UK Justice Forum 🇬🇧
Disappeared and Abducted Children and Young Adults => Madeleine McCann (3) disappeared from her parent's holiday apartment at Ocean Club, Praia da Luz, Portugal on 3 May 2007. No trace of her has ever been found. => Topic started by: faithlilly on June 17, 2014, 06:02:10 PM
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Thank to themccannfiles for the resume below.
The truth about the libel trial recent postponements.
By Nigel Moore
17 June 2014
Yesterday, outside the Palace of Justice, in Lisbon, following the postponement of court proceedings, the 'furious' McCanns raged:
Gerry McCann: "This is the fourth time that this has happened, when we've travelled to Portugal."
Kate McCann: "...this has happened now about four times, as Gerry said this can't be seen as anything but blatant and cynical."
So, no ambiguity there.
Needless to say, the tabloid media were not slow in picking up the McCann baton and running with it. Gary O'Shea (The Sun) was typical of most of the coverage: 'The parents of Madeleine McCann spoke out yesterday after an ex-cop deliberately delayed his libel trial for the FOURTH time.'
But what is the truth?
On 12 September 2013 Kate McCann attended, for no obvious reason, other than to deliver an 'emotional' statement outside the court for the waiting media.
- There was no postponement.
The following day 13 September 2013 Kate McCann attended, as an observer, with her mother who was due to appear as a witness.
- Proceedings were halted at lunch time after the judge failed to return due to a personal issue.
On 27 September 2013 Gerry McCann attended court, with sister Trish Cameron, even though he was not due to appear as a witness.
- Postponed due to illness of Gonçalo Amaral's lawyer's son.
On 02 October 2013 Gerry McCann once again travelled from the UK in the hope of being admitted to the process as a witness, thus allowing him to give evidence. However, the judge decided she would not rule on whether he could give evidence until after October 16.
Kate's mother, Susan Healy, also made the trip, for her second time, but was not allowed to give evidence due to a blunder by the McCanns' lawyer, Isabel Duarte.
On 07 January 2014 the impending libel trial was postponed as Gonçalo Amaral's lawyer filed a request for the court to evaluate the McCann couple's legitimacy to file a lawsuit in their daughter's name, as she is a Ward of Court in the UK. He did not ask for any postponement. It was the judge that issued a 15-day deadline for him to submit the relevant documentation.
Afterwards, Isabel Duarte filed a document related to Mr Alan Pike, and asked for a postponement of the session. The McCanns did not travel.
And?
That's it.
- One half-day postponement due to a personal issue relating to the judge.
- One postponement due to the illness of Vitor Santos de Oliveira's son who required hospital treatment.
- One occasion when Kate's mother, Susan Healy, was not heard due to a blunder by the McCanns' lawyer, Isabel Duarte but proceedings were not postponed, as Trish Cameron was heard.
- One postponement at the request of the McCanns' lawyer, Isabel Duarte, when the McCanns did not travel.
In total: Kate travelled once. Gerry travelled twice.
On no occasion were they due to be heard as witnesses - it was their decision to travel.
On no occasion were they denied their 'day in court' due to the postponement of proceedings.
So the insinuation that Gonçalo Amaral has manipulated the postponement of the trial for the 'FOURTH time' is patently wrong, lapped up without question by the mainstream media.
The truth is, this is the FIRST time (get that, Mr O'Shea?) that a decision by Gonçalo Amaral has directly affected the proceedings.
But then, why tell the truth when you can sell stories?
[Edited by
Moderator]
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"So the accusation that Gonçalo Amaral has manipulated the postponement of the trial for the 'FOURTH time' is a blatant and cynical lie by the McCanns, lapped up without question by the mainstream"
Could you please supply a link to the McCanns making this statement, thanks.
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BTW, you missed the "bird flu" excuse.
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BTW, you missed the "bird flu" excuse.
Which was also not Amaral's fault.
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Which was also not Amaral's fault.
Hmm...if you say so.
