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Disappeared and Abducted Children and Young Adults => Madeleine McCann (3) disappeared from her parent's holiday apartment at Ocean Club, Praia da Luz, Portugal on 3 May 2007. No trace of her has ever been found. => Topic started by: John on May 05, 2014, 01:25:22 PM

Title: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: John on May 05, 2014, 01:25:22 PM
The UK CrimeStoppers organisation is currently offering a reward of up to £20,000 for information leading to the identification, arrest and prosecution of the person or persons responsible for the abduction of Madeleine McCann from Praia da Luz.

Surprising isn't it that there is no reward currently in place for the Safe Return Of Madeleine McCann!


(http://i.imgur.com/0SYkTgh.jpg?1-Madeleine_McCann-Abduction-Disappeared)

73
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Angelo222 on May 05, 2014, 01:59:02 PM
I must admit I never noticed that before which makes what is happening all the more suspicious imo.  Why has the Fund not offered a reward for her safe return, wasn't that the whole point in it being set up by Kennedy?

PS CH 4 is currently showcasing PdL.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: jassi on May 05, 2014, 02:04:56 PM
I must admit I never noticed that before which makes what is happening all the more suspicious imo.  Why has the Fund not offered a reward for her safe return, wasn't that the whole point in it being set up by Kennedy?

PS CH 4 is currently showcasing PdL.

You will need to address that question to the McCanns.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Mr Gray on May 05, 2014, 02:09:31 PM
The UK CrimeStoppers organisation is currently offering a reward of up to £20,000 for information leading to the identification, arrest and prosecution of the person or persons responsible for the abduction of Madeleine McCann from Praia da Luz.

Surprising isn't it that there is no reward currently in place for the Safe Return Of Madeleine McCann!


(http://i.imgur.com/0SYkTgh.jpg?1-Madeleine_McCann-Abduction-Disappeared)

isn't it SY offering this reward...and once again it CONFIRMS their belief in the abduction
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Air Con on May 08, 2014, 02:38:59 PM
isn't it SY offering this reward...and once again it CONFIRMS their belief in the abduction

Crimestoppers doesn't even mention the case on their website.

The exact wording also changes depending on the article you read.

There is a £20,000 reward for information leading to the arrest and prosecution of those responsible for Madeleine's disappearance.

Is how the Guardian tells it.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Victoria on May 08, 2014, 04:14:06 PM
Crimestoppers doesn't even mention the case on their website.

The exact wording also changes depending on the article you read.

There is a £20,000 reward for information leading to the arrest and prosecution of those responsible for Madeleine's disappearance.

Is how the Guardian tells it.

http://content.met.police.uk/Appeal/Madeleine-McCann-Appeal--October-2013/1400020463601/1257246745782

Appeal on Scotland Yards own website says abduction. End of.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Air Con on May 08, 2014, 04:30:57 PM
http://content.met.police.uk/Appeal/Madeleine-McCann-Appeal--October-2013/1400020463601/1257246745782

Appeal on Scotland Yards own website says abduction. End of.

Very mature.

In case you've missed it this is the actual remit of the Operation Grange investigation.

Op Grange Remit

The support and expertise proffered by the Commissioner will be provided by the Homicide & Serious Crime Command - SCD1. 

The activity, in the first instance, will be that of an ‘investigative review’.  This will entail a review of the whole of the investigation(s) which have been conducted in to the circumstances of Madeleine McCann’s disappearance.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Victoria on May 08, 2014, 04:34:52 PM
Very mature.

In case you've missed it this is the actual remit of the Operation Grange investigation.

Op Grange Remit

The support and expertise proffered by the Commissioner will be provided by the Homicide & Serious Crime Command - SCD1. 

The activity, in the first instance, will be that of an ‘investigative review’.  This will entail a review of the whole of the investigation(s) which have been conducted in to the circumstances of Madeleine McCann’s disappearance.

And which is more recent?
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Air Con on May 08, 2014, 08:26:49 PM
And which is more recent?

And which is the official remit of the operation?
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: pegasus on May 09, 2014, 03:40:35 AM
Why don't SY in the official wording of their reward simply replace the word "abduction" with the word "disappearance"?
It would not offend anyone and it would obviously still include abduction and it would remove what looks to all the world like an assumption of a particular type of solution which SY cannot possibly know is correct yet.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: John on May 09, 2014, 08:20:35 PM
The point being that there is no incentive to give any information which could lead to a live Madeleine  being rescued or returned to her family.  This investigation is only interested in finding someone to prosecute so that they can justify the almost £7 million cost of the review to date.  I find the whole thing quite appalling given the money which Operation Grange has spent.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: John on May 11, 2014, 05:26:06 AM
Why don't SY in the official wording of their reward simply replace the word "abduction" with the word "disappearance"?
It would not offend anyone and it would obviously still include abduction and it would remove what looks to all the world like an assumption of a particular type of solution which SY cannot possibly know is correct yet.

