UK Justice Forum 🇬🇧
Alleged Miscarriages of Justice => Jeremy Bamber and the callous murder of his father, mother, sister and twin nephews. Case effectively CLOSED by CCRC on basis of NO APPEAL REFERRAL. => Topic started by: John on August 03, 2012, 09:07:34 PM
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Must has been written and indeed speculated about the blood which can be seen on Sheila Caffell's neck. It is suggested that at least some of this blood is in fact wet blood which was an indication that death may have occurred not that long before the photographs were taken. Others will point to the fact that the photographer used a flash bulb when taking the photos which in itself could account for the shiny appearance of the blood.
Judge for yourself, is it in fact wet blood? Was this blood actually pooled blood from within Sheila's throat cavity which when disturbed exited the wound to give the appearance of being fresh blood?
http://i.imgur.com/nggFO.jpg
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What is certainly clear from the image is that Sheila's head must have been forward from the position seen in the photograph following the second and fatal shot (upper wound). When her head was moved back allowing blood to flow under gravity a mirror image of the entry wound was then immediately observable under her chin.
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Here is another picture of the scene showing Sheila with her head slightly to the side of the bedside table.
Could it be that when Sheila fell back her head actually rested against the table allowing the mirror image effect to occur? Was her head then moved and set back by the police to facilitate the photography?
http://i.imgur.com/Iii66.jpg
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It might look wet because of the amount there is there and how it's dried. For it to be 'wet' it'd have to be 'fresh' blood which is only going to carry on flowing while the heart beats. It'll bleed for a bit until the pressure is lost.
Or Sheils died just before she was found and it is wet which would begger the question, if she's bleeding, she might (and I say might) have a heartbeat or a recently lost one which should have instigated cpr, so I don't think she was still bleeding myself and might well have started with rigour which is why they chose to leave her.
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Looking at this picture the question must be asked how did she get the blood on her right wrist because blood certainly does not run up hill?
The flash photography can again be clearly seen in this photograph reflected in the Bible.
http://i.imgur.com/JEcTv.jpg
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The more I look at the top neck wound the less sure I am about it being mirrored.
If you bend your head tightly down the skin of the neck creases lower down, nearer to the hollow below the larynx, whereas in the photo the mirroring appears to be higher up in the neck, where little creasing occurs.
And I would have expected to see more blood transferred upwards from the lower wound too.
To me it looks like the end of the sound moderator has been dragged or wiped across the upper wound twice from right to left in the close-up photo, after the first shot was fired when it became coated with backspattered blood, which would have caused the two heavier blood spots, showing just to the left of the fore-sight of the rifle.
Could they assailant have been testing where to place the final shot?
If Sheila had been found with her head tight up against the bedside cabinet, surely there would have been more spreading of blood across the neck area from both wounds too.
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The more I look at the top neck wound the less sure I am about it being mirrored.
If you bend your head tightly down the skin of the neck creases lower down, nearer to the hollow below the larynx, whereas in the photo the mirroring appears to be higher up in the neck, where little creasing occurs.
And I would have expected to see more blood transferred upwards from the lower wound too.
To me it looks like the end of the sound moderator has been dragged or wiped across the upper wound twice from right to left in the close-up photo, after the first shot was fired when it became coated with backspattered blood, which would have caused the two heavier blood spots, showing just to the left of the fore-sight of the rifle.
Could they assailant have been testing where to place the final shot?
If Sheila had been found with her head tight up against the bedside cabinet, surely there would have been more spreading of blood across the neck area from both wounds too.
John's going with the mirror image, but I don't. I just see that Sheila's head was moved slightly between shots. Her rucked-up nightie and splayed out hair proves that she was pulled down to expose her throat so that the second shot didn't miss. IMO.
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Looking at this picture the question must be asked how did she get the blood on her right wrist because blood certainly does not run up hill?
