UK Justice Forum

Welcome to the UK Justice Forum => Admin introduction, forum rules, colours and requests for documents and photos. => Topic started by: John on August 15, 2017, 12:42:22 AM

Title: Moderation queries.
Post by: John on August 15, 2017, 12:42:22 AM
All queries relating to moderation should be posted on this thread.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Erngath on August 15, 2017, 12:48:40 AM
All queries relating to moderation should be posted on this thread.



It would be good if posters were informed of the reason the reason their post is removed.
Thank you.


Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: John on August 15, 2017, 01:01:12 AM



It would be good if posters were informed of the reason the reason their post is removed.
Thank you.

Hi Erngath

We have had this raised numerous times and the answer from moderators is always that it would create far too much work if every deletion had to be explained.  That said however, I have no problem with posters asking why their post was removed and being entitled to an answer.

The most common reason why innocuous posts are removed is generally because they quoted an already deleted post or were off topic.  I believe your reply to davel earlier today was removed as it was off topic.  Members can ask an admin to intervene at any time if they consider that a post has been removed contrary to the forum rules.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: ShiningInLuz on August 15, 2017, 02:42:58 PM
Deleted.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Robittybob1 on May 14, 2019, 12:28:47 PM
Is it acceptable that a post when shown to be inaccurate is then claimed to be irony. 

The words of the post are obviously wrong in other words "inaccurate".  There is a rule about posts NOT being "inaccurate":
"Forum Rules
You agree, through your use of this forum, that you will not post any material which is false, defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, adult material, or otherwise in violation of any International or United States Federal law."

I think when irony is being used to make a point the forum needs to be made aware that irony is being used.  This could be an explanatory note at the end of the ironic post.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 28, 2019, 08:20:51 AM
Moderation on the McCann board seems to be an ongoing bone of contention, No-one seems to feel that it's working. There are constant complaints about deletions from old and new members. Members seem to feel that posts are deleted because of bias on the part of the moderator rather than because the post broke forum rules.

I understand that the forum is essentially a dictatorship; the choices being to accept the status quo or leave.  I thought it might be useful for members to express their opinions and suggest any possible solutions here, rather than having periodic arguments in public.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 28, 2019, 09:03:28 AM
Moderation on the McCann board seems to be an ongoing bone of contention, No-one seems to feel that it's working. There are constant complaints about deletions from old and new members. Members seem to feel that posts are deleted because of bias on the part of the moderator rather than because the post broke forum rules.

I understand that the forum is essentially a dictatorship; the choices being to accept the status quo or leave.  I thought it might be useful for members to express their opinions and suggest any possible solutions here, rather than having periodic arguments in public.

The Members who feel that their comments are deleted due to Bias are wrong, especially since they don't know who deleted what.  But a large number of comments are deleted due to Reply to Deleted Post.
If Members did not reply to Insulting or Goading Posts then the number of Deletions would diminish.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: barrier on May 28, 2019, 09:50:51 AM
The trouble with a thread such as this can a mod answer objectively rather than take it personally.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: APRIL on May 28, 2019, 09:51:52 AM
The Members who feel that their comments are deleted due to Bias are wrong, especially since they don't know who deleted what.  But a large number of comments are deleted due to Reply to Deleted Post.
If Members did not reply to Insulting or Goading Posts then the number of Deletions would diminish.


How amusing! It sounded as if you're saying that it's perfectly permissible for Members to post insults and/or goads, but those who respond to such create unnecessary work for moderators. I had to read it twice to see that my initial thought was incorrect.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: barrier on May 28, 2019, 09:52:51 AM
Moderation on the McCann board seems to be an ongoing bone of contention, No-one seems to feel that it's working. There are constant complaints about deletions from old and new members. Members seem to feel that posts are deleted because of bias on the part of the moderator rather than because the post broke forum rules.

I understand that the forum is essentially a dictatorship; the choices being to accept the status quo or leave.  I thought it might be useful for members to express their opinions and suggest any possible solutions here, rather than having periodic arguments in public.
I think all chat forums are like that G,not just McCann associated ones.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Cheeky Monkey on May 28, 2019, 09:54:00 AM
The Members who feel that their comments are deleted due to Bias are wrong, especially since they don't know who deleted what.  But a large number of comments are deleted due to Reply to Deleted Post.
If Members did not reply to Insulting or Goading Posts then the number of Deletions would diminish.
I've had comments reinstated, so someone's not doing their job properly IMO.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 28, 2019, 09:55:53 AM

How amusing! It sounded as if you're saying that it's perfectly permissible for Members to post insults and/or goads, but those who respond to such create unnecessary work for moderators. I had to read it twice to see that my initial thought was incorrect.

Please try not to be too silly.  Of course the Goad or Insult are removed first.  And No, they are not acceptable.  But replying to these comments does make more work for Moderators.

Less is always best, don't you think.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 28, 2019, 09:59:47 AM
I've had comments reinstated, so someone's not doing their job properly IMO.

Precisely.  John revues all deletions and reinstates where he thinks it is necessary.  Unfortunately, John is not able to be here all of the time.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 28, 2019, 10:35:07 AM
I'd like to thank Eleanor for being willing to take part in this discussion. Moderating is a difficult job which I personally wouldn't touch with a bargepole. It seems to me that moderators end up between the devil and the deep blue sea. It must be annoying to delete a post and then see it reinstated.  It also encourages members to think moderators arem't doing their job properly, so it leads to more challenges and arguments.

On the other hand I'm sure I'm not the only member who has posted a carefully worded post or two and then discovered them gone because I was involved in a discussion triggered by a post which moderators have decided, with hindsight, needs deleting.

Members can't be expected to read back before posting to ensure that previous posts are within the rules; that's not their responsibilty. I think speed of reaction by moderators is the problem here. If moderators dealt with unacceptable posts immediately then no-one would br able to reply to them.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 28, 2019, 10:49:25 AM
I'd like to thank Eleanor for being willing to take part in this discussion. Moderating is a difficult job which I personally wouldn't touch with a bargepole. It seems to me that moderators end up between the devil and the deep blue sea. It must be annoying to delete a post and then see it reinstated.  It also encourages members to think moderators arem't doing their job properly, so it leads to more challenges and arguments.

On the other hand I'm sure I'm not the only member who has posted a carefully worded post or two and then discovered them gone because I was involved in a discussion triggered by a post which moderators have decided, with hindsight, needs deleting.

Members can't be expected to read back before posting to ensure that previous posts are within the rules; that's not their responsibilty. I think speed of reaction by moderators is the problem here. If moderators dealt with unacceptable posts immediately then no-one would br able to reply to them.

Thank You, G-Unit.

However, how fast on my feet do you think I am?  I can go to the lavatory or feed the dog and when I get back there are a dozen posts up, one of which could be unacceptable, in my opinion, and to which there are replies that also have to be deleted.  Often it is not possible to modify.

I shall be at The Food Bank this afternoon for a couple of hours.  I'm not missing that for what you should be able to control yourselves.  I don't know how busy any other Moderator might be.  We are not subjected to a Regime.

I do not mind if John reinstates a post that I have deleted.  It is only a matter of opinion.  But John's is the only opinion that matters in the end.  He does his utmost to make sure that you are all treated fairly.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 28, 2019, 12:25:39 PM
Thank You, G-Unit.

However, how fast on my feet do you think I am?  I can go to the lavatory or feed the dog and when I get back there are a dozen posts up, one of which could be unacceptable, in my opinion, and to which there are replies that also have to be deleted.  Often it is not possible to modify.

I shall be at The Food Bank this afternoon for a couple of hours.  I'm not missing that for what you should be able to control yourselves.  I don't know how busy any other Moderator might be.  We are not subjected to a Regime.

I do not mind if John reinstates a post that I have deleted.  It is only a matter of opinion.  But John's is the only opinion that matters in the end.  He does his utmost to make sure that you are all treated fairly.

How dare you wander off feeding dogs lol!!

I know it's purely a voluntary matter, but even volunteers are usually organised so they are present when needed.  Perhaps more organisation between moderators would help?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: barrier on May 28, 2019, 01:20:30 PM
Brietta accuses Monkey of making it up,I do the same to sadie and it gets whoosed,unbiased far from it,watch this go as well.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 28, 2019, 01:35:28 PM
Brietta accuses Monkey of making it up,I do the same to sadie and it gets whoosed,unbiased far from it,watch this go as well.

Thank you barrier. That's another problem. Moderators shouldn't penalise others for doing things they also do. Respect has to be earned and a moderator who displays the "do as I say not as I do" attitude won't be respected, and will lose authority imo. Leading by example is what the best leaders do imo.

Another problem is the provision of cites. I find myself being pursued for a cite, but when I ask for one I rarely get it, even from a moderator. That feels unfair because the moderator can delete my post if I don't comply, but I can do nothing if they fail to comply.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 28, 2019, 02:24:47 PM
How dare you wander off feeding dogs lol!!

I know it's purely a voluntary matter, but even volunteers are usually organised so they are present when needed.  Perhaps more organisation between moderators would help?

I can sometimes be here for hours and no one puts a foot wrong, in my opinion.  And then John whooshes the lot.  Off Topic, or something.  I'm not very hot on Off Topic.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 28, 2019, 02:27:51 PM
Brietta accuses Monkey of making it up,I do the same to sadie and it gets whoosed,unbiased far from it,watch this go as well.