Another good point Pegasus, nobody except those involved in Madeleine's disappearance (assuming she didn't fall down a manhole of course) can ever know what befell her.  Disappearance is the term that should be used imo.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: pegasus on May 13, 2014, 03:02:52 AM
Another good point Pegasus, nobody except those involved in Madeleine's disappearance (assuming she didn't fall down a manhole of course) can ever know what befell her.  Disappearance is the term that should be used imo.
IMO the reward is not addressed to the perp it is addressed IMO to peeps who might have seen something which they did not report because it seemed likely irrelevant. A reward might tip the balance and encourage them to come forward.
Phrasing the reward like it is now with a built-in premature psychic assumption of the exact nature of the solution is unnecessarily restrictive IMO.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: John on May 13, 2014, 03:30:04 AM
IMO the reward is not addressed to the perp it is addressed IMO to peeps who might have seen something which they did not report because it seemed likely irrelevant. A reward might tip the balance and encourage them to come forward.
Phrasing the reward like it is now with a built-in premature psychic assumption of the exact nature of the solution is unnecessarily restrictive IMO.

Agreed, its like putting the cart before the horse.  If it was my child the priority would be her safe return, prosecutions should be a secondary issue.

The reward should be for information leading to the safe return of Madeleine imo. Who gives a damn about prosecutions as long as the child is rescued.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Silkywhiskers on May 13, 2014, 03:34:37 AM
Agreed, its like putting the cart before the horse.  If it was my child the priority would be her safe return, prosecutions should be a secondary issue.

The reward should be for information leading to the safe return of Madeleine imo. Who gives a damn about prosecutions as long as the child is rescued.

The McCanns have always been wildly litigious.

Example - turning up for their libel trial uncalled and unrequested, but not turning up for the dig.

Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: John on May 13, 2014, 04:25:28 AM
The McCanns have always been wildly litigious.

Example - turning up for their libel trial uncalled and unrequested, but not turning up for the dig.

At least one of them will have to go to Luz. It's a dead cert (oops)
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Silkywhiskers on May 13, 2014, 04:30:27 AM
At least one of them will have to go to Luz. It's a dead cert (oops)

Do you think?

Why have they told the press they will not be attending?
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: pegasus on May 13, 2014, 09:47:15 PM
Agreed, its like putting the cart before the horse.  If it was my child the priority would be her safe return, prosecutions should be a secondary issue.

The reward should be for information leading to the safe return of Madeleine imo. Who gives a damn about prosecutions as long as the child is rescued.

I agree the best outcome would be safe return and this should come first in the reward wording.

However if that is not possible, it is hugely important for innocent family members to know exactly what happened, to have closure, rather than the eternal limbo of not knowing.

And that is the main reason why I put in the second option in this proposed wording:

"25,000 euros reward for information leading to the safe return of the child, or leading to arrest and conviction of the individual(s) responsible for her disappearance"

Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Mr Gray on May 13, 2014, 09:50:50 PM
I agree the best outcome would be safe return and this should come first in the reward wording.

However if that is not possible, it is hugely important for innocent family members to know exactly what happened, to have closure, rather than the eternal limbo of not knowing.

And that is the main reason why I put in the second option in this proposed wording:

"25,000 euros reward for information leading to the safe return of the child, or leading to arrest and conviction of the individual(s) responsible for her disappearance"

if maddie is alive she has been abducted...so who is going to claim the reward for her safe return...think about it
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: pegasus on May 13, 2014, 10:02:41 PM
if maddie is alive she has been abducted...so who is going to claim the reward for her safe return...think about it
What if tomorrow a hotel worker witness sees a suspicious man and child about the relevant age at a hotel in Portugal and say overhears a conversation which indicates it is the missing child. He phones up SY's portuguese language phone number (not sure what the number is for portuguese speakers anyone know?) to report it. SY ask PJ to raid hotel. There they find the child, safe, but the man has gone, false name, disguise, no car licence plate to go on, untraceable. The man is never caught or identified.

How much reward will the witness get for info leading to safe return of child? Nothing. Not a penny. Read SY's reward wording.