The flash photography can again be clearly seen in this photograph reflected in the Bible.
http://i.imgur.com/JEcTv.jpg
An excellent post John,
It is thought that the blood on her wrist came from the when she was reclining at an angle when she was first shot. The blood from the wound would be expelled outwards from the sub-sonic bullet in large droplets. When she settled in her horizontal position the blood ran topwards the floor leaving the blood you see.
I think she was in a semi-sitting position, leaning against the cabinet when she was shot. I also think Bamber tricked her or threatened her into that position. It was here that Bamber pulled the trigger at a angle that was almost perpendicular to her neck (this again questions any notion that Sheila shot herself as the distance between the end of the silencer and the trigger would have been too great)
The bullet severed the carotid artery and shattered the fourth vertebrae of her neck at a shallow angle.
The second shot was administered at a much more shallow angle with her torso. The bullet went through the roof of her mouth and into her brain, killing her instantly. The two angles are completely different and strongly suggests that they were fired by someone else.
I have my doubts that Sheila would have been capable of firing a second shot and I am almost certain that she could not have. Peter Vanizes left the options open on that one, but I think he was being perhaps a little too fence-sitting on this. DS Stan Jones also thought so when he visited his dentist shortly after the murders with agonising tooth ache which had keep him up all night. It turned out to be a small hole in his molar. He figured right then, that a small hole could cause such an astonishing amount of pain - just think what Sheila wounds must have been like?
Food for thought indeed.....
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Thats what i was thinking, Ian. Sheila was made to get into that position at gun point. Then he shot her.
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These horrific crime scene photographs of Sheila Caffell should remind us what this revolting apology for humanity did and why he should NEVER be allowed out of prison. We should remember that it is nearly the 27th anniversary of one of the worst crimes in the second half of the twentieth century. This monster butchered two innocent 6 year olds as well as the rest of his immediate family. He deserves to die in custody.
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These horrific crime scene photographs of Sheila Caffell should remind us what this revolting apology for humanity did and why he should NEVER be allowed out of prison. We should remember that it is nearly the 27th anniversary of one of the worst crimes in the second half of the twentieth century. This monster butchered two innocent 6 year olds as well as the rest of his immediate family. He deserves to die in custody.
Absolutely Dillon,
We should also remember that he plotted and planned this with unbelievable callousness. He actually asked Colin Caffell when he was going to bring the twins to White House Farm shortly before he murdered them in cold blood. He also had the sheer audacity to laugh about the crime and brag of his own 'ingenuity' afterwards.
The utter cold-bloodedness of this twisted monster is there for all to see.
I totally agree with you Dillon, this appalling, murderous ingrate needs to be kept locked up in maximum security until the day he dies.
Thank you also Dillon of reminding us all that nearly 27 years have gone by - 27 years of life stolen from two little boys, a beautiful young woman who had their whole lives in front of them and two devoted parents, by a sick, twisted greedy waste of oxygen.
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The Bamber forum. Unbelievable. Mike Teskowski rambling on to himself, and mertol off to a car boot sale. These are the people responsible for Bamber's future.
You couldn't make this stuff up. @)(++(*
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The Bamber forum. Unbelievable. Mike Teskowski rambling on to himself, and mertol off to a car boot sale. These are the people responsible for Bamber's future.
You couldn't make this stuff up. @)(++(*
what is wrong with boot sales there are many treasures to be found, a brushomatic, half a bottle of brut aftershave, a commode with only one leg missing, a signed photo of Norman vaughn, never ending story (betamax) , hamster ball, marbles, a book about nuns. 8((()*/
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The Bamber forum. Unbelievable. Mike Teskowski rambling on to himself, and mertol off to a car boot sale. These are the people responsible for Bamber's future.