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Imagine if you can the shoe being on the other foot - Amaral has 4 times flown to London to attend court. Each time there is an excuse why the case has to be postponed - the McCanns' lawyer has chicken pox, the McCanns' lawyer's son fell off a horse, the McCanns' decide to sack their sickly lawyer on the day Amaral is due to give evidence, the British judge presiding over the trial suddenly has a family emergency and cancels the day's proceedings. Well obviously Amaral's repeated inconvenience would in NO WAY be the fault of the McCanns now would it?
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Imagine if you can the shoe being on the other foot - Amaral has 4 times flown to London to attend court. Each time there is an excuse why the case has to be postponed - the McCanns' lawyer has chicken pox, the McCanns' lawyer's son fell off a horse, the McCanns' decide to sack their sickly lawyer on the day Amaral is due to give evidence, the British judge presiding over the trial suddenly has a family emergency and cancels the day's proceedings. Well obviously Amaral's repeated inconvenience would in NO WAY be the fault of the McCanns now would it?
Of course not. These things happen and I'm sure Mr Amaral would deal with the delays with the same dignity and patience with which he approaches everything else.
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Of course not. These things happen and I'm sure Mr Amaral would deal with the delays with the same dignity and patience with which he approaches everything else.
Hahahahaha, no of COURSE you wouldn't blame the McCanns, you'd be very understanding I just know it, hahahahaha!
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Hahahahaha, no of COURSE you wouldn't blame the McCanns, you'd be very understanding I just know it, hahahahaha!
You see, there you are, you're getting to know me already.
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You see, there you are, you're getting to know me already.
I know you very well dear, and I can just imagine the diatribe you'd be posting if the McCanns prevaricated even half as much as the dashing, relaxed and wholly untroubled "Dr" A.
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Appointing another lawyer in 10 days to get fully up to speed for engaging proceedings (at least scheduled!) to go ahead just a few days after that should be a breeze ...
And of course Dr Amaral will present in court this time ...
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Speaking afterwards, Mr McCann said he would return to Portugal for the next hearing, which has been set for 8 July.
He said the latest delay was a "blatant and cynical attempt to wear us down".
"We're exasperated that the hearing has been cancelled once again at Mr Amaral's request," he said, adding: "We're not going to give up. We're going to keep going."
They blame him for at least one delay.
What are the other ones?
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The McCanns didn't blame Amaral for the four occasions. But people will read what they want to read.
And funnily enough, this latest delay was predicted, albeit we didn't actually think Amaral would pull this one.
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The McCanns didn't blame Amaral for the four occasions. But people will read what they want to read.
And funnily enough, this latest delay was predicted, albeit we didn't actually think Amaral would pull this one.
Not true.
You should remember, people do read elsewhere,together with the hate filled posts of the mccannite trolls, blaming every delay on Amaral.
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The mccanns have blamed Amaral for the delays, don't try to bluff me.
As to the mccann trolls, they blame Amaral for everything.
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so there is no proof that the mccanns blamed amaral for the 4 delays..so the article claiming this is a lie...how ironic......and of course I was the poster who noticed the glaring mistake
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Can you tell me what he did say?
Não falo com os McCanns (I don't speak with the McCanns)
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Não falo com os McCanns (I don't speak with the McCanns)
Really? It sounded much shorter and sharper than that too me.
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Martin Brunt was there and he confirmed that Amaral didn't swear.
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Kate McCann:
Can I... can I just add, I mean, I think we need to make it clear to people we... we took on this case because of the pain and stress that Mr Amaral has brought to us and our children. And every time he postpones the case, like this, it brings us more pain and distress, Every time we come here we have to make arrangements for our children to be looked after, we have to book flights, we have to book hotels, we have to take time off work to come here. Now Mr Amaral handed that letter in, apparently, around 9 o'clock this morning. That letter could have been handed in before we left the country and this has happened now about four times, as Gerry said this can't be seen as anything but blatant and cynical. We just want justice. This is not fair.
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It is really scary the blatant myths being propagated by E & D today. It shows their true colours. Not seekers after truth just victory for the McCanns.
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It is really scary the blatant myths being propagated by E & D today. It shows their true colours. Not seekers after truth just victory for the McCanns.
