been for Tesko filling his head with nonsense. Jeremy must now realise this and resent him all the more for it.
Just so David. I dont believe for a minute anything Tesko posts in any event but Sheilas body may have been placed on the bed momentarily to facilitate removal from the scene. Why a photograph of this was taken is anybodys guess.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Angelo222 on April 05, 2012, 01:27:43 PM
if the officers huddled round the body on the floor for half an hour, in a pickle, at what stage was the body on the bed? Mike Tesko says he has seen a picture of the body on the bed. I'm not saying that he's making it up as he goes along but i am confused, and dare not ask questions on his forum because of abrasive members.
It is so simple really. The people who lifted the body probably laid her out on the bed before removal to the mortuary. The most obvious explanations are sometimes the hardest to comprehend.
Mike Tesko has lost all credibility, even Jeremy Bamber doesn't believe his nonsense any more. It is quite true what a senior police officer wrote of Tesko many years ago that Jeremy Bamber would have been freed on parole by now if it hadn't been for Tesko filling his head with nonsense. Jeremy must now realise this and resent him all the more for it.
Just so David. I dont believe for a minute anything Tesko posts in any event but Sheilas body may have been placed on the bed momentarily to facilitate removal from the scene. Why a photograph of this was taken is anybodys guess.
Most people have got wise to him by now as just about everything he promotes is either fabricated or fictional. He has failed to provide a single tangible piece of evidence which could in any way help Jeremy Bamber in all the years he has been doing what he is doing and that for me says it all.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 05, 2012, 05:53:16 PM
i wonder how many officers mike tesko is including in his suggested cover-up conspiracy? wouldn't it have been like ripples in a pond?
according to mike tesko's latest post, the police photographer DEFINITELY knew that sheila was on the bed with one shot. is there any way of finding the identity of this person?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Judas Preece on April 05, 2012, 06:02:16 PM
Tesko is just a sad old ex.con porn pervert trying to get attention. Just google his name and you will see what a pervert he is! Best ignored like Bamber does!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 05, 2012, 06:02:55 PM
That's a good question. Seems like we need a Hartley over here!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 05, 2012, 06:06:16 PM
Tesko is just a sad old ex.con porn pervert trying to get attention. Just google his name and you will see what a pervert he is! Best ignored like Bamber does!
Dear me. Are we sure that's the same Teskowski? That's nasty.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 05, 2012, 06:14:18 PM
Tesko is just a sad old ex.con porn pervert trying to get attention. Just google his name and you will see what a pervert he is! Best ignored like Bamber does!
Dear me. Are we sure that's the same Teskowski? That's nasty.
I'm pretty new to this, but can't help noticing that Tesko's main forum member is a semi illiterate, choleric, elderly lady. Angry of Brentwood. Doesn't really inspire one with confidence.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 05, 2012, 06:19:04 PM
That's a good question. Seems like we need a Hartley over here!
It's a shame to see Hartley sucking up to that Preece woman. Seems like he's being made to toe the line, like the rest of them. He used to have a real edge.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: scream on April 05, 2012, 07:03:34 PM
jackie cant wait for the child killers blogger to come out, what an exciting life the stupid old hag must have. anyone know what she looks like? she reckon she is stunning and beautiful.Just been looking at her posts on the other forum shes a psychotic s...k and she has the cheek to call other people, even sheila caffell who was genuinly stunning.she hates danielle hamond the former model who now goes out with bamber,preece doesnt like any female to get attention of the child killer except herself, sad old witch hehehehe
she still stalking members on here?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: scream on April 05, 2012, 07:08:13 PM
this is funny, roch says that people have backed off due to things not case related yes they have all backed off because of preece, are you so silly you cant see that roch but the s...k still posts they must love her on the forum or are shit scared of her hehehe
or they have been banned tesko and co dont like their little rose coloured world spoiling with the truth so anyone who dont believe bamber gets banned, some forum 8@??)(
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on April 05, 2012, 07:34:41 PM
this is funny, roch says that people have backed off due to things not case related yes they have all backed off because of preece, are you so silly you cant see that roch but the s...k still posts they must love her on the forum or are shit scared of her hehehe
or they have been banned tesko and co dont like their little rose coloured world spoiling with the truth so anyone who dont believe bamber gets banned, some forum 8@??)(
I don't think they have anything left to offer now that the case is before the CCRC and its final death knell. Mike tried to resurrect some of the old arguments but they are as worthless now as they were before. I also believe that the ITV Tonight programme was a total and utter mitigated disaster for them. Simon McKay had led everyone to believe that he had discovered some marvellous new evidence when all along all he had to offer was technicalities. Technicalities will not overturn a conviction for murdering five people including two children. If anyone believes for a minute that they will then they are living in cloud cuckoo land with La La.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on April 05, 2012, 07:40:01 PM
i wonder how many officers mike tesko is including in his suggested cover-up conspiracy? wouldn't it have been like ripples in a pond?
according to mike tesko's latest post, the police photographer DEFINITELY knew that sheila was on the bed with one shot. is there any way of finding the identity of this person?