 
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Mr Gray on May 13, 2014, 10:17:17 PM
What if tomorrow a hotel worker witness sees a suspicious man and child about the relevant age at a hotel in Portugal and say overhears a conversation which indicates it is the missing child. He phones up SY's portuguese language phone number (not sure what the number is for portuguese speakers anyone know?) to report it. SY ask PJ to raid hotel. There they find the child, safe, but the man has gone, false name, disguise, no car licence plate to go on, untraceable. The man is never caught or identified.

How much reward will the witness get for info leading to safe return of child? Nothing. Not a penny. Read SY's reward wording.

not apenny ..rubbish..how much would the papers pay for the story
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Mr Gray on May 13, 2014, 10:20:16 PM
as a police force could it be that SY can only offer rewards leading to the apprehension of criminals
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Silkywhiskers on May 13, 2014, 11:50:40 PM
It surely must be widely acknowledged by now, that Madeleine died that night.

That is where the investigation has ended up....twice now.

You could say "oh, they're only being thorough" or you could say, "they followed the evidence and it led them to the exact same conclusions as Amaral". in which case, OF COURSE they are digging up PDL.

The evidence remains unchanged.  Truth is truth.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: pegasus on May 14, 2014, 12:39:55 AM
not apenny ..rubbish..how much would the papers pay for the story
The point is that if a new witness today give the Met information leading to the safe recovery of the child, but no arrest and conviction of the person responsible, the witness would get not a penny of the Metropolitan Police Reward.

Next looking at the possible solution: person enters apartment and removes child.
Imagine someone today gives information leading to the arrest and conviction of that perp.
Read the Met's wording, the witness will get up to 25K euros only if the victim was alive at time of removal, not a penny otherwise.

 
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: pegasus on May 14, 2014, 12:49:35 AM
Its like I lose a pet and put up reward posters

"£100 reward for information about who stole my live pet.
No reward for any information involving the d... word.
No reward for safe return of pet."

 

 
 
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Victoria on May 14, 2014, 04:04:45 PM
The McCanns have always been wildly litigious.

Example - turning up for their libel trial uncalled and unrequested, but not turning up for the dig.

What dig?
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: John on May 14, 2014, 05:11:21 PM
if maddie is alive she has been abducted...so who is going to claim the reward for her safe return...think about it

An informer who wants some cash maybe?
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: John on May 14, 2014, 05:16:21 PM
The McCanns should be offering every single penny they can put their hands on to anyone regardless of culpability for the SAFE RETURN of Madeleine. Unfortunately, I think it is too late.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Cariad on May 14, 2014, 09:36:45 PM
Does anyone know what happened to the massive reward offered in 2007? It may  have been the Sun offering it?
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Silkywhiskers on May 14, 2014, 09:41:32 PM
Isn't it amusing - despite alleged teams of burglars and cleaners, apartment managers and organised child stealing in Portugal -

NO ONE HAS EVER CLAIMED THE REWARD.

Most crimes are solved in two ways -

1. forensics
2. someone blabs

Now in this case we HAVE the forensics, albeit virtually rendered useless by the keenings of the McCann.

Why don't we have someone blabbing?

Not ONE of those burglars has a buddy who knows something?  Not ONE staff member in the OC saw something, ever?????

Yeah right.

The reason why the reward has never been claimed is that even the local PDL criminals have no idea what happened to Madeleine.

Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Silkywhiskers on May 14, 2014, 10:32:57 PM
@sadie.

You still haven't answered this question.

Oh come on she's answered one out of 49.....

 @)(++(*
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Air Con on May 14, 2014, 10:43:36 PM
Oh come on she's answered one out of 49.....

 @)(++(*

Probably slipped her mind about posting.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Mr Gray on May 17, 2014, 12:44:13 PM
SY are a police force whose job it is to catch criminals...are they allowed to offer a reward for a safe return or are they only able to offer rewards leading to arrests and convictions
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: stephen25000 on May 17, 2014, 12:56:05 PM
'SY are a police force whose job it is to catch criminals'


Hello,hello, hello. What's all this then ? @)(++(*
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Air Con on May 19, 2014, 11:02:00 PM
Still nothing from Sadie.

Wonder why?
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: John on May 20, 2014, 01:58:41 AM
To get back to the subject of the thread I find it quite puzzling why there is no reward on offer for the safe return of Madeleine.  A sceptic could be forgiven for thinking that her parents have given up any hope of finding her alive.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Carana on May 21, 2014, 04:28:52 PM
To get back to the subject of the thread I find it quite puzzling why there is no reward on offer for the safe return of Madeleine.  A sceptic could be forgiven for thinking that her parents have given up any hope of finding her alive.

