UK Justice Forum

Disappeared and Abducted Children and Young Adults => Madeleine McCann (3) disappeared from her parent's holiday apartment at Ocean Club, Praia da Luz, Portugal on 3 May 2007. No trace of her has ever been found. => Topic started by: John on April 07, 2013, 12:19:23 AM

Title: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: John on April 07, 2013, 12:19:23 AM
Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?

Does anyone have any up to date information on this as a search on the internet seems to throw up all sorts of nonsense?


(http://www.theportugalnews.com/uploads/news/page10b_McCanns_and_Amaral.jpg)
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: C.Edwards on April 07, 2013, 12:21:52 AM
Why "disgraced" John?
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: debunker on April 07, 2013, 12:24:17 AM
Why "disgraced" John?

COnvicted and serving a suspended prison sentence.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: icabodcrane on April 07, 2013, 12:29:58 AM
Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?

Does anyone have any up to date information on this as a search on the internet  seems to throw up all sorts of nonsense?

oh dear John   8(8-))

... that kind of provocative language from a moderator is awfully disheartening

 
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: C.Edwards on April 07, 2013, 12:33:24 AM
Why "disgraced" John?

COnvicted and serving a suspended prison sentence.

...on the words of the woman who just got jailed for lying about the whole incident, yeah?  That's going to sit well on the appeal.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: gilet on April 07, 2013, 12:37:26 AM
Why "disgraced" John?

He also disgraced himself by getting himself thrown off the McCann case for telling journalists things he should not have been telling them. I understand that is actually a crime in Portugal. I think he is lucky not to have been charged over that as well. He tells us all the details of the situation and the way in which the phone call led to his dismissal in his own book.

He also disgraced the PJ by his actions of course.

It was pretty shocking that the Co-ordinator of the case got dismissed don't you think? And even more shocking when we heard reports from Rebelo that the case was in a shambles when he took over.

Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: C.Edwards on April 07, 2013, 12:42:34 AM
Why "disgraced" John?

He also disgraced himself by getting himself thrown off the McCann case for telling journalists things he should not have been telling them. I understand that is actually a crime in Portugal. I think he is lucky not to have been charged over that as well. He tells us all the details of the situation and the way in which the phone call led to his dismissal in his own book.

He also disgraced the PJ by his actions of course.

It was pretty shocking that the Co-ordinator of the case got dismissed don't you think? And even more shocking when we heard reports from Rebelo that the case was in a shambles when he took over.

Good grief. Come on debunker... you're quick enough to jump in when an anti posts up uncorroborated claptrap and yet you let this kind of nonsense pass without comment?  Then you have the temerity to say you're not a pro?  Give me a break.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: puglove on April 07, 2013, 12:46:42 AM
Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?

Does anyone have any up to date information on this as a search on the internet  seems to throw up all sorts of nonsense?

oh dear John   8(8-))

... that kind of provocative language from a moderator is awfully disheartening

www.youtube.com/watch?v=ms5RQefyJLs

Sorry. Nice song.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Luz on April 07, 2013, 12:49:01 AM
Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?

Does anyone have any up to date information on this as a search on the internet  seems to throw up all sorts of nonsense?

That's more than bad taste, it's utterly offensive.

Dr. Gonçalo Amaral is not disgraced and if he is not a member of the PJ anymore that's because he chose to: he was taken of from the Madeleine case but he returned to one of his prior positions as a leader on Drug and Terrorism, in fact just prior from his dismissal he was responsible for one of the biggest drug arrests .

In order to write a book to say all he wanted to say he had to resign from his post. I don't believe many people would do that.

It was him that left what he loved most in his life, his profession, in order to speak out.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Luz on April 07, 2013, 12:52:50 AM
Gonçalo Amaral didn't have to appeal anything. As short as the "disgraced" (poor miserable woman even explored by the Mccannites, like the debunkernnites and other ites around here) Leonor was convicted every official of the PJ was immediately exhonerated.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: John on April 07, 2013, 12:53:50 AM
Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?

Does anyone have any up to date information on this as a search on the internet  seems to throw up all sorts of nonsense?

That's more than bad taste, it's utterly offensive.

Dr. Gonçalo Amaral is not disgraced and if he is not a member of the PJ anymore that's because he chose to: he was taken of from the Madeleine case but he returned to one of his prior positions as a leader on Drug and Terrorism, in fact just prior from his dismissal he was responsible for one of the biggest drug arrests .

In order to write a book to say all he wanted to say he had to resign from his post. I don't believe many people would do that.

It was him that left what he loved most in his life, his profession, in order to speak out.


A suspended sentence?   He's dam lucky he didn't see the inside of a Portuguese prison cell.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: debunker on April 07, 2013, 12:54:59 AM
Why "disgraced" John?

He also disgraced himself by getting himself thrown off the McCann case for telling journalists things he should not have been telling them. I understand that is actually a crime in Portugal. I think he is lucky not to have been charged over that as well. He tells us all the details of the situation and the way in which the phone call led to his dismissal in his own book.

He also disgraced the PJ by his actions of course.



It was pretty shocking that the Co-ordinator of the case got dismissed don't you think? And even more shocking when we heard reports from Rebelo that the case was in a shambles when he took over.




Good grief. Come on debunker... you're quick enough to jump in when an anti posts up uncorroborated claptrap and yet you let this kind of nonsense pass without comment?  Then you have the temerity to say you're not a pro?  Give me a break.

WHy is it nonsense. He is a convicted criminal.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: C.Edwards on April 07, 2013, 12:58:09 AM
Why "disgraced" John?

He also disgraced himself by getting himself thrown off the McCann case for telling journalists things he should not have been telling them. I understand that is actually a crime in Portugal. I think he is lucky not to have been charged over that as well. He tells us all the details of the situation and the way in which the phone call led to his dismissal in his own book.

He also disgraced the PJ by his actions of course.



It was pretty shocking that the Co-ordinator of the case got dismissed don't you think? And even more shocking when we heard reports from Rebelo that the case was in a shambles when he took over.




