Disappeared and Abducted Children and Young Adults => Madeleine McCann (3) disappeared from her parent's holiday apartment at Ocean Club, Praia da Luz, Portugal on 3 May 2007. No trace of her has ever been found. => Topic started by: Robittybob1 on January 08, 2018, 10:36:49 AM
Title: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 08, 2018, 10:36:49 AM
471 to 473-Witness statement of Arlindo Epifano Goncalves Fernandes Peleja 2007.05.07
Do any of his direct reports mention his presence at the Tapas Restaurant? Was there any attempt to locate the car he says was outside the reception entrance?
Who were the three couples in the esplanade? Were the Tapas nine group sitting in the Esplanade? If they were the Tapas 9 he was referring to why does he have them vacating the table so early?
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Carana on January 08, 2018, 11:14:03 AM
Do any of his direct reports mention his presence at the Tapas Restaurant? Was there any attempt to locate the car he says was outside the reception entrance?
Who were the three couples in the esplanade? Were the Tapas nine group sitting in the Esplanade? If they were the Tapas 9 he was referring to why does he have them vacating the table so early?
I can't recall re the car, Rob.
I just checked the PT: it does say "esplanada", but it can also mean terrace - which makes more sense.
Re "leaving early" - it would take time to wade through again, and I don't think we have a thread on that issue on here, but some statements describe events, and that can be corroborated by cross-checking with others, almost to withinn 5 mins or so - but with a 1-hour time difference.
Unless there's a time zone difference running through half the village, both can't be right.
That has led to all kinds of "init" theories, but my best guess is that as there were so many witnesses to get statements from ASAP, different officers may have had a flipchart of the approximate timing of events in their offices, and one of them got mixed up, and just filled in the time with the wrong hour to get on with the next witness to interview.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: jassi on January 08, 2018, 12:04:14 PM
I just checked the PT: it does say "esplanada", but it can also mean terrace - which makes more sense.
Re "leaving early" - it would take time to wade through again, and I don't think we have a thread on that issue on here, but some statements describe events, and that can be corroborated by cross-checking with others, almost to withinn 5 mins or so - but with a 1-hour time difference.
Unless there's a time zone difference running through half the village, both can't be right.
That has led to all kinds of "init" theories, but my best guess is that as there were so many witnesses to get statements from ASAP, different officers may have had a flipchart of the approximate timing of events in their offices, and one of them got mixed up, and just filled in the time with the wrong hour to get on with the next witness to interview.
In the case of this witness, he gives 3 times that all correspond, so unlikely to a simple mix-up of times and no possibility of a translation error
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Carana on January 08, 2018, 01:37:21 PM
Correspond to what? It is a correspondence that I need but is it real?
Correspond to one another. He gives a sequence of times so it is unlikely that they were all transcribed incorrectly. No doubt the police were able to confirm if these times were accurate. - eg the staff at the main restaurant would know when he left to go to the Tapas - maybe not to the exact minute, but not 30 or 40 minutes adrift.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 08, 2018, 06:57:14 PM
Correspond to one another. He gives a sequence of times so it is unlikely that they were all transcribed incorrectly. No doubt the police were able to confirm if these times were accurate. - eg the staff at the main restaurant would know when he left to go to the Tapas - maybe not to the exact minute, but not 30 or 40 minutes adrift.
But does anyone there even mention him? How can I tell if he is not making the whole story up? What part of what he does say can be confirmed by anyone else?
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: jassi on January 08, 2018, 06:59:38 PM
But does anyone there even mention him? How can I tell if he is not making the whole story up? What part of what he does say can be confirmed by anyone else?
You can't, but why should he?
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 08, 2018, 07:16:33 PM
The whole idea of witness statements is that what they say is supposed to be the truth. Generally facts and events mentioned by the witness will be mentioned by other witnesses which then confirms that it was likely to be true.
Let's look at each paragraph in turn and see if any part can be confirmed. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm ". Is a functionary of the Ocean Club establishment since the 13th of January of the current year (2007), and is employed as executive chef of the kitchen. He clarifies that along with being responsible for the five (5) kitchens (one of whom is the Tapas) of the Ocean Club, his post essentially centres on the principal kitchen next to a reception, close to the restaurant MIRAGE. His work takes him occasionally to the other kitchens; "
If we Google Mirage restaurant praia da luz do we get a result?
There is a restaurant caled the Mirage "Mirage Restaurant Rua do Ramalhete" So is this the one " .... next to a reception, close to the restaurant MIRAGE."?
Well according to Google Earth Rua do Ramalhete is nowhere near either the main reception or the secondary reception.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 08, 2018, 07:22:38 PM
Strangely enough the Mirage restaurant is for sale and the real estate agent is Sergey Malinka https://livealgarve.com/property/264
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 08, 2018, 07:30:59 PM
Next sentence: "He records that the past Thursday, 3rd of May, he left the central kitchen with the objective of going to the Tapas restaurant in order to determine that everything was functioning smoothly; "
You would think that the presence of the executive chef would be enough for some of the other staff to mention it.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 08, 2018, 07:44:09 PM
Next bit: ". When he arrived there, by vehicle, at around 21:10, he remembers that next to the Tapas reception, he saw a vehicle, dark blue in colour, with Portuguese license plates. Although he cannot be definite, he believes it was a Fiesta or Focus. The deponent furthers that is was not a small car, and for this reason it could very well have been a Focus and not a Fiesta. He tells that he does not remember any sticker indicating that it was a rental car. Inside the vehicle he saw no one. . After parking his vehicle, he entered through the reception of that restaurant, in the left hand direction, toward the side opposite the pool, and passed by the esplanade. He remembers having seen in that esplanade, one table, occupied by three couples, without children, and all of them adults. On the esplanade, he encountered no one else."
9:10 is when Gerry Jane and Jez were out and about. Did they see any cars pull up? Previously I thought when he saw a table occupied by three couples he could have been taking about the Tapas 9 with at least 3 of them away. We might say it was possible that Jane and Gerry had left so that might look as if there were 3 couples still seated. Was it the Tapas 9 or was it some other group?
When he says he saw no one else? Had Stephen Carpenter and his friends left by that stage?
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 08, 2018, 08:01:24 PM
Next bit: ". A few minutes later, when it was around 21H20, he heard some clamour, which made him leave toward the restaurant, a few meters away, and was then informed that a child had disappeared. Given the importance of this, believed that he should be in the surroundings. At that moment, he did not leave the area of the restaurant, and did not have the opportunity to check if the vehicle mentioned before was situated in the same location; "
I sort of wondering what did he hear and if he had some sense in what direction the noise came from? I am not sure of the spatial arrangement of those seated in the esplanade and the restaurant. Was he walking toward the noise or away from it? Why didn't he go and check it out? Who informed him at 9:20 a child had disappeared? If he had been there at 10:20 PM I could understand the story line, but then he should have noticed the Tapas mob making a dash for the exit.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: pathfinder73 on January 08, 2018, 08:09:20 PM
His times are completely out. The alarm was not raised at 21:20.
A few minutes later, when it was around 21H20, he heard some clamour, which made him leave toward the restaurant, a few meters away, and was then informed that a child had disappeared. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 08, 2018, 08:21:18 PM
His times are completely out. The alarm was not raised at 21:20.
A few minutes later, when it was around 21H20, he heard some clamour, which made him leave toward the restaurant, a few meters away, and was then informed that a child had disappeared. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm
So why is he an hour out with his times? Could he be just half an hour out?