You couldn't make this stuff up. @)(++(*
what is wrong with boot sales there are many treasures to be found, a brushomatic, half a bottle of brut aftershave, a commode with only one leg missing, a signed photo of Norman vaughn, never ending story (betamax) , hamster ball, marbles, a book about nuns. 8((()*/
That's a coincidence Mertol, as I am went to a local village fate this morning
and I brought home some well-needed bargain such as a 1979 xylophone, a chess board with all the pieces except the black queen and the white rook. Two Beano 1976 and 1977 Annuals, an Armenian washing machine thermostat (slightly burnt?), a very worn-looking board game of KerPlunk and Mousetrap, both with most of the pieces missing and a signed copy of Tom Clancy's new thriller, the intenational best selling sequel; 'Don't Go to Village Fete's and Squander Your Money on Buying Useless Crap (Vol II) ' I can't seem to find Volume one?
.................I ask you. Can it get better than that? 8((()*/
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Thats what i was thinking, Ian. Sheila was made to get into that position at gun point. Then he shot her.
I have always thought that Sheila was taken into the main bedroom at gunpoint. I believe that she was leaning away from the gun when she was shot. I also believe that she died pretty quickly after that first shot.
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The Bamber forum. Unbelievable. Mike Teskowski rambling on to himself, and mertol off to a car boot sale. These are the people responsible for Bamber's future.
You couldn't make this stuff up. @)(++(*
what is wrong with boot sales there are many treasures to be found, a brushomatic, half a bottle of brut aftershave, a commode with only one leg missing, a signed photo of Norman vaughn, never ending story (betamax) , hamster ball, marbles, a book about nuns. 8((()*/
That's a coincidence Mertol, as I am went to a local village fate this morning
and I brought home some well-needed bargain such as a 1979 xylophone, a chess board with all the pieces except the black queen and the white rook. Two Beano 1976 and 1977 Annuals, an Armenian washing machine thermostat (slightly burnt?), a very worn-looking board game of KerPlunk and Mousetrap, both with most of the pieces missing and a signed copy of Tom Clancy's new thriller, the intenational best selling sequel; 'Don't Go to Village Fete's and Squander Your Money on Buying Useless Crap (Vol II) ' I can't seem to find Volume one?
.................I ask you. Can it get better than that? 8((()*/
ian i bow to you you are clearly king of unwanted shite I can only imagine your back bedroom. do you have the crying girl? it takes pride of place in my static caravan
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Thats what i was thinking, Ian. Sheila was made to get into that position at gun point. Then he shot her.
I have always thought that Sheila was taken into the main bedroom at gunpoint. I believe that she was leaning away from the gun when she was shot. I also believe that she died pretty quickly after that first shot.
Yup I agree Simong,
Sheila I have always believed that Sheila was either threatened or somehow persuaded to be in the bedroom. What is evident is that she would undoubtedly have seen the body of her mother June lying by the bedroom door. June's body was described as being in a 'horrific state' Witnessing this must have had an shocking effect on poor Sheila. The poor woman must have been in a state of unimaginable terror; not for just herself but for her little boys who were just down the hallway.
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I think we have to assume that maybe Sheila knew nothing of her boys' deaths (I think most people are fairly sure they were shot first) and perhaps was told that if she didn't do as she was told the boys would be next after June. I can't see her being compliant in this if she knew what had happened to Daniel and Nicholas. I have wondered how she would have been kept out of the way while June and Neville were being killed. Is there some sort of anasthetic substance that could have kept her comatose or quiet without showing up in the post mortem?
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I think we have to assume that maybe Sheila knew nothing of her boys' deaths (I think most people are fairly sure they were shot first) and perhaps was told that if she didn't do as she was told the boys would be next after June. I can't see her being compliant in this if she knew what had happened to Daniel and Nicholas. I have wondered how she would have been kept out of the way while June and Neville were being killed. Is there some sort of anasthetic substance that could have kept her comatose or quiet without showing up in the post mortem?