Good grief. Come on debunker... you're quick enough to jump in when an anti posts up uncorroborated claptrap and yet you let this kind of nonsense pass without comment?  Then you have the temerity to say you're not a pro?  Give me a break.

WHy is it nonsense. He is a convicted criminal.

Yeah, that's the easy way out. Look at the actual statements posted. Or don't bother. It's pretty obvious where your supposedly unbiased loyalties lie!
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: debunker on April 07, 2013, 12:59:26 AM
Why "disgraced" John?

COnvicted and serving a suspended prison sentence.

...on the words of the woman who just got jailed for lying about the whole incident, yeah?  That's going to sit well on the appeal.

ANd a decision made by the Portuguese courts.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: puglove on April 07, 2013, 01:10:36 AM


I am totally open-minded about this case. I'm angry with, and desperately sad for the McCanns in equal measure. I think they were bloody idiots, but they've paid too high a price for their stupidity.

But I am yet to read anything positive about Amaral.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: John on April 07, 2013, 01:21:52 AM
Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?

Does anyone have any up to date information on this as a search on the internet  seems to throw up all sorts of nonsense?

That's more than bad taste, it's utterly offensive.

Dr. Gonçalo Amaral is not disgraced and if he is not a member of the PJ anymore that's because he chose to: he was taken of from the Madeleine case but he returned to one of his prior positions as a leader on Drug and Terrorism, in fact just prior from his dismissal he was responsible for one of the biggest drug arrests .

In order to write a book to say all he wanted to say he had to resign from his post. I don't believe many people would do that.

It was him that left what he loved most in his life, his profession, in order to speak out.


Why Amaral with a criminal conviction was not kicked out of the Portuguese Police immediately is beyond me.  Says much about the justice system in Portugal but then again...I ain't surprised given what I already know about Spain!

I don't know about you Luz (being in Portugal) but a serving police officer here in the UK with a criminal convictions is considered a disgrace!   Anyone disagree?
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: John on April 07, 2013, 01:26:28 AM
Back to the question...does anyone know at what stage Amaral's appeal is at or has he decided to bin it?
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: icabodcrane on April 07, 2013, 01:36:15 AM
Back to the question...does anyone know at what stage Amaral's appeal is at or has he decided to bin it?


The question is a bit redundant now John ...  you have made it clear that your real purpose in posing it (  in provactive language )  was to get a  reaction

That happened

Might as well let it go now
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: John on April 07, 2013, 01:39:40 AM
Back to the question...does anyone know at what stage Amaral's appeal is at or has he decided to bin it?


The question is a bit redundant now John ...  you have made it clear that your real purpose in posing it (  in provactive language )  was to get a  reaction

That happened

Might as well let it go now


I take it the question of appealing his conviction has been conveniently put to the side?
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: debunker on April 07, 2013, 01:40:11 AM
Back to the question...does anyone know at what stage Amaral's appeal is at or has he decided to bin it?


The question is a bit redundant now John ...  you have made it clear that your real purpose in posing it (  in provactive language )  was to get a  reaction

That happened

Might as well let it go now

Has he appealed his criminal convicti o n which resulted in a custodial sentence (suspended).

Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: gilet on April 07, 2013, 01:41:03 AM
Back to the question...does anyone know at what stage Amaral's appeal is at or has he decided to bin it?


The question is a bit redundant now John ...  you have made it clear that your real purpose in posing it (  in provactive language )  was to get a  reaction

That happened

Might as well let it go now

How exactly is it provocative to use the totally accurate adjective "disgraced" about the former cop and current convict Amaral?

He is disgraced.

He disgraced himself. He admitted one disgraceful act in his book and he was convicted for another.



Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: gilet on April 07, 2013, 01:46:51 AM
Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?

Does anyone have any up to date information on this as a search on the internet  seems to throw up all sorts of nonsense?

That's more than bad taste, it's utterly offensive.

Dr. Gonçalo Amaral is not disgraced and if he is not a member of the PJ anymore that's because he chose to: he was taken of from the Madeleine case but he returned to one of his prior positions as a leader on Drug and Terrorism, in fact just prior from his dismissal he was responsible for one of the biggest drug arrests .

In order to write a book to say all he wanted to say he had to resign from his post. I don't believe many people would do that.

It was him that left what he loved most in his life, his profession, in order to speak out.


Why Amaral with a criminal conviction was not kicked out of the Portuguese Police immediately is beyond me.  Says much about the justice system in Portugal but then again...I ain't surprised given what I already know about Spain!

I don't know about you Luz (being in Portugal) but a serving police officer here in the UK with a criminal convictions is considered a disgrace!   Anyone disagree?

Possibly the most bizarre aspect of the connection between Amaral and the McCann case is that on the morning the case effectively began, 4th May 2007, Amaral wasn't actually co-ordinating full time because he was spending time that day being made Arguido in the Cipriano torture case.

How the senior officers of the Policia Judiciara could allow an arguido in one missing child case to become the Co-ordinator of another missing child case quite astounds me.

Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Luz on April 07, 2013, 02:04:14 AM
Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?

Does anyone have any up to date information on this as a search on the internet  seems to throw up all sorts of nonsense?

That's more than bad taste, it's utterly offensive.

Dr. Gonçalo Amaral is not disgraced and if he is not a member of the PJ anymore that's because he chose to: he was taken of from the Madeleine case but he returned to one of his prior positions as a leader on Drug and Terrorism, in fact just prior from his dismissal he was responsible for one of the biggest drug arrests .

In order to write a book to say all he wanted to say he had to resign from his post. I don't believe many people would do that.

It was him that left what he loved most in his life, his profession, in order to speak out.


Why Amaral with a criminal conviction was not kicked out of the Portuguese Police immediately is beyond me.  Says much about the justice system in Portugal but then again...I ain't surprised given what I already know about Spain!

I don't know about you Luz (being in Portugal) but a serving police officer here in the UK with a criminal convictions is considered a disgrace!   Anyone disagree?

Possibly the most bizarre aspect of the connection between Amaral and the McCann case is that on the morning the case effectively began, 4th May 2007, Amaral wasn't actually co-ordinating full time because he was spending time that day being made Arguido in the Cipriano torture case.

