The timeline revisited

[Eleanor]

I do.  Soz la.

And yours.

[Eleanor]

I don't think I have ever encountered such a prolonged or transparent misuse of the English Language. It isn't a trustworthy thing to do.

.

I put it down to ignorance.  Silly old me.

[Billy Whizz Fan Club]

If you read his book he says the alerts confirm a body in the apt

Yes that is his opinion, but he understood the FSS results could not be used to support his  case. The alerts on their own are only indicative. I personally believe the alerts suggest there was a cadaver in 5A - though I don't fully understand the issue of Eddie and alerts to human blood i.e. Maybe both Eddie and Keela were alerting to human blood. I do understand that the alerts on their own don't constitute proof of Madeleine McCann dying in apartment 5A. I believe it is certainly likely and is actually touched upon by DCI Redwood as a possibility. It is disputed if they can be even claimed to be evidence. That's not so important here as evidence was collected. The issue is inconclusive DNA analysis.

Cite for Redwood remarks:

Redwood did say during the same press conference that police were considering the possibility that Madeleine was not alive when taken from the apartment as well as the possibility that she was.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/mar/19/madeleine-mccann-police-intruder-girls-algarve

[Mr Gray]

Yes that is his opinion, but he understood the FSS results could not be used to support his  case. The alerts on their own are only indicative. I personally believe the alerts suggest there was a cadaver in 5A - though I don't fully understand the issue of Eddie and alerts to human blood i.e. Maybe both Eddie and Keela were alerting to human blood. I do understand that the alerts on their own don't constitute proof of Madeleine McCann dying in apartment 5A. I believe it is certainly likely and is actually touched upon by DCI Redwood as a possibility. It is disputed if they can be even claimed to be evidence. That's not so important here as evidence was collected. The issue is inconclusive DNA analysis.

Cite for Redwood remarks:
 https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/mar/19/madeleine-mccann-police-intruder-girls-algarve

You believe what you want... I trust my judgement implicitly and believe I have a far better understanding of the evifenve than amaral.  I think there's going to be a lot of sceptics not knowing which way to turn fairly soon.
The dog alerts are imo a total joke.  ..The dogs role is to find evidence... To suggest MM died in the aptand the alerts were to her cadaver is total fantasy... As was the coconut in Jersey.  Grimes dreams in his white paper never materialised... I've got my opinions why

[Billy Whizz Fan Club]

You believe what you want... I trust my judgement implicitly and believe I have a far better understanding of the evifenve than amaral.  I think there's going to be a lot of sceptics not knowing which way to turn fairly soon.
The dog alerts are imo a total joke.  ..The dogs role is to find evidence... To suggest MM died in the aptand the alerts were to her cadaver is total fantasy... As was the coconut in Jersey.  Grimes dreams in his white paper never materialised... I've got my opinions why

What do you believe led Redwood to make the remark; "that police were considering the possibility that Madeleine was not alive when taken from the apartment as well as the possibility that she was".?

The dog alerts led to the collection of evidence? Can you find any serious scientific articles or research to support your claim that "the dog alerts are [in your opinion] a total joke"? (Dave's quote states "imo" where I have inserted the brackets.)

Do you remember Debunked's posts from years ago trying to rubbish the dog alerts? He arrived at the conclusion that given their "70-90%"  reliability a certain percentage of alerts would be false. He then uses a statistical maths equation to state  the reliability of two dogs is actually less so Debunked stated maybe 51% of alerts are false... It stands to reason that the other alerts are not false. So what were Eddie and Keela alerting to? Surely it is the material sent to the FSS?

Yes the "coconut" in Jersey might be total fantasy!

[Vertigo Swirl]

What do you believe led Redwood to make the remark; "that police were considering the possibility that Madeleine was not alive when taken from the apartment as well as the possibility that she was".?

The dog alerts led to the collection of evidence? Can you find any serious scientific articles or research to support your claim that "the dog alerts are [in your opinion] a total joke"? (Dave's quote states "imo" where I have inserted the brackets.)