Thanks for your points Goatboy,
An intriguing set of questions. I think that Sheila may have been initially asleep. It appeared that her bed was made but she may have slept on the top of the covers. Moreover I think you point about drugs is a good one. She was 'very quiet' according to Pamela Boutflour, who phoned the farm that evening. I believe she was under the influence of her medication and may have consumed something else that can be masked so it is not detected during an autopsy. Whatever it was, made her extremely lethargic and listless. These were and still are widely available. I cannot but help think about Bamber's request to Julie Mugford for her to obtain some tranquilisers. This she did and she later stated that she left them at Jeremy's house. They were part of Bamber's original plan to drug the family and burn down the house. Let us not forget that Bamber admitted sharing an evening meal with the family the night before they were killed. He had ample opportunity to slip Sheila a 'Mickey Finn' However, the autopsy didnt show anything apart from her usual drugs and some traces of cannabis. Only Bamber knows for sure what he did or did give Sheila. The mystery continues...
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The Bamber forum. Unbelievable. Mike Teskowski rambling on to himself, and mertol off to a car boot sale. These are the people responsible for Bamber's future.
You couldn't make this stuff up. @)(++(*
what is wrong with boot sales there are many treasures to be found, a brushomatic, half a bottle of brut aftershave, a commode with only one leg missing, a signed photo of Norman vaughn, never ending story (betamax) , hamster ball, marbles, a book about nuns. 8((()*/
That's a coincidence Mertol, as I am went to a local village fate this morning
and I brought home some well-needed bargain such as a 1979 xylophone, a chess board with all the pieces except the black queen and the white rook. Two Beano 1976 and 1977 Annuals, an Armenian washing machine thermostat (slightly burnt?), a very worn-looking board game of KerPlunk and Mousetrap, both with most of the pieces missing and a signed copy of Tom Clancy's new thriller, the intenational best selling sequel; 'Don't Go to Village Fete's and Squander Your Money on Buying Useless Crap (Vol II) ' I can't seem to find Volume one?
.................I ask you. Can it get better than that? 8((()*/
ian i bow to you you are clearly king of unwanted shite I can only imagine your back bedroom. do you have the crying girl? it takes pride of place in my static caravan
No but I do have a poster of a woman playing tennis scratching her backside and flying ducks on the wall..............beat that 8)-)))
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I think we have to assume that maybe Sheila knew nothing of her boys' deaths (I think most people are fairly sure they were shot first) and perhaps was told that if she didn't do as she was told the boys would be next after June. I can't see her being compliant in this if she knew what had happened to Daniel and Nicholas. I have wondered how she would have been kept out of the way while June and Neville were being killed. Is there some sort of anasthetic substance that could have kept her comatose or quiet without showing up in the post mortem?
My own personal belief is that it came down to two scenarios. Either Sheila was locked in her room at the outset or she was indeed rendered unconscious by some noxious substance.
I prefer the latter however which would have allowed her to have been carried into the master bedroom after the killings had taken placed and then strategically placed alongside the bed before being shot herself.
As there is no blood spatter on her face, wiped blood on her neck and no blood on her fingers It can only be deduced that she never regained consciousness at any time.
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I think we have to assume that maybe Sheila knew nothing of her boys' deaths (I think most people are fairly sure they were shot first) and perhaps was told that if she didn't do as she was told the boys would be next after June. I can't see her being compliant in this if she knew what had happened to Daniel and Nicholas. I have wondered how she would have been kept out of the way while June and Neville were being killed. Is there some sort of anasthetic substance that could have kept her comatose or quiet without showing up in the post mortem?
My own personal belief is that it came down to two scenarios. Either Sheila was locked in her room at the outset or she was indeed rendered unconscious by some noxious substance.
I prefer the latter however which would have allowed her to have been carried into the master bedroom after the killings had taken placed and then strategically placed alongside the bed before being shot herself.
As there is no blood spatter on her face, wiped blood on her neck and no blood on her fingers It can only be deduced that she never regained consciousness at any time.
John, thanks for posting up the info about McDonald. I think Sheila was the last to go to bed that night after eating a snack. I believe the house was being watched by the killer and as the last light went out, they entered the house through a window. I have always thought that she was the first person to meet the killer as he enters her room and forces her at gunpoint into the parents room. As i have said before on here, the killer would want all the adults together to have control of the situation. Thats my theory.