Not necessarily. They may have been advised to downplay any reward, perhaps even by the police.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Mr Gray on May 21, 2014, 04:51:54 PM
To get back to the subject of the thread I find it quite puzzling why there is no reward on offer for the safe return of Madeleine.  A sceptic could be forgiven for thinking that her parents have given up any hope of finding her alive.


madeleine disappaered as a result of a criminal act....her return would have to involve knowledge of her whereabouts and therefore those of the criminals involved...how can the reward be claimed without withholding knowledge of a criminal act
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: jassi on May 21, 2014, 04:55:47 PM

madeleine disappaered as a result of a criminal act....her return would have to involve knowledge of her whereabouts and therefore those of the criminals involved...how can the reward be claimed without withholding knowledge of a criminal act

I don't think we know that for a fact - it is an assumption.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Mr Gray on May 21, 2014, 05:34:02 PM
I don't think we know that for a fact - it is an assumption.

then you tell me a scenario that doesnt involve  acriminal act
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: jassi on May 21, 2014, 06:19:58 PM
then you tell me a scenario that doesnt involve  acriminal act

Wandered & fell in sewer
Removed by agreement.

Only  hypothetical, of course, but not criminal.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Mr Gray on May 21, 2014, 06:29:40 PM
Wandered & fell in sewer
Removed by agreement.

Only  hypothetical, of course, but not criminal.

wandered and fell...this thread is about a reward for the safe return

removed by agreement...would  still be criminal.......perverting the cause of justice
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: jassi on May 21, 2014, 06:46:06 PM
wandered and fell...this thread is about a reward for the safe return

removed by agreement...would  still be criminal.......perverting the cause of justice

I agree, but you asked the question and I thought it only polite to reply.

Not sure that removal by agreement would be a crime in itself, though a cover-up would be.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Mr Gray on May 21, 2014, 07:08:54 PM
I agree, but you asked the question and I thought it only polite to reply.

Not sure that removal by agreement would be a crime in itself, though a cover-up would be.

I asked the question in the context of the thread
a cover up....lying to police......fraudulent fund..all criminal

therefore any return would involve knowledge of a crime.........SY could not sanction the return if it involved witholding information
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: jassi on May 21, 2014, 07:11:33 PM
I asked the question in the context of the thread
a cover up....lying to police......fraudulent fund..all criminal

therefore any return would involve knowledge of a crime.........SY could not sanction the return if it involved witholding information

That knowledge might only be second or even third hand - someone discovering something and reporting it. Not necessarily criminal in itself.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Mr Gray on May 21, 2014, 07:24:04 PM
That knowledge might only be second or even third hand - someone discovering something and reporting it. Not necessarily criminal in itself.

the trail of knowledge would lead back to the criminal
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: jassi on May 21, 2014, 07:25:35 PM
the trail of knowledge would lead back to the criminal

Would that not likely be a condition of the reward?
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Mr Gray on May 21, 2014, 07:26:31 PM
Would that not likely be a condition of the reward?

thats the point of the thread
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Carana on May 21, 2014, 08:23:13 PM
That knowledge might only be second or even third hand - someone discovering something and reporting it. Not necessarily criminal in itself.

Yes, that's possible.

However, the issue of a reward seems to be a double-edged sword... and no, I can't remember all the reasons offhand. The police would be more familiar with the [banned word] and cons of that than a family, or even the media.

ETA: LOL

Substitute "advantages" for [banned word].

There's a section on that topic in a publication I posted some time ago. I'll add the title again if I remember it...
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Eleanor on May 22, 2014, 12:25:45 AM
SY are a police force whose job it is to catch criminals...are they allowed to offer a reward for a safe return or are they only able to offer rewards leading to arrests and convictions

That would be it.  It is their job to arrest and convict primarily.  Offering a reward for the safe return could be misconstrued.  It is public money that is being offered, so a conviction would be paramount.
If Madeleine is returned safe and well then no doubt the person who made this possible would be rewarded by others, provided they weren't involved.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: John on May 22, 2014, 02:10:44 PM
Who gives a shit about the perpetrator if the child can be recovered safely.  This should be the primary objective here and from everything I have seen recently it appears not to be the case. If the child is found dead then the perpetrator can be pursued but while there is a chance, even the slightest glimmer of hope, then EVERY POSSIBLE MEANS should be used to get her back.

