Cadaver dogs are unreliable - Eugene Zapata

[Mr Gray]

Davel - do you accept a dog's sense of smell is better than that of a human?

If it is, what factor would you say it was?

Of course s dogs sense of smell is better but tests can't be run on that basis

[Billy Whizz Fan Club]

Sorry Rob...that's your opinion...very unscientific...and absolute rubbish imo
Why not just test the dogs

They are tested. as of course you know.

Where it is known that human cadaver odour is present, in tests, dogs trained to alert to cadaver odour will correctly alert 92-100% of the time.

[Mr Gray]

They are tested. as of course you know.

Where it is known that human cadaver odour is present, in tests, dogs trained to alert to cadaver odour will correctly alert 92-100% of the time.

And what happens if cadaver odour is not present...the tests are extremely limited.
How long does cadaver odour last as a remnant scent...no data

dogs are only tested when it is known the scent is present....they are not tested when the scent is not present

[Robittybob1]

And what happens if cadaver odour is not present...the tests are extremely limited.
How long does cadaver odour last as a remnant scent...no data

There are so many variables to consider, like:
1. How long since death occurred.
2.  How much decomposition has taken place (environmental temperature)
3.  Presence of insect larvae
4.  Length of time a cadaver had contact with the surface
5 .  Whether there were barriers between the cadaver and the surface.

[Mr Gray]

There are so many variables to consider, like:
1. How long since death occurred.
2.  How much decomposition has taken place (environmental temperature)
3.  Presence of insect larvae
4.  Length of time a cadaver had contact with the surface
5 .  Whether there were barriers between the cadaver and the surface.

they could try and answer the simple questions first....Grime is looking for a scientific basis to support the alerts...he doesnt seem to have found one. Would remnant scent have lasted 3 months in 5a...no one knows

[Robittybob1]

they could try and answer the simple questions first....Grime is looking for a scientific basis to support the alerts...he doesnt seem to have found one. Would remnant scent have lasted 3 months in 5a...no one knows

That is why in my theory of a longer period between death and when the body was moved after 4:30 AM  is possible and hence works better that the theories that make out she died and was moved out of apartment 5A before 10:00 PM.  In my theory there is another 6.5 hours for cadaver odour to develop.

[barrier]

And what happens if cadaver odour is not present...the tests are extremely limited.
How long does cadaver odour last as a remnant scent...no data

dogs are only tested when it is known the scent is present....they are not tested when the scent is not present

5a could be seen as a test then.

[Mr Gray]

5a could be seen as a test then.

but no confirmation of cadaver odour

[Mr Gray]

for those who think the dogs are tested...this is what a scientific study and report looks like...and an interesting topic re false alerts and handler cuing.

https://link.springer.com/epdf/10.1007/s10071-010-0373-2?shared_access_token=Vut12Uai65004q4v-y_Xkve4RwlQNchNByi7wbcMAY4bHsjVym_Rn1xhUadVArBPtORCcCsdqHrjfpKRHjPPjYb5mMYWDvHEbTHOAv6HV6ANjhZim-a0wggN1S-Kvmj0IeYkWH2nWnXHGCrn5yBcmWOTIMVDV7FUMgrm42lcSdY%3D

[ShiningInLuz]

for those who think the dogs are tested...this is what a scientific study and report looks like...and an interesting topic re false alerts and handler cuing.

https://link.springer.com/epdf/10.1007/s10071-010-0373-2?shared_access_token=Vut12Uai65004q4v-y_Xkve4RwlQNchNByi7wbcMAY4bHsjVym_Rn1xhUadVArBPtORCcCsdqHrjfpKRHjPPjYb5mMYWDvHEbTHOAv6HV6ANjhZim-a0wggN1S-Kvmj0IeYkWH2nWnXHGCrn5yBcmWOTIMVDV7FUMgrm42lcSdY%3D

Whilst that was an interesting and informative read   

it has nothing to do with the deployment of a cadaver dog in Luz 2007

nor does it have anything to do with the deployment of Tito and Muzzy in Luz 2014.

By the way, if that paper had been sent to me now for peer review, I would have rejected it.  That experiment is riddled with holes.

[Mr Gray]

Whilst that was an interesting and informative read   

it has nothing to do with the deployment of a cadaver dog in Luz 2007

nor does it have anything to do with the deployment of Tito and Muzzy in Luz 2014.

By the way, if that paper had been sent to me now for peer review, I would have rejected it.  That experiment is riddled with holes.

Well it wasn't sent to you....and you would have rejected it because you are biased imo...it was posted by a scientist with a PHD ...who had written scientific papers re dogs and had trained detection dogs...by someone who is professionally respected in her field..

So how many scientific papers have you written ..zero I would confidently say

Could you point out where the holes are...no you can't...just empty opinion...you are welcome to prove me wrong


It has everything to do with claimed uncorroborated alerts as was the case in Luz in 2007

[ShiningInLuz]

Well it wasn't sent to you....and you would have rejected it because you are biased imo...it was posted by a scientist with a PHD ...who had written scientific papers re dogs and had trained detection dogs...by someone who is professionally respected in her field..

So how many scientific papers have you written ..zero I would confidently say

Could you point out where the holes are...no you can't...just empty opinion...you are welcome to prove me wrong


It has everything to do with claimed uncorroborated alerts was the case n Luz in 2007

May I ask what you have written has to do with the price of chips?

If you want to equate explosives dogs to drug dogs to cadaver dogs to blood dogs, go for it.  That's an absolute fail.

There were corroborated alerts in Luz 2007.  Need I say more?

[Mr Gray]

May I ask what you have written has to do with the price of chips?

If you want to equate explosives dogs to drug dogs to cadaver dogs to blood dogs, go for it.  That's an absolute fail.

There were corroborated alerts in Luz 2007.  Need I say more?

There were not corroborated alerts in luz...there was one for blood...singular..so there were multiple uncorroborated  alerts...and yes...the article applies to handler bias which applies to all detection  dogs..

you are still unable to show the so called holes in the article...which is expected

[ShiningInLuz]

There were not corroborated alerts in luz...there was one for blood...singular..so there were multiple uncorroborated  alerts...and yes...the article applies to handler bias which applies to all detection  dogs..

you are still unable to show the so called holes in the article...which is expected

Oh dear, how wrong can you get?

There were more than one corroborated alerts.

Feel free to dispute it until the cows come home.   

[Mr Gray]

Oh dear, how wrong can you get?

There were more than one corroborated alerts.

Feel free to dispute it until the cows come home.   

I see you have not even attepted to support your claim that  the article was full of holes....the only corroborated alert was blood on the key fob...no other corroborations