For the members convinced that JB did it, is JB watching the house waiting for the right time to gain entry. Everyone else has gone to sleep. He sees Sheila enter the kitchen to prepare her snack and simply taps on the window or door and is let into the house. He then, gets the gun and takes her upstairs at gunpoint. Just another theory 8-)(--)
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I love the way someone called 'Roch' writes. I have never, come across a more hypocritical, arrogant, misguided non-entity in my life. The man (if he is, in fact, a man?) is a ticking time-bomb of conflicting half-baked barely credible theories, and a waterfall of self-delusion which often cascades into gushing praise of the equally hypocritical power zealot and fairy-tale-in-chief Mike Tesko. Roch simply cannot comprehend the notion that other people might have viewpoints that may not be the same as his own. This probably came as a big shock to someone like him. A completely brainwashed over-protective robot that sees the differing sides of the debate in the same was as a panzer general would. 'Annihilate them before they annihilate us' He drips with barely-concealed loathing and hatred for anyone that doesnt support his idol and is equally susceptable to bouts of immature unreasonable idiocy.
Roch I award you the starryian award for the most hypocritical, biased and utterly obnoxious poster on the blue forum.
We salute you!
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is caroline r really Keira? and patti shes a right know it all, or she thinks she knows it all.briget normally thrashes her in a debate. and lookout what a nobhead,he/she comes out with some shite its embarasing
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is caroline r really Keira? and patti shes a right know it all, or she thinks she knows it all.briget normally thrashes her in a debate. and lookout what a nobhead,he/she comes out with some shite its embarasing
Caroline R sounds like snotty Chochokeira tonight.
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is caroline r really Keira? and patti shes a right know it all, or she thinks she knows it all.briget normally thrashes her in a debate. and lookout what a nobhead,he/she comes out with some shite its embarasing
Idiot, do you know it all too...Leave my name off here....you have no idea who you are dealing with when you mention my name...What you do not understand is that Bridget and I are friendly eve though we have opposite views. If I was you I would change your nappy... @)(++(* 8((()*/ 8((()*/ 8((()*/ 8((()*/
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If that really is Patti she is really lovely and very clever
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If that really is Patti she is really lovely and very clever
Hey Jackie it is really me....Had some bad news recently; had some paedophilia stuff posted on my account...Got all and sundry involved...Police, NSPCC and CEOP and got the site on facebook closed down....in hours...thank god...But, sadly it made me close my facebook and Twitter account down....
Hope you are OK....xxxx
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Patti
That's terrible do you know if it's somebody personally responsible and were the police any help?
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Elvis
Bridget never ever thrashes Patti
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Patti
That's terrible do you know if it's somebody personally responsible and were the police any help?
Hi Jackie. At first the police wasn't interested, although the image was of a child no older than 12 years old. I gave them a piece of my mind and told them who I was. I also told them I would investigate it myself, which I did and passed all the information on to CEOP....Within a couple of hours it was all deleted and is still being investigated....Ironically, the police contacted me the day after and told me that they were going to investigate it too...Ha! 24 hours too late......I could not wait, that length of time, but I still await for information concerning who/what/when/why the photo's were taken....that poor child....was she forced?
I don't care for adult porn, but when it involves children, it really gets to me....xxxxx
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Elvis
Bridget never ever thrashes Patti
She does occasionally, but I am winning 3-1 lololol 8@??)( 8@??)( 8@??)(
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Disgusting, I bet Mark Williams Thomas would be interested in that. That's the main area he investigates xxx
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Disgusting, I bet Mark Williams Thomas would be interested in that. That's the main area he investigates xxx
i did ask him to help....I suspect he helped....but closed my account down...He is one lovely man. I admire his work; along with Prof. David. Wilson. Both are criminologists. Just like me...xxxx
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Sorry I am not a criminologist....Posted that incorrectly... 8(8-))
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I love the way someone called 'Roch' writes. I have never, come across a more hypocritical, arrogant, misguided non-entity in my life. The man (if he is, in fact, a man?) is a ticking time-bomb of conflicting half-baked barely credible theories, and a waterfall of self-delusion which often cascades into gushing praise of the equally hypocritical power zealot and fairy-tale-in-chief Mike Tesko. Roch simply cannot comprehend the notion that other people might have viewpoints that may not be the same as his own. This probably came as a big shock to someone like him. A completely brainwashed over-protective robot that sees the differing sides of the debate in the same was as a panzer general would. 'Annihilate them before they annihilate us' He drips with barely-concealed loathing and hatred for anyone that doesn't support his idol and is equally susceptible to bouts of immature unreasonable idiocy.