It was PC Bird.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 05, 2012, 08:03:02 PM
thank you. Is it known if he is still alive? because if he is, Mike could get agent z to speak to him
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Angelo222 on April 05, 2012, 08:05:54 PM
i wonder how many officers mike tesko is including in his suggested cover-up conspiracy? wouldn't it have been like ripples in a pond?
according to mike tesko's latest post, the police photographer DEFINITELY knew that sheila was on the bed with one shot. is there any way of finding the identity of this person?
Just ask yourself the question, what would Sheila be doing lying on a bed with one shot to her throat after 9am when we know from every single witness report that she had two shots to her throat when found on the floor at 7.45am?
Anyone who believes a word Mike Teskoswski posts is as deluded as he is.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 05, 2012, 08:07:59 PM
thank you. Is it known if he is still alive? because if he is, Mike could get agent z to speak to him
He is still alive according to my latest information as are most of those who attended the shooting that morning. Getting agent Z to speak to PC Bird is akin to having the Dalai Lama invite a Yeti to tea...it just couldn't happen!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on April 05, 2012, 08:12:29 PM
That's a good question. Seems like we need a Hartley over here!
It's a shame to see Hartley sucking up to that Preece woman. Seems like he's being made to toe the line, like the rest of them. He used to have a real edge.
Hartley probably wants to stay on there until the decision. Playing ball with Preece is the only way. That's why hardly anyone posts anymore.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Myster on April 06, 2012, 08:09:16 AM
Did anyone notice that the Anschutz 525 used in the ITV tests was a short-barreled version, not the same as the long-barreled actual murder weapon held by PC Whiddon in the old b&w photo.
Look at the side view in YouTube ITV film part 2.., pause at 3:13 and take a screenshot.
(I use the free "Irfanview"...Options...Capture/Screenshot...5)Custom rectangle/region capture...Choose a Destination directory...then Start).
Find and open the captured pic. and compare with the b&w photo side by side.
What effect if any, would an increased barrel length have on the presence of deposit around the wounds?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Weety on April 06, 2012, 09:42:43 AM
Did anyone notice that the Anschutz 525 used in the ITV tests was a short-barreled version, not the same as the long-barreled actual murder weapon held by PC Whiddon in the old b&w photo.
Look at the side view in YouTube ITV film part 2.., pause at 3:13 and take a screenshot.
(I use the free "Irfanview"...Options...Capture/Screenshot...5)Custom rectangle/region capture...Choose a Destination directory...then Start).
Find and open the captured pic. and compare with the b&w photo side by side.
What effect if any, would an increased barrel length have on the presence of deposit around the wounds?
That's a good point, could you post the screen shots? Although I would hope that they used the correct weapon in the Arizona tests.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Myster on April 06, 2012, 10:27:52 AM
Here you are Weety.
I can't get it to show up in Preview, so it may not show up here 8(8-))
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Weety on April 06, 2012, 11:31:34 AM
It shows fine for me, thanks for that. And yes, the barrel is clearly very much shorter.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Angelo222 on April 06, 2012, 01:41:46 PM
Did anyone notice that the Anschutz 525 used in the ITV tests was a short-barreled version, not the same as the long-barreled actual murder weapon held by PC Whiddon in the old b&w photo.
Look at the side view in YouTube ITV film part 2.., pause at 3:13 and take a screenshot.
(I use the free "Irfanview"...Options...Capture/Screenshot...5)Custom rectangle/region capture...Choose a Destination directory...then Start).
Find and open the captured pic. and compare with the b&w photo side by side.
What effect if any, would an increased barrel length have on the presence of deposit around the wounds?
That's a good point, could you post the screen shots? Although I would hope that they used the correct weapon in the Arizona tests.
Nicely pointed out!!! I did wonder at that but wrongly dismissed it. A longer barrel would also dissipate heat better as well so looks like the test was a bit of a joke. Can you do a Twitter release on this admin as this is yet another blot against that ITV prog?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Angelo222 on April 06, 2012, 01:57:04 PM
That's a good question. Seems like we need a Hartley over here!
Not if he deregisters and runs away every time he gets a decent challenge like has happened over there several times. They treat him and anyone else who disagrees with then with disdain and Hartley is finding it very frustrating if yesterdays posts are anything to go by. At least here he could guide the way with the background knowledge he has. In saying that though I am not convinced he is a he at all if you know what I mean?