Precisely. 8(0(*
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Kate McCann:
Can I... can I just add, I mean, I think we need to make it clear to people we... we took on this case because of the pain and stress that Mr Amaral has brought to us and our children. And every time he postpones the case, like this, it brings us more pain and distress, Every time we come here we have to make arrangements for our children to be looked after, we have to book flights, we have to book hotels, we have to take time off work to come here. Now Mr Amaral handed that letter in, apparently, around 9 o'clock this morning. That letter could have been handed in before we left the country and this has happened now about four times, as Gerry said this can't be seen as anything but blatant and cynical. We just want justice. This is not fair.
well done Stephen...now show me where she mentions 4 times
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well done Stephen...now show me where she mentions 4 times
Do you know what plural means ?
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Do you know what plural means ?
Plural isn't four times. Do you understand basic English?
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Plural isn't four times. Do you understand basic English?
Plural means more than one. 8((()*/
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WELL DAVEY BOY.......
Kate McCann: Can I... can I just add, I mean, I think we need to make it clear to people we... we took on this case because of the pain and stress that Mr Amaral has brought to us and our children. And every time he postpones the case, like this, it brings us more pain and distress, Every time we come here we have to make arrangements for our children to be looked after, we have to book flights, we have to book hotels, we have to take time off work to come here. Now Mr Amaral handed that letter in, apparently, around 9 o'clock this morning. That letter could have been handed in before we left the country and this has happened now about four times, as Gerry said this can't be seen as anything but blatant and cynical. We just want justice. This is not fair.
yes they have twisted this to deceive....just like they have with everything from day one....
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yes they have twisted this to deceive....just like they have with everything from day one....
And they are very good at it - years of practice.
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Plural means more than one. 8((()*/
Yes, Two. After that it is Several.
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Yes, Two. After that it is Several.
Splitting hairs yet again ?
'GRAMMAR
(of a word or form) denoting more than one, or (in languages with dual number) more than two.'
Geddit. 8((()*/
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No dave.
Try to understand the meaning of the word plural.
It's not hard.
The title of the tread says four...
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The title of the tread says four...
4 is more than one dave.
It isn't hard to understand.
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The fact remains that the trial has been suspended delayed:
The start of the trial has been postponed twice,
the first one on the 9th of February of 2012.
the second on the 8th September 2012
Then a delay to allow the parties to attempt to reach a settlement
Then a delay earlier this year when Amaral introduced doubt as to whether the McCanns needed authority from the High Court to join Madeleine in the action (significantly a point which had not been raised previously by his defence team or by the court).
Now a delay because he sacked his lawyer.
All legal of course. But not really convinced this is the way a man on his way to winning a case behaves?
The judge then scheduled the start of the trial at the Palace of Justice for the 13th of September of the same year, with another three sessions on the agenda, but none took place due to Gonçalo Amaral's lawyer's unavailability, as he was admitted for a stomach examination under anesthesia.
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WELL DAVEY BOY.......
Kate McCann: Can I... can I just add, I mean, I think we need to make it clear to people we... we took on this case because of the pain and stress that Mr Amaral has brought to us and our children. And every time he postpones the case, like this, it brings us more pain and distress, Every time we come here we have to make arrangements for our children to be looked after, we have to book flights, we have to book hotels, we have to take time off work to come here. Now Mr Amaral handed that letter in, apparently, around 9 o'clock this morning. That letter could have been handed in before we left the country and this has happened now about four times, as Gerry said this can't be seen as anything but blatant and cynical. We just want justice. This is not fair.
The implication that Dr Amaral has caused 4 postponements is glaringly obvious when you take both Kate and Gerry's statements into account.
My blue highlight: What was she thinking? Considering why this trial was taking place, did she reallly think it was a good idea to highlight childcare!
She must see the irony, surely?
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I don't know why he did it. But I do know that he has made a right fool of himself. This is the action of a coward which ever are his supposed legal reasons.
We can also be pretty sure that his next lawyer, if he can find one, won't be up to speed in ten days time. Roll on September.
Unless The Judge gets shirty.
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The implication that Dr Amaral has caused 4 postponements is glaringly obvious when you take both Kate and Gerry's statements into account.
My blue highlight: What was she thinking? Considering why this trial was taking place, did she reallly think it was a good idea to highlight childcare!
She must see the irony, surely?