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: pathfinder73 on January 08, 2018, 08:41:41 PM
So why is he an hour out with his times? Could he be just half an hour out?
21:40 according to him nobody was at the table not even Dianne so he's way out with his times. Not seeing Dianne there alone like others did then you have to question the reliability of the witness.
Later, at around 21:40, he left the restaurant passing through the same esplanade where moments before, he had seen the same table occupied by the three couples, empty, who had left in the meanwhile various items, principally clothing. He was told by his colleagues that the child who had disappeared was a child of one of those couples; http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: G-Unit on January 08, 2018, 08:57:09 PM
Next bit: ". When he arrived there, by vehicle, at around 21:10, he remembers that next to the Tapas reception, he saw a vehicle, dark blue in colour, with Portuguese license plates. Although he cannot be definite, he believes it was a Fiesta or Focus. The deponent furthers that is was not a small car, and for this reason it could very well have been a Focus and not a Fiesta. He tells that he does not remember any sticker indicating that it was a rental car. Inside the vehicle he saw no one. . After parking his vehicle, he entered through the reception of that restaurant, in the left hand direction, toward the side opposite the pool, and passed by the esplanade. He remembers having seen in that esplanade, one table, occupied by three couples, without children, and all of them adults. On the esplanade, he encountered no one else."
9:10 is when Gerry Jane and Jez were out and about. Did they see any cars pull up? Previously I thought when he saw a table occupied by three couples he could have been taking about the Tapas 9 with at least 3 of them away. We might say it was possible that Jane and Gerry had left so that might look as if there were 3 couples still seated. Was it the Tapas 9 or was it some other group?
When he says he saw no one else? Had Stephen Carpenter and his friends left by that stage?
Mrs Carpenter heard someone calling'Madeleine' long before 10 pm.
He heard about the news being investigated on the evening of 3rd May at about 21.30 - 21.40 from P**** B******, a Dutchman and owner of the Atlantico restaurant, who passed by the witness near the Baptista supermarket, in P da L and who asked for his help in searching for Madeleine. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/BAREND_WEIJDOM.htm
was contacted by a member of staff from the Tapas Restaurant between 09.30 and 22.00 who informed him that the daughter of some guests who were dining there had disappeared. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/HELDER_LUIS.htm
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Carana on January 08, 2018, 10:04:49 PM
The whole idea of witness statements is that what they say is supposed to be the truth. Generally facts and events mentioned by the witness will be mentioned by other witnesses which then confirms that it was likely to be true.
Let's look at each paragraph in turn and see if any part can be confirmed. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm ". Is a functionary of the Ocean Club establishment since the 13th of January of the current year (2007), and is employed as executive chef of the kitchen. He clarifies that along with being responsible for the five (5) kitchens (one of whom is the Tapas) of the Ocean Club, his post essentially centres on the principal kitchen next to a reception, close to the restaurant MIRAGE. His work takes him occasionally to the other kitchens; "
If we Google Mirage restaurant praia da luz do we get a result?
There is a restaurant caled the Mirage "Mirage Restaurant Rua do Ramalhete" So is this the one " .... next to a reception, close to the restaurant MIRAGE."?
Well according to Google Earth Rua do Ramalhete is nowhere near either the main reception or the secondary reception.
Use G Earth.
That will fly you to the Mirage Apartments owned by Ocean Club.
The Mirage Restaurant is at the extreme eastern end of Rua do Ramalhete, on its northern side, immediately east of three tennis Courts.. It appears to wrap itself around the corner of the complex. If upon reaching that extreme eastern end of Rua do Ramalhete you turn in a northern direction, you will see a car park.
Behind that car park there apppears to be the reception area for Ocean Club Mirage Apartments. It looks as though the restaurant adjoins the Reception area.
Within the curve of the restaurant, it appears that in summer there is out door dining.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 08, 2018, 11:26:07 PM
Sadie - can you recall if the Esplanade was before or after the Tapas restaurant? Do you know how I can visualise the relationships?
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 08, 2018, 11:28:12 PM
Mrs Carpenter heard someone calling'Madeleine' long before 10 pm.
He heard about the news being investigated on the evening of 3rd May at about 21.30 - 21.40 from P**** B******, a Dutchman and owner of the Atlantico restaurant, who passed by the witness near the Baptista supermarket, in P da L and who asked for his help in searching for Madeleine. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/BAREND_WEIJDOM.htm
was contacted by a member of staff from the Tapas Restaurant between 09.30 and 22.00 who informed him that the daughter of some guests who were dining there had disappeared. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/HELDER_LUIS.htm
So how do you explain that if Kate discovered Madeleine missing at 10:00 PM?
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Mr Gray on January 08, 2018, 11:32:39 PM
So why were so many people getting their times so seriously wrong. For you to be right the Carpenters would have to leave after the Tapas group rushed off. Wouldn't they be aware of that?
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 09, 2018, 12:03:00 AM
Sadie - can you recall if the Esplanade was before or after the Tapas restaurant? Do you know how I can visualise the relationships?
This website has a type of a slideshow is the image of the tables the restaurant or the esplanade? http://luzoceanclub.com/gallery-luz-ocean-club/
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 09, 2018, 12:13:29 AM
Back to Arlindo's statement ". Later, at around 21:40, he left the restaurant passing through the same esplanade where moments before, he had seen the same table occupied by the three couples, empty, who had left in the meanwhile various items, principally clothing. He was told by his colleagues that the child who had disappeared was a child of one of those couples;"
So let me understand this at this time he was aware of a missing child but he was still going to leave the area? The fact that items of clothing were left behind does make it sound like the McCann table with Dianne leaving clothing, a baby monitor and a camera behind. But are we to make out Dianne didn't come back for these items till 10:40 PM or later if Arlindo is an hour out in his timings?
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: sadie on January 09, 2018, 12:36:14 AM
Sadie - can you recall if the Esplanade was before or after the Tapas restaurant? Do you know how I can visualise the relationships?
I dont quite know what he means by the Esplanade t.b.h. Rob, but I think he probably means the walkway, the level paved area that people walked over to get to the tennis courts, play area, childrens creche, childrens pool, lawned area / gardens, Tapas bar and of course one would walk over part of it to get to the restaurant.
As he mentions the left way IIRC, I think it likely that he actually walked right in front of the restaurant and that he was probably going to the Tapas Bar for a night cap, as much as for a check. But I dont know.
And upon further thought, I wonder if he called in to the Bar to check the books and take the cash from the days takings. He was Head Honcho after all.
AIMO
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 09, 2018, 12:39:54 AM
I dont quite know what he means by the Esplanade t.b.h. Rob, but I think he probably means the walkway, the level paved area that people walked over to get to the tennis courts, play area, childrens creche, childrens pool, lawned area / gardens, Tapas bar and of course one would walk over part of it to get to the restaurant.
As he mentions the left way IIRC, I think it likely that he actually walked right in front of the restaurant and that he was probably going to the Tapas Bar for a night cap, as much as for a check. But I dont know.
And upon further thought, I wonder if he called in to the Bar to check the books and take the cash from the days takings. He was Head Honcho after all. Would that be the Chefs job?