How the senior officers of the Policia Judiciara could allow an arguido in one missing child case to become the Co-ordinator of another missing child case quite astounds me.

Check your sources. You are totally uninformed.
I'm sorry that you are such a little person that chose to insult a person that you don't know just to try to save the face of two "DISGRACED" parents (do you like the word? Fine. Take it.)
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: gilet on April 07, 2013, 02:15:32 AM
Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?

Does anyone have any up to date information on this as a search on the internet  seems to throw up all sorts of nonsense?

That's more than bad taste, it's utterly offensive.

Dr. Gonçalo Amaral is not disgraced and if he is not a member of the PJ anymore that's because he chose to: he was taken of from the Madeleine case but he returned to one of his prior positions as a leader on Drug and Terrorism, in fact just prior from his dismissal he was responsible for one of the biggest drug arrests .

In order to write a book to say all he wanted to say he had to resign from his post. I don't believe many people would do that.

It was him that left what he loved most in his life, his profession, in order to speak out.


Why Amaral with a criminal conviction was not kicked out of the Portuguese Police immediately is beyond me.  Says much about the justice system in Portugal but then again...I ain't surprised given what I already know about Spain!

I don't know about you Luz (being in Portugal) but a serving police officer here in the UK with a criminal convictions is considered a disgrace!   Anyone disagree?

Possibly the most bizarre aspect of the connection between Amaral and the McCann case is that on the morning the case effectively began, 4th May 2007, Amaral wasn't actually co-ordinating full time because he was spending time that day being made Arguido in the Cipriano torture case.

How the senior officers of the Policia Judiciara could allow an arguido in one missing child case to become the Co-ordinator of another missing child case quite astounds me.

Check your sources. You are totally uninformed.
I'm sorry that you are such a little person that chose to insult a person that you don't know just to try to save the face of two "DISGRACED" parents (do you like the word? Fine. Take it.)

I have checked my facts and I am perfectly correct. You are being very silly now calling me names when I am in fact right about my facts.

And the proof of my claim is here.

http://expresso.sapo.pt/policia-arguido-no-processo-das-agressoes-a-leonor-cipriano=f109569



Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: puglove on April 07, 2013, 02:21:14 AM
The McCanns had a choice. A good old buckets and spades beach holiday with the kids, or a wanky tapas bar talking crap meeting place with their pals. They chose the latter, and hoped they'd get away with it. They didn't, And that is the price they will always have to pay. Whatever happened to that little child, she was too little to be left.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: debunker on April 07, 2013, 08:21:31 AM
The McCanns had a choice. A good old buckets and spades beach holiday with the kids, or a wanky tapas bar talking crap meeting place with their pals. They chose the latter, and hoped they'd get away with it. They didn't, And that is the price they will always have to pay. Whatever happened to that little child, she was too little to be left.

AGreed about her being too little to leave alone in the appartment and that they acted in an ill advised manner. But it does not justify the wankers (thanks for showing that this term is acceptable on this board) who defame and harass the McCanns.

ANd you should note that many caring parents make full use of creches and children's clubs because they know that kids like playing with oother kids. As a stay at home dad who did most of the childcare and spent years in constant contact with two toddlers 24 hours 7 days, both they and I enjoyed the change that came with holidays.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: debunker on April 07, 2013, 12:13:39 PM
Apparently Amaral appealed his conviction in 2011 and lost


http://www.dn.pt/inicio/portugal/interior.aspx?content_id=1882361
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Faithlilly on April 07, 2013, 12:21:59 PM
Apparently Amaral appealed his conviction in 2011 and lost


http://www.dn.pt/inicio/portugal/interior.aspx?content_id=1882361

He did indeed and I'm sure, with Cipriano's conviction for perjury, will appeal again.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: debunker on April 07, 2013, 12:26:06 PM
Apparently Amaral appealed his conviction in 2011 and lost


http://www.dn.pt/inicio/portugal/interior.aspx?content_id=1882361

He did indeed and I'm sure, with Cipriano's conviction for perjury, will appeal again.

BUt his conviction was not dependent on the truth f those statements.

WE shall see if he is allowed another appeal.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Eleanor on April 07, 2013, 12:31:52 PM

Goncalo Amaral was convicted on Written Evidence, signed by him.  He can't talk his way out of that one.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Faithlilly on April 07, 2013, 12:35:21 PM
If Cipriano has been proven to have lied then the whole of her testimony, up to and including her claims of torture, is discredited and gives Amaral excellent grounds for appeal.

Can you imagine in this country a conviction standing when the very foundation of that conviction ie the accuser's testimony, has been show to be a tissue of lies ?
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Faithlilly on April 07, 2013, 12:36:53 PM

Goncalo Amaral was convicted on Written Evidence, signed by him.  He can't talk his way out of that one.

Explain further please ?
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Eleanor on April 07, 2013, 12:40:56 PM

Goncalo Amaral was convicted on Written Evidence, signed by him.  He can't talk his way out of that one.

Explain further please ?

It was a written statement by Amaral, and presented to The Court.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: insider on April 07, 2013, 12:48:17 PM

It's also riddled with inaccuracies - or if you were less charitable - lies.

I know that all of these "discrepancies" are excused by McCann supporters as:
a) minor and irrelevant and
b) perfectly understandable after so much time

...but KM herself goes into great depth in her book explaining how much she spent (£100K or so) and how much time she spent going through the police files in microscopic detail. Therefore she should have been accurate to the files. Unless, of course, the initial statements to the police were inaccurate, of course.

She says she was always Kate Healy and only became Kate McCann on May 4th. Except she signed the creche (or someone did) as Kate McCann several times in the holiday (http://www.mccannfiles.com/id351.html (http://www.mccannfiles.com/id351.html)) as Kate McCann. Oopsie.

What about "As soon as it was light Gerry and I resumed our search."  Where's that interview again where she admits to not physically searching but working hard or something...?

What about Kate claiming she took the photo of Madeleine and the tennis balls?  Rachel Oldfield says that was taken by Jane Tanner. Discrepancies? What discrepancies, your honour?