I don't think this is quite the topic for whooshing.  Unless it is down right Insulting.  But then I am difficult to insult.  I've had too much practice at dealing with that.  The rest of the moderators are on their own.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: barrier on May 28, 2019, 03:04:19 PM
I don't think this is quite the topic for whooshing.  Unless it is down right Insulting.  But then I am difficult to insult.  I've had too much practice at dealing with that.  The rest of the moderators are on their own.


The trouble with a thread such as this can a mod answer objectively rather than take it personally.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 28, 2019, 03:06:42 PM


No Moderator is obliged to answer anything to do with Moderating.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: barrier on May 28, 2019, 03:24:25 PM
Hi Erngath

We have had this raised numerous times and the answer from moderators is always that it would create far too much work if every deletion had to be explained.  That said however, I have no problem with posters asking why their post was removed and being entitled to an answer.

The most common reason why innocuous posts are removed is generally because they quoted an already deleted post or were off topic.  I believe your reply to davel earlier today was removed as it was off topic.  Members can ask an admin to intervene at any time if they consider that a post has been removed contrary to the forum rules.

No Moderator is obliged to answer anything to do with Moderating.

No one said you were,but out of courtesy to John I'll hi-light his thoughts.

Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on May 28, 2019, 03:32:29 PM
The trouble with a thread such as this can a mod answer objectively rather than take it personally.
I think it might depend on whether the question asked was objective or personal.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 28, 2019, 06:40:26 PM
I can sometimes be here for hours and no one puts a foot wrong, in my opinion.  And then John whooshes the lot.  Off Topic, or something.  I'm not very hot on Off Topic.

I've seen Rob struggling to decide what is and isn't acceptable too. It seems moderators aren't completely sure of the rules they're enforcing.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 28, 2019, 06:43:15 PM
I've seen Rob struggling to decide what is and isn't acceptable too. It seems moderators aren't completely sure of the rules they're enforcing.

Moderators have no power, is the short answer.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 28, 2019, 08:45:23 PM
Moderators have no power, is the short answer.

So moderators get stick from members and get overruled on their decisions? Why on earth would anyone want to do it?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on May 28, 2019, 11:21:29 PM
I would advocate fewer deletions and warnings.  I have had a warning before for being sarcastic.  I mean how ridiculous.  The best forum moderation I ever encountered was the British Democracy Forum which took a libertarian approach and you could say what you liked pretty much.  The only times things got removed was when named people complained that there were libellous comments about them and they were removed.  No one had posts removed for being off topic, there were no warning points at all, we weren’t treated like naughty school children.  That said it was forced to close because I think of a threat of a lawsuit by some political type, probably a UKIPPER or a BNPer, so perhaps it was just too relaxed in the end.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 29, 2019, 12:05:16 AM
So moderators get stick from members and get overruled on their decisions? Why on earth would anyone want to do it?

Someone has to try to prevent this Forum from turning into a cess pit, and John can't do it all by himself.  You have two Supporter Mods, two Sceptic Mods and one Middle of the Road.  And most of you don't want to do it.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 29, 2019, 12:19:47 AM
I would advocate fewer deletions and warnings.  I have had a warning before for being sarcastic.  I mean how ridiculous.  The best forum moderation I ever encountered was the British Democracy Forum which took a libertarian approach and you could say what you liked pretty much.  The only times things got removed was when named people complained that there were libellous comments about them and they were removed.  No one had posts removed for being off topic, there were no warning points at all, we weren’t treated like naughty school children.  That said it was forced to close because I think of a threat of a lawsuit by some political type, probably a UKIPPER or a BNPer, so perhaps it was just too relaxed in the end.

I think you have pretty well described the purpose of Moderation on this Forum.  Off Topic is not enforced to any great extent, and John deals with most of that as sometimes there are some comments worth saving for some other Thread, but only John can move stuff around.

As for Warnings, some members do push their luck to see how far they can go.  The worst being repeatedly reposting Deleted Posts.

In the end it is all a matter of opinion, unless it is outright Libel or downright lies.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on May 29, 2019, 07:51:30 AM
I think you have pretty well described the purpose of Moderation on this Forum.  Off Topic is not enforced to any great extent, and John deals with most of that as sometimes there are some comments worth saving for some other Thread, but only John can move stuff around.

As for Warnings, some members do push their luck to see how far they can go.  The worst being repeatedly reposting Deleted Posts.

In the end it is all a matter of opinion, unless it is outright Libel or downright lies.
In my opinion things have certainly improved on the moderation front since a certain mod decided to take a more backseat role and didn’t deliberately go out of their way to wind me up with warnings for sarcasm and being argumentative, that was IMO an example of a mod using their authority in a provocative way.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 29, 2019, 07:59:49 AM
Someone has to try to prevent this Forum from turning into a cess pit, and John can't do it all by himself.  You have two Supporter Mods, two Sceptic Mods and one Middle of the Road.  And most of you don't want to do it.

Well good for you, tp take on such a thankless task. It seems to me that not only are moderators sometimes overruled from above, they also don't appear to support each other.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: barrier on May 29, 2019, 08:23:27 AM
I think you have pretty well described the purpose of Moderation on this Forum.  Off Topic is not enforced to any great extent, and John deals with most of that as sometimes there are some comments worth saving for some other Thread, but only John can move stuff around.

As for Warnings, some members do push their luck to see how far they can go.  The worst being repeatedly reposting Deleted Posts.

In the end it is all a matter of opinion, unless it is outright Libel or downright lies.

How can you repeatedly repost a deleted post?

Hard to judge downright libel unless one is a qualified lawyer I'd venture,offer an opinion of such more like.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 29, 2019, 08:25:27 AM
In my opinion things have certainly improved on the moderation front since a certain mod decided to take a more backseat role and didn’t deliberately go out of their way to wind me up with warnings for sarcasm and being argumentative, that was IMO an example of a mod using their authority in a provocative way.

The problem with sarcasm and argumentativeness is that it can be seen as abusiveness, which isn't allowed. Perhaps those whose style is to be sarcastic and argumentative need to be aware that they nay be seen as havong crossed that line sometimes.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: barrier on May 29, 2019, 08:26:20 AM
Someone has to try to prevent this Forum from turning into a cess pit, and John can't do it all by himself.  You have two Supporter Mods, two Sceptic Mods and one Middle of the Road.  And most of you don't want to do it.
5 mods,nearly one each.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on May 29, 2019, 08:45:44 AM
The problem with sarcasm and argumentativeness is that it can be seen as abusiveness, which isn't allowed. Perhaps those whose style is to be sarcastic and argumentative need to be aware that they nay be seen as havong crossed that line sometimes.
Which is all very well except when the mod in question only punishes one side of the argument (remember it takes two to argue) and then likes sarky posts by the person with whom you are debating and also makes sarky comments themselves. 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: carlymichelle on May 29, 2019, 08:56:35 AM
i have to admit i dont   post  here as much because even a joking post  can be  deleted   i think some  take   this  forum too seriously       i dont  think a post  should be  deleted because of a diffrent opinion  either
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 29, 2019, 09:29:09 AM
Well good for you, tp take on such a thankless task. It seems to me that not only are moderators sometimes overruled from above, they also don't appear to support each other.

Nor should they.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 29, 2019, 09:32:40 AM
How can you repeatedly repost a deleted post?

Hard to judge downright libel unless one is a qualified lawyer I'd venture,offer an opinion of such more like.

It is quite simple.  A comment is Deleted and then the Member posts it again, and again.

Downright Libel and Lies are easy to spot.  It's the innuendo that sometimes causes difficulties.  But then you know that.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 29, 2019, 09:37:28 AM
i have to admit i dont   post  here as much because even a joking post  can be  deleted   i think some  take   this  forum too seriously       i dont  think a post  should be  deleted because of a diffrent opinion  either

This subject is not a joke.  Good on ya for mostly staying out of it.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 29, 2019, 10:30:40 AM

I have tried to explain how Moderation on this Forum works.  I am a little surprised by the fact that some members see fit to twist what I have said.

Why do I do it?  I honestly believed that I could help to keep a good Forum on track.  I had seen Sherlock as a Moderator bullied off this Forum, and my reaction to that was You and Whose Army.  However, the amount of vitriol levelled at me nearly defeated even me.  But I am made of stern stuff, and no way was I going to be driven out just because I believe in the Rule of Law.  In fact it made me more determined.

As G-Unit rightly pointed out, this is not a Democracy.  I operate under these conditions.  John always has the last word and I don't have a problem with that.  If I did then I would have left.

New people come and go, perhaps because they can't cope with The Rules.  But you are never going to get anything better.

Some of you might actually make good Moderators if you were able to separate yourselves.  I have spotted a couple in the Sceptic Team.  It is a life enhancing exercise, and one that I would not have wanted to miss.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 29, 2019, 11:04:40 AM
Which is all very well except when the mod in question only punishes one side of the argument (remember it takes two to argue) and then likes sarky posts by the person with whom you are debating and also makes sarky comments themselves.

You are now just presenting your opinion of a specific incident which I don't remember. It's perfectly possible, however, for one person to be sarcastic and argumentative and another to respond in a different manner imo.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 29, 2019, 11:19:50 AM
Nor should they.

