More Funding for Operation Grange

[Carana]

When looking back at my response to Rob's original post ... I had forgotten to mention the second part of it.  As an outsider looking in ... I think official attitudes are in the process of changing as the old older changes ... for example, I think the Policia Judiciaria are determined to pursue Madeleine's case as far as it goes this time round.  My experience of Portugal and the Portuguese is a positive one ... and I think that applies to most foreigners ... probably what Madeleine experienced should perhaps be recognised as the perfect storm I think it was.

IMO, there's been a new basis of cooperation established which is healthier (for both forces) than the initial one.

[Robittybob1]

I agree with the first part, but not the second.

Can you assure me the PJ don't have a thing about pinning the blame on foreigners?  I don't know Portugal but only the very few cases I've heard about make me fear the place.  There was the Australian woman hit on the head 4 times with an axe and the PJ put it down to suicide.  There was the couple found at the bottom of a building (last year?) and they put that down to an accident, whereas I think the evidence pointed to murder.

IMO, there's been a new basis of cooperation established which is healthier (for both forces) than the initial one.

Well I hope it is genuine change and not just the result from the feeling of being pressured into it.

[Brietta]

Can you assure me the PJ don't have a thing about pinning the blame on foreigners?  I don't know Portugal but only the very few cases I've heard about make me fear the place.  There was the Australian woman hit on the head 4 times with an axe and the PJ put it down to suicide.  There was the couple found at the bottom of a cliff (last year?) and they put that down to an accident, whereas I think the evidence pointed to murder.

Well I hope it is genuine change and not just the feeling of being pressured into it.

I don't think there is any suggestion the Portuguese have yielded to any pressure except internal ones.  I think their initial review which was driven by the PJ in Porto, started about the same time Scotland Yard started theirs.

I think the PJ are as determined if not more so than SY to sort Madeleine's case out ... and I think Carana is right about the spirit of cooperation there is towards that end.

[Robittybob1]

I don't think there is any suggestion the Portuguese have yielded to any pressure except internal ones.  I think their initial review which was driven by the PJ in Porto, started about the same time Scotland Yard started theirs.

I think the PJ are as determined if not more so than SY to sort Madeleine's case out ... and I think Carana is right about the spirit of cooperation there is towards that end.

From here I would have no way of telling except for reports of cases investigated by the PJ and to consider whether they appear to be properly investigated.
IMO if the change is genuine it won't just be the McCann case that gets sorted out.

[Brietta]

From here I would have no way of telling except for reports of cases investigated by the PJ and to consider whether they appear to be properly investigated.
IMO if the change is genuine it won't just be the McCann case that gets sorted out.

Don't ask me for a quote because I don't have one ... but I read that the reorganisation of the judicial system and courts has proceeded well and has borne fruit to the benefit of all concerned.
There is also evidence that corrupt police are being systematically dealt with. 
I am absolutely certain Madeleine's case won't be alone in getting 'sorted' ... but I am also certain that the perceived incompetence of police actions as in Madeleine's case will have far less chance of occurring in the future due to lessons having been learned.

[Carana]

Can you assure me the PJ don't have a thing about pinning the blame on foreigners?  I don't know Portugal but only the very few cases I've heard about make me fear the place.  There was the Australian woman hit on the head 4 times with an axe and the PJ put it down to suicide.  There was the couple found at the bottom of a building (last year?) and they put that down to an accident, whereas I think the evidence pointed to murder.

Well I hope it is genuine change and not just the result from the feeling of being pressured into it.

Re the Australian woman:

I was never able to get to the bottom of the Australian woman. She apparently died as a result of a blow to the head, but it's not clear to me whether the initial blow was an accident (falling somewhere) or by a third party, nor whether any subsequent cranial fractures were due to an autopsy or not.

Re a new police "dynasty" - yes, I think they're moving forward. Institutional change takes time.

[Robittybob1]

Re the Australian woman:

I was never able to get to the bottom of the Australian woman. She apparently died as a result of a blow to the head, but it's not clear to me whether the initial blow was an accident (falling somewhere) or by a third party, nor whether any subsequent cranial fractures were due to an autopsy or not.

Re a new police "dynasty" - yes, I think they're moving forward. Institutional change takes time.

What about the second case?  "The bizarre mystery of Australian man and his girlfriend found dead beneath a cliff in Portugal."  https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/world/the-bizarre-mystery-of-australian-man-and-his-girlfriend-found-dead-beneath-a-cliff-in-portugal/ar-AAyMvmj

Who takes selfies in the night?
There seems to be a wall then a ledge and then another wall.  You can't just fall from the top to the bottom without hitting the ledge half way down.  Was forensics done in this case.  Did the sign have fibres and blood on it?

There seem to be photos of them standing on high positions so I suppose talking selfies is a good suggestion.  The phone if it fell would be on the ledge, not beside the bodies IMO.

[Carana]

What about the second case?  "The bizarre mystery of Australian man and his girlfriend found dead beneath a cliff in Portugal."  https://www.msn.com/en-nz/news/world/the-bizarre-mystery-of-australian-man-and-his-girlfriend-found-dead-beneath-a-cliff-in-portugal/ar-AAyMvmj

Who takes selfies in the night?
There seems to be a wall then a ledge and then another wall.  You can't just fall from the top to the bottom without hitting the ledge half way down.  Was forensics done in this case.  Did the sign have fibres and blood on it?

There seem to be photos of them standing on high positions so I suppose talking selfies is a good suggestion.  The phone if it fell would be on the ledge, not beside the bodies IMO.

No idea, Rob. First I've heard of that case.

[Robittybob1]

https://www.perthnow.com.au/news/wa/portugal-cliff-death-parents-of-michael-kearn-say-report-into-sons-death-shoddy-incomplete-ng-b881043136z

"Portugal cliff death: parents of Michael Kearn say report into son’s death ‘shoddy, incomplete’"

Well is it?

As far as Australia is concerned I'd imagine the government wouldn't want to interfere as it might affect trade.

[sadie]

Who would they be trying to 'round up'...do you mean the people in your theory Sadie?

  Not everyone who is sceptical of the abduction story is against more funding. I'm all for it. It's not going to the
parents as people keep repeating, it's going to solve how a girl disappeared and very probably died.
  If our society just lets small children disappear with no consequences there's something very, very wrong.

   If Operation grange is truly investigating all leads then they should continue.

Very sound post Gertrude      
I have respect for a compassionate sceptic, especially one who is open minded


The rounding up would be massive, global, if my theory is correct.  But more concentrated in some areas than others.

I have already shared as much  as I dare ... and I don't want to mess the investigation up if I am correct in my thoughts, so I am stopping here..