AIMO
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 09, 2018, 12:49:39 AM
Final part ". When he left, he noticed that the dark blue vehicle was no longer in its location (previously noted) and does not know of the existence or any connection between the presence of that vehicle and the disappearance of the child; . Ending, states that during the days that preceded the facts, he did not notice any element/individual/fact that would have merited his attention; . And nothing more said, having read the statement, finds it in conformity and signs it; . The document is duly signed by me ? "
He has mentioned the importance of another car several times. 1. ". When he arrived there, by vehicle, at around 21:10, he remembers that next to the Tapas reception, he saw a vehicle, dark blue in colour, with Portuguese license plates. Although he cannot be definite, he believes it was a Fiesta or Focus. The deponent furthers that is was not a small car, and for this reason it could very well have been a Focus and not a Fiesta. He tells that he does not remember any sticker indicating that it was a rental car. Inside the vehicle he saw no one." 2. ".... and did not have the opportunity to check if the vehicle mentioned before was situated in the same location;"
3. "When he left, he noticed that the dark blue vehicle was no longer in its location (previously noted) and does not know of the existence or any connection between the presence of that vehicle and the disappearance of the child;"
He is strongly hinting that the incident happened before 9:40 (when he left) due to his hunch I suspect that a car was involved in the abduction.
When did he report the presence of this car - one that could be very vital to the investigation? On the 08 MAY 07. Is that really as urgent as it should be? It doesn't sound quite urgent enough to me.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 09, 2018, 12:53:49 AM
Just as I was signing out the words "missing page" caught my eye, so I opened up again "02_VOLUME_IIa_Page_473 MISSING PAGE" Ok what was on that? Some PJ follow up?? Who knows.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 09, 2018, 03:05:05 AM
So far nothing that Arlindo says has been confirmed in any way other than there is complex called the Mirage. I wonder if there is a photo of him anywhere? nothing.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Carana on January 09, 2018, 09:31:52 AM
It can translate as esplanade or terrace. He may just mean the restaurant area by the pool.
Well do you think that the table he is talking about was the table with the Tapas 9 at it? Were they seated in "the Esplanade"?
In the group of statements under the heading Tapas Bar Employees there were 4 mentions of the Esplanade and 2 make it clear that the Tapas 9 were dining in the Esplanade rather than the restaurant. "He has been employed as an apprentice waiter at the OC since April this year. Within the resort he works at the Tapas restaurant from 09.30 to 17.00 and has Mondays and Tuesdays off. His functions within the resort are limited to the Tapas Restaurant, including the esplanade and the pool."
"The witness went to the esplanade zone and saw that the table that had previously been occupied by nine adults was now occupied only by the older woman, called Dianne Webster. It was also at this time that he saw that Russell's food was only half eaten and that the others had all finished their dinner. "
"The witness went to the esplanade zone and saw that the table that had previously been occupied by nine adults was now occupied only by the older woman, called Dianne Webster. It was also at this time that he saw that Russell's food was only half eaten and that the others had all finished their dinner. "
And what Arlindo says: ". After parking his vehicle, he entered through the reception of that restaurant, in the left hand direction, toward the side opposite the pool, and passed by the esplanade. He remembers having seen in that esplanade, one table, occupied by three couples, without children, and all of them adults. On the esplanade, he encountered no one else."
One is left thinking the only group left in the Esplanade at the time Arlindo was there were the Tapas 9 group. If he thought there were 3 couples there that could correspond to the time Jane and Russell were away together so his timing is off for I had previously worked out that they were both away at around 9:40.
If that is the case he may have closed the security door at the time of his arrival. When he comes back past the table and notices possessions still there that could correspond to the time when Dianne had gone to the apartment 5A, when she admits leaving the clothing and monitor and camera behind. 10:15 or thereabouts.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: G-Unit on January 09, 2018, 10:13:38 AM
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 12, 2018, 01:37:01 AM
I think this is a reference to Arlindo JERONIMO RODRIGUES SALCEDAS ROGATORY "I went to find Ze and Ricardo to give them the news and to get their help in searching for the missing girl. I saw the head of the Milenium Restaurant in the Tapas and asked him to telephone the restaurant." "head of the Milenium Restaurant" could well be equivalent to "executive chef" as Arlindo called himself. Here Arlindo is being ask to telephone the restaurant". There is nothing in Arlindo's statement that suggests he rang the Millennium. One person at the Millennium gets a call from an English citizen from over at the Tapas.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: G-Unit on January 12, 2018, 10:09:00 AM
I think this is a reference to Arlindo JERONIMO RODRIGUES SALCEDAS ROGATORY "I went to find Ze and Ricardo to give them the news and to get their help in searching for the missing girl. I saw the head of the Milenium Restaurant in the Tapas and asked him to telephone the restaurant." "head of the Milenium Restaurant" could well be equivalent to "executive chef" as Arlindo called himself. Here Arlindo is being ask to telephone the restaurant". There is nothing in Arlindo's statement that suggests he rang the Millennium. One person at the Millennium gets a call from an English citizen from over at the Tapas.
Who got a call?
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 12, 2018, 10:31:15 AM
It may not be from the Tapas - can you decipher this? "Gustavo Cesar Cabral Campos
Date: 2007-05-08
Occupation: Waiter
Place of Work: Millenium Restaurant, OC
He has worked at the Millenium Restaurant since 9th March 2007, near to the apartment where the events occurred.
He says that as he is a waiter he has direct contact with the clients at the restaurant. He works from 16.00 to 24.00 without interruption every day except for Fridays and Saturdays which are his days off.
The place where he works receives guests staying at the resort, mainly of British nationality.
However, he thinks it is possible that people who are not staying at the resort can frequent the restaurant.
When asked if these people can use the areas adjacent to the restaurant (gardens, pools, tennis courts) he does not know whether this is possible.
It is certain that from 18.30/19.00 onwards these leisure area are closed to the public (guests and others).
For security reasons, and given that the restaurant has a receptionist, the entrances of guests are registered and in order to access the spaces adjacent to the restaurant individuals have to show a member card with their name and the apartment where they are staying as well as the dates of arrival and departure from the resort.
Concerning the facts being investigated he says that he has nothing of interest to add.
When questioned, he says that when the events occurred he was working in the restaurant and heard about the disappearance at about 22.30 - 23.00 from a Mark Warner employee (he doesn't know his name, but he is of English nationality) who, at that moment asked to use a telephone in the bar to make a call as he had received information about the disappearance of the girl on his mobile.
He does not know the concrete terms of the conversation but he is clear that something had happened.
The employee then left the bar/restaurant.
When his shift ended he joined in the searched with his colleague Nelson. He searched until 03.00 AM."
The person was a MW employee but it does NOT appear to work at the Millennium, but he was there when he got the text (possible) and made the phone call to someone else. The English person must have discussed with Gustavo the content of the message to some extent. Was that original message the phone call from Arlindo?
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: G-Unit on January 12, 2018, 06:43:14 PM
It may not be from the Tapas - can you decipher this? "Gustavo Cesar Cabral Campos
Date: 2007-05-08
Occupation: Waiter
Place of Work: Millenium Restaurant, OC
He has worked at the Millenium Restaurant since 9th March 2007, near to the apartment where the events occurred.
He says that as he is a waiter he has direct contact with the clients at the restaurant. He works from 16.00 to 24.00 without interruption every day except for Fridays and Saturdays which are his days off.
The place where he works receives guests staying at the resort, mainly of British nationality.
However, he thinks it is possible that people who are not staying at the resort can frequent the restaurant.
When asked if these people can use the areas adjacent to the restaurant (gardens, pools, tennis courts) he does not know whether this is possible.
It is certain that from 18.30/19.00 onwards these leisure area are closed to the public (guests and others).
For security reasons, and given that the restaurant has a receptionist, the entrances of guests are registered and in order to access the spaces adjacent to the restaurant individuals have to show a member card with their name and the apartment where they are staying as well as the dates of arrival and departure from the resort.