I am quite sure he would be welcome regardless of previous comments, all water under the bridge at this stage.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on April 06, 2012, 02:41:59 PM
That's a good question. Seems like we need a Hartley over here!
Not if he deregisters and runs away every time he gets a decent challenge like has happened over there several times. They treat him and anyone else who disagrees with then with disdain and Hartley is finding it very frustrating if yesterdays posts are anything to go by. At least here he could guide the way with the background knowledge he has. In saying that though I am not convinced he is a he at all if you know what I mean?
I am quite sure he would be welcome regardless of previous comments, all water under the bridge at this stage.
I agree Dave. Hartley would do his or her cause so much more benefit by actually posting where he is appreciated and not condemned. I have a sneaky suspicion that he/she contributes anyway but it would be nice to see him/her use their own name which is available I believe.
How about it Hartley, are you up to the challenge bud?
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Admin on April 06, 2012, 05:25:29 PM
That's a good question. Seems like we need a Hartley over here!
Not if he deregisters and runs away every time he gets a decent challenge like has happened over there several times. They treat him and anyone else who disagrees with then with disdain and Hartley is finding it very frustrating if yesterdays posts are anything to go by. At least here he could guide the way with the background knowledge he has. In saying that though I am not convinced he is a he at all if you know what I mean?
I am quite sure he would be welcome regardless of previous comments, all water under the bridge at this stage.
I agree Dave. Hartley would do his or her cause so much more benefit by actually posting where he is appreciated and not condemned. I have a sneaky suspicion that he/she contributes anyway but it would be nice to see him/her use their own name which is available I believe.
How about it Hartley, are you up to the challenge bud?
In response to the above can we post this charming piece just posted by Buddy over on the Bamber forum...
You haven't changed too much Hartley! You are still of the opinion that all others are beneath you. The lie that the bout flours were rich has been exposed as a lie. I tire of your bullish comments, which have no foundation. I n my opinion you are a stuck up snob, and I take your comments with a pinch of salt. When you leave again Steve, make it perminant
That's a good question. Seems like we need a Hartley over here!
Not if he deregisters and runs away every time he gets a decent challenge like has happened over there several times. They treat him and anyone else who disagrees with then with disdain and Hartley is finding it very frustrating if yesterdays posts are anything to go by. At least here he could guide the way with the background knowledge he has. In saying that though I am not convinced he is a he at all if you know what I mean?
I am quite sure he would be welcome regardless of previous comments, all water under the bridge at this stage.
I agree Dave. Hartley would do his or her cause so much more benefit by actually posting where he is appreciated and not condemned. I have a sneaky suspicion that he/she contributes anyway but it would be nice to see him/her use their own name which is available I believe.
How about it Hartley, are you up to the challenge bud?
In response to the above can we post this charming piece just posted by Buddy over on the Bamber forum...
You haven't changed too much Hartley! You are still of the opinion that all others are beneath you. The lie that the bout flours were rich has been exposed as a lie. I tire of your bullish comments, which have no foundation. I n my opinion you are a stuck up snob, and I take your comments with a pinch of salt. When you leave again Steve, make it perminant
Absolutely charming, well at least Hartley cannot say you didn't tell him so. 8(0(*
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Admin on August 05, 2012, 05:14:17 PM
The original ITV Tonight programme was removed from YouTube a short time after it was aired but has been uploaded again by another member so that everyone can again view it.
This is a real must if you are interested in the Jeremy Bamber case. The funniest bit about it is the title.
Video: Bamber - The New Evidence (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_i2CjYDJGTo)
(http://i.imgur.com/K0fDO.jpg)
Retired Det Supt Mick Gradwell (left) discusses the case with presenter and former detective Mark Williams-Thomas.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: James on August 05, 2012, 05:39:51 PM
Hi........