Oh and whilst you're harping on about the naughty illegal amaral leaking information in contravention of the secrecy laws (you do, of course, have evidence it was Amaral, right?) what about the McCanns hiring Metodo 3 to work in Portugal on an active investigation?  Illegal.  Does that make them "unconvicted criminals"?


How very pathetic and narrow minded of you to try and use such non entities in a manner which attempts to prove some sort of culpability on behalf of the McCanns.  My first reaction to this post is to ask myself is this really the best you can do?  Silliness and immature point scoring....pathetic.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Faithlilly on April 07, 2013, 12:52:24 PM

Goncalo Amaral was convicted on Written Evidence, signed by him.  He can't talk his way out of that one.

Explain further please ?

It was a written statement by Amaral, and presented to The Court.

Saying what ?
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: insider on April 07, 2013, 12:52:42 PM
Apparently Amaral appealed his conviction in 2011 and lost


http://www.dn.pt/inicio/portugal/interior.aspx?content_id=1882361


Translation:

On 18 March this year, the Court of Appeal upheld the conviction of former PJ inspector Gonçalo Amaral and António Nunes Cardoso, with suspended sentences, the Court of Faro in 2009, but the latter former agent requested "clarification and reform of judgment. "

According to judicial sources, the Évora understood that "lacks reason," the application of António Nunes Cardoso, sentenced to two years and three months imprisonment with suspended sentence for the crime of document forgery. Understand yet the appellate court that the appeal of Évora "extravassa fully the scope allowed to a request for clarification or adduction of errors, oversights, or obscurities nonentities."

In the decision of the resources of the former inspectors, reported on 18 March 2011, the ratio also remained a sentence of one year and six months in prison for the crime of making false allegations, suspended on probation, applied to Gonçalo Amaral, former coordinator of the Criminal Investigation Department in Portimão.

Following the decision of the Appeal, Marcos Aragão Correia, Leonor Cipriano's lawyer, filed a complaint against the Portuguese state at the United Nations for violating "gross the most basic human rights." The lawyer said the agency Lusa that the conviction and ordered the expulsion of Portugal's Commission on Human Rights of the United Nations.

The case of attacks on Leonor Cipriano was tried in Faro in 2009, but the Court of Faro did not determine the authorship of the attacks on the mother of Joana. Besides Gonçalo Amaral, acquitted of the crime of failure to report abuse, and António Nunes Cardoso, was also judged the former inspector Paulo Pereira Cristovao Morgado Leonel Marques and still active agent and Paulo Marques Good Paulo Pereira Cristovao, Leonel Marques Morgado and Paulo Marques Bom were acquitted.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: insider on April 07, 2013, 12:56:06 PM
Gonçalo Amaral stands as a convicted criminal who has lost at least one appeal.   Lets not split hairs on this fact because frankly it makes those who do look quite stupid.   

If he ever has his conviction overturned that is another matter but I have my doubts.   8(0(*
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Faithlilly on April 07, 2013, 01:15:06 PM
Gonçalo Amaral stands as a convicted criminal who has lost at least one appeal.   Lets not split hairs on this fact because frankly it makes those who do look quite stupid.   

If he ever has his conviction overturned that is another matter but I have my doubts.   8(0(*

As it stands Amaral has indeed been convicted of a crime and has had his appeal against that conviction turned down but that was before the evidence that convicted him ie Cipriano's 'torture' testimony, was categorically discredited by her perjury conviction.

Now it's a whole different ball game.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: insider on April 07, 2013, 01:19:40 PM
I believe Amaral was not involved in the beating of this woman but he participated in the subsequent cover up.  Regardless of what happens to the abusers his conviction is a separate matter.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: debunker on April 07, 2013, 01:23:13 PM
Gonçalo Amaral stands as a convicted criminal who has lost at least one appeal.   Lets not split hairs on this fact because frankly it makes those who do look quite stupid.   

If he ever has his conviction overturned that is another matter but I have my doubts.   8(0(*

As it stands Amaral has indeed been convicted of a crime and has had his appeal against that conviction turned down but that was before the evidence that convicted him ie Cipriano's 'torture' testimony, was categorically discredited by her perjury conviction.

Now it's a whole different ball game.


IN your humble and ill-informed opinion.

HE may be allowed an appeal.
Shall we wait and see instead of assum ing our prejudices are the determinant of the future.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Eleanor on April 07, 2013, 01:44:34 PM

The complaint of False Accusations against Leonor Cipriano was brought by the three PJ Officers who were acquitted of actual torture, since she failed to identify them due to having a bag over her head while someone was beating her up.
Two Courts now have accepted as proven that she was beaten while in Police Custody.

Personally, I fail to see how she can have been convicted of this since she does not appear to have named them herself because she didn't know who they were, due to aforementioned bag.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Admin on April 07, 2013, 01:47:21 PM

The complaint of False Accusations against Leonor Cipriano was brought by the three PJ Officers who were acquitted of actual torture, since she failed to identify them due to having a bag over her head while someone was beating her up.
Two Courts now have accepted as proven that she was beaten while in Police Custody.

Personally, I fail to see how she can have been convicted of this since she does not appear to have named them herself because she didn't know who they were, due to aforementioned bag.

There will be custody records which detail who saw her and when.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Faithlilly on April 07, 2013, 01:52:20 PM
Amaral would certainly be given leave to appeal in the UK if the main witness for the prosecution had been convicted of perjury in the same case.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Eleanor on April 07, 2013, 01:56:42 PM

The complaint of False Accusations against Leonor Cipriano was brought by the three PJ Officers who were acquitted of actual torture, since she failed to identify them due to having a bag over her head while someone was beating her up.
Two Courts now have accepted as proven that she was beaten while in Police Custody.

Personally, I fail to see how she can have been convicted of this since she does not appear to have named them herself because she didn't know who they were, due to aforementioned bag.

There will be custody records which detail who saw her and when.

