Author Topic: Hi Everyone  (Read 4945 times)

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Offline Holly Goodhead

Hi Everyone
« on: March 03, 2013, 06:23:26 PM »
I'm Holly pleased to meet you all   ?{)(**

I heard about the White House Farm murders from Cardiff Law School.

Just found this site from Googling stuff online.

Don't know much about the case yet.  What's the general consensus on here? 

Look forward to posting with you all  8((()*/
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Myster

Re: Hi Everyone
« Reply #1 on: March 03, 2013, 06:50:46 PM »
I'm Holly pleased to meet you all   ?{)(**

I heard about the White House Farm murders from Cardiff Law School.

Just found this site from Googling stuff online.

Don't know much about the case yet.  What's the general consensus on here? 

Look forward to posting with you all  8((()*/

Hi Holly, welcome to the forum... (John's the Big Cheese and Shona's the resident comedienne).  8(0(*

Did you attend Simon McKay's lecture, and if so it would be interesting initially to hear whether you subscribe to his view that Jeremy Bamber is innocent? I 'cast around before the lecture for any students at the School to join the forum to discuss the case... do you study there?

Most on here think he is guilty as charged, by the way. One or two don't or are undecided, but you'll soon work out who they are!

It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline John

Re: Hi Everyone
« Reply #2 on: March 03, 2013, 06:55:55 PM »
I'm Holly pleased to meet you all   ?{)(**

I heard about the White House Farm murders from Cardiff Law School.

Just found this site from Googling stuff online.

Don't know much about the case yet.  What's the general consensus on here? 

Look forward to posting with you all  8((()*/

Welcome to the forum Holly, good to have you on board.   8((()*/
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. An exposé of egregious malfeasance by public officials.
Indeed, the truth never changes with the passage of time.

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Hi Everyone
« Reply #3 on: March 03, 2013, 07:37:48 PM »
Thank you John and Myster.

No I didn't attend the presentation.  My boyfriend is at the uni of Kent and he heard about it from a pal of his through rugby/Cardiff.

We are both fascinated by the case and can't stop talking about it: did he, didn't he?  No idea.   I find it interesting that the verdict was not unanimous 10 : 2.  Also the fact that the case has been at the appeal court twice?  First time on summing up and second a referral from the criminal cases review commission  8-)(--)

I assume you attended Myster.  I would be interested in hearing your views.

Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Myster

Re: Hi Everyone
« Reply #4 on: March 04, 2013, 06:13:01 PM »
Thank you John and Myster.

No I didn't attend the presentation.  My boyfriend is at the uni of Kent and he heard about it from a pal of his through rugby/Cardiff.

We are both fascinated by the case and can't stop talking about it: did he, didn't he?  No idea.   I find it interesting that the verdict was not unanimous 10 : 2.  Also the fact that the case has been at the appeal court twice?  First time on summing up and second a referral from the criminal cases review commission  8-)(--)

I assume you attended Myster.  I would be interested in hearing your views.

Holly... no, I didn't attend the lecture, I'm sorry if I gave the impression that I had. It was over 150 miles away from me and I'd no intention of wasting time and money to listen to a Solicitor Advocate whose views on the case I disagree with... I'd seen enough on the ITV documentary to realise that he's clutching at straws with the dodgy burn marks on Nevill Bamber's back and gunpowder deposits around Sheila's neck wounds.

I suppose you saw that documentary either on television or Youtube... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_i2CjYDJGTo

The Judicial Review result of the last appeal is here too, if you haven't already seen it... http://www.crimeline.info/case/bamber-v-criminal-cases-review-commission
From looking at some of my posts you'll have gathered which side of the fence I'm on.  ?{)(**

The Jeremy Bamber case is a difficult one to wade through at first if you're coming fresh to it, but you'll find plenty to chew over in the documents library here, and if you become really interested there are two or three books giving a lot more background information.

It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Hi Everyone
« Reply #5 on: March 04, 2013, 09:35:53 PM »
Thank you for the links Myster.  They are both new to me.  I shall listen with interest.