Concerning the facts being investigated he says that he has nothing of interest to add.
When questioned, he says that when the events occurred he was working in the restaurant and heard about the disappearance at about 22.30 - 23.00 from a Mark Warner employee (he doesn't know his name, but he is of English nationality) who, at that moment asked to use a telephone in the bar to make a call as he had received information about the disappearance of the girl on his mobile.
He does not know the concrete terms of the conversation but he is clear that something had happened.
The employee then left the bar/restaurant.
When his shift ended he joined in the searched with his colleague Nelson. He searched until 03.00 AM."
The person was a MW employee but it does NOT appear to work at the Millennium, but he was there when he got the text (possible) and made the phone call to someone else. The English person must have discussed with Gustavo the content of the message to some extent. Was that original message the phone call from Arlindo?
I can decipher it quite easily. An English MW employee was in the Millenium between 10.30 and 11.00 when he got information on his phone. I assume that was a text and he asked to use the phone in the premises, probably to check that the information was correct. He then left.
It wasn't Arlingo, he left the Tapas at 9.40; ". Later, at around 21:40, he left the restaurant" http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm
I expect it was the search organisers contacting staff to help.
*Note the reference to the guest cards*
That statement does not say what you declared it did, by the way. I think that's why cites are needed.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 12, 2018, 08:40:18 PM
I can decipher it quite easily. An English MW employee was in the Millenium between 10.30 and 11.00 when he got information on his phone. I assume that was a text and he asked to use the phone in the premises, probably to check that the information was correct. He then left.
It wasn't Arlingo, he left the Tapas at 9.40; ". Later, at around 21:40, he left the restaurant" http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm
I expect it was the search organisers contacting staff to help.
*Note the reference to the guest cards*
That statement does not say what you declared it did, by the way. I think that's why cites are needed.
Look I think your analysis starts off well until you say it wasn't Arlindo because of times given but if Arlindo's statement aligns with any other it has to be assumed be was out by about half an hour. Have you not accepted that yet?
As far not saying what I declared, who knows for you have not made a specific point, so I don't know what you are alleging. But you had emboldened "One person at the Millennium gets a call from an English citizen from over at the Tapas."
An English person at the Millennium gets a text message, what language is it in? Probably in English OK guessing now and the only place that the original message has to originate is the tapas area for that is where action is happening.
OK I should have said "it is possible a person at the Millennium gets a call from an English citizen from over at the Tapas" for I can't be sure. That Jeronimo guy seems to be bilingual. and it was Jeronimo who asked Arlindo to ring so maybe he did it instead.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: G-Unit on January 12, 2018, 10:49:25 PM
Look I think your analysis starts off well until you say it wasn't Arlindo because of times given but if Arlindo's statement aligns with any other it has to be assumed be was out by about half an hour. Have you not accepted that yet?
As far not saying what I declared, who knows for you have not made a specific point, so I don't know what you are alleging. But you had emboldened "One person at the Millennium gets a call from an English citizen from over at the Tapas."
An English person at the Millennium gets a text message, what language is it in? Probably in English OK guessing now and the only place that the original message has to originate is the tapas area for that is where action is happening.
OK I should have said "it is possible a person at the Millennium gets a call from an English citizen from over at the Tapas" for I can't be sure. That Jeronimo guy seems to be bilingual. and it was Jeronimo who asked Arlindo to ring so maybe he did it instead.
Why does it have to be Arlindo who was wrong? At least three other people report something happening at around 9.30; HELDER_LUIS BAREND JAN JACOB WEIJDOM CAROLINE CARPENTER
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 12, 2018, 11:05:44 PM
Why does it have to be Arlindo who was wrong? At least three other people report something happening at around 9.30; HELDER_LUIS BAREND JAN JACOB WEIJDOM CAROLINE CARPENTER
Good question and no doubt part of the answer to this case, so there isn't any off the shelf easy answer, but believe me I'm working on it.
You have given me a clue. Do you know the answer to your own question? I'm picking you don't. well how would you even begin to explain the "timing errors"?
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: jassi on January 13, 2018, 08:49:14 AM
Good question and no doubt part of the answer to this case, so there isn't any off the shelf easy answer, but believe me I'm working on it.
You have given me a clue. Do you know the answer to your own question? I'm picking you don't. well how would you even begin to explain the "timing errors"?
Those with least to lose are more likely to give more reliable times and answers - IMO
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: G-Unit on January 13, 2018, 10:14:58 AM
Good question and no doubt part of the answer to this case, so there isn't any off the shelf easy answer, but believe me I'm working on it.
You have given me a clue. Do you know the answer to your own question? I'm picking you don't. well how would you even begin to explain the "timing errors"?
If the Tapas 9 didn't order until 9 pm the serving and eating times make sense. If they were all present and ordered at 8.30 pm, however......
At approximately half past eight, Gerry and Kate and their group of approximately ten people were already seated at their table, http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/STEPHEN-CARPENTER.htm
Dinner would end at about 21.45, a few minutes later the witness looked at the table and saw that there was nobody there and one of his colleagues told them that all the guests had left the table in a hurry. In any case, he remembers having heard shouts from the direction of Madeleine's parents' apartment. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/RICARDO-A-D-L-OLIVEIRA.htm
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 13, 2018, 10:53:40 AM
Why does it have to be Arlindo who was wrong? At least three other people report something happening at around 9.30; HELDER_LUIS BAREND JAN JACOB WEIJDOM CAROLINE CARPENTER
Helder Luis - was at the main reception so all his timing information is 2nd hand. BAREND JAN JACOB WEIJDOM he arrives later. CAROLINE CARPENTER - no statement from her.
Barend: "He heard about the news being investigated on the evening of 3rd May at about 21.30 - 21.40 from P**** B******, a Dutchman and owner of the Atlantico restaurant, who passed by the witness near the Baptista supermarket, in P da L and who asked for his help in searching for Madeleine." Well that is part of my theory that someone other than Kate and Gerry are already searching for Madeleine soon after 21:40 PM but that search does not involve the whole of the Tapas group. So the table is not cleared then.
Stephen Carpenter Statement sort of confirms a similar timing.
Who rang Helder?
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 13, 2018, 11:29:38 AM
Helder states: "He knows about the situation that happened at the Ocean Club concerning the disappearance of a little given that on the day in question (03/05/2007) he was on duty and was contacted by a member of staff from the Tapas Restaurant between 09.30 and 22.00 who informed him that the daughter of some guests who were dining there had disappeared." Who from the Tapas staff rings Helder, yet Jeronimo asks Arlindo to ring the Millennium. So 9:30 - 10:00 could be right, in that Arlindo is also apprised of Madeleine's disappearance ahead of Kate and Gerry too. Helder must have been quite concerned for he says he rang the Police. "That he immediately contacted the GNR in Lagos, .... " but they were busy on other call outs remember.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 13, 2018, 06:06:21 PM
What I find really surprising is that Helder couldn't be precise about the time that the call came through to him. I might have noted the time of an important call like that came through and surely the Police have a record of his call to them.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: G-Unit on January 13, 2018, 08:01:36 PM
What I find really surprising is that Helder couldn't be precise about the time that the call came through to him. I might have noted the time of an important call like that came through and surely the Police have a record of his call to them.
It was an internal call, so wouldn't show up. He didn't, of course, ring the GNR at that time. Nor did he ring his boss. If he did it wasn't on the Greentrust landline in reception. AFAIK he was never asked to explain those anomalies.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 13, 2018, 08:09:29 PM
It was an internal call, so wouldn't show up. He didn't, of course, ring the GNR at that time. Nor did he ring his boss. If he did it wasn't on the Greentrust landline in reception. AFAIK he was never asked to explain those anomalies.