Pretty nearly absolutely, although one might have to take into account the honesty of the records. 
This did happen over a day and a night, and there have been pointers to Officers being brought in from outside.  But I think it is pretty safe to assume that The PJ Hierarchy know who done.  This could be why moves are afoot to remove the pensions of all five of them.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Angelo222 on December 28, 2016, 11:24:57 AM
Amaral would certainly be given leave to appeal in the UK if the main witness for the prosecution had been convicted of perjury in the same case.

Amaral lied to the judge over the altered timesheets so an appeal cannot alter that fact. Ironically, had he not been involved with the McCann case he would not have been convicted nor lost his job.  C'est la vie!!
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: sadie on December 28, 2016, 03:15:02 PM
Amaral lied to the judge over the altered timesheets so an appeal cannot alter that fact. Ironically, had he not been involved with the McCann case he would not have been convicted nor lost his job.  C'est la vie!!

Nothing to do with The Mccanns.  The documents were falsified way back in 2005, long before we even heard of Madeleine Mccann.

Now, come on Angelo .... just why did Amaral lose his job?  Let's get at the truth here please
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: slartibartfast on December 28, 2016, 03:25:46 PM
Nothing to do with The Mccanns.  The documents were falsified way back in 2005, long before we even heard of Madeleine Mccann.

Now, come on Angelo .... just why did Amaral lose his job?  Let's get at the truth here please

He resigned.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Davel on December 28, 2016, 03:40:53 PM
He resigned.
Yes he did
Angelo is wrong
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: slartibartfast on December 28, 2016, 03:49:11 PM
Yes he did
Angelo is wrong

No, lost job can be voluntary or involuntary.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: sadie on December 28, 2016, 03:55:22 PM
He resigned.
Since when have you been called Angelo ?

And I  expect a response from Angelo on BOTH points

Nothing to do with The Mccanns.  The documents were falsified way back in 2005, long before we even heard of Madeleine Mccann.

 expect a response from Angelo on both points

Do you also acknowledge, Angelo, that The Mccanns had nothing to do with Amaral being convicted. 
To remind you Amarals perjury was in 2005, long before The Mccanns came on the scene.

Please can you amend your post.


BTW, it was my understanding that Amaral had upset the heirachy by criticizing the British Police.  Might they have been ultra kind and called it resignation?

Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: slartibartfast on December 28, 2016, 03:56:48 PM
Since when have you been called Angelo ?

And I  expect a response from Angelo on BOTH points

Do you also acknowledge, Angelo, that The Mccanns had nothing to do with Amaral being convicted. 
To remind you Amarals perjury was in 2005, long before The Mccanns came on the scene.

Please can you amend your post.


BTW, it was my understanding that Amaral had upset the heirachy by criticizing the British Police.  Might they have been ultra kind and called it resignation?

Sorry dear open forum, posters can reply to who they please.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Davel on December 28, 2016, 04:05:58 PM
No, lost job can be voluntary or involuntary.
dont talk rubbish
You don't LOSE your job voluntarily
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: slartibartfast on December 28, 2016, 04:23:39 PM
dont talk rubbish
You don't LOSE your job voluntarily

If your position is made intolerable then you may still resign which is voluntary.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Davel on December 28, 2016, 04:26:53 PM
If your position is made intolerable then you may still resign which is voluntary.
No you don't
You stand up for yourself
That's what I would do but perhaps I'm made of stronger stuff than you or amaral
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alice Purjorick on December 28, 2016, 05:42:00 PM
If your position is made intolerable then you may still resign which is voluntary.

Or one may take Voluntary Redundancy.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: misty on December 28, 2016, 05:52:55 PM
http://truthofthelie.com/the-book/

Copy of the forward from the French version -

“Certainly, this book responds to the need I felt to defend myself, having been discredited by the institution for which I worked for more than twenty-six years, without being given any chance to explain myself, publicly or within the institution itself. I made the request several times, but it was never heard. I, therefore, scrupulously respected the rules of the police judiciaire and I refrained from making any comment. But this goes without saying: I experienced that silence to which I was constrained as an attack on my dignity. Later, I was removed from the investigation. It was then that I understood that it was time to speak. To do that, I requested early retirement in order to be able to express myself freely.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: ShiningInLuz on December 28, 2016, 06:42:13 PM
dont talk rubbish
You don't LOSE your job voluntarily
I've done it, and I'm aware of many others doing the same.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: slartibartfast on December 28, 2016, 07:12:04 PM
http://truthofthelie.com/the-book/

Copy of the forward from the French version -

“Certainly, this book responds to the need I felt to defend myself, having been discredited by the institution for which I worked for more than twenty-six years, without being given any chance to explain myself, publicly or within the institution itself. I made the request several times, but it was never heard. I, therefore, scrupulously respected the rules of the police judiciaire and I refrained from making any comment. But this goes without saying: I experienced that silence to which I was constrained as an attack on my dignity. Later, I was removed from the investigation. It was then that I understood that it was time to speak. To do that, I requested early retirement in order to be able to express myself freely.

Thanks.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Davel on December 29, 2016, 01:10:10 AM
I've done it, and I'm aware of many others doing the same.
Losing your job is something you are forced to accept
It is not a voluntary action
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: ShiningInLuz on December 29, 2016, 01:14:33 AM
Losing your job is something you are forced to accept
It is not a voluntary action
Rubbish.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Davel on December 29, 2016, 01:55:32 AM
Rubbish.

It is you who is posting rubbish
Give me an example how it is possible to lose a job voluntarily
You will not be able to
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: ShiningInLuz on December 29, 2016, 02:38:14 AM
It is you who is posting rubbish
Give me an example how it is possible to lose a job voluntarily
You will not be able to
You have obviously not worked for a FTSE 100 company.  I have worked for 3, in which it happened each time.

My son worked for a Fortune 500 company, which had a policy of counselling 10% of its execs out of a job each year.

Don't come back on this one.  I am not in the mood for this rubbish.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Davel on December 29, 2016, 05:17:31 AM
You have obviously not worked for a FTSE 100 company.  I have worked for 3, in which it happened each time.

My son worked for a Fortune 500 company, which had a policy of counselling 10% of its execs out of a job each year.