Any organisation will have problems if it's 'management team' doesn't present a united front in my opinion. All moderators are there for is to ensure that members don't break the rules. If moderators can't agree what the rules actually are and whether they have been breached or not how can they fulfill their purpose?

Also, how can members avoid breaking the rules if even the moderators are unsure what that means? Members are occasionally asked to keep to the rules, but the rules seem to be a matter of opinion rather than fact.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on May 29, 2019, 11:26:42 AM
Any organisation will have problems if it's 'management team' doesn't present a united front in my opinion. All moderators are there for is to ensure that members don't break the rules. If moderators can't agree what the rules actually are and whether they have been breached or not how can they fulfill their purpose?

Also, how can members avoid breaking the rules if even the moderators are unsure what that means? Members are occasionally asked to keep to the rules, but the rules seem to be a matter of opinion rather than fact.
At the end of the day does it really matter?  If you don't like the way the forum operates there is no obligation for you to continue posting is there?  Perhaps a wholly sceptic forum moderated by sceptics would be better suited to your agenda? 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 29, 2019, 11:35:49 AM
Any organisation will have problems if it's 'management team' doesn't present a united front in my opinion. All moderators are there for is to ensure that members don't break the rules. If moderators can't agree what the rules actually are and whether they have been breached or not how can they fulfill their purpose?

Also, how can members avoid breaking the rules if even the moderators are unsure what that means? Members are occasionally asked to keep to the rules, but the rules seem to be a matter of opinion rather than fact.

So you think that Supporter Mods should support each other even if they disagree?  We aren't all brain welded you know.

The Rules are laid down.  I suggest you read them.  But don't think I don't know when Members try to circumvent them.  Brietta's interpretation of that is her own affair.

And we all know what happens when two Moderators gang up together.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: barrier on May 29, 2019, 11:40:26 AM
So you think that Supporter Mods should support each other even if they disagree?  We aren't all brain welded you know.

The Rules are laid down.  I suggest you read them.  But don't think I don't know when Members try to circumvent them.  Brietta's interpretation of that is her own affair.

And we all know what happens when two Moderators gang up together.

Glad you acknowledge it.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: barrier on May 29, 2019, 11:42:42 AM
At the end of the day does it really matter?  If you don't like the way the forum operates there is no obligation for you to continue posting is there?  Perhaps a wholly sceptic forum moderated by sceptics would be better suited to your agenda?

Stop the myths? is the route you require?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 29, 2019, 11:43:40 AM
Glad you acknowledge it.

Two Sceptic Mods.  Brietta and I don't even communicate by PM.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 29, 2019, 12:45:28 PM
At the end of the day does it really matter?  If you don't like the way the forum operates there is no obligation for you to continue posting is there?  Perhaps a wholly sceptic forum moderated by sceptics would be better suited to your agenda?

It seems to matter to you judging by your complaints when things don't go your way. Perhaps a supporter forum might suit you better?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 29, 2019, 12:53:19 PM
So you think that Supporter Mods should support each other even if they disagree?  We aren't all brain welded you know.

The Rules are laid down.  I suggest you read them.  But don't think I don't know when Members try to circumvent them.  Brietta's interpretation of that is her own affair.

And we all know what happens when two Moderators gang up together.

So the rules are open to interpretation by everyone; members and moderators alike?  If a member posts something they think is OK a moderator can come along and delete it. Then John can come along and reinstate it.That sounds to me like the rules aren't clear enough. 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on May 29, 2019, 12:55:10 PM
Stop the myths? is the route you require?
Is that a sceptic forum now?  I had no idea.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on May 29, 2019, 12:55:38 PM
It seems to matter to you judging by your complaints when things don't go your way. Perhaps a supporter forum might suit you better?
You're the one doing the complaining here, not me.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 29, 2019, 12:58:22 PM
Two Sceptic Mods.  Brietta and I don't even communicate by PM.

When you say 'gang up' can I interpret that as 'agree with each other on the interpretation of a rule?'
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 29, 2019, 02:26:34 PM
When you say 'gang up' can I interpret that as 'agree with each other on the interpretation of a rule?'

No.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on May 29, 2019, 04:58:44 PM
This thread was set up to address moderation queries ... I've not really seen too many quoting present concerns members may have ... wonder why that is.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 29, 2019, 05:04:04 PM
This thread was set up to address moderation queries ... I've not really seen too many quoting present concerns members may have ... wonder why that is.

Some people would rather blame you and me for things over which we have no control.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on May 29, 2019, 05:16:21 PM
Some people would rather blame you and me for things over which we have no control.

I think we both give of our best for the simple reason we back up to the hilt the ethos of this forum and have a great admiration for what John has achieved here.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 29, 2019, 05:20:16 PM
I think we both give of our best for the simple reason we back up to the hilt the ethos of this forum and have a great admiration for what John has achieved here.

Absolutely.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 29, 2019, 05:32:27 PM
You're the one doing the complaining here, not me.

Not vomplaining, discussing. One of my reasons for doing so is the disruption caused to discussions when threads are deflected by arguments between members and mods. By definition those arguments are off-topic and so against the rules.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on May 29, 2019, 08:18:13 PM
Not vomplaining, discussing. One of my reasons for doing so is the disruption caused to discussions when threads are deflected by arguments between members and mods. By definition those arguments are off-topic and so against the rules.
LOL at vomplaining, great new word.   @)(++(*
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 30, 2019, 07:00:00 AM
This thread was set up to address moderation queries ... I've not really seen too many quoting present concerns members may have ... wonder why that is.

I rarely have problems with moderation, but I do have a problem with members complaining about it on threads set up to debate other subjects. I thought people might like to air their grievences here, which is the place for it imo.  It seems people prefer to carry on disrupting threads imtermittently.

In my opinion any complaints about moderators should be posted on a thread such as this, not on threads discussing other subjects. Those are off topiic posts and moderators should delete them on sight imo.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 30, 2019, 07:02:23 AM
LOL at vomplaining, great new word.   @)(++(*

I'm glad my mistakes (caused by my cataract) are keeping you amused.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on May 30, 2019, 07:23:47 AM
I'm glad my mistakes (caused by my cataract) are keeping you amused.
I’m glad you’re glad.  It was a terrific new word and I thank you for it.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 30, 2019, 10:06:24 AM
I’m glad you’re glad.  It was a terrific new word and I thank you for it.

No need for thanks, I had no intention of creating a new word. Noticing, drawing attention to and laughing at other's mistakes is an unattractive trait in my opinion, but you obviously think it's acceptable.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Miss Taken Identity on May 30, 2019, 11:51:23 AM
No need for thanks, I had no intention of creating a new word. Noticing, drawing attention to and laughing at other's mistakes is an unattractive trait in my opinion, but you obviously think it's acceptable.

I have been a mod on two forums, I have to say only one had a McCann thread. That was very different as its visitors  were mature, and presented a good agrgument. Hypothosis and opinions were acceptable but out right accusations were not. I only ever deleted two types of posts. 1 being nasty to other posters, making personal jibes and on the McCann thread for out right libel= direct accusation of killing.hurting their child. they could opine and have a theory- unpleasant as it was to read in some occasion but none the less interesting.

I do get it,how difficult it is to be a mod- to be fair, however I had respect as I never gave in to bullies. on either side of the argument.

This is a debating forum- Some cannot grasp how to conduct themselves in a debate on this McCann thread- when someone mentions an annomoly about parents story it is met with snipes (even encouraged by certain mods)  about the poster and no real effort to argue why the annomoly could be wrong- apart from it is every one elses fault.

I have also observed much to my personal annoyance the book burning attitude to some theads and posters. Sensorship is never a good thing- it is a fascist trait and should never be allowed to enter a free speech.

This type of post from VS is a cancer runing through the forum on some threads. I would delete this insulting,childish,bulllying behaviour on site, whether he is supporter or sceptic!
 
LOL at vomplaining, great new word.   @)(++(*


It would be an improvement if mods didn't add their little 'comments' about posters THAT is not their job.

some things to improve this forum:
1. stop the sensorship
2. remove personal jibes and snipes
3. impose the 'cites' request for all ,or remove that from the 'rules'

I am not going to dismiss the role of the mods- it is important and I appprecaite it- I have said this to John on  many occasions. It is the quality and having mods with integrity that is required. Something for one or two to work on with help from John  perhaps.


Just as an aside  do mods take on the role of admin OR is there am actual admin person who isn't also a mod?

Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on May 30, 2019, 07:25:14 PM
No need for thanks, I had no intention of creating a new word. Noticing, drawing attention to and laughing at other's mistakes is an unattractive trait in my opinion, but you obviously think it's acceptable.
Blimey, sense of humour failure on an epic scale.   I do think it is wholly acceptable to laugh at a funny mistake, and you’re welcome to laugh at any of mine, I promise not to vomplain.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on May 30, 2019, 07:28:29 PM
I have been a mod on two forums, I have to say only one had a McCann thread. That was very different as its visitors  were mature, and presented a good agrgument. Hypothosis and opinions were acceptable but out right accusations were not. I only ever deleted two types of posts. 1 being nasty to other posters, making personal jibes and on the McCann thread for out right libel= direct accusation of killing.hurting their child. they could opine and have a theory- unpleasant as it was to read in some occasion but none the less interesting.