Why did you say he didn't ring his boss, his boss being whom? Somehow Robin Crossland or Crosland (another name with multiple spellings) found out and doesn't Robin say John Hill spoke to him. So who spoke to John Hill?
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 13, 2018, 08:14:28 PM
Robin Crossland ". That at around 22h15 of 03 May 2007, he was alone in his residence, situated in Lagos, and was contacted by John Hill, Mark Warner manager who works in the Ocean Club establishment and who informed him that a child, a minor, of the feminine sex, who was staying with her family in that resort, had disappeared and that he was going to initiate the 'procedure for missing child' (sic); . The deponent left toward the local where he arrived at 22H25 and there found John Hill and other functionaries, Silvia Batista, Joao Batista, the former who is employee manager and the latter maintenance; "
So from that Silvia is met by Robin earlier than she claims to have been phoned by him, and she still has the 15 minute dive to work to account for. Was she really at home in Lagos when the call was made? Unexplained speed of travel?
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: G-Unit on January 13, 2018, 08:28:26 PM
Why did you say he didn't ring his boss, his boss being whom? Somehow Robin Crossland or Crosland (another name with multiple spellings) found out and doesn't Robin say John Hill spoke to him. Who spoke to John Hill?
His boss was Vitor Santos. His number wasn't called on the Greentrust landline.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 13, 2018, 08:47:11 PM
His boss was Vitor Santos. His number wasn't called on the Greentrust landline.
And this is what Vitor Santos says: "With regard to the date of the disappearance on 3rd May 2007, he remembers that at 22.00/22.15 he received a phone call from the reception, from receptionist Helder, who told him that John Hill was extremely agitated as a child had disappeared and that the GNR had been contacted but had not arrived yet. He added (the receptionist) that he had phoned the GNR post several times and that he had been told that they would arrive when they could but that they were investigating a theft in Odiaxere."
So we have a chain of events, 1. Someone rang Helder from the Tapas area. 2. Helder rang John Hill and the GNR but the GNR were busy at Odiaxere. 3. John Hill rang Robin Crossland and 4. Robin rang Silvia Batista.
So was it the Executive Chef Arlindo that rang Helder in the first place? Does that chain of events make it so that when Matt arrives asking that the Police please be called the receptionists are thinking the Police have already been called. But Matt does not report this response.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on February 04, 2018, 07:54:26 AM
This seems rather strange to me. "we don't know if the staff knew to leave the secondary reception door open but the Manager (Executive Chef) who spent most of his time at the Millennium Restaurant hadn't agreed to it or knew about it. His visit that night was like a random spot check. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm Even on the PJ file lists he is not thought of as a Tapas employee yet he is the manager! The file doesn't really acknowledge him as being there. (he is there but no one mentions him by name, so in some way he doesn't have an alibi. Yet in his statement he admits being there at the time Madeleine disappears. No one gives Arlindo an alibi! That is extremely strange IMO.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: G-Unit on February 04, 2018, 08:20:25 AM
This seems rather strange to me. "we don't know if the staff knew to leave the secondary reception door open but the Manager (Executive Chef) who spent most of his time at the Millennium Restaurant hadn't agreed to it or knew about it. His visit that night was like a random spot check. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm Even on the PJ file lists he is not thought of as a Tapas employee yet he is the manager! The file doesn't really acknowledge him as being there. (he is there but no one mentions him by name, so in some way he doesn't have an alibi. Yet in his statement he admits being there at the time Madeleine disappears. No one gives Arlindo an alibi! That is extremely strange IMO.
His interest was the kitchen; food storage, preparation, cooking and serving. I don't think he was in charge of the whole facility.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on February 04, 2018, 08:29:47 AM
He is on a list of employees "Arlindo Peleja - Executive Chef, in charge of all 5 kitchens, Central Kitchen" file:///C:/Users/Robert/Downloads/ocean_club_staff.pdf
This is someone else's study which may give us some clues but not answers "8. Tapas clients
Phillip Edmonds, another guest on the Tapas list with his 2 boys for a meal at 19.00, chatted to the McCanns and may be able to clarify what he saw before he left and any person he saw after leaving the restaurant. Not having given a statement, we don’t know what time he left the restaurant but it must have been before 21.10, time Arlindo Peleja arrived.
Neither did the mysterious Irwin sisters, booked for 20.30 give statements. Were they added to the list in error, when it should have been the sisters Jayne Jensen and Annie Wiltshire" http://textusa.blogspot.co.nz/2016/06/reconstruction-for-may-3rd-3007.html
Textusa seems to take Arlindo's times at face value but I have shown they were about 30 minutes out. But I had never heard of Philip Edmonds before!
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on February 04, 2018, 08:33:15 AM
Has anyone come across Phillip Edmonds in the file? He is not in the alphabetical listing. He has not been mentioned on the forum before!
Was he on the Tapas booking sheet? Where did this name come from? (http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/T/03_VOLUME_IIIa_Page_608.jpg)
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on February 04, 2018, 08:44:50 AM
Arlindo is also mentioned in this study "The eight independent Alarm witnesses" http://genreith.de/MMcC/doku.php?id=alarm-witnesses
Just a copy of statement sections "Time: 21:20↔21:40 (average 21:30)
21:20, Executive Chef A.E.G.F.P. heard some clamour, which made him leave toward the restaurant, a few metres away, and was then informed that a child had disappeared. At around 21:40, he left the restaurant passing through the same esplanade where moments before, he had seen the same table occupied by the three couples, empty, who had left in the meanwhile various items, principally clothing. He was told by his colleagues that the child who had disappeared was a child of one of those couples…" nothing conclusive.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on February 04, 2018, 10:31:58 AM
Pages and pages of Google and then this "The invisibile Jane" English/Deutsch http://unterdenteppichgekehrt.blogspot.co.nz/2012/03/invisibile-jane.html
Inspired by Pat Brown's visit to Praia da Luz and the subsequent renewed discussion about the Tanner sighting I revisited my photo selection and some statements from the files again. The core mystery and the only "evidence" for an abduction still remains Jane Tanner's statement of when she encountered eggman aka the abductor.
Part of her statement again: Questioned about the path she took on the way to her home, she relates that she left the reception at the entrance to the Tapas/pool area and went up the pavement to the corner, having entered the apartment by the front door, which was, as already stated, locked. Then we have the statement by Arlindo Epifanio Goncalves Fernandes Peleja, the executive chef at the Ocean's Club regarding that evening: When he arrived there, by vehicle, at around 21:10, he remembers that next to the Tapas reception, he saw a vehicle, dark blue in colour, with Portuguese license plates. Although he cannot be definite, he believes it was a Fiesta or Focus.....After parking his vehicle, he entered through the reception of that restaurant..... So shortly before Jane saw the abductor, we have 2 cars parked in that road. This is confirmed by the statement of Stephen Carpenter who left the Tapas Bar around the time of the sighting: Between approximately a quarter past nine and half past nine we left the Tapas bar to go home.... When I crossed the road outside the MW reception I remember there were cars parked, I remember taking some time to see if I could cross the road because there were cars parked to my left and I was carrying I****. They were about six metres away from me and i calculate that some (inaudible) metres from the back of Gerry’s apartment At 22:00 an employee of the Ocean Club left the carpark of Block 6 and saw only one car left on that road: After leaving Block 6, they turned right and after left, passing in front of the block occupied by the McCanns. She states that she saw no movement of people, and that in the immediate areas of the blocks she saw no vehicle with the exception of a small car, that appeared to her grey in colour, parked close to the window of the McCann apartment; So at the time of Jane's vision at 21:15 there would have been one car parked under the McCann's kitchen window and another car closer to the Tapas entrance. Assuming these cars did not park on the curb - which would make Jane's path even narrower - this would roughly be the situation Jane faced after having turned left at the exit of the Tapas Bar:
Is there ANY chance BOTH men would have failed to notice the woman flip-flopping past them on the pavement?