Don't come back on this one.  I am not in the mood for this rubbish.

You are not at liberty to stop me being replying to your post nor removing posts because you are losing the argument
You are referring to people being forced out of a job not leaving voluntarily

Being forced out of a job would be regarded as unfair dismissal
I have employed many people
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: ShiningInLuz on December 29, 2016, 04:27:23 PM
You are not at liberty to stop me being replying to your post nor removing posts because you are losing the argument
You are referring to people being forced out of a job not leaving voluntarily

Being forced out of a job would be regarded as unfair dismissal
I have employed many people
OK, I will respond to this.

Frankly, I don't care how many people you have employed.  It is irrelevant.

The companies I have experience of employ experts in employment law and know exactly how far they can push someone and remain within the law.

On my personal occasion I consulted a lawyer whose field of expertise was employment law.

I have had enough of the nonsense you are spouting on this.  You need to get into the real world.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alfie on December 29, 2016, 06:04:12 PM
Or one may take Voluntary Redundancy.
If you took voluntary redundancy would you tell people that you'd lost your job?
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: slartibartfast on December 29, 2016, 06:22:00 PM
Sorry dear open forum, posters can reply to who they please.

See what you did there... 8)-)))
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alice Purjorick on December 29, 2016, 06:23:02 PM
If you took voluntary redundancy would you tell people that you'd lost your job?

Yes! but what difference does it make to this argument ?
If your job moves 100 miles up the road and you choose not to go but to take the money you have voluntarily put yourself out of a job. QED
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alfie on December 29, 2016, 06:24:28 PM
See what you did there... 8)-)))
It was only a matter of time...  @)(++(*
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alfie on December 29, 2016, 06:28:12 PM
Yes! but what difference does it make to this argument ?
If your job moves 100 miles up the road and you choose not to go but to take the money you have voluntarily put yourself out of a job. QED
You don't voluntarily lose a job. It's about choice and whether you have control over your employment status or not.  If you choose not to move then you didn't lose the job, you chose to leave it. 
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alice Purjorick on December 29, 2016, 06:41:10 PM
You don't voluntarily lose a job. It's about choice and whether you have control over your employment status or not.  If you choose not to move then you didn't lose the job, you chose to leave it.

You chose to lose it. However you may wish to dress it up.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alfie on December 29, 2016, 06:42:58 PM
You chose to lose it. However you may wish to dress it up.
Rubbish.  No one chooses to lose anything. 
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alice Purjorick on December 29, 2016, 06:59:13 PM
Rubbish.  No one chooses to lose anything.

If you choose not to follow the job you have chosen to lose it.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alfie on December 29, 2016, 08:15:47 PM
If you choose not to follow the job you have chosen to lose it.
*&*%£
So, when you hand in your resignation regardless of the circumstances you are choosing to lose your job, so when David Cameron resigned as PM he lost his job.  Right-o then.  "I've just lost my job Samantha" he said mournfully to his wife at the breakfast table.   Or should that be brexit table?
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alice Purjorick on December 29, 2016, 09:18:40 PM
*&*%£
So, when you hand in your resignation regardless of the circumstances you are choosing to lose your job, so when David Cameron resigned as PM he lost his job.  Right-o then.  "I've just lost my job Samantha" he said mournfully to his wife at the breakfast table.   Or should that be brexit table?

Now you are being silly.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: misty on December 29, 2016, 09:47:48 PM
How do you assess constructive dismissal when defining a "lost" job?
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alfie on December 29, 2016, 10:22:59 PM
Now you are being silly.
According to you a resignation is another word for choosing to lose a job.  So anyone who has ever resigned from a job has "lost their job", yes?
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alice Purjorick on December 29, 2016, 10:36:20 PM
According to you a resignation is another word for choosing to lose a job.  So anyone who has ever resigned from a job has "lost their job", yes?

No and No. Now show me where I used the word "resignation".
Thanking you in anticipation
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alfie on December 29, 2016, 10:47:54 PM
No and No. Now show me where I used the word "resignation".
Thanking you in anticipation
When you choose not to follow a job 100 miles up country you don't get sacked, you.....(fill in the dots).
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Faithlilly on January 17, 2017, 09:12:44 PM
http://portugalresident.com/portuguese-journalist-wins-landmark-case-over-freedom-of-expression

A Portuguese journalist condemned to pay €60,000 for an opinion article he wrote in 2006 has finally won what will undoubtedly become a landmark case for freedom of expression.

José Manuel Fernandes - formerly editor of Público (now publisher of news review website Observador) - was found guilty of defamation by the full gamut of Portuguese courts.

But the European Court of Human Rights has now ruled that these courts “exceeded their margin of appreciation” in maintaining Fernandes’ enormous indemnity - one which it pointed out was equivalent to a sum attributed over a death.

The State has thus been ordered to pay Fernandes €9,400 “plus expenses” within a three-month deadline from today.

It hasn’t been explained this way, but the “plus expenses” clause is likely to run to hefty sum, considering Fernandes has been fighting this judicial battle for the best part of a decade.

The article that started Fernandes’ litigation nightmare centred on a critique of the appointment of Noronha do Nascimento to head up the Supreme Tribunal of Justice.

Noronha do Nascimento took exception to being considered the personification of the “dark side of our justice system”, and took out a prosecution for defamation.

As Observador explains, the ECHR is available to any citizen who has exhausted the judicial means at their disposal and who feels their human rights have been violated.

And today the ECHR ruled in Fernandes’ favour, saying there was “no reasonable relationship of proportionality between the restriction of freedom of expression of the complainant and the objective pursued of protecting the good name of Noronha do Nascimento”.