Thanks for putting up that link as I never got a chance to see the original programme. 8((()*/
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: goatboy on August 05, 2012, 07:59:28 PM
Really not a great show. And I think people are pretty unanimous that it didn't particularly help team Bamber. David Boutflour had the last word, and Gradwell took a look at all the evidence "new" and otherwise and came to the conclusion that the conviction was safe.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: starryian on August 05, 2012, 08:32:09 PM
I think this case remains a particular fascination because of the manner in which the murders were carried out and concealed afterwards. The sheer horror of the murders were not lost on members of the press either; five members of the same family and one of them a beautiful ex-model is the kind of stuff the media dream of. However, ultimately it was the culprit that horrified us. A seemingly pleasant and good-looking young man with everything that life could offer at his fingertips, is actually a cold-blooded mass-murdering monster. It may have asked some searching questions of how we perceive each other and the case held a mirror to our obsession with appearence and habit of taking things at face value. A seemingly ordinary, decent middle class family had a killer in their midst and exposed a dysfunctional family at the heart of the drama. It also highlighted issues of mental health, religion, middle class attitudes, education, age-gap relations and adoption. It also highlighted that in this world...........evil knows no bounds.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: John on August 06, 2012, 02:37:54 AM
I think this case remains a particular fascination because of the manner in which the murders were carried out and concealed afterwards. The sheer horror of the murders were not lost on members of the press either; five members of the same family and one of them a beautiful ex-model is the kind of stuff the media dream of. However, ultimately it was the culprit that horrified us. A seemingly pleasant and good-looking young man with everything that life could offer at his fingertips, is actually a cold-blooded mass-murdering monster. It may have asked some searching questions of how we perceive each other and the case held a mirror to our obsession with appearence and habit of taking things at face value. A seemingly ordinary, decent middle class family had a killer in their midst and exposed a dysfunctional family at the heart of the drama. It also highlighted issues of mental health, religion, middle class attitudes, education, age-gap relations and adoption. It also highlighted that in this world...........evil knows no bounds.
The White House Farm murders have left many people aghast at the inhumanity which an otherwise respectable human being was capable of. The dreadful deed of murdering innocent 6-year-old twins as they slept has provoked many a heated debate. I personally feel that many people just cannot get their head around the idea that Jeremy Bamber could have done such a dreadful thing to his own family. This colours their judgement even though the evidence is there and clear for all to see if they want to see it. Problem is they don't want to believe it!
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: goatboy on August 06, 2012, 08:17:33 AM
The fact is he had to also murder his nephews to make sure he wouldn't have to share the inheritance. JM's statements confirm that he thought he would be doing Colin a favour by killing them according to his twisted logic.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on August 06, 2012, 09:17:49 AM
That's right, Mike. You "throw in the copy image of Sheila on the bed." It might as well be today, as opposed to the last 8 years when you could have done it, you bullshitting old fraud.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: puglove on August 06, 2012, 09:31:15 AM
That's right, Mike. You "throw in the copy image of Sheila on the bed." It might as well be today, as opposed to the last 8 years when you could have done it, you bullshitting old fraud.
It's plainly "game over" for Jeremy Bamber! 8@??)(
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: starryian on August 06, 2012, 09:39:36 AM
Indeed. Even if by some miracle it gets to CCRC they will insist on seeing all the evidence presented before them - without Tesko's spin added to it. He cannot spin his way through that like his does to supporters on the blue forum. No conspiracy theories, no mysterious 'third' party' no nit-picking and certainly no ENIGMA files. Just the plain evidence..............and we all know full well the result dont' we? The CCRC know it would be a complete waste of taxpayers money and so do we. Game over Bamber. 8@??)(
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: Matthew Wyse on August 06, 2012, 11:05:38 AM
The fact is he had to also murder his nephews to make sure he wouldn't have to share the inheritance. JM's statements confirm that he thought he would be doing Colin a favour by killing them according to his twisted logic.
If you think about it peeps how could someone be so utterly callous to shoot two beautiful innocent defenceless children in the head?? Hardened criminals don't usually tolerate child killers so I think Bambers persistent denials are for the benefit of his fellow prisoners. That is why he keeps in with as many of them as possible because he knows that he would be on a sticky wicket if he ever admitted to killing them. He would end up in a virtual solitary environment just like Huntley for his own safety.
Title: Re: Bamber case on ITV Tonight Programme 29th March 2012
Post by: starryian on August 06, 2012, 03:53:45 PM
The fact is he had to also murder his nephews to make sure he wouldn't have to share the inheritance. JM's statements confirm that he thought he would be doing Colin a favour by killing them according to his twisted logic.
If you think about it peeps how could someone be so utterly callous to shoot two beautiful innocent defenceless children in the head?? Hardened criminals don't usually tolerate child killers so I think Bambers persistent denials are for the benefit of his fellow prisoners. That is why he keeps in with as many of them as possible because he knows that he would be on a sticky wicket if he ever admitted to killing them. He would end up in a virtual solitary environment just like Huntley for his own safety.
A very good point Mark, Child-killer as you say are perceived as the 'lowest of the low' in the prison system unofficial heirarchy. The people who have served time wiith Bamber have mentioned that he was threatened on many occasions and and one occassion has his throat cut so severely that it just missed his carotid (main) artery. Luckily for him he made a full recovery. He is, according to some, 'not well liked' in prison for his arrogant, haughty and middle class attitudes. On one occasion he had to be segregated from the other prisoners for his own safety after he revealed that he may tell the media about the 'cushy' lifestyle that some prisoners have inside.