Why did she nor Gerry mention the cars? They could have been used to explain why the men had not seen her had she claimed to have used the other side of the road. But since she did such an exact drawing in her first statement of the way she walked up to the crossing there was no chance to use these cars to their advantage. So it was better not to mention them at all, since even the visually impaired would see that she must have been invisible to pass them. The cars narrow down the path she could have taken and make it impossible not to notice her."
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: pathfinder73 on February 04, 2018, 11:04:59 AM
Pages and pages of Google and then this "The invisibile Jane" English/Deutsch http://unterdenteppichgekehrt.blogspot.co.nz/2012/03/invisibile-jane.html
Inspired by Pat Brown's visit to Praia da Luz and the subsequent renewed discussion about the Tanner sighting I revisited my photo selection and some statements from the files again. The core mystery and the only "evidence" for an abduction still remains Jane Tanner's statement of when she encountered eggman aka the abductor.
Part of her statement again: Questioned about the path she took on the way to her home, she relates that she left the reception at the entrance to the Tapas/pool area and went up the pavement to the corner, having entered the apartment by the front door, which was, as already stated, locked. Then we have the statement by Arlindo Epifanio Goncalves Fernandes Peleja, the executive chef at the Ocean's Club regarding that evening: When he arrived there, by vehicle, at around 21:10, he remembers that next to the Tapas reception, he saw a vehicle, dark blue in colour, with Portuguese license plates. Although he cannot be definite, he believes it was a Fiesta or Focus.....After parking his vehicle, he entered through the reception of that restaurant..... So shortly before Jane saw the abductor, we have 2 cars parked in that road. This is confirmed by the statement of Stephen Carpenter who left the Tapas Bar around the time of the sighting: Between approximately a quarter past nine and half past nine we left the Tapas bar to go home.... When I crossed the road outside the MW reception I remember there were cars parked, I remember taking some time to see if I could cross the road because there were cars parked to my left and I was carrying I****. They were about six metres away from me and i calculate that some (inaudible) metres from the back of Gerry’s apartment At 22:00 an employee of the Ocean Club left the carpark of Block 6 and saw only one car left on that road: After leaving Block 6, they turned right and after left, passing in front of the block occupied by the McCanns. She states that she saw no movement of people, and that in the immediate areas of the blocks she saw no vehicle with the exception of a small car, that appeared to her grey in colour, parked close to the window of the McCann apartment; So at the time of Jane's vision at 21:15 there would have been one car parked under the McCann's kitchen window and another car closer to the Tapas entrance. Assuming these cars did not park on the curb - which would make Jane's path even narrower - this would roughly be the situation Jane faced after having turned left at the exit of the Tapas Bar:
Is there ANY chance BOTH men would have failed to notice the woman flip-flopping past them on the pavement?
Why did she nor Gerry mention the cars? They could have been used to explain why the men had not seen her had she claimed to have used the other side of the road. But since she did such an exact drawing in her first statement of the way she walked up to the crossing there was no chance to use these cars to their advantage. So it was better not to mention them at all, since even the visually impaired would see that she must have been invisible to pass them. The cars narrow down the path she could have taken and make it impossible not to notice her."
Because there were none. Jane confirmed it in her rog. Have you seen the reconstruction with Gerry and Jane? No vehicles. Have you read JW statement? No vehicles.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on February 04, 2018, 11:33:23 AM
Because there were none. Jane confirmed it in her rog. Have you seen the reconstruction with Gerry and Jane? No vehicles. Have you read JW statement? No vehicles.
So where was the vehicle Arlindo was talking about? I had thought Arlindo drove there too but that fact is not covered in the statement. I would have thought the coming and going by Arlindo should have been questioned by the PJ.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: pathfinder73 on February 04, 2018, 01:14:22 PM
Obviously his timeline is wrong. It's not rocket science.
Later, at around 21:40, he left the restaurant passing through the same esplanade where moments before, he had seen the same table occupied by the three couples, empty, who had left in the meanwhile various items, principally clothing. He was told by his colleagues that the child who had disappeared was a child of one of those couples; http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on February 04, 2018, 05:38:44 PM
Obviously his timeline is wrong. It's not rocket science.
Later, at around 21:40, he left the restaurant passing through the same esplanade where moments before, he had seen the same table occupied by the three couples, empty, who had left in the meanwhile various items, principally clothing. He was told by his colleagues that the child who had disappeared was a child of one of those couples; http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm
As I did, I went through the entire Google results for Arlindo + McCann and I copied parts of the results above. You are the first person other than myself to write it down "Obviously his timeline is wrong". It has taken 11 years for two people to agree on that one point.
I would like SY to ask the PJ to bring him in for additional questioning. It isn't clear why he didn't stay to assist with the search, How does he leave the area, by car or on foot? What phone calls did he make? (luckily they have the records - do they know his number?) He is the only person in the file that admits to leaving the area of the missing child after the alarm is called. Well that I am aware of anyway.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: jassi on February 04, 2018, 06:03:33 PM
As I did, I went through the entire Google results for Arlindo + McCann and I copied parts of the results above. You are the first person other than myself to write it down "Obviously his timeline is wrong". It has taken 11 years for two people to agree on that one point.
I would like SY to ask the PJ to bring him in for additional questioning. It isn't clear why he didn't stay to assist with the search, How does he leave the area, by car or on foot? What phone calls did he make? (luckily they have the records - do they know his number?) He is the only person in the file that admits to leaving the area of the missing child after the alarm is called. Well that I am aware of anyway.
Get real. OG have done with all the fishing trips - IMO
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on February 04, 2018, 06:35:53 PM
Pages and pages of Google and then this "The invisibile Jane" English/Deutsch http://unterdenteppichgekehrt.blogspot.co.nz/2012/03/invisibile-jane.html
Inspired by Pat Brown's visit to Praia da Luz and the subsequent renewed discussion about the Tanner sighting I revisited my photo selection and some statements from the files again. The core mystery and the only "evidence" for an abduction still remains Jane Tanner's statement of when she encountered eggman aka the abductor.