I do get it,how difficult it is to be a mod- to be fair, however I had respect as I never gave in to bullies. on either side of the argument.

This is a debating forum- Some cannot grasp how to conduct themselves in a debate on this McCann thread- when someone mentions an annomoly about parents story it is met with snipes (even encouraged by certain mods)  about the poster and no real effort to argue why the annomoly could be wrong- apart from it is every one elses fault.

I have also observed much to my personal annoyance the book burning attitude to some theads and posters. Sensorship is never a good thing- it is a fascist trait and should never be allowed to enter a free speech.

This type of post from VS is a cancer runing through the forum on some threads. I would delete this insulting,childish,bulllying behaviour on site, whether he is supporter or sceptic!
 
LOL at vomplaining, great new word.   @)(++(*


It would be an improvement if mods didn't add their little 'comments' about posters THAT is not their job.

some things to improve this forum:
1. stop the sensorship
2. remove personal jibes and snipes
3. impose the 'cites' request for all ,or remove that from the 'rules'

I am not going to dismiss the role of the mods- it is important and I appprecaite it- I have said this to John on  many occasions. It is the quality and having mods with integrity that is required. Something for one or two to work on with help from John  perhaps.


Just as an aside  do mods take on the role of admin OR is there am actual admin person who isn't also a mod?
Oh dear oh dear oh dear.  What ridiculous sanctimonious humourless  hyperbole is this?  So, now I’m like a cancer for laughing at “vomplaining”?  @)(++(*. And all this from a poster who herself delights in making rude, sneery sarky facetious posts herself!
Some of your many spelling mistakes in the above post raised a little chortle too you’ll be thorughly outraged and indignant to know.  Sorry.  My bad.  Naughty cancer, me. 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 08:50:56 AM
Oh dear oh dear oh dear.  What ridiculous sanctimonious humourless  hyperbole is this?  So, now I’m like a cancer for laughing at “vomplaining”?  @)(++(*. And all this from a poster who herself delights in making rude, sneery sarky facetious posts herself!
Some of your many spelling mistakes in the above post raised a little chortle too you’ll be thorughly outraged and indignant to know.  Sorry.  My bad.  Naughty cancer, me.

Was it really so amusing? I suspect there was another motive for highlighting my typing error.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on May 31, 2019, 09:34:45 AM

Just ruminating or even chewing the cud ... is it fair to have a thread questioning moderation without the balance of one for questioning members?

Anyway ... this one appears to be a great success ... NOT !!!

How many valid on topic questions of anything at all referring to moderation or by definition moderators have actually been posted?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 10:10:34 AM
Just ruminating or even chewing the cud ... is it fair to have a thread questioning moderation without the balance of one for questioning members?

Anyway ... this one appears to be a great success ... NOT !!!

How many valid on topic questions of anything at all referring to moderation or by definition moderators have actually been posted?

That wouldn't be allowed while Moderators are fair game.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 11:04:46 AM
Just ruminating or even chewing the cud ... is it fair to have a thread questioning moderation without the balance of one for questioning members?

Anyway ... this one appears to be a great success ... NOT !!!

How many valid on topic questions of anything at all referring to moderation or by definition moderators have actually been posted?

You sound like you've taken to living in a field and eating grass, Brietta.  8(0(*

You mention fairness, but surely you realise that the relationship between members and moderators isn't one of equality?  Moderators have powers which give them an advantage over members.

I think some valid points have been raised, even if they haven't been answered.

1. Deletions
2. Restoring deleted posts.
3. Moderator Bias
4. Cites
5. Rules
6. Too much moderation?
7. Public/off topic arguments

I think that's pretty good for a thread covering just 5 pages.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 11:10:20 AM

It sounds to me as though you all would rather not have any moderators at all.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 11:17:11 AM
That wouldn't be allowed while Moderators are fair game.

Moderators have volunteered to ensure that all members keep to the rules of the Forum. If you poke your head above the parapet you should expect to be shot at in my opinion. As long as you are confident that your moderating is fair, unbiased and in accordance with forum rules there's no need to feel like anyone is attacking you personally. 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on May 31, 2019, 11:18:49 AM
You sound like you've taken to living in a field and eating grass, Brietta.  8(0(*

You mention fairness, but surely you realise that the relationship between members and moderators isn't one of equality?  Moderators have powers which give them an advantage over members.

I think some valid points have been raised, even if they haven't been answered.

1. Deletions
2. Restoring deleted posts.
3. Moderator Bias
4. Cites
5. Rules
6. Too much moderation?
7. Public/off topic arguments

I think that's pretty good for a thread covering just 5 pages.

1. Deletions. … Which of your posts have been deleted unfairly?
2. Restoring deleted posts. … Which of your posts have been restored?
3. Moderator Bias. … Please give examples or an example of moderator bias.
4. Cites … What is your problem?
5. Rules … Haven’t you read them?
6. Too much moderation? … Please give examples or an example illustrating your concerns
7. Public/off topic arguments … Please give examples or an example illustrating your concerns.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on May 31, 2019, 11:25:33 AM
It sounds to me as though you all would rather not have any moderators at all.

I don't know if I would quite go as far as that Eleanor.  I don't think there would be any objection to a board balanced to suit any particular complainant's bias ... but I think gunit would shed no tears for me and thee did we decide to quit and apply to Jill Havern's with our CV's for a home.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 11:27:04 AM
It sounds to me as though you all would rather not have any moderators at all.

One member seems to want a free for all, but I'm sure most accept that moderation is necessary. Preferably of the highest quality with clear unbiased enforcement of the rules.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 11:29:00 AM
Moderators have volunteered to ensure that all members keep to the rules of the Forum. If you poke your head above the parapet you should expect to be shot at in my opinion. As long as you are confident that your moderating is fair, unbiased and in accordance with forum rules there's no need to feel like anyone is attacking you personally.

You should give it a go.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 11:32:44 AM
I don't know if I would quite go as far as that Eleanor.  I don't think there would be any objection to a board balanced to suit any particular complainant's bias ... but I think gunit would shed no tears for me and thee did we decide to quit and apply to Jill Havern's with our CV's for a home.

Going Free.  One battered Moderator.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 11:39:03 AM
I don't know if I would quite go as far as that Eleanor.  I don't think there would be any objection to a board balanced to suit any particular complainant's bias ... but I think gunit would shed no tears for me and thee did we decide to quit and apply to Jill Havern's with our CV's for a home.

I wonder why you think I'm targetting you and Eleanor in particular?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on May 31, 2019, 11:40:44 AM
Going Free.  One battered Moderator.

I've seen how moderation on that forum handles dissidents ... oooooh the POWER ... no arbitration there.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: barrier on May 31, 2019, 11:41:44 AM
I don't know if I would quite go as far as that Eleanor.  I don't think there would be any objection to a board balanced to suit any particular complainant's bias ... but I think gunit would shed no tears for me and thee did we decide to quit and apply to Jill Havern's with our CV's for a home.

People come and go for a variety of reasons,I don't think there's much shedding of tears from some quarters when they do,Stephen springs to mind for one.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 11:42:47 AM
I've seen how moderation on that forum handles dissidents ... oooooh the POWER ... no arbitration there.

I am almost overcome with longing.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on May 31, 2019, 11:43:05 AM
I wonder why you think I'm targetting you and Eleanor in particular?

Why on earth would I be thinking that  *%87

Anyway ... back to topic ... did you catch sight of my response to your queries?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on May 31, 2019, 11:45:01 AM
I am almost overcome with longing.

Do you think we could wing it?  They'd never notice.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 11:47:14 AM
Do you think we could wing it?  They'd never notice.

Change the user name.  Change the email address and only go for Supporters.  Yep, dead easy.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on May 31, 2019, 11:52:25 AM
People come and go for a variety of reasons,I don't think there's much shedding of tears from some quarters when they do,Stephen springs to mind for one.

Stephen was part of the exodus seeking a more suitable home.  There was no-one on either side of the divide who did not feel his pain and sympathised greatly when he lost his dear wife.  I think of him often and hope for his well being.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on May 31, 2019, 11:54:26 AM
Change the user name.  Change the email address and only go for Supporters.  Yep, dead easy.

I reckon I could do that.  Would soon work my way through the ranks.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 12:12:11 PM

Could someone give me some tips on how to change my email address?  I don't know how to do that.

User Name.  How's about, I Love Gonc?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on May 31, 2019, 12:31:53 PM
Could someone give me some tips on how to change my email address?  I don't know how to do that.

User Name.  How's about, I Love Gonc?

That should do it ... but you would need to drop Mona Lisa she's a giveaway ... but there are loads of appropriate avatars to choose from.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 12:38:45 PM
That should do it ... but you would need to drop Mona Lisa she's a giveaway ... but there are loads of appropriate avatars to choose from.

What about The Terminator?  That should tell em I mean business.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 01:00:27 PM
1. Deletions. … Which of your posts have been deleted unfairly?
2. Restoring deleted posts. … Which of your posts have been restored?
3. Moderator Bias. … Please give examples or an example of moderator bias.
4. Cites … What is your problem?
5. Rules … Haven’t you read them?
6. Too much moderation? … Please give examples or an example illustrating your concerns
7. Public/off topic arguments … Please give examples or an example illustrating your concerns.