Do you remember Debunked's posts from years ago trying to rubbish the dog alerts? He arrived at the conclusion that given their "70-90%"  reliability a certain percentage of alerts would be false. He then uses a statistical maths equation to state  the reliability of two dogs is actually less so Debunked stated maybe 51% of alerts are false... It stands to reason that the other alerts are not false. So what were Eddie and Keela alerting to? Surely it is the material sent to the FSS?

Yes the "coconut" in Jersey might be total fantasy!

It means the police considered the possibility that she was murdered by a stranger in the room who then removed her body but that doesn’t mean they considered this possibility because of the dog alerts.  Remember, the Met believe Madeleine was abducted by a stranger and there is no way that could have happened if the dogs were actually alerting to the scent of her dead body.  The Met obviously chose to ignore the alerts completely IMO. 

[Wonderfulspam]

It means the police considered the possibility that she was murdered by a stranger in the room who then removed her body but that doesn’t mean they considered this possibility because of the dog alerts.  Remember, the Met believe Madeleine was abducted by a stranger and there is no way that could have happened if the dogs were actually alerting to the scent of her dead body.  The Met obviously chose to ignore the alerts completely IMO.

Wasn't there some guy in the news the other week who had a thing about dead bodies?

Maybe it was him.

[Vertigo Swirl]

Wasn't there some guy in the news the other week who had a thing about dead bodies?

Maybe it was him.

Good point, he may have holidayed in Apt 5 a shortly before or after the disappearance.

[Billy Whizz Fan Club]

It means the police considered the possibility that she was murdered by a stranger in the room who then removed her body but that doesn’t mean they considered this possibility because of the dog alerts.  Remember, the Met believe Madeleine was abducted by a stranger and there is no way that could have happened if the dogs were actually alerting to the scent of her dead body.  The Met obviously chose to ignore the alerts completely IMO.

What other evidence exists that could lead you to consider the possibility she was dead before being taken out of the apartment?

[Vertigo Swirl]

What other evidence exists that could lead you to consider the possibility she was dead before being taken out of the apartment?

Who talked about there being evidence?  It was a theory they considered that is all.  Now you tell me how Madeleine could have been abducted by a stranger as the Met believe she was and be dead in situ in the apartment for long enough to leave cadaver odour.

[Snowgirl]

Who talked about there being evidence?  It was a theory they considered that is all.  Now you tell me how Madeleine could have been abducted by a stranger as the Met believe she was and be dead in situ in the apartment for long enough to leave cadaver odour.

Firstly do you  believe cadaverine existed in the apt.?
Secondly the Met never implied when Redwood made that revelation on Crimewatch that she had been abducted by a stranger .

[Vertigo Swirl]

Firstly do you  believe cadaverine existed in the apt.?
Secondly the Met never implied when Redwood made that revelation on Crimewatch that she had been abducted by a stranger .

Firstly - I have no idea.
Secondly- are you serious?!  I suggest you go back and watch the episode of Crimewatch in question again.

[Snowgirl]

Firstly - I have no idea.
Secondly- are you serious?!  I suggest you go back and watch the episode of Crimewatch in question again.

I know what he said and he was indicating Smithsman was the person to concentrate on . However he made no reference to the fact that the latter could possibly be carrying a dead child did he?

[Vertigo Swirl]

I know what he said and he was indicating Smithsman was the person to concentrate on . However he made no reference to the fact that the latter could possibly be carrying a dead child did he?

I don’t know what point you are trying to make but Redwood and the Met think Madeleine was abducted by a stranger, not that she died in the apartment and Gerry carried her dead body through town, hope that’s cleared up any misunderstanding you mayhave had about it.

[Billy Whizz Fan Club]

I don’t know what point you are trying to make but Redwood and the Met think Madeleine was abducted by a stranger, not that she died in the apartment and Gerry carried her dead body through town, hope that’s cleared up any misunderstanding you mayhave had about it.

Given those words:

 "that police were considering the possibility that Madeleine was not alive when taken from the apartment as well as the possibility that she was".

It doesn't seem that the former had been rejected. There must have been some rationale for the Met to consider the possibility that Madeleine was dead before she left the apartment. They don't consider scenarios without some reason just for the sake of it.