Remember that SY have their own agenda regardless of what image they portray publicly.  Someone will have to pay the piper!
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Mr Gray on May 22, 2014, 04:52:52 PM
Who gives a shit about the perpetrator if the child can be recovered safely.  This should be the primary objective here and from everything I have seen recently it appears not to be the case. If the child is found dead then the perpetrator can be pursued but while there is a chance, even the slightest glimmer of hope, then EVERY POSSIBLE MEANS should be used to get her back.

Remember that SY have their own agenda regardless of what image they portray publicly.  Someone will have to pay the piper!

on that line of thinking SY could offer a reward to the "abductor" ...just to get maddie back
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Carana on May 22, 2014, 05:05:08 PM
Do the police offer rewards for the safe return of a missing person? Appeals for information, yes, but rewards?

Nothing comes to mind.

If that has ever happened, how frequent would it be in modern policing?
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Mr Moderator on May 23, 2014, 01:13:03 PM
So on that line of thinking what's more important?

* Getting Madeleine back ?

 or

* Prosecuting some perv(s) ?
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Carana on May 23, 2014, 01:36:09 PM
So on that line of thinking what's more important?

* Getting Madeleine back ?

 or

* Prosecuting some perv(s) ?

Both I would have thought. Whether the victim is alive or dead, a crime has been committed by someone, and information on the culprit may lead to the victim.


I've found the publication I had in mind:

When your child is missing: a survival guide

Chapter 6 Rewards and Donations

http://www.o[Name removed]dp.gov/pubs/childismissing/ch6.html





Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Mr Moderator on May 23, 2014, 01:52:28 PM
Both I would have thought. Whether the victim is alive or dead, a crime has been committed by someone, and information on the culprit may lead to the victim.


I've found the publication I had in mind:

When your child is missing: a survival guide

Chapter 6 Rewards and Donations

http://www.o[Name removed]dp.gov/pubs/childismissing/ch6.html

Why jeopardise one by attempting to achieve both?  Is Madeleine's life not worth more than the need for a prosecution?
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Carana on May 23, 2014, 02:23:07 PM
Why jeopardise one by attempting to achieve both?  Is Madeleine's life not worth more than the need for a prosecution?



Re Claudia Lawrence:
The independent charity Crimestoppers has also lent its support by offering a £10,000 reward for information that leads to an arrest and charge. Callers can remain anonymous.
http://www.northyorkshire.police.uk/13147

There's no proof that Claudia's dead yet. Perhaps the police have more experience on such matters than distraught parents (or the media) in the aftermath of a disappearance?

Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Mr Moderator on May 23, 2014, 02:39:44 PM


Re Claudia Lawrence:
The independent charity Crimestoppers has also lent its support by offering a £10,000 reward for information that leads to an arrest and charge. Callers can remain anonymous.
http://www.northyorkshire.police.uk/13147

There's no proof that Claudia's dead yet. Perhaps the police have more experience on such matters than distraught parents (or the media) in the aftermath of a disappearance?

Perhaps CrimeStoppers' agenda is to stop crime.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Carana on May 23, 2014, 03:15:34 PM
Perhaps CrimeStoppers' agenda is to stop crime.

And also to help apprehend culprits. Rewards by the police seem to be similar (if indeed rewards are distinct).

The lower amount offered by the police is an incentive, but not so high as to create a media frenzy of false sightings.

For a desperate family, a reward keeps a high profile, particularly when there may be a high chance of finding the missing child / adult quickly. A huge one increases paper sales or general media advertising, positive PR, etc.

However... how much of this supposed £2.6 million reward by various benefactors is actually cash-in-bank ready to be handed over as opposed to pledges?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reactions_to_the_disappearance_of_Madeleine_McCann#Rewards

Who would be legally responsible for this alleged £2.6 million announced in the press? What about the amount pledged by the now defunct News of the World (£250,000), for example? Have pledges been withdrawn for any reason? Negative press assuming the parents were guilty?

Other benefactors may simply not have the same means that they did in 2007 when they first pledged.

The issue might well be quite complicated.

Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: John on May 23, 2014, 08:42:20 PM
And also to help apprehend culprits. Rewards by the police seem to be similar (if indeed rewards are distinct).

The lower amount offered by the police is an incentive, but not so high as to create a media frenzy of false sightings.

For a desperate family, a reward keeps a high profile, particularly when there may be a high chance of finding the missing child / adult quickly. A huge one increases paper sales or general media advertising, positive PR, etc.

However... how much of this supposed £2.6 million reward by various benefactors is actually cash-in-bank ready to be handed over as opposed to pledges?