Part of her statement again: Questioned about the path she took on the way to her home, she relates that she left the reception at the entrance to the Tapas/pool area and went up the pavement to the corner, having entered the apartment by the front door, which was, as already stated, locked. Then we have the statement by Arlindo Epifanio Goncalves Fernandes Peleja, the executive chef at the Ocean's Club regarding that evening: When he arrived there, by vehicle, at around 21:10, he remembers that next to the Tapas reception, he saw a vehicle, dark blue in colour, with Portuguese license plates. Although he cannot be definite, he believes it was a Fiesta or Focus.....After parking his vehicle, he entered through the reception of that restaurant..... So shortly before Jane saw the abductor, we have 2 cars parked in that road. This is confirmed by the statement of Stephen Carpenter who left the Tapas Bar around the time of the sighting: Between approximately a quarter past nine and half past nine we left the Tapas bar to go home.... When I crossed the road outside the MW reception I remember there were cars parked, I remember taking some time to see if I could cross the road because there were cars parked to my left and I was carrying I****. They were about six metres away from me and i calculate that some (inaudible) metres from the back of Gerry’s apartment At 22:00 an employee of the Ocean Club left the carpark of Block 6 and saw only one car left on that road: After leaving Block 6, they turned right and after left, passing in front of the block occupied by the McCanns. She states that she saw no movement of people, and that in the immediate areas of the blocks she saw no vehicle with the exception of a small car, that appeared to her grey in colour, parked close to the window of the McCann apartment; So at the time of Jane's vision at 21:15 there would have been one car parked under the McCann's kitchen window and another car closer to the Tapas entrance. Assuming these cars did not park on the curb - which would make Jane's path even narrower - this would roughly be the situation Jane faced after having turned left at the exit of the Tapas Bar:
Is there ANY chance BOTH men would have failed to notice the woman flip-flopping past them on the pavement?
Why did she nor Gerry mention the cars? They could have been used to explain why the men had not seen her had she claimed to have used the other side of the road. But since she did such an exact drawing in her first statement of the way she walked up to the crossing there was no chance to use these cars to their advantage. So it was better not to mention them at all, since even the visually impaired would see that she must have been invisible to pass them. The cars narrow down the path she could have taken and make it impossible not to notice her."
So at the time of Jane's vision at 21:15 there would have been one car parked under the McCann's kitchen window and another car closer to the Tapas entrance
How do you get that Rob ?
Stephen Carpenter stated "When I crossed the road outside the MW reception I remember there were cars parked, I remember taking some time to see if I could cross the road because there were cars parked to my left and I was carrying I****. They were about six metres away from me and i calculate that some (inaudible) metres from the back of Gerry’s apartment"
IOW, Stephen saw two cars[/b] and they were positioned between about 6 metres away from him and some metres short of the back of 5A.
So, one was parked before (south of) the alleyway ... and the other car, if it was some metres from the back of Gerrys apartment, must have been parked partially across the alleyway where Gerry and Jez chatted as Jane passed by. There is no room for any other configuration in the specified space by Stephen Carpenter
So as I surmised before, Jez must have been standing between two cars as he chatted and Gerry could not see Jane as she passed anyway because she was essentially behind him all the time she walked up that road
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on February 05, 2018, 02:30:56 AM
Email sent to Operation Grange: " 3:28 PM (0 minutes ago) to Operation.Gran., operation.gran., investigation http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm
Hi there I study the McCann full time and recently I have completed a study on Arlindo Pelega which you can read on http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=8970.msg439667#msg439667
I would like Scotland Yard to ask the PJ to bring him in for additional questioning. 1. It isn't clear why he didn't stay to assist with the search, 2. How does he leave the area, by car or on foot? 3. What phone calls did he make? (luckily they have the records - do they know his number?)
4. And most importantly he is the only person in the file that admits to leaving the area (the vicinity) of the missing child after the alarm is called. (Well the only one that I am aware of anyway.)"
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on February 05, 2018, 02:37:14 AM
So at the time of Jane's vision at 21:15 there would have been one car parked under the McCann's kitchen window and another car closer to the Tapas entrance
How do you get that Rob ?
Stephen Carpenter stated "When I crossed the road outside the MW reception I remember there were cars parked, I remember taking some time to see if I could cross the road because there were cars parked to my left and I was carrying I****. They were about six metres away from me and i calculate that some (inaudible) metres from the back of Gerry’s apartment"
IOW, Stephen saw two cars[/b] and they were positioned between about 6 metres away from him and some metres short of the back of 5A.
So, one was parked before (south of) the alleyway ... and the other car, if it was some metres from the back of Gerrys apartment, must have been parked partially across the alleyway where Gerry and Jez chatted as Jane passed by. There is no room for any other configuration in the specified space by Stephen Carpenter
So as I surmised before, Jez must have been standing between two cars as he chatted and Gerry could not see Jane as she passed anyway because she was essentially behind him all the time she walked up that road
The position of the cars is from someone else's work. I'm not condoning it but I put it there as it one of the very few articles discussing Arlindo Pelega. It was additionally interesting as it proposed parked cars along the route to the apartments. I have not read it but the link is there to the original.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on February 05, 2018, 03:22:44 AM
Because there were none. Jane confirmed it in her rog. Have you seen the reconstruction with Gerry and Jane? No vehicles. Have you read JW statement? No vehicles.
Does a person remember parked cars? "Reply 'No, not really, you might get the occasional car come into that car park, but mostly the car park you wouldn't have seen cars in, erm, and it's not really through road, when you look at the map it's sort of like on a 'U', so you've got the, a more main road at the top and one main T-junction to go down at the far end of the two apartment complexes, you didn't really get much through traffic, even going down the hill to the Supermarket there wasn't, there was always cars parked down there Matthew Oldfield Rogatory.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on February 07, 2018, 07:20:09 AM
Does a person remember parked cars? "Reply 'No, not really, you might get the occasional car come into that car park, but mostly the car park you wouldn't have seen cars in, erm, and it's not really through road, when you look at the map it's sort of like on a 'U', so you've got the, a more main road at the top and one main T-junction to go down at the far end of the two apartment complexes, you didn't really get much through traffic, even going down the hill to the Supermarket there wasn't, there was always cars parked down there Matthew Oldfield Rogatory.
Arlindo says he arrives by car ". When he arrived there, by vehicle, at around 21:10," he sees another car parked there "he remembers that next to the Tapas reception, he saw a vehicle, dark blue in colour, with Portuguese license plates. Although he cannot be definite, he believes it was a Fiesta or Focus. The deponent furthers that is was not a small car, and for this reason it could very well have been a Focus and not a Fiesta. He tells that he does not remember any sticker indicating that it was a rental car. Inside the vehicle he saw no one. "
So there was a time when we can assume there were at least two cars parked near the reception entrance. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: pathfinder73 on February 07, 2018, 05:00:21 PM
Does a person remember parked cars? "Reply 'No, not really, you might get the occasional car come into that car park, but mostly the car park you wouldn't have seen cars in, erm, and it's not really through road, when you look at the map it's sort of like on a 'U', so you've got the, a more main road at the top and one main T-junction to go down at the far end of the two apartment complexes, you didn't really get much through traffic, even going down the hill to the Supermarket there wasn't, there was always cars parked down there Matthew Oldfield Rogatory.
That's towards Baptista - wrong direction.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on February 07, 2018, 07:24:15 PM
Still in the direction that Jez is approaching from. Even if you discount these cars what about the two cars Arlindo talks about?
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: sadie on February 07, 2018, 10:59:53 PM
Arlindo says he arrives by car ". When he arrived there, by vehicle, at around 21:10," he sees another car parked there "he remembers that next to the Tapas reception, he saw a vehicle, dark blue in colour, with Portuguese license plates. Although he cannot be definite, he believes it was a Fiesta or Focus. The deponent furthers that is was not a small car, and for this reason it could very well have been a Focus and not a Fiesta. He tells that he does not remember any sticker indicating that it was a rental car. Inside the vehicle he saw no one. "
So there was a time when we can assume there were at least two cars parked near the reception entrance. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm
Yep, and that is confirmed by Stephen Carpenter whose statement also points to the fact that they were parked in the area some metres south of 5A and some 6 metres north of the Tapas reception exit.
This means that one car was parked partially across the entrance to the alleyway: the alleyway that Gerry and Jez chatted on.