Roch I award you the starryian award for the most hypocritical, biased and utterly obnoxious poster on the blue forum.
We salute you!
Far be it for me to disagree with your description of the formidable Roch so I don't intend to. @)(++(*
I notice he had a go at me on the blue forum yesterday and made a comment to the effect that I was disliked on forums. Could it be that what is actually disliked is my ability to say it as it is and not take any prisoners?
I will say one thing for Roch though...he has managed to keep his anonymity so far. 8(0(*
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Elvis
Bridget never ever thrashes Patti
She does occasionally, but I am winning 3-1 lololol 8@??)( 8@??)( 8@??)(
Is that right? Bridget has thrashed the lot of you and made you look like muppets.
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Elvis
Bridget never ever thrashes Patti
She does occasionally, but I am winning 3-1 lololol 8@??)( 8@??)( 8@??)(
Is that right? Bridget has thrashed the lot of you and made you look like muppets.
Bridget is right about the gun. It's clear to see. They are a thick bunch over the road if they can't or won't see that. No wonder Bamber's still in the clink.
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John in your opinion, you know as much about what happened that night as I do
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Enigma why doesn't Bridget go back to her Weety name instead of hiding behind a secret user name on here and making out she left after her row with Tim.
Bridget/Weety wouldn't know how to tell the truth if it was staring her in the face
If you don't believe me read her website just for a laugh
Or aren't you interested in the truth????
Not a clue what you're on about. Bridget is making them look like stubborn idiots. Mike Tesko, photographic expert YOU ARE WRONG.
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I didn't say I agreed with Mike Tesko
Patti is brilliant digging to get to the truth, she is not rude either and she should be welcomed to post on this forum if you want even debate
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Enigma why doesn't Bridget go back to her Weety name instead of hiding behind a secret user name on here and making out she left after her row with Tim.
Bridget/Weety wouldn't know how to tell the truth if it was staring her in the face
If you don't believe me read her website just for a laugh
Or aren't you interested in the truth????
Not a clue what you're on about. Bridget is making them look like stubborn idiots. Mike Tesko, photographic expert YOU ARE WRONG.
And now Rochford is being thick.
This is beginning to feel like Stepford. >@@(*&)
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And you are one to Judge????? 8-)(--)
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Try listening and reading you might learn something you didn't know about the case
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Enigma why doesn't Bridget go back to her Weety name instead of hiding behind a secret user name on here and making out she left after her row with Tim.
Bridget/Weety wouldn't know how to tell the truth if it was staring her in the face
If you don't believe me read her website just for a laugh
Or aren't you interested in the truth????
Not a clue what you're on about. Bridget is making them look like stubborn idiots. Mike Tesko, photographic expert YOU ARE WRONG.
And now Rochford is being thick.
This is beginning to feel like Stepford. >@@(*&)
They haven't got a clue. Blind as bats. Jeremy will stay safe and sound, where he is 8((()*/
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It's quite sad to see Mike Tesko struggling like that. It seems like he's at the end of his journey. And trust belton to make things worse.
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It's quite sad to see Mike Tesko struggling like that. It seems like he's at the end of his journey. And trust belton to make things worse.
I can't work out if Tesko is confused or untruthful. And I don't think he and Bamber have been "mates" for quite some time.
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It's quite sad to see Mike Tesko struggling like that. It seems like he's at the end of his journey. And trust belton to make things worse.