For anyone following ‘freedom of expression’ cases - like that of former Maddie cop Gonçalo Amaral, or of currently jailed activist Maria de Lurdes (click here) - this ruling may well set a valid precedent over “reasonable relationship of proportionality”. The pity is that people have to fight so long to win it.

natasha.donn@algarveresident.com
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alfie on January 17, 2017, 11:05:55 PM
The case of Maria de Lurdes truly is a scandal and lends credence to the view of Portugal as a third world nation, (as described by one of Maria's supporters)

http://portugalresident.com/outrage-over-jailing-of-portuguese-woman-who-called-judges-“gangs-of-organised-criminals”
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Faithlilly on January 17, 2017, 11:41:28 PM
The case of Maria de Lurdes truly is a scandal and lends credence to the view of Portugal as a third world nation, (as described by one of Maria's supporters)

http://portugalresident.com/outrage-over-jailing-of-portuguese-woman-who-called-judges-“gangs-of-organised-criminals”

One miscarriage of justice does not a third world nation make Alfie.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: misty on January 17, 2017, 11:54:41 PM
It all depends for whose benefit justice is seen to be served.

The Maria de Lurdes case is shocking in an EU country in 2016.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: sadie on January 18, 2017, 12:23:07 AM
The case of Maria de Lurdes truly is a scandal and lends credence to the view of Portugal as a third world nation, (as described by one of Maria's supporters)

http://portugalresident.com/outrage-over-jailing-of-portuguese-woman-who-called-judges-“gangs-of-organised-criminals”

The webpage that you mention seems already to have been pulled Alfie.

I wonder why?

Fast work.  Very fast work.  Are they hiding something?
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Robittybob1 on January 18, 2017, 01:31:47 AM
The webpage that you mention seems already to have been pulled Alfie.

I wonder why?

Fast work.  Very fast work.  Are they hiding something?
try http://portugalresident.com/outrage-over-jailing-of-portuguese-woman-who-called-judges-%E2%80%9Cgangs-of-organised-criminals%E2%80%9D
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alfie on January 18, 2017, 09:21:33 AM
One miscarriage of justice does not a third world nation make Alfie.
It was a Portuguese national who used that phrase.  Is it the only miscarriage of justice in Portugal?  According to a poster on here there has NEVER been a miscarriage of justice in Portugal! 
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: ShiningInLuz on January 18, 2017, 09:42:31 AM
It was a Portuguese national who used that phrase.  Is it the only miscarriage of justice in Portugal?  According to a poster on here there has NEVER been a miscarriage of justice in Portugal!
I would be interested in knowing who your alleged poster is, because for the life of me, I cannot think of one who fits the jaundiced picture you are presenting.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Davel on January 18, 2017, 09:50:13 AM
I would be interested in knowing who your alleged poster is, because for the life of me, I cannot think of one who fits the jaundiced picture you are presenting.

The poster is Montclair
The post is almost certainly still there it has been widely discussed
He maintained that there was no major case where a miscarriage of justice has been admitted
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: ferryman on January 18, 2017, 09:54:09 AM
The case of Maria de Lurdes truly is a scandal and lends credence to the view of Portugal as a third world nation, (as described by one of Maria's supporters)

http://portugalresident.com/outrage-over-jailing-of-portuguese-woman-who-called-judges-“gangs-of-organised-criminals”

Something seems to have happened to the link you gave, Alfie.

Here it is again:

http://portugalresident.com/portuguese-journalist-wins-landmark-case-over-freedom-of-expression

Shocking indeed.

Posted by PORTUGALPRESS on October 11, 2016
Outrage over jailing of Portuguese woman who called judges “gangs of organised criminals”

It is a case that goes back 16 years and which is causing a wave of outrage on social media. Fifty-year-old Maria de Lurdes Lopes Rodrigues entered Tires jail (Cascais) nearly two weeks ago to serve a three-year sentence for defamation - handed out almost 16 years ago.

The ‘victims’ of her crimes are judges, policemen and prosecutors - many of them high-profile, and extremely well-connected.

As critics explain, it is “extremely rare, almost unheard of” for anyone to be prosecuted for “minor crimes such as offence and defamation”, but in this case perhaps, Maria de Lurdes’ ‘victims’ were simply too important to let the insults go.
Suffice it to say, she is now sharing a cell with two women convicted of murder.

She had dodged her conviction for years, managed to evade orders remanding her to ‘psychiatric accompaniment’ but finally, on September 29, ‘time ran out’.

“It seems that we are in a Third World country, but this is Portugal in the 21st century”, writes friend and ‘social activist’ Mário Gomes, who is behind the gathering appeal to free Rodrigues.

“This woman is not a criminal. She is an intellectual and an artist”.

Indeed, Gomes explains that in the two weeks since her incarceration, Rodrigues has “tried to adapt to prison life, the very rigorous timetables, the slamming of doors, the internal conflicts - very often violent - in which no-one in authority steps in to halt”, and she has made friends: a Moldovian woman imprisoned for falsifying immigration papers, and a Brazilian girl in jail for carrying drugs into Europe.

The trio asked to be transferred to a shared cell. “On the explicit orders of the prison governor, the Moldovian and Brazilian were transferred to a joint cell. Lurdes was transferred to another where her company are two women serving time for murder”.

“What more can I say?” He asks. “People say it isn’t possible to jail someone for words denouncing illegalities. I am sorry but it is. Please all of you leave your iPads, PCs, latest generation mobile phones and do something to get this human being out of prison!”

The facebook group now in operation is rapidly amassing members (click here).

The background to this story can be found in media archives. It centres on Rodrigues taking out a prosecution against former culture minister Manuel Maria Carrilho (currently involved in VIP divorce proceedings with a former game show hostess) in 1996.

Carrilho had ‘robbed her’ of the chance of a scholarship to continue her studies in cinematography, claimed Rodrigues.

Then in her late 30s, Lurdes won the case, which went to appeal.

As her friend Mário Gomes explains, she lost thereafter in court “with a judge whom she accused of corruption because, as (Rodrigues) believed, she (the judge) always put herself on the side of the minister”.

And so it went on. Diário de Notícias explained in 2013 that Rodrigues refused to give up, filing complaints about “various personalities, like the former Attorney General of the Republic Pinto Monteiro, the director of DCIAP Maria José Morgado and the director of the PJ Almeida Rodrigues, accusing them of “excusing crimes” practised by people she had accused of “stealing and plundering” her home and property”.