Well, you all seem dead keen to know what happens to the twins when Kate and Gerry are away. So now you know. They arrange child care. This is what you want them to do, isn't it?
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I don't know why he did it. But I do know that he has made a right fool of himself. This is the action of a coward which ever are his supposed legal reasons.
We can also be pretty sure that his next lawyer, if he can find one, won't be up to speed in ten days time. Roll on September.
Unless The Judge gets shirty.
Unlike the mother complaining about having to find childcare when failing to provide childcare in the first place is the reason this whole thing started?
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Unlike the mother complaining about having to find childcare when failing to provide childcare in the first place is the reason this whole thing started?
Nope. This whole thing started when Amaral wrote his ill advised book. That is why he is in Court. When he turns up, that is.
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Unlike the mother complaining about having to find childcare when failing to provide childcare in the first place is the reason this whole thing started?
Indeed.
The very failure to do that is the reason they're in the predicament they find themselves.
So km saying what she did is extremely hypocrtiçal.
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Nope. This whole thing started when Amaral wrote his ill advised book. That is why he is in Court. When he turns up, that is.
If childcare had been provided, no child would be missing, therefore no book and no court case.
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Indeed they could have continued in their little mundane lives and no one would ever have heard of them .
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If childcare had been provided, no child would be missing, therefore no book and no court case.
Not necessarily true. Intruders break into places while the parents are asleep. But I expect Amaral would have had an hypothesis for that. As long as it included the parents in some way.
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A light sleeper, such as Madeleine was would have woken them up, Gerry, or more likely Kate would have beaten the intruder to a pulp and all would have been well.
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Unlike the mother complaining about having to find childcare when failing to provide childcare in the first place is the reason this whole thing started?
I think it is an absolute disgrace to blame a victim of crime for the crime itself...but as we all know there are some very nasty people about...and yes...the whole McCann family are victims of crime
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the parents are victims of a crime ...by definition...it is a fact
Just remember, it has not been established what sort of crime it was , and WHO COMMITTED it.
So options are open.
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Just remember, it has not been established what sort of crime it was , and WHO COMMITTED it.
So options are open.
so posters should shut up and stop accusing the parents...especially that bent copper from Portugal..excellent point stephen
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so posters should shut up and stop accusing the parents...especially that bent copper from Portugal..excellent point stephen
Who else is in the frame dave ?
P.S. How do you know Amaral's basic thesis was wrong ?
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Sorry to take so long but I have been about very important Leshy business again.
The Star seemed to run a similar distortion of the facts (see below) you can't trust a soul these days it would appear.
McCanns: Maddie cop has made our lives hell Daily Star (paper edition, page 9)
[see below for image]
Libel trial is held up
by MEG JORSH
Tuesday, June 17, 2014
KATE and Gerry McCann have blasted disgraced ex-detective Goncalo Amaral for throwing their day in court into chaos.
The couple flew to Portugal to give evidence in their £1million libel case against Amaral.
But they landed in Lisbon yesterday to learn the former police chief had sacked his lawyer and forced a last-minute adjournment.
Standing outside court, Kate looked close to tears as her husband Gerry, 45, slammed Amaral's "blatant and cynical" attempt to delay the trial.
He said: "We are exasperated that the hearing has been cancelled once again at Mr Amaral's request.
"This is the fourth time this has happened and we have travelled to Portugal. This case has been going on for over five years. Today is a blatant and cynical attempt to wear us down and it's Madeleine who's suffering. We're not going to give up, we'll keep going."
Amaral had slipped into the Palace of Justice at 9am and handed in a letter stating he had sacked his lawyer Vitor Santos de Oliveira.
The McCanns, both doctors from Rothley, Leics, then arrived half an hour later still expecting to be giving evidence.
Kate said: "We need to make it clear to people we took on this case because of the pain and distress Mr Amaral has caused to us and our children.
"And every time he postpones the case like this it causes us more pain and suffering. We just want justice. This is not fair."
The distraught couple launched legal action when Amaral tried to blacken their names with shocking slurs in his book The Truth of the Lie.
He claimed Madeleine, three, was killed in their holiday flat in Praia da Luz in 2007 and accused the pair of covering up her death.