Why are you challenging me personally? If you read the Madeleine McCann board and this thread you will see that I have listed subjects which have been repeatedly raised by all members, not just me.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on May 31, 2019, 01:10:43 PM
Was it really so amusing? I suspect there was another motive for highlighting my typing error.
Listen, you’ve made dozens of typing errors in the last few months, none of them particularly amusing.  This one amused me, that is all.  Please try not to take it so seriously, if you can’t laugh at your own mistakes once in a while then I think that’s a bit sad.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on May 31, 2019, 01:11:59 PM
It sounds to me as though you all would rather not have any moderators at all.
That would suit me, no offence like, but I’d certainly favour a far less “hands on” approach.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on May 31, 2019, 01:13:38 PM
Could someone give me some tips on how to change my email address?  I don't know how to do that.

User Name.  How's about, I Love Gonc?
The person or the cadaver dog?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on May 31, 2019, 01:16:36 PM
Why are you challenging me personally? If you read the Madeleine McCann board and this thread you will see that I have listed subjects which have been repeatedly raised by all members, not just me.

OK ... so your opinion based on observation only.
You do not have any concerns or questions regarding moderation. 
Perhaps those who do would be kind enough to hit their keyboards to inform us first hand rather than relying on hearsay of the problems they are experiencing.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 01:17:37 PM
Why are you challenging me personally? If you read the Madeleine McCann board and this thread you will see that I have listed subjects which have been repeatedly raised by all members, not just me.

Would you like The Rules to be changed?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 01:18:55 PM
The person or the cadaver dog?

The Dog, obviously.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 01:19:19 PM
You should give it a go.

Although I'm not here to win any popularity contest I know full well that I would be universally unpopular if I was a moderator. I believe rules should be adhered to and I would enforce them much more strictly than they are currently enforced.

I wouldn't allow any;

Personal comments
Lack of respect
Speculation
Lack of cites
Protracted arguments
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 01:20:31 PM
Although I'm not here to win any popularity contest I know full well that I would be universally unpopular if I was a moderator. I believe rules should be adhered to and I would enforce them much more strictly than they are currently enforced.

I wouldn't allow any;

Personal comments
Lack of respect
Speculation
Lack of cites
Protracted arguments

You would most certainly be better at this than I am.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on May 31, 2019, 01:25:07 PM
I think I should be a Mod, I know it would cause plenty of vomplaining.   @)(++(*
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 01:27:56 PM
OK ... so your opinion based on observation only.
You do not have any concerns or questions regarding moderation. 
Perhaps those who do would be kind enough to hit their keyboards to inform us first hand rather than relying on hearsay of the problems they are experiencing.

I do have one; protracted off topic arguments, especually those between members and a moderator(s) about moderation should be stopped.

As I said, the concerns I highlighted are all to be found if anyone wants to see them.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 01:29:27 PM
I do have one; protracted off topic arguments, especually those between members and a moderator(s) about moderation should be stopped.

As I said, the concerns I highlighted are all to be found if anyone wants to see them.

You do know that John's in charge, I hope.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on May 31, 2019, 01:34:12 PM
Would it be possible to make a league table of members who have reported  the most posts? 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 01:34:39 PM
You would most certainly be better at this than I am.

I don't quite know how to respond to that.  8)-)))
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 01:38:34 PM
You do know that John's in charge, I hope.

I do indeed. Does he take the view that off topic arguments about moderation should be allowed to disrupt threads?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 01:40:14 PM
Would it be possible to make a league table of members who have reported  the most posts?

There isn't one.  Most members go straight to John, so the Moderators don't know what is going on most of the time.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 01:41:47 PM
I don't quite know how to respond to that.  8)-)))

You should try it, and then you would know.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 01:44:10 PM
I do indeed. Does he take the view that off topic arguments about moderation should be allowed to disrupt threads?

I don't know.  You will have to ask him.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: barrier on May 31, 2019, 02:32:17 PM
I think I should be a Mod, I know it would cause plenty of vomplaining.   @)(++(*

I suspect this post and a like by a mod is attempt at a wind up,G is better than to warrant it.
davel says he has a form of dyslexia and its respected,not the same compassion for a sceptic it can be said.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 02:38:38 PM
I suspect this post and a like by a mod is attempt at a wind up,G is better than to warrant it.
davel says he has a form of dyslexia and its respected,not the same compassion for a sceptic it can be said.

I Liked the thought of VS being a Mod.

Everyone, apart from me, makes mistakes.  And sometimes they are funny.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 02:56:20 PM
I don't know.  You will have to ask him.

Well as I understand it moderators are allowed to deal with off topic posts. Therefore it's in your power to do so in my opinion. I don't understand why you think it's up to John?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 02:57:36 PM
You should try it, and then you would know.

Know what?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 03:25:06 PM
I Liked the thought of VS being a Mod.

Everyone, apart from me, makes mistakes.  And sometimes they are funny.

I probably am too serious, but the idea of VS as a moderator doesn't sit well with your declared intent of preventing a cesspit in my opinion.

I think you made a mistake a while back, Eleanor.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on May 31, 2019, 03:26:41 PM
Know what?

Know what we know.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 03:49:51 PM
Well as I understand it moderators are allowed to deal with off topic posts. Therefore it's in your power to do so in my opinion. I don't understand why you think it's up to John?

Ah well you see, often there is interesting stuff that John might like to move to the correct Topic.  But only he can do that.
Nothing is ever as simple as it might seem.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 03:51:38 PM
I probably am too serious, but the idea of VS as a moderator doesn't sit well with your declared intent of preventing a cesspit in my opinion.

I think you made a mistake a while back, Eleanor.

Really?  Oh My.

I Liked the thought of VS being a Moderator because I thought it was funny.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 04:12:25 PM
Know what we know.

Why would that interest me?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on May 31, 2019, 04:15:47 PM
Why would that interest me?

Wasn't that you asking the question?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 04:16:32 PM
Ah well you see, often there is interesting stuff that John might like to move to the correct Topic.  But only he can do that.
Nothing is ever as simple as it might seem.

I find nothing of interest in members and moderators arguing about Forum Rules and I haven't seen any pf those arguments being moved, just deleted eventually.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 04:21:53 PM
Wasn't that you asking the question?

Well if the answer was 'know what we know' I expect I can manage without thanks.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on May 31, 2019, 04:47:52 PM
Well if the answer was 'know what we know' I expect I can manage without thanks.

So you aren't interested in how complicated it can be.  I might as well have saved my time.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on May 31, 2019, 06:31:09 PM
I suspect this post and a like by a mod is attempt at a wind up,G is better than to warrant it.
davel says he has a form of dyslexia and its respected,not the same compassion for a sceptic it can be said.
Davel’s typos are always being complained about!!  I have utmost compassion for anyone suffering from poor vision and cataracts, they run in my family so I know all about it, that doesn’t mean if a family member makes a funny typo that I have to be all respectful and po-faced about it.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Erngath on May 31, 2019, 09:37:11 PM
Davel’s typos are always being complained about!!  I have utmost compassion for anyone suffering from poor vision and cataracts, they run in my family so I know all about it, that doesn’t mean if a family member makes a funny typo that I have to be all respectful and po-faced about it.

One of my friend's husband has dementia.
She tells me that they share laughs about some of the incidents of forgetfulness.
It's how they cope.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 09:43:57 PM
So you aren't interested in how complicated it can be.  I might as well have saved my time.

I'm not interested in cryptic comments, but I'm just as interested in how the moderators feel as I am in how ordinary members feel. My aim was to explore why there's such conflict between moderators and members sometimes and to see if a solution could be found. Understanding the problens moderators face is an important part of that process. Thanks to some of the things you've said I understand better than I did, even if no-one else does. Thank you Eleanor.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 10:00:43 PM
One of my friend's husband has dementia.
She tells me that they share laughs about some of the incidents of forgetfulness.
It's how they cope.

Shared laughter is important. I told my children how I used the torch on my phone one night to look for something instead of putting the light on. What was I looking for? My phone!

Poking fun at relative strangers is another matter entirely in my opinion. I'm not upset by it because strangers I interact with online don't have the power to upset me. I simply speak my mind and let others judge. .
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on May 31, 2019, 11:14:00 PM
Shared laughter is important. I told my children how I used the torch on my phone one night to look for something instead of putting the light on. What was I looking for? My phone!

Poking fun at relative strangers is another matter entirely in my opinion. I'm not upset by it because strangers I interact with online don't have the power to upset me. I simply speak my mind and let others judge. .
I’m very glad to hear you’re not remotely upset and I’d like to remind you that I wasn’t poking fun at you, simply amused by the descriptive new word you had inadvertently invented. 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 11:29:43 PM
I’m very glad to hear you’re not remotely upset and I’d like to remind you that I wasn’t poking fun at you, simply amused by the descriptive new word you had inadvertently invented.