I have just used my Amazon Christmas gift card to purchase 4 books on the Bamber case.  Are there only four?

I need to read up on the case more before I can start posting anything meaningful.  I will have a good dig around in the forum library. 

I hadn't realised Mr Bamber suffered burn marks to his back.  How did this come about and where is it documented?

Would the gunpowder deposits around Sheila's neck wounds not have occurred then had she have taken her own life?  As I said my knowledge of this case is near zero so forgive me if its a crass question but I would have thought it would be the same whether Jeremy shot Sheila or Sheila shot herself?  Whatever its oh so sad  8(8-))
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Myster

Re: Hi Everyone
« Reply #6 on: March 05, 2013, 07:01:18 PM »
Thank you for the links Myster.  They are both new to me.  I shall listen with interest.

I have just used my Amazon Christmas gift card to purchase 4 books on the Bamber case.  Are there only four?

I need to read up on the case more before I can start posting anything meaningful.  I will have a good dig around in the forum library. 

I hadn't realised Mr Bamber suffered burn marks to his back.  How did this come about and where is it documented?

Would the gunpowder deposits around Sheila's neck wounds not have occurred then had she have taken her own life?  As I said my knowledge of this case is near zero so forgive me if its a crass question but I would have thought it would be the same whether Jeremy shot Sheila or Sheila shot herself?  Whatever its oh so sad  8(8-))

That's a good sensible post, Holly!.. I don't blame you for absorbing as much info as possible before you contribute.

These are the ones I've digested so far... I gave the Scott Lomax one a miss, mainly because it's the only one promoted by the Official Bamber website and he's an active supporter for his release. I don't think there are any more worth reading other than the OOP Marshall Cavendish Murder Casebook Magazine no.7 which is short and lightweight, and has a lot of good photos from the period but is only available on ebay or similar.



No-one knows how the burn marks (which was one of the main grounds of the McKay CCRC submission) came about. His theory was that they were caused by the end of the rifle being heated up by simply firing it, but as you probably saw in the documentary the branding temperature was never achieved this way, and I presume the USA tests produced the same result.
So other theories have been discussed on here, such as heating the end of it or some other metallic object on one of the AGA hotplates, or inserting it in the AGA combustion chamber through the coke filler hole in the left hand hotplate, or the stubbing of a cigar/cigarette on Nevill's back, or at the other extreme, burns caused by farm machinery earlier in the day. Peter Vanezis noted that they were recent - you'll find the comment among his pathology reports.

They could have been inflicted for some vindictive purpose... who knows?
 
Burn marks to Nevill Bamber's back.



McKay was trying to show that the deposit rings on Sheila's neck were only of a size to have been caused by end of the rifle without the moderator fitted, whereas the prosecution case at the trial was that the moderator was fitted throughout the murders. If it was fitted, the marks would have been larger around the wounds... this is explained by Philip Boyce, the firearms expert in the film. But again the USA experts clouded the issue by saying more tests would be needed.

So to sum up..., McKay's submission was to prove that if the moderator wasn't fitted, then Sheila's reach would have been sufficient for her to pull the trigger to shoot herself... and the burn marks too, because of their small diameter could only have been inflicted by the rifle end without moderator.

« Last Edit: March 05, 2013, 07:22:37 PM by Myster »
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline Andrea

Re: Hi Everyone
« Reply #7 on: March 05, 2013, 11:59:59 PM »
I have the Lomax book myster, i also had the murder casebook but i lost it.
There is a ebook on Amazon about the case but i heard its shite!
I have the other three books in your picture too! Colins book is very good, i need to read the wilkes book cover to cover.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2013, 12:01:43 AM by Andrea »

Offline Myster

Re: Hi Everyone
« Reply #8 on: March 06, 2013, 06:45:19 PM »
I have the Lomax book myster, i also had the murder casebook but i lost it.
There is a ebook on Amazon about the case but i heard its shite!
I have the other three books in your picture too! Colins book is very good, i need to read the wilkes book cover to cover.