So Jez was positioned in the roiad, between two cars whilst Gerry was partially in / on the kerb. Therefore Jezes view of the pavement that Jane walked along was restricted somewhat by the cars and further by the bulk of Jerrys body. Jerry couldn't see Jane at all cos she was always beyond his field of vision. She was always behind him from the Tapas reception all the way up to the junction at the top of R. Francisco G. Martins (Tannerman Corner)
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on February 07, 2018, 11:12:17 PM
Yep, and that is confirmed by Stephen Carpenter whose statement also points to the fact that they were parked in the area some metres south of 5A and some 6 metres north of the Tapas reception exit.
This means that one car was parked partially across the entrance to the alleyway: the alleyway that Gerry and Jez chatted on.
So Jez was positioned in the roiad, between two cars whilst Gerry was partially in / on the kerb. Therefore Jezes view of the pavement that Jane walked along was restricted somewhat by the cars and further by the bulk of Jerrys body. Jerry couldn't see Jane at all cos she was always beyond his field of vision. She was always behind him from the Tapas reception all the way up to the junction at the top of R. Francisco G. Martins (Tannerman Corner)
It would be made worse if any of the vehicles were a van.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: pathfinder73 on February 08, 2018, 12:09:56 AM
The reconstruction with Jane and Gerry showed no parked cars. Jez didn't see parked cars when crossing.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on February 08, 2018, 12:38:09 AM
The reconstruction with Jane and Gerry showed no parked cars. Jez didn't see parked cars when crossing.
Jez wasn't there at the reconstruction.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: sadie on February 08, 2018, 01:27:58 AM
Going towards Baptista from the top road R Agostinho da Silva (name from memory) down R. FRANCISCO GENTIL MARTIN, which IS DEFINITELY THE CORRECT ROAD. According to Jane, she walked that road in a northerly direction when she passed Gerry and Jez chatting.
Furthermore R. FRANCISCO GENTIL MARTIN is the CORRECT road that the Carpenters crossed when they saw the two cars parked some metres south of 5A and about 6 metres north of Tapas Reception. Within the constraints of that distance, one car had to have been partially across the alleyway in my opinion.
And Arlindo parked there too. The above is all fact according to the statements.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: pathfinder73 on February 08, 2018, 01:38:59 PM
Going towards Baptista from the top road R Agostinho da Silva (name from memory) down R. FRANCISCO GENTIL MARTIN, which IS DEFINITELY THE CORRECT ROAD. According to Jane, she walked that road in a northerly direction when she passed Gerry and Jez chatting.
Furthermore R. FRANCISCO GENTIL MARTIN is the CORRECT road that the Carpenters crossed when they saw the two cars parked some metres south of 5A and about 6 metres north of Tapas Reception. Within the constraints of that distance, one car had to have been partially across the alleyway in my opinion.
And Arlindo parked there too. The above is all fact according to the statements.
He said there was cars parked down towards Baptista. Jane never headed down when leaving the secondary reception she headed up so yet again my response was correct. That is the wrong direction.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Angelo222 on February 08, 2018, 03:34:38 PM
I fail to see what parked cars have to do with Jane's as yet uncorroborated claim to have passed Gerry and Jez chatting by the side of the road. Neither Jane or Gerry made any reference to parked cars while taking part in the TV documentary as far as I remember.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: pathfinder73 on February 08, 2018, 04:54:41 PM
Of course they didn't but Rob and Sadie think otherwise without any evidence.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on February 08, 2018, 06:26:31 PM
Two witnesses did a reconstruction with no parked cars. Let's see your evidence from the third witness.
Yep, that may be true, but we have (at least) two witnesses, Stephen Carpenter and Arlindo, who say there were at least parked cars
And stated that in official statements. Better than in a commercial video.
It is obvious to me that IMO all the cars were cleared away for the filming that we saw for The Cutting Edge video, which is featured in the "Madeleine was here" video part 4/5. Apart from few people being allowed thru en route to and from their homes, you can see on the video, that they were kept at bay too.
http://youtu.be/na4aBr5PTYY
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: sadie on February 09, 2018, 12:24:38 PM
Two witnesses did a reconstruction with no parked cars. Let's see your evidence from the third witness.
Why do you continue to cofabulate?
You are talking about a filming exercise. Rob and I are talking about what happened on May 3rd 2007 according to actual official statements.
Doesn't matter whether a person was walking up or down, according to the statements of Stephen Carpenter and the statement of Arlingio, there were (at least) two cars parked between 6 metres north of the Tapas Reception and some metres short of 5A.
Because of the constraints of that distance, this means that one car was partially over thye alleyway and the other pretty close ... and seems from other statements Jez was standing between these cars. Gerry was positioned that he definitely couldnt see Jane and if Jez was bending down attending to his baby in the wheeler, then Jane would be out of his peripheral vision too.
Please do not obfuscate PFinder; we are making a concerted effort, led by Rob, to solve as much of this case as is possible.
OK we all know that you have a theory involving Gerry, but for the common good and a little missing girl, please fairly consider what actually went on. Do not twist the facts. We need the truth.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: G-Unit on February 09, 2018, 01:16:02 PM
You are talking about a filming exercise. Rob and I are talking about what happened on May 3rd 2007 according to actual official statements.
Doesn't matter whether a person was walking up or down, according to the statements of Stephen Carpenter and the statement of Arlingio, there were (at least) two cars parked between 6 metres north of the Tapas Reception and some metres short of 5A.
Because of the constraints of that distance, this means that one car was partially over thye alleyway and the other pretty close ... and seems from other statements Jez was standing between these cars. Gerry was positioned that he definitely couldnt see Jane and if Jez was bending down attending to his baby in the wheeler, then Jane would be out of his peripheral vision too.
Please do not obfuscate PFinder; we are making a concerted effort, led by Rob, to solve as much of this case as is possible.
OK we all know that you have a theory involving Gerry, but for the common good and a little missing girl, please fairly consider what actually went on. Do not twist the facts. We need the truth.
Two witnesses say that two cars were parked on the road between 9.10 and 9.30 pm. Jane Tanner remembers seeing the two men but not any parked cars. If the cars were where Carpenter said they were and the men were near the alleyway how did Jane fail to notice them? If Jes was in the road he was either in between the two cars or behind the second one and he makes no mention of them either. Is it possible to decide the truth of the matter? Not in my opinion.
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: Robittybob1 on February 09, 2018, 06:10:17 PM
Two witnesses say that two cars were parked on the road between 9.10 and 9.30 pm. Jane Tanner remembers seeing the two men but not any parked cars. If the cars were where Carpenter said they were and the men were near the alleyway how did Jane fail to notice them? If Jes was in the road he was either in between the two cars or behind the second one and he makes no mention of them either. Is it possible to decide the truth of the matter? Not in my opinion.
Would cars be part of the background and hence not get a mention?
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: sadie on February 09, 2018, 07:05:51 PM
Would cars be part of the background and hence not get a mention?
Cars are generally mundane and part of the scenery after dark.
THey are only really noticeable if 1) they are in the way when looking for the 'all clear' in order to cross the road. Stephen Carpenter noticed them because of this, they got in the way of his clear vision for crossing the road 2) one was trying to pull into a parking place and a car/s was in the way. Arlingo noticed the other car because he was trying to get the most convenient parking place.
Why would anyone else make note of them on a poorly lit road, where they regularly sat parked?
Title: Re: Is any of Arlindo's statement confirmed by anyone else?
Post by: G-Unit on February 09, 2018, 07:56:32 PM