Of course you weren't.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on May 31, 2019, 11:34:17 PM
Of course you weren't.
Are you calling me a liar?  For someone who claims not to be upset you seem to want to make something of it.  As I have already pointed out, you have made dozens and dozens of typing errors, this was the ONLY one I have commented on and the ONLY reason for doing so was because ai liked the word.  Now, you may choose to believe I am out to ridicule you if you want or you can accept it was a harmless bit of fun that you havr chosen to blow out of all proportion, perhaps to try and make a show of me.  Time to be mature and move on. 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on May 31, 2019, 11:55:53 PM
Are you calling me a liar?  For someone who claims not to be upset you seem to want to make something of it.  As I have already pointed out, you have made dozens and dozens of typing errors, this was the ONLY one I have commented on and the ONLY reason for doing so was because ai liked the word.  Now, you may choose to believe I am out to ridicule you if you want or you can accept it was a harmless bit of fun that you havr chosen to blow out of all proportion, perhaps to try and make a show of me.  Time to be mature and move on.

Every post I've made on this subject has been a reply to you or others.. I wouldn't have referred to it again if you and others hadn't carried on posting about it. I can assure you that if you shut up so will I.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 01, 2019, 07:26:52 AM
Every post I've made on this subject has been a reply to you or others.. I wouldn't have referred to it again if you and others hadn't carried on posting about it. I can assure you that if you shut up so will I.
Incorrect.  You raised the issue of me laughing at your typo first when you wrote

“I'm glad my mistakes (caused by my cataract) are keeping you amused”

It now transpires that you weren’t glad at all but rather attempting to take some moral high ground on account of your condition to try and put me in my place.  It is you who has made something out of nothing but it seems you are also determined to have the last word on the subject.  As I said, time to accept my explanation or keep on and on about it forever.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 01, 2019, 10:00:31 AM
Incorrect.  You raised the issue of me laughing at your typo first when you wrote

“I'm glad my mistakes (caused by my cataract) are keeping you amused”

It now transpires that you weren’t glad at all but rather attempting to take some moral high ground on account of your condition to try and put me in my place.  It is you who has made something out of nothing but it seems you are also determined to have the last word on the subject.  As I said, time to accept my explanation or keep on and on about it forever.

I have only ever replied. If you don't like my replies that's tough. I don't care why you did it to be honest, and I don't want to keep on discussing it; you do. 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on June 01, 2019, 10:18:01 AM
I have only ever replied. If you don't like my replies that's tough. I don't care why you did it to be honest, and I don't want to keep on discussing it; you do.

Is the current Off Topic argument in which you are presently indulging an example of something that you would wish moderators to take censoring action against as per your former posts suggesting how we could improve moderation?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 01, 2019, 11:31:00 AM
Is the current Off Topic argument in which you are presently indulging an example of something that you would wish moderators to take censoring action against as per your former posts suggesting how we could improve moderation?

As I have pointed out several times I have instigated none of it. Why have you chosen to address your post to me instead of to the one who is driving the exchanges?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on June 01, 2019, 11:57:31 AM
As I have pointed out several times I have instigated none of it. Why have you chosen to address your post to me instead of to the one who is driving the exchanges?

                          Takes two to tango 🤪
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Angelo222 on June 01, 2019, 12:21:26 PM
The above is a good example of how things deteriorate to the point that the mods have to start deleting and then members start to ask why their posts were deleted.

The majority of mods here post opinion too and that can often cause conflict if said mod has to moderate those posts. It's a no win situation really but I feel my fellow mods handle it well in those difficult circumstances.

I notice davel is taking some time out, is he off on his hols?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 01, 2019, 01:21:07 PM
The above is a good example of how things deteriorate to the point that the mods have to start deleting and then members start to ask why their posts were deleted.

The majority of mods here post opinion too and that can often cause conflict if said mod has to moderate those posts. It's a no win situation really but I feel my fellow mods handle it well in those difficult circumstances.

I notice davel is taking some time out, is he off on his hols?

As you have chosen to give your opinion perhaps you could elucidate further? I didn't post an off topic post, but I answered one because it was aimed at me. Futher off topic posts were directed at me, which I also answered. In my opinion a moderator chose to intercede by castigating me for taking part. Why me and not the one driving the discussion? Why was I targetted?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 01, 2019, 01:30:31 PM
                          Takes two to tango 🤪

Then address your posts to both dancers.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: APRIL on June 01, 2019, 02:21:39 PM
Of course you weren't.


May I just say, as a complete newbie to this thread who knows nothing of possible machinations, agendas and internal politics, that I thought "your" word, vomplain, was both deliberate and brilliant. It's totally self explanatory. When we complain, we spew or vomit the words. I can't be the only one here who had that thought.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 01, 2019, 02:54:56 PM

May I just say, as a complete newbie to this thread who knows nothing of possible machinations, agendas and internal politics, that I thought "your" word, vomplain, was both deliberate and brilliant. It's totally self explanatory. When we complain, we spew or vomit the words. I can't be the only one here who had that thought.

As you say, you have no knowledge of the background. All I know is that if a poster feels personally attacked by my posts I tend to apologise for any offence I have inadvetently caused and then explain. That usually satisfies the other party.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on June 01, 2019, 03:00:27 PM

I think that you are all very unkind to Moderators.

I am off to Blog about a really nice afternoon.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 01, 2019, 04:30:13 PM
I think that you are all very unkind to Moderators.

I am off to Blog about a really nice afternoon.

I think moderators are sometimes unkind too. Enjoy your blogging, I may take a nap.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on June 01, 2019, 04:39:13 PM
I think moderators are sometimes unkind too. Enjoy your blogging, I may take a nap.

Thanks for that accolade.  Despite a not very good education there is absolutely nothing wrong with my command of The English Language, in my opinion.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 01, 2019, 05:11:08 PM
Thanks for that accolade.  Despite a not very good education there is absolutely nothing wrong with my command of The English Language, in my opinion.

Your command of English is perfectly fine in my opinion for what that's worth.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on June 01, 2019, 05:20:49 PM
Your command of English is perfectly fine in my opinion for what that's worth.

Gee, tanks.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 01, 2019, 05:45:20 PM
As I have pointed out several times I have instigated none of it. Why have you chosen to address your post to me instead of to the one who is driving the exchanges?
You have made something out of a nothing throw away remark by me.  You are the one with the problem not me.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 01, 2019, 05:53:14 PM
You have made something out of a nothing throw away remark by me.  You are the one with the problem not me.

You are off topic and I'm not in the mood to tango.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 01, 2019, 05:57:10 PM
You are off topic and I'm not in the mood to tango.
I’m in the mood for dancing, romancing, I’m giving it all tonight...  (&^&
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 01, 2019, 06:36:56 PM

May I just say, as a complete newbie to this thread who knows nothing of possible machinations, agendas and internal politics, that I thought "your" word, vomplain, was both deliberate and brilliant. It's totally self explanatory. When we complain, we spew or vomit the words. I can't be the only one here who had that thought.
Thank you April, my thoughts exactly. 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 02, 2019, 07:23:39 AM
I have a Mod query.  If you are asked to provide a cite, then provide a cite and are told scornfully that the cite you have provided is inadequate  but without the complainant making any attempt to provide any reasons why the cite is inadequate is that acceptable?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on June 02, 2019, 09:05:35 AM
I have a Mod query.  If you are asked to provide a cite, then provide a cite and are told scornfully that the cite you have provided is inadequate  but without the complainant making any attempt to provide any reasons why the cite is inadequate is that acceptable?

In my opinion cites are caveat emptor; if there is a strong reason for objecting to one ... that should either be given or reported.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: ShiningInLuz on June 03, 2019, 06:46:31 AM
In my opinion cites are caveat emptor; if there is a strong reason for objecting to one ... that should either be given or reported.

There are two recent issues with that.

1) An instance in which a member did a copy and paste from my blog, then requested a cite from me.  Cites don't work like that.

2) An instance in which a member provided a link and claimed it as a cite.  Since the link in question did not pertain to the debate, there was no point in getting bogged down in its veracity.

Cites are not weapons of debate.  They are either pertinent or they are not.  There is no forum rule that non-pertinent cites have to be accepted or debated.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on June 03, 2019, 08:40:36 AM
There are two recent issues with that.

1) An instance in which a member did a copy and paste from my blog, then requested a cite from me.  Cites don't work like that.

2) An instance in which a member provided a link and claimed it as a cite.  Since the link in question did not pertain to the debate, there was no point in getting bogged down in its veracity.

Cites are not weapons of debate.  They are either pertinent or they are not.  There is no forum rule that non-pertinent cites have to be accepted or debated.

Why is there the necessity of having to ask for cites.  If one is quoting from a particular source why not just include that in the post as a matter of course to enable members to check it out?  In my opinion that would be the courteous thing to do in the first instance.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 03, 2019, 02:12:33 PM
Why is there the necessity of having to ask for cites.  If one is quoting from a particular source why not just include that in the post as a matter of course to enable members to check it out?  In my opinion that would be the courteous thing to do in the first instance.

When I joined MoJ cites weren't required. Lots of members were posting their own opinions as if they were facts. There was also a lot of paraphrasing going on. The onus was on the reader of the post to decide whether 'fact's' were fact or opinion and whether quotes were correct or paraphrased, which sometimes made them suggest something incorrect.

Although the rules now say that opinions must be identified  as such and cites must be provided for facts that doesn't always happen. Hence the need to ask.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Brietta on June 03, 2019, 03:09:49 PM
When I joined MoJ cites weren't required. Lots of members were posting their own opinions as if they were facts. There was also a lot of paraphrasing going on. The onus was on the reader of the post to decide whether 'fact's' were fact or opinion and whether quotes were correct or paraphrased, which sometimes made them suggest something incorrect.