Who would be legally responsible for this alleged £2.6 million announced in the press? What about the amount pledged by the now defunct News of the World (£250,000), for example? Have pledges been withdrawn for any reason? Negative press assuming the parents were guilty?

Other benefactors may simply not have the same means that they did in 2007 when they first pledged.

The issue might well be quite complicated.

The cosy relationship with Murdoch's London Times just isn't what it used to be if recent articles are anything to go by.  Little wonder the NOTW reward has never been repeated.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Eleanor on May 24, 2014, 07:40:16 AM
Perhaps CrimeStoppers' agenda is to stop crime.

I think you might have got it.  This is also the agenda of The Police.

And quite frankly, anyone with knowledge of what happened to Madeleine shouldn't need rewarding.  Not disclosing this sort of information is a crime in itself, and rewarding it could be seen as compounding the felony.
What happens if this person later appears to have been involved and has been rewarded by The Police?  It could stink as coercion.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: John on October 23, 2014, 06:34:48 PM
...and still no reward exists for the safe return of Madeleine.

(http://i.imgur.com/IkWcuuB.png?1)

A poster from days gone by.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Eleanor on October 23, 2014, 06:46:01 PM

No one actually involved in the crime was ever going to claim any reward.  Short of being immune from prosecution.  But then The PJ don't do deals.

Or do any of you think they might?
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Alfred R Jones on October 23, 2014, 06:47:53 PM
...and still no reward exists for the safe return of Madeleine.
And...?
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: pathfinder73 on October 23, 2014, 08:15:57 PM
...and still no reward exists for the safe return of Madeleine.

(http://i.imgur.com/IkWcuuB.png?1)

A poster from days gone by.

I thought the cadaver dogs and digs would give you a clue as to why no reward exists for her safe return. When Smithman is arrested misty can tell us all why he doesn't exist.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: misty on October 23, 2014, 08:38:46 PM
I thought the cadaver dogs and digs would give you a clue as to why no reward exists for her safe return. When Smithman is arrested misty can tell us all why he doesn't exist.

I'll have to wait for admin's permission first.  8)--))
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: sadie on October 24, 2014, 12:34:37 AM
...and still no reward exists for the safe return of Madeleine.

(http://i.imgur.com/IkWcuuB.png?1)

A poster from days gone by.

Well the abductor would never have claimed it, would he?
I ask myself "What normal person would require a reward to motivate him/herself to help find a missing child?"
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Eleanor on October 24, 2014, 12:53:02 AM

No one was ever going to claim any Reward.  At least not after the first six months.  Too much culpability after that, if anyone who wasn't actually involved knew anything about it.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Angelo222 on October 24, 2014, 12:59:25 AM
The £20,000 currently being made available by Crimestoppers isn't even for the safe return of Maddie so what's the point??

From Crimestoppers website >

Reward

The Metropolitan Police Service is offering a reward of up to £20,000 for information leading to the identification, arrest and prosecution of the person(s) responsible for the abduction of Madeleine McCann from Praia da Luz Portugal on the 3rd May 2003.


http://content.met.police.uk/Appeal/Madeleine-McCann-Appeal--October-2013/1400020463601/1400020541583
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Eleanor on October 24, 2014, 01:11:56 AM
The £20,000 currently being made available by Crimestoppers isn't even for the safe return of Maddie so what's the point??

From Crimestoppers website >

Reward

The Metropolitan Police Service is offering a reward of up to £20,000 for information leading to the identification, arrest and prosecution of the person(s) responsible for the abduction of Madeleine McCann from Praia da Luz Portugal on the 3rd May 2003.


http://content.met.police.uk/Appeal/Madeleine-McCann-Appeal--October-2013/1400020463601/1400020541583

Ambiguous.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Brietta on October 24, 2014, 02:21:24 AM
The £20,000 currently being made available by Crimestoppers isn't even for the safe return of Maddie so what's the point??

From Crimestoppers website >

Reward

The Metropolitan Police Service is offering a reward of up to £20,000 for information leading to the identification, arrest and prosecution of the person(s) responsible for the abduction of Madeleine McCann from Praia da Luz Portugal on the 3rd May 2003.


http://content.met.police.uk/Appeal/Madeleine-McCann-Appeal--October-2013/1400020463601/1400020541583

It seems to be a standard amount.

During the search for Alice Gross the reward for information was £20,000.