I had to smile, Andrea when I saw the price of most of the Murder Casebook no.7 partworks on offer at amazon... £0.01 + £2.80 postage... amazon's own is £2.80 + free postage!!!



This is exactly the same magazine translated into French with most if not all of the photos and illustrations from it, except at lower quality resolution. If you were desperate you could select all, then copy & paste it into Google Translate to get a whacky English version...., http://tueursenserie.wifeo.com/jeremy-bamber-le-massacre-de-lessex.php

The only English part in it is....  "I.C.W.T.G.Y.T.B., ce qui signifiait I Can't Wait To Get You To Bed ", from the letter he wrote to Anji Greaves, when he was on remand in Brixton and had high hopes of being found not guilty.

As you say Colin's book is from the heart, although he did lose me a bit with the Kubler-Ross episode in the US.  The other two are well-balanced and both authors interviewed Jeremy Bamber at some stage... and you get the odd laugh in Wilkes' book when he quotes Stan Jones calling Julie... Julie 'Dogbreath' when she inadvertently breathed on him in the police accommodation, (because she hadn't taken any toothpaste with her!!). @)(++(*
« Last Edit: March 08, 2013, 07:37:09 PM by Myster »
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline Andrea

Re: Hi Everyone
« Reply #9 on: March 06, 2013, 07:39:33 PM »
Thanks for the link Myster, ill have a look now.

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Hi Everyone
« Reply #10 on: March 07, 2013, 12:55:45 PM »
Thank you for the links Myster.  They are both new to me.  I shall listen with interest.

I have just used my Amazon Christmas gift card to purchase 4 books on the Bamber case.  Are there only four?

I need to read up on the case more before I can start posting anything meaningful.  I will have a good dig around in the forum library. 

I hadn't realised Mr Bamber suffered burn marks to his back.  How did this come about and where is it documented?

Would the gunpowder deposits around Sheila's neck wounds not have occurred then had she have taken her own life?  As I said my knowledge of this case is near zero so forgive me if its a crass question but I would have thought it would be the same whether Jeremy shot Sheila or Sheila shot herself?  Whatever its oh so sad  8(8-))

That's a good sensible post, Holly!.. I don't blame you for absorbing as much info as possible before you contribute.

These are the ones I've digested so far... I gave the Scott Lomax one a miss, mainly because it's the only one promoted by the Official Bamber website and he's an active supporter for his release. I don't think there are any more worth reading other than the OOP Marshall Cavendish Murder Casebook Magazine no.7 which is short and lightweight, and has a lot of good photos from the period but is only available on ebay or similar.



No-one knows how the burn marks (which was one of the main grounds of the McKay CCRC submission) came about. His theory was that they were caused by the end of the rifle being heated up by simply firing it, but as you probably saw in the documentary the branding temperature was never achieved this way, and I presume the USA tests produced the same result.
So other theories have been discussed on here, such as heating the end of it or some other metallic object on one of the AGA hotplates, or inserting it in the AGA combustion chamber through the coke filler hole in the left hand hotplate, or the stubbing of a cigar/cigarette on Nevill's back, or at the other extreme, burns caused by farm machinery earlier in the day. Peter Vanezis noted that they were recent - you'll find the comment among his pathology reports.

They could have been inflicted for some vindictive purpose... who knows?
 
Burn marks to Nevill Bamber's back.



McKay was trying to show that the deposit rings on Sheila's neck were only of a size to have been caused by end of the rifle without the moderator fitted, whereas the prosecution case at the trial was that the moderator was fitted throughout the murders. If it was fitted, the marks would have been larger around the wounds... this is explained by Philip Boyce, the firearms expert in the film. But again the USA experts clouded the issue by saying more tests would be needed.

So to sum up..., McKay's submission was to prove that if the moderator wasn't fitted, then Sheila's reach would have been sufficient for her to pull the trigger to shoot herself... and the burn marks too, because of their small diameter could only have been inflicted by the rifle end without moderator.


Awww thank you Myster, I really appreciate all the information  8((()*/  I am still trying to get up to speed with all the intricacies before I start posting.  May take a while.
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?