Although the rules now say that opinions must be identified  as such and cites must be provided for facts that doesn't always happen. Hence the need to ask.
I don't know when you joined the forum but when I joined in late 2013 it was very common for cites to be requested.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on June 03, 2019, 03:31:50 PM
I don't know when you joined the forum but when I joined in late 2013 it was very common for cites to be requested.

And a lot of them were rubbish.  Still are sometimes.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 11, 2019, 10:17:19 AM
Yet again the rules have been blatantly ignored and action has had to be taken. How many chances should people be given, I wonder?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Erngath on June 11, 2019, 05:01:30 PM
Yet again the rules have been blatantly ignored and action has had to be taken. How many chances should people be given, I wonder?

I suppose some score should be kept .
Perhaps differing penalty points depending on the gravity of the breaking of rules?
Ten points for insulting a fellow poster?
Twenty for insulting a moderator?
Twenty for posting libel?

In school each child was awarded points for good behaviour.
Perhaps that should be considered?

This could be fun!
On a Friday the golden time was a reward for good behaviour.
Some children had their whole half hour of Golden time, some less, some even less and some none at all!

Back to your original question.
Do you have any suggestion of "how many chances people should be given" ?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on June 11, 2019, 05:17:08 PM

Posters may please themselves.  And Moderators do not have the last word.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 11, 2019, 05:52:29 PM
IMO, Davel is deliberately provoked to breaking point by members and mods who seem intent on getting a rise out of him and then using as an excuse to silence him.  I used to be similarly provoked and would rise to the bait.  I probably still would if the mod who used to pursue me relentlessly and give me warning for absolutely nothing hadn’t decided to take a bit of a backseat.  I completely understand Davel’s frustrations.   The answer of course is to rise above the bait but it can be difficult sometimes. 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Erngath on June 11, 2019, 06:00:14 PM
IMO, Davel is deliberately provoked to breaking point by members and mods who seem intent on getting a rise out of him and then using as an excuse to silence him.  I used to be similarly provoked and would rise to the bait.  I probably still would if the mod who used to pursue me relentlessly and give me warning for absolutely nothing hadn’t decided to take a bit of a backseat.  I completely understand Davel’s frustrations.   The answer of course is to rise above the bait but it can be difficult sometimes.

Observing the entirety of the posts.
Deliberately provoked  is most definitely the correct description.

Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on June 11, 2019, 06:00:20 PM
IMO, Davel is deliberately provoked to breaking point by members and mods who seem intent on getting a rise out of him and then using as an excuse to silence him.  I used to be similarly provoked and would rise to the bait.  I probably still would if the mod who used to pursue me relentlessly and give me warning for absolutely nothing hadn’t decided to take a bit of a backseat.  I completely understand Davel’s frustrations.   The answer of course is to rise above the bait but it can be difficult sometimes.

It is often what you don't say that matters.  But this can be hard.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 11, 2019, 06:58:52 PM
IMO, Davel is deliberately provoked to breaking point by members and mods who seem intent on getting a rise out of him and then using as an excuse to silence him.  I used to be similarly provoked and would rise to the bait.  I probably still would if the mod who used to pursue me relentlessly and give me warning for absolutely nothing hadn’t decided to take a bit of a backseat.  I completely understand Davel’s frustrations.   The answer of course is to rise above the bait but it can be difficult sometimes.

Self control is definitely the answer imo, because the alterative is being controlled by others. My method is to write my answer to a post which annoys me then read it back. I then edit or delete it, depending. It's a trick I used with emails.

Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Erngath on June 11, 2019, 07:07:42 PM
Self control is definitely the answer imo, because the alterative is being controlled by others. My method is to write my answer to a post which annoys me then read it back. I then edit or delete it, depending. It's a trick I used with emails.

To be fair, you have never, ever been subjected to the over moderating and combined hounding by two posters which Davel was subjected to on that evening.
An annoying post can be easily ignored.
I do it many a time.
But that is not the same as the unfair moderating and goading which Davel was subjected to on that evening!
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 11, 2019, 08:12:39 PM
Self control is definitely the answer imo, because the alterative is being controlled by others. My method is to write my answer to a post which annoys me then read it back. I then edit or delete it, depending. It's a trick I used with emails.
You’d be amazed (or not) by how many posts I begin with “you complete tw..” and then delete before posting..l 8(>((
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Eleanor on June 11, 2019, 08:14:39 PM
You’d be amazed (or not) by how many posts I begin with “you complete tw..” and then delete before posting..l 8(>((

I get the same urge myself sometimes.  But it would never do, of course.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 11, 2019, 09:00:29 PM
To be fair, you have never, ever been subjected to the over moderating and combined hounding by two posters which Davel was subjected to on that evening.
An annoying post can be easily ignored.
I do it many a time.
But that is not the same as the unfair moderating and goading which Davel was subjected to on that evening!

It's not always possible to prove you're right. The sensible thing to do then is to stop trying. Resorting to abuse isn't the sensible thing to do, especially if those disagreeing with you are moderators.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 11, 2019, 09:11:32 PM
It's not always possible to prove you're right. The sensible thing to do then is to stop trying. Resorting to abuse isn't the sensible thing to do, especially if those disagreeing with you are moderators.
Davel obviously deliberately resorted to abuse knowing he would be banned.  He’d had enough of the stupidity and wanted a break I expect. 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 11, 2019, 09:57:13 PM
Davel obviously deliberately resorted to abuse knowing he would be banned.  He’d had enough of the stupidity and wanted a break I expect.

All these judgemental words that get bandied about; stupidity, bullying, bias, etc. All opinions and all designed to sow discord imo.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Erngath on June 11, 2019, 10:26:47 PM
Davel obviously deliberately resorted to abuse knowing he would be banned.  He’d had enough of the stupidity and wanted a break I expect.

A self imposed exile?
Wouldn't blame him at all.
He had had over moderating and.goading to deal with and then the jocular posts about Madeleines disappearance which in my opinion were unacceptable.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 11, 2019, 11:13:50 PM
All these judgemental words that get bandied about; stupidity, bullying, bias, etc. All opinions and all designed to sow discord imo.
OK let’s ban all insults and all judgmental words, regardless of to whom they apply, shall we?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 12, 2019, 06:48:35 AM
A self imposed exile?
Wouldn't blame him at all.
He had had over moderating and.goading to deal with and then the jocular posts about Madeleines disappearance which in my opinion were unacceptable.

So in your opinion he's a reasonable, uncontroversial member who, through no fault of his own, gets goaded and ober moderated?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 12, 2019, 07:11:05 AM
So in your opinion he's a reasonable, uncontroversial member who, through no fault of his own, gets goaded and ober moderated?
Exactly.  His views are not controversial, certainly not when compared to numerous sceptics on here, IMO.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 12, 2019, 08:01:09 AM
Exactly.  His views are not controversial, certainly not when compared to numerous sceptics on here, IMO.

I was referring to his posting style, not his opinions.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Erngath on June 12, 2019, 08:18:13 AM
So in your opinion he's a reasonable, uncontroversial member who, through no fault of his own, gets goaded and ober moderated?

My part in the public discussion of a fellow forum member is finished!
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 12, 2019, 10:14:51 AM
My part in the public discussion of a fellow forum member is finished!

I agree. The discussion shouldn't have focussed onto one named member.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Erngath on June 12, 2019, 11:34:50 AM
I agree. The discussion shouldn't have focussed onto one named member.

I think when you raised your initial question about how many chances people should be given, then it was more than obvious to whom you were referring.
Did you receive any answers to your original question?
Pardon my cynicism in believing that if a sceptic had been the person in question, then I doubt you would have raised such a question!
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 12, 2019, 01:57:17 PM
I think when you raised your initial question about how many chances people should be given, then it was more than obvious to whom you were referring.
Did you receive any answers to your original question?
Pardon my cynicism in believing that if a sceptic had been the person in question, then I doubt you would have raised such a question!
totally
An incident occured which led to someone being sanctioned. We were all told why; totally unacceptable language had been used to both moderators and other members. As was also pointed out; there should be no need to keep reminding people of the rules.

It seems to me that the sanctions don't work, because if they did people would behave better, Hence ny question, In my opinion repeating the same offence should carry a heavier penalty each time it's repeated.This should apply to ALL menbers.

Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Erngath on June 12, 2019, 02:03:31 PM
totally
An incident occured which led to someone being sanctioned. We were all told why; totally unacceptable language had been used to both moderators and other members. As was also pointed out; there should be no need to keep reminding people of the rules.

It seems to me that the sanctions don't work, because if they did people would behave better, Hence ny question, In my opinion repeating the same offence should carry a heavier penalty each time it's repeated.This should apply to ALL menbers.

Possibly best to direct your concerns and suggestions to John!

I've had an entire career dealing with classroom rewards, discipline, indiscipline, rules, penalties etc! ..........

Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 12, 2019, 03:03:35 PM
I was referring to his posting style, not his opinions.
What’s controversial about it?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 12, 2019, 03:05:27 PM
totally
An incident occured which led to someone being sanctioned. We were all told why; totally unacceptable language had been used to both moderators and other members. As was also pointed out; there should be no need to keep reminding people of the rules.