I can't work out if Tesko is confused or untruthful. And I don't think he and Bamber have been "mates" for quite some time.
I think that he is/was untruthful so to speak/as it were
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If that really is Patti she is really lovely and very clever
And hopeless at French
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Enigma why doesn't Bridget go back to her Weety name instead of hiding behind a secret user name on here and making out she left after her row with Tim.
Bridget/Weety wouldn't know how to tell the truth if it was staring her in the face
If you don't believe me read her website just for a laugh
Or aren't you interested in the truth????
Not a clue what you're on about. Bridget is making them look like stubborn idiots. Mike Tesko, photographic expert YOU ARE WRONG.
And now Rochford is being thick.
This is beginning to feel like Stepford. >@@(*&)
I'm suprised at Rochford, he's usually fair. He's way off the mark this time.
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Belton is a Rampton case!
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Is "susan ingham" the former Bamber forum member jackiepreece?
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John in your opinion, you know as much about what happened that night as I do
So if that is the case why are you still in denial? >@@(*&)
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Nice to see you discuss the case Jack, care to explain how sheila got upstairs after the first shot? No blood down her front?
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Looking at this picture the question must be asked how did she get the blood on her right wrist because blood certainly does not run up hill?
The flash photography can again be clearly seen in this photograph reflected in the Bible.
http://i.imgur.com/JEcTv.jpg
Could the blood on her right wrist and hand be there because Sheila grabbed the end of the barrel as it was pushed into her neck for the first shot? Also the reason for the shot being to the side of her throat?
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I'm inclined to think that the blood on her wrist came from blood which had exited the neck wound under pressure and hit her arm before she collapsed. Several others spots can be seen on the carpet.
Notice how there isn't any on her legs or the rifle.
http://i.imgur.com/7XWiif1.jpg
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The first shot might well have been a mistake because it was fired at almost 90 degrees to the neck. You may be right Shona... if Sheila had her right hand holding the barrel end to try to divert the shot and his finger tripped the trigger accidentally, before he was ready to fire.
Weren't some of the blood spots found underneath Sheila's body, and like those to the side of her leg thought to be from June as she wandered around the bedroom after being shot earlier on. They look like they have dropped vertically rather than being sprayed.
Only a couple of blood samples from the carpet in the room were taken though, and I don't think any from that region before the carpets were burned, so the spots could have been from any of the three victims.
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The first shot might well have been a mistake because it was fired at almost 90 degrees to the neck. You may be right Shona... if Sheila had her right hand holding the barrel end to try to divert the shot and his finger tripped the trigger accidentally, before he was ready to fire.
Weren't some of the blood spots found underneath Sheila's body, and like those to the side of her leg thought to be from June as she wandered around the bedroom after being shot earlier on. They look like they have dropped vertically rather than being sprayed.
Only a couple of blood samples from the carpet in the room were taken though, and I don't think any from that region before the carpets were burned, so the spots could have been from any of the three victims.
I have always thought that the blood spots were from Ralph.
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The first shot might well have been a mistake because it was fired at almost 90 degrees to the neck. You may be right Shona... if Sheila had her right hand holding the barrel end to try to divert the shot and his finger tripped the trigger accidentally, before he was ready to fire.
Weren't some of the blood spots found underneath Sheila's body, and like those to the side of her leg thought to be from June as she wandered around the bedroom after being shot earlier on. They look like they have dropped vertically rather than being sprayed.
Only a couple of blood samples from the carpet in the room were taken though, and I don't think any from that region before the carpets were burned, so the spots could have been from any of the three victims.
I have always thought that the blood spots were from Ralph.
I don't think Ralph was ever on that side of the bedroom after having been shot initially as he opened the bedroom door.
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The first shot might well have been a mistake because it was fired at almost 90 degrees to the neck. You may be right Shona... if Sheila had her right hand holding the barrel end to try to divert the shot and his finger tripped the trigger accidentally, before he was ready to fire.