There came a point where she wrote that DIAP director Morgado “smiled like a psychopath and murderer” over Rodrigues’ case of eviction.

And then came the letters describing the Attorney General and other personalities as “criminal gangs”.

As DN said at the time, Maria de Lurdes Lopes Rodrigues has entered into the history of Portuguese justice “as being one of the few people condemned to prison for a minor crime like offence and defamation”.

It now remains to be seen if she stays there, or if this impetus to see her freed rings the changes.

The Free Maria de Lurdes facebook group is open to anyone, of any nationality.

Its next upcoming event is a meeting at the Faculty of Human and Social Sciences on October 24, to debate: “Freedom, Censure and Democracy”.

natasha.donn@algarveresident.com
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: ShiningInLuz on January 18, 2017, 10:01:00 AM
The poster is Montclair
The post is almost certainly still there it has been widely discussed
He maintained that there was no major case where a miscarriage of justice has been admitted
So which is it?

Alfie "there has NEVER been a miscarriage of justice in Portugal".
Davel "no major case where a miscarriage of justice has been admitted".

And why are you filling in for Alfie?
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alfie on January 18, 2017, 10:06:48 AM
I would be interested in knowing who your alleged poster is, because for the life of me, I cannot think of one who fits the jaundiced picture you are presenting.
"In Portugal, there is an appeals system and people have seen their sentences reduced or verdicts overturned but miscarriages of justices as you see in the UK, I am not aware of" - Montclair.  Previous comments on the same subject by this poster, predating the above comment seem to have been wiped.

Full thread on the subject here http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=5005.0
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: ferryman on January 18, 2017, 10:12:17 AM
11th post in the link.

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=2853.msg99023#msg99023

As for cases being overturned, I don't remember any but that doesn't mean that there weren't any.

(Montclair)
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Faithlilly on January 18, 2017, 10:15:09 AM
It was a Portuguese national who used that phrase.  Is it the only miscarriage of justice in Portugal?  According to a poster on here there has NEVER been a miscarriage of justice in Portugal!

And an anonymous poster on this forum is the font of all knowledge, are they?

I have been involved in several horrendous miscarriages of justice in this country. Should we then also be considered ' a third world nation' ?
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alfie on January 18, 2017, 10:32:04 AM
And an anonymous poster on this forum is the font of all knowledge, are they?

I have been involved in several horrendous miscarriages of justice in this country. Should we then also be considered ' a third world nation' ?
You live in a country where miscarriages of justice have been identified and therefore measures can be taken to seek redress.  If you live in a country where it the concept "miscarriage of justice" doesn't even seem to be acknowledged then how does one ever know about it or seek redress? 
But maybe Montclair was wrong as you suggest and Portugal is full of miscarriages of justice that have been highlighted, and redress sought and won. 
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Faithlilly on January 18, 2017, 10:34:49 AM
You live in a country where miscarriages of justice have been identified and therefore measures can be taken to seek redress.  If you live in a country where it the concept "miscarriage of justice" doesn't even seem to be acknowledged then how does one ever know about it or seek redress? 
But maybe Montclair was wrong as you suggest and Portugal is full of miscarriages of justice that have been highlighted, and redress sought and won.

The whole basis of your argument seems to stems from one post on this forum. Is that correct?
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alfie on January 18, 2017, 10:40:16 AM
The whole basis of your argument seems to stems from one post on this forum. Is that correct?
I am not arguing, simply pointing out.   I have already conceded in my previous post that Montclair may have been talking out of his trumpet.  It wouldn't be the first time blatant misinformation has been posted on this forum!
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Faithlilly on January 18, 2017, 10:44:58 AM
I am not arguing, simply pointing out.   I have already conceded in my previous post that Montclair may have been talking out of his trumpet.  It wouldn't be the first time blatant misinformation has been posted on this forum!

Pointing out? Pointing out what? That a poster sometime ago claimed there was no miscarriages of justice in Portugal but you've found one?

Thank you Alfie. Your worth to this forum is immeasurable.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Davel on January 18, 2017, 10:51:45 AM
So which is it?

Alfie "there has NEVER been a miscarriage of justice in Portugal".
Davel "no major case where a miscarriage of justice has been admitted".

And why are you filling in for Alfie?

Because it's a free forum and I can respond to any posts I wish
Do you have a problem with that
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alfie on January 18, 2017, 10:59:31 AM
Pointing out? Pointing out what? That a poster sometime ago claimed there was no miscarriages of justice in Portugal but you've found one?

Thank you Alfie. Your worth to this forum is immeasurable.
You're welcome, and I know  8)--))
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: ShiningInLuz on January 18, 2017, 11:08:42 AM
Because it's a free forum and I can respond to any posts I wish
Do you have a problem with that
"So which is it?

Alfie "there has NEVER been a miscarriage of justice in Portugal".
Davel "no major case where a miscarriage of justice has been admitted".

And why are you filling in for Alfie?"

Duck, swerve, dive.

Seemingly, upon no occasion is it fit and proper to answer the issue in question.
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Alfie on January 18, 2017, 11:41:12 AM
"So which is it?

Alfie "there has NEVER been a miscarriage of justice in Portugal".
Davel "no major case where a miscarriage of justice has been admitted".

And why are you filling in for Alfie?"

Duck, swerve, dive.

Seemingly, upon no occasion is it fit and proper to answer the issue in question.
Why are you bullying Davel about something I said?
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Davel on January 18, 2017, 12:43:14 PM
"So which is it?

Alfie "there has NEVER been a miscarriage of justice in Portugal".
Davel "no major case where a miscarriage of justice has been admitted".

And why are you filling in for Alfie?"

Duck, swerve, dive.

Seemingly, upon no occasion is it fit and proper to answer the issue in question.

Whichever it is it's an absolute disgrace
The post is there
I can answer any post I want
Unless you have changed the rules
Title: Re: Has disgraced former cop Gonçalo Amaral appealed his conviction?
Post by: Davel on January 18, 2017, 12:46:24 PM
Sil must understand she is new to the forum and some things have been discussed a million times
Another reason I answered the post is because the original post by Montclair was addressed to me