It seems to me that the sanctions don't work, because if they did people would behave better, Hence ny question, In my opinion repeating the same offence should carry a heavier penalty each time it's repeated.This should apply to ALL menbers.
IMO, this forum needs Davel and others who post “controversially” because without them it would be Dullsville Arizona. 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 12, 2019, 05:25:41 PM
IMO, this forum needs Davel and others who post “controversially” because without them it would be Dullsville Arizona.

Well, as you say, you're just here for the craic.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 12, 2019, 06:58:26 PM
Well, as you say, you're just here for the craic.
I am indeed, I’m not here as a McCann scholar or armchair detective, is that so very wrong of me?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 12, 2019, 09:49:43 PM
I am indeed, I’m not here as a McCann scholar or armchair detective, is that so very wrong of me?

Not in the least; it just means you have different priorities.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 12, 2019, 11:23:56 PM
Not in the least; it just means you have different priorities.
Not really.  Anyone who says they post here for purely altruistic reasons is a liar.  We’re all here to enjoy ourselves, it’s just some get their enjoyment from picking holes in the McCanns’ statements and some get their enyoyment from pointing out the absurd logic others employ to maintain their belief that the McCanns were involved in Madeleine’s disappearance.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 13, 2019, 08:51:42 AM
Not really.  Anyone who says they post here for purely altruistic reasons is a liar.  We’re all here to enjoy ourselves, it’s just some get their enjoyment from picking holes in the McCanns’ statements and some get their enyoyment from pointing out the absurd logic others employ to maintain their belief that the McCanns were involved in Madeleine’s disappearance.

It all comes down to opinion in the end because of the lack of evidence. The point is I think abusing other members is wrong, full stop. You seem to think it's OK.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Erngath on June 13, 2019, 08:56:44 AM
It all comes down to opinion in the end because of the lack of evidence. The point is I think abusing other members is wrong, full stop. You seem to think it's OK.


You seem to think that posters who abuse the family of a missing little girl is ok.
I don't remember any outcry when a moderator called Madeleine's parents s***!.
That was his opinion!
When the jocular post was made by a poster who finds humour in a little girls disappearance and when that post was liked by a moderator, then a poster is entitled to use the same descriptive language as has been previously endorsed by a moderator. IMO.

Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 13, 2019, 09:39:38 AM
It all comes down to opinion in the end because of the lack of evidence. The point is I think abusing other members is wrong, full stop. You seem to think it's OK.
You don’t think it’s wrong at all.  You have liked several abusive posts aimed at supporters.  Plus your definition of abuse is extremely wide when you think you’re on the receiving end of it, having been accused myself by  you of abusing you in the past.  I have also been accused of being a stalker by another member, simply for challenging her views, so  could you define “abuse” specifically? 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: APRIL on June 13, 2019, 12:05:15 PM
You don’t think it’s wrong at all.  You have liked several abusive posts aimed at supporters.  Plus your definition of abuse is extremely wide when you think you’re on the receiving end of it, having been accused myself by  you of abusing you in the past.  I have also been accused of being a stalker by another member, simply for challenging her views, so  could define “abuse” specifically?


"Abuse" appears to be a word which is thrown around willy-nilly. I was accused of attacking someone on another forum because I typed certain words in capitals!!! ie "YOU", as opposed to "you" purely to emphasize that something was personal rather than generic. Accusing someone of abuse simply because they disagree seems common-place, as is the accusation of "stalker" because one poster takes offense at being disagreed with by, say, one person in particular. Such a delicate little flower/internet virgin was I, when it first occurred, that I was appalled that such could be thought of me.........................I learned very quickly that a thick skin is de rigour!!!
 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 13, 2019, 02:44:15 PM
I class abuse as making personal remarks to other members. Calling them stupid, unintelligent or otherwise lacking in some way. I take those insults on the chin because I know it means they have run out of sensible answers, I'm aksi amused by the fact that those who hurl these insults around complain so bitterly if someone upsets them. Ifthey can't take it they shouldn't dish it out.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 13, 2019, 05:26:47 PM
I class abuse as making personal remarks to other members. Calling them stupid, unintelligent or otherwise lacking in some way. I take those insults on the chin because I know it means they have run out of sensible answers, I'm aksi amused by the fact that those who hurl these insults around complain so bitterly if someone upsets them. Ifthey can't take it they shouldn't dish it out.
Does that explain why you sometimes like abusive posts aimed at members who you perceive to be abusive?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 13, 2019, 05:50:36 PM
You’ll be pleased to know I have received a warning for making snide remarks to other posters.  I have no idea which post so offended the mods, it would be nice to know though. 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 13, 2019, 07:15:51 PM
Does that explain why you sometimes like abusive posts aimed at members who you perceive to be abusive?

I like all kinds of posts for all kinds of reasons; not all of them by sceptics either. Davel's reference to the illuminations a while back made me laugh out loud.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 13, 2019, 07:17:59 PM
You’ll be pleased to know I have received a warning for making snide remarks to other posters.  I have no idea which post so offended the mods, it would be nice to know though.

Don't you know when you're being snide?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Erngath on June 13, 2019, 07:44:58 PM
Don't you know when you're being snide?

You are being snide in that post!

"Mocking in an indirect way"

In my opinion of course.
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Erngath on June 13, 2019, 08:12:50 PM
You’ll be pleased to know I have received a warning for making snide remarks to other posters.  I have no idea which post so offended the mods, it would be nice to know though.

It's nonsense.
At least in school pupils knew the reason  why  they  were being " punished"
Was the snide remark the reason you have the ten percent award?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: G-Unit on June 13, 2019, 09:23:34 PM
You are being snide in that post!

"Mocking in an indirect way"

In my opinion of course.

You're fond of accusing others, aren't you? I don't know whether VS is able to judge his/her own posts or not. 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Erngath on June 13, 2019, 09:41:31 PM
You're fond of accusing others, aren't you? I don't know whether VS is able to judge his/her own posts or not.

I'm fond of accusing others of what?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 13, 2019, 10:02:49 PM
Don't you know when you're being snide?
Did I say that?  No.  I said I didn’t know whichpost so offended the mods, especially as none seemed to have been doctored or removed. 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on June 13, 2019, 10:06:18 PM
To be fair I would say a reasonable percentage of my posts are snide, but I’m certainly not the only one guilty of such disgusting behaviour..  There are others far more masterful in the art of snidery than me, mostly on the sceptic side IMO.. 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Faithlilly on July 08, 2019, 07:00:12 PM
Davel has just posted on another thread that John has told him that he is being unfairly moderated. I wonder if John could respond to this accusation?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on August 30, 2019, 09:21:49 PM
I got 10% watning for being “patronising “.  Can we please see this patronising post so that it can be understood which part of it contravened forum rules?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Robittybob1 on September 01, 2019, 02:35:48 AM
I'd like to thank Eleanor for being willing to take part in this discussion. Moderating is a difficult job which I personally wouldn't touch with a bargepole. It seems to me that moderators end up between the devil and the deep blue sea. It must be annoying to delete a post and then see it reinstated.  It also encourages members to think moderators arem't doing their job properly, so it leads to more challenges and arguments.

On the other hand I'm sure I'm not the only member who has posted a carefully worded post or two and then discovered them gone because I was involved in a discussion triggered by a post which moderators have decided, with hindsight, needs deleting.

Members can't be expected to read back before posting to ensure that previous posts are within the rules; that's not their responsibilty. I think speed of reaction by moderators is the problem here. If moderators dealt with unacceptable posts immediately then no-one would br able to reply to them.
Do you think we've got nothing else to do?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Robittybob1 on September 01, 2019, 02:41:20 AM
I've seen Rob struggling to decide what is and isn't acceptable too. It seems moderators aren't completely sure of the rules they're enforcing.
People keep inventing ways which appear to be designed to insult.  Do they fall within the rules?
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on September 01, 2019, 07:24:31 PM
Vertigo Swirl,

You have received a warning for posting content which may constitute defamation or libel. Please refrain from posting such material as this infringes your registration undertaking.

Regards,
The UK Justice Forum Team.

WHAT DID I DO THIS TIME FGS???
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Davel on September 16, 2019, 05:18:38 PM
Vertigo Swirl,

You have received a warning for posting content which may constitute defamation or libel. Please refrain from posting such material as this infringes your registration undertaking.

Regards,
The UK Justice Forum Team.

WHAT DID I DO THIS TIME FGS???

I've had a lot of penalty points, and been banned... Every time by my own choice.
However I've found when I stopped replying and challenging goading posts from moderators things have gone a lot smoother...
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Vertigo Swirl on September 17, 2019, 07:52:53 AM
I've had a lot of penalty points, and been banned... Every time by my own choice.
However I've found when I stopped replying and challenging goading posts from moderators things have gone a lot smoother...
And a lot quieter which obviously suits the mods as now they have virtually no new posts to moderate.  It’s Dullsville Arizona here, unless you get your kicks from discussing door mechanisms. 
Title: Re: Moderation queries.
Post by: Admin on November 15, 2019, 11:12:21 PM
I've had a lot of penalty points, and been banned... Every time by my own choice.
However I've found when I stopped replying and challenging goading posts from moderators things have gone a lot smoother...

Telling a mod to stick it up their arse isn't a smart response in anyone's book.