:: snip ::
There is a £20,000 reward in place for any information that helps police find Alice.

http://www.ealing.gov.uk/news/article/1040/alice_gross_appeal_for_information
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: sadie on October 24, 2014, 11:30:09 AM
The £20,000 currently being made available by Crimestoppers isn't even for the safe return of Maddie so what's the point??

From Crimestoppers website >

Reward

The Metropolitan Police Service is offering a reward of up to £20,000 for information leading to the identification, arrest and prosecution of the person(s) responsible for the abduction of Madeleine McCann from Praia da Luz Portugal on the 3rd May 2003.


http://content.met.police.uk/Appeal/Madeleine-McCann-Appeal--October-2013/1400020463601/1400020541583

The Met are covering both options, Madeleine dead or alive, by wording their reward as they do. 

Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Miss Taken Identity on October 24, 2014, 11:59:00 PM
If no one came forward to claim over £1 million - what chance of 20 thousand.

 I do not understand people who cannot accept that the police have 'informers' and pay them for information.

There are also cases of police getting perpetrators to turn queens evidence for leniency, against other persons involved with a particular crime.

AND as we all know, some people will snitch rival gangs anonymously, to get them arrested and out of the way, so they can do business.

The wonderful world of crime fighting!
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: John on September 20, 2017, 05:08:16 PM
It appears that the £20,000 reward has been removed from both the Crimestoppers and the Metropolitan Police websites.

Previous SY link.

http://content.met.police.uk/Appeal/Madeleine-McCann-Appeal--October-2013/1400020463601/1257246745782
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Miss Taken Identity on September 20, 2017, 10:50:00 PM
It appears that the £20,000 reward has been removed from both the Crimestoppers and the Metropolitan Police websites.

Previous SY link.

http://content.met.police.uk/Appeal/Madeleine-McCann-Appeal--October-2013/1400020463601/1257246745782


Interesting...

My thinking is the alledged loving childless couple don't need the money and neither do their family members....2.5.million and No one comes forward? mmm
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: sadie on September 21, 2017, 11:35:30 PM

Interesting...

My thinking is the alledged loving childless couple don't need the money and neither do their family members....2.5.million and No one comes forward? mmm

And end in jail as the most despised couple in the World, maybe?



BTW, since when did the reward become 2.5 million?

Would you call that a tad incorrect perchance?   A massive tad incorrect.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: faithlilly on September 21, 2017, 11:40:31 PM
And end in jail as the most despised couple in the World, maybe?



BTW, since when did the reward become 2.5 million?

Would you call that a tad incorrect perchance?   A massive tad incorrect.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/6649951.stm

'Rewards totalling £2.5m have been offered to anyone who can help with information leading to the safe return of Madeleine McCann.'
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: sadie on September 21, 2017, 11:51:37 PM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/6649951.stm

'Rewards totalling £2.5m have been offered to anyone who can help with information leading to the safe return of Madeleine McCann.'
Dated May12th 2007
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: faithlilly on September 21, 2017, 11:58:35 PM
Dated May12th 2007

A date wasn't specified in the post.

Do the right thing Sadie and admit you were wrong.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: sadie on September 22, 2017, 01:37:31 AM
A date wasn't specified in the post.

Do the right thing Sadie and admit you were wrong.

Look again Faith ... top line

ast Updated: Saturday, 12 May 2007, 17:22 GMT 18:22 UK
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: faithlilly on September 22, 2017, 10:14:27 AM
Look again Faith ... top line

ast Updated: Saturday, 12 May 2007, 17:22 GMT 18:22 UK

MTI didn't specify a date when the reward had been offered. She merely said that it had been offered at some point.

You were wrong Sadie but if you don't have the grace to apologise that is strictly a matter for you.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Angelo222 on September 23, 2017, 12:32:22 PM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/6649951.stm

'Rewards totalling £2.5m have been offered to anyone who can help with information leading to the safe return of Madeleine McCann.'

The fact that no-one availed of such a substantial reward has always suggested to me that she is deceased.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Miss Taken Identity on September 25, 2017, 07:39:21 PM
The fact that no-one availed of such a substantial reward has always suggested to me that she is deceased.

Yes, I think a great many people were amazed that nothing came of it. One person mentioned to me that the  dying paedophile could have talked and gave that money to his family... or anyone who knew anything could have asked for  the money and just moved away... It was also passed on as a theory regarding the paedophile scenario, that this would need to be with very high placed people, who are well protected.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: misty on September 26, 2017, 02:09:02 PM
The fact that no-one availed of such a substantial reward has always suggested to me that she is deceased.