But yesterday Kate said she still believed her daughter would be found. She added: "Madeleine deserves that right.
"We believe Mr Amaral is trying to stop her human right of being looked for and found. It's happened to other children and can happen to Madeleine."
Last September Gerry flew to Lisbon to speak at the libel trial only to find the case adjourned because Amaral's lawyer's grown-up son was ill.
Judge Maria de Melo e Castro adjourned the hearing until July 8, when the McCanns plan to return to give evidence.
I suppose we could have a pointless argument about who did what with which and to whom: Oh silly me we are having that argument.
I will leave the nitpickers to their craft.
In five years there have been four cancellations at short notice...3 of these involving amaral or his legal team.
Can you point out specifically where the mccanns have lied..you wont be able to because they havent
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In five years there have been four cancellations at short notice...3 of these involving amaral or his legal team.
Can you point out specifically where the mccanns have lied..you wont be able to because they havent
They weren't Amaral's fault dave.
Try to comprehend that.
You cannot carry on passing the buck.
The mccanns have to take responsibility for what they've done wrong.
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They weren't Amaral's fault dave.
Try to comprehend that.
You cannot carry on passing the buck.
The mccanns have to take responsibility for what they've done wrong.
Never! never! they are totally blameless of everything - whatever it might be , there is a totally innocent explanation.
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Is anyone bothered about this little fact: The McCanns had no reason to attend court at all, for any reason, on any occasion.
They have no case, no medical evidence, or any evidence that 'maddie' has suffered as a consequence of Mr Amarals' book.
It was they who asked to address the court, which regardless of what they say, will not have any effect on the outcome.
They are, as usual, using a platform to push their story. Did they look for their daughter whilst they were there on those occasions? you know in their spare time...As the Needham Family do without the mass media, financed by celebrity backers, poor members of the public and Government.
Yes they are enraged, as I am, about why they are enraged(?)
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Is anyone bothered about this little fact: The McCanns had no reason to attend court at all, for any reason, on any occasion.
They have no case, no medical evidence, or any evidence that 'maddie' has suffered as a consequence of Mr Amarals' book.
It was they who asked to address the court, which regardless of what they say, will not have any effect on the outcome.
They are, as usual, using a platform to push their story. Did they look for their daughter whilst they were there on those occasions? you know in their spare time...As the Needham Family do without the mass media, financed by celebrity backers, poor members of the public and Government.
Yes they are enraged, as I am, about why they are enraged(?)
A good point.
The McCanns were not giving evidence so technically had no reason to be in Lisbon.. That is of course until they saw how disastrous their case had gone and decided to shoehorn themselves in to at least save some face.
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A good point.
The McCanns were not giving evidence so technically had no reason to be in Lisbon.. That is of course until they saw how disastrous their case had gone and decided to shoehorn themselves in to at least save some face.
The Drs McCann hardly 'shoehorned themselves in'. They were due to give Victim Impact statements to the court and this must be done in person.
Conversely the individual whose presence was not require was Dr Amaral as he was neither due to be called to give evidence nor was he due to give a statement to the court.
There was no ambiguity about the date and the time of the final hearing so Dr Amaral had plenty of time to work out that he had issues with his counsel which required his dismissal.
Sacking him by text was decidedly unorthodox.
The fact that he engineered this as an excuse to disrupt the final hearing of a case which has stretched over five years was a determined and successful ploy to have the trial further postponed.
That may be condoned as acceptable behaviour by you but to the wider audience it is a measure of the man.
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I don't think it matters whether one condones something or not, the Judge agreed to the postponement and she, after all, is the person in charge of proceedings.
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A good point.
The McCanns were not giving evidence so technically had no reason to be in Lisbon.. That is of course until they saw how disastrous their case had gone and decided to shoehorn themselves in to at least save some face.
are you really under the illusion that the case has gone badly for the mccanns...I find that incredible...amaral is obviously down and out and heading for total humiliation
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Justice being seen to be done. And no hope of appeal on the grounds of Being Denied a Lawyer.
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Justice being seen to be done. And no hope of appeal on the grounds of Being Denied a Lawyer.
The judge has to be very careful with procedure otherwise amaral will be crying mistrial...mccanns just have to be patient