Weren't some of the blood spots found underneath Sheila's body, and like those to the side of her leg thought to be from June as she wandered around the bedroom after being shot earlier on. They look like they have dropped vertically rather than being sprayed.
Only a couple of blood samples from the carpet in the room were taken though, and I don't think any from that region before the carpets were burned, so the spots could have been from any of the three victims.
I have always thought that the blood spots were from Ralph.
I don't think Ralph was ever on that side of the bedroom after having been shot initially as he opened the bedroom door.
It might be that Ralph was still close to his side of the bed (it may have taken him a few seconds to wake up and realise what was happening) when Bamber burst into the bedroom and started shooting. June was shot while her head was still on the pillow.
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Three movie quotes, all of them wrong!!
Ho ho ho ho ho ho ho!!
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The first shot might well have been a mistake because it was fired at almost 90 degrees to the neck. You may be right Shona... if Sheila had her right hand holding the barrel end to try to divert the shot and his finger tripped the trigger accidentally, before he was ready to fire.
Weren't some of the blood spots found underneath Sheila's body, and like those to the side of her leg thought to be from June as she wandered around the bedroom after being shot earlier on. They look like they have dropped vertically rather than being sprayed.
Only a couple of blood samples from the carpet in the room were taken though, and I don't think any from that region before the carpets were burned, so the spots could have been from any of the three victims.
I have always thought that the blood spots were from Ralph.
I don't think Ralph was ever on that side of the bedroom after having been shot initially as he opened the bedroom door.
It might be that Ralph was still close to his side of the bed (it may have taken him a few seconds to wake up and realise what was happening) when Bamber burst into the bedroom and started shooting. June was shot while her head was still on the pillow.
I agree.. Nevill might have been there initially, getting out of bed when the assailant came through the door and surprised both parents. Most of the ejected cartridge shells were located within the room rather than on the landing (the hatched area indicates where the bullets were most likely fired from) and he may have received those first shots to the left arm and/or mouth on his way round from his side of the bed to confront his son.
(http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/2449/whfmainbedroom.jpg)
The drops of blood too look as if they have dropped vertically from someone standing upright, rather than elongated as they might have been if they sprayed from a spurting wound... so it's possible they came from Nevill.
(http://img823.imageshack.us/img823/5445/socksd.jpg)
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As a new member I have no right to complain but would it be possible to hide or remove the pictures of Shelia and put them in an area where you have to register to view them. There are are lot of people who "like" these sort of things. Thanks to the "Blue" forum poor Sheila has precious little dignity left in this world. Can we help protect her?
Let her be remembered in happier circumstances.
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As a new member I have no right to complain but would it be possible to hide or remove the pictures of Shelia and put them in an area where you have to register to view them. There are are lot of people who "like" these sort of things. Thanks to the "Blue" forum poor Sheila has precious little dignity left in this world. Can we help protect her?
Let her be remembered in happier circumstances.
This was mentioned some time back and it was agreed that we would keep the images to a minimum. However, I do agree with your sentiments about Sheila. What we can do is to convert the existing ones on this thread to links which means anyone wanting to look at them will have to click on them. I hope this helps.
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As a new member I have no right to complain but would it be possible to hide or remove the pictures of Shelia and put them in an area where you have to register to view them. There are are lot of people who "like" these sort of things. Thanks to the "Blue" forum poor Sheila has precious little dignity left in this world. Can we help protect her?
Let her be remembered in happier circumstances.
This was mentioned some time back and it was agreed that we would keep the images to a minimum. However, I do agree with your sentiments about Sheila. What we can do is to convert the existing ones on this thread to links which means anyone wanting to look at them will have to click on them. I hope this helps.
I know you are right. It is a difficult balance to respect the dignity of the dead and yet show sufficient to prove the lies of the Crankies. At least one of the Crankies has a graphic picture of Sheila's neck on a public page of his Facebook account. Others on "Blue" have "got off" on defacing images of her neck to "show what she would have looked like with a single wound."
You know more of these things than I. What you suggest is a kindly compromise.