Why? There's no point in providing information to acquire a large reward if you don't live to enjoy the benefits.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Miss Taken Identity on September 27, 2017, 11:03:35 PM
Why? There's no point in providing information to acquire a large reward if you don't live to enjoy the benefits.

But they would live to enjoy the rewards- that would be part of the deal. crims do it ALL the time.
Title: Re: The current £20,000 Reward is not for the safe return of Madeleine McCann.
Post by: Brietta on September 28, 2017, 03:05:40 PM
There are more problems than one when reward money is offered ... some replies might very well be genuine ... but there are all sorts of creatures encouraged to crawl out of the woodwork at the thought of putting their hands on some easy money.

I'm sure most of us are aware of the bare bones of most of the information real and fake surrounding Madeleine's case and I was aware of the attempt by a couple to make a fraudulent claim.  I think it was discussed on the forum a while ago.

Very recently I was given pause for thought when I came across a report in a Portuguese newspaper of the time about this appalling couple.
A sad reminder of individuals attracted by the lure of 'easy money'.  I'm glad it backfired on them but I hope that after due process they weren't allowed just to fade out of sight to continue to blight other young lives.


30/06/07 - 08h03 - Updated 06/30/07 - 08h11
Couple arrested in Madeleine case arrested for abusing daughter

The information was published by the English newspaper The Times.

Casal has already been investigated for child trafficking.

The couple detained in Spain in an investigation into the kidnapping of British girl Madeleine McCann, who disappeared in Portugal on May 3, has been investigated in connection with child trafficking in the past, the Times reported on Saturday.

The 61-year-old Italian Danielo Chemello and his 54-year-old partner, Aurora Pereira Vaz, of Portuguese origin, drew the attention of French police three years ago. The reason was the high number of children passing by their house in the Côte D'Azur, the newspaper said.
SEE ALSO: Madeleine Can Attract Bounty Hunters, Says Lead Investigator

The French authorities suspect that the couple also dedicated themselves to the international sale of sperm and eggs. Chemello and Vaz, who lived in Italy and France, would have moved to Spain two months ago.

They spent 18 months imprisoned in France, convicted in 2004 for abusing their daughter, then at age 5, reports the Times.
In 2003, French police found the couple's daughter "almost naked" and taped.

UNDERSTAND THE MADELEINE CASE

According to the British newspaper, Vaz is being investigated for having lied about the biological motherhood of another girl.

The two detainees are accused of trying to receive the reward Madeleine's parents offer to anyone who hints at the girl's whereabouts.

Spanish police, who had been guarding the couple since Saturday, decided to detain them on Wednesday after discovering that there was an international arrest warrant against Chemello.

The agents found in his house several newspaper reports on the missing girl and pictures of her on a computer, as well as two children, 7 and 5 years old.

Police are now trying to find out whether the couple are actually involved in the kidnapping or simply wanted the reward for giving some clue about Madeleine.

According to the French promoter Christian Girard, despite strong suspicions that the couple engaged in international trade in gametes, in collaboration with a doctor in Greece and a laboratory in the United States, the two were not charged because the alleged crimes would have occurred outside France.

The French court, however, seeks Chemello to stand trial for attempting to blackmail the judge who sentenced the couple to three years in prison for abuse of their daughter.

According to Dominique Moyal, deputy prosecutor of Nice, Chemello was investigated on suspicion of having organized a plot to assassinate the judge.

According to "The Times", Chemello was a respected business man in Sandrigo (northern Italy), married with two children. Until, in the 90's, he met Aurora Vaz, who was married to financial executive Enzo Alberto Tana.

Chemello and her lover left the city where they lived and embarked on a new life of luxury by the nightclubs and restaurants of France and Italy.
The couple, who had a daughter from their extramarital affairs, were accused in 1996 of murdering the Portuguese's ex-husband, bribing a police officer and falsely accusing Enzo Tana of being part of a child pornography ring.

The two men were sentenced to five years imprisonment each for illegal possession of weapons, false testimony and bribery.
http://g1.globo.com/Noticias/Mundo/0,,MUL61535-5602,00.html



Olegário Sousa - There was a police action in Spain that arrested a couple, an Italian citizen and a lady. We were following the operation to see if these people had any connection with the missing girl's case. But links have not yet been confirmed between the two who were detained and the case of Madeleine. It is still not possible to say if they have any responsibility in the disappearance of the child. The investigations go on and we will see what emerges from here on.

So far there is no indication that they have responsibility for the disappearance of the child.
http://g1.globo.com/Noticias/Mundo/0,,MUL61004-5602,00.html