Martin Grime's Credentials At The Time OF Entering 5A - Fit For Purpose?

[Holly Goodhead]

Please don't shoot the messenger.  I am merely highlighting what I consider to be an anomaly for further investigation.  MG's wit stat dated Aug 2007 states the following:

Personal Profile

I am a 'retired' police officer, formally a senior instructor at the South
Yorkshire Police dog training establishment.

I have 35 years experience in the training of dogs both within the police
service and in the public sector.

I specialise in the development and training of specialist search dogs to
include narcotics, explosives, currency, human remains, blood and semen.

I am the Special Advisor to The U.S. Department of Justice, Federal Bureau
of Investigation, in relation to their Canine Forensic Program.

I am a U.K.A.C.P.O. (Association of Chief Police Officers, England and Wales)
accredited police dog training instructor. I am a Subject Matter Expert in
forensic canine search and on the N.P.I.A. (National Policing Improvement
Agency) Expert Advisers database.

I advise Domestic and International Law enforcement agencies on the
operational deployment of Police Dogs in the role of Homicide investigation.

I develop methods of detecting forensically recoverable evidence by the use
of dogs and facilitate training.

I am regularly deployed to homicide cases within my portfolio and form a
'Specialist Canine Homicide Search Team' including the S.A.M dog teams
from Dyfed Powys and USA.

I have trained and handle two operational specialist search dogs:
'Eddie' is a 7-year-old English Springer spaniel dog who is trained as an
Enhanced Victim Recovery Dog (EVRD).

'Keela' is a three-year old English Springer spaniel bitch who is trained as an
Human blood search dog (C.S.I. dog).

https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_GRIMES.htm

A report produced by the National Policing Improvement Agency (NPIA) dated 2009 regarding the disappearance of Shannon Matthews in 2008 states the following:

The Victim Recovery Dogs used in this operation were drawn from 4 different forces.  It emerged that each force has its own training and deployment policy and so there is no consistency in what the dogs can do and how it is done.  Furthermore, there is no national standard for accrediting dogs and handlers, or record keeping of the success rate they achieve.  This makes it difficult for SIO's to interpret the indication from a dog with no way knowing how reliable that indication was in the first place.  ACPO is currently examining this issue due to a number of recent cases where the use of victim recovery dogs has had the potential to cause complications in an enquiry.

The value of these dogs is undoubted, but there is an urgent need to have national policy on their training, accreditation and deployment and better information for SIOs about their use.  The NPIA is currently working with the ACPO Strategic Dogs Working Group to resolve these issues.

Page 25 of doc:

http://library.college.police.uk/docs/npia/Operation-Paris.pdf

So there seems to be a mismatch between MG and NPIA? 

[Holly Goodhead]

At the time MG entered 5A he was no longer employed by UK police/Home Office but operating under his own steam and selling his services for a fee?  Was there some conflict of interest here?  Who actually commissioned MG and the dogs?  Or did MG knock on PJ's door selling his services?  What sort of fee/expenses did MG receive? 

[Eleanor]

At the time MG entered 5A he was no longer employed by UK police/Home Office but operating under his own steam and selling his services for a fee?  Was there some conflict of interest here?  Who actually commissioned MG and the dogs?  Or did MG knock on PJ's door selling his services?  What sort of fee/expenses did MG receive?

Wouldn't we all like to know that.

 Martin Grime was paid 96,000 Pounds for the Jersey Case, plus expenses and free accommodation.

[Holly Goodhead]

And interestingly, according to his LinkedIn profile, he left the police service and set up his own consultancy in Aug 2007 

https://uk.linkedin.com/in/martin-grime-9724a78

[jassi]

At the time MG entered 5A he was no longer employed by UK police/Home Office but operating under his own steam and selling his services for a fee?  Was there some conflict of interest here?  Who actually commissioned MG and the dogs?  Or did MG knock on PJ's door selling his services?  What sort of fee/expenses did MG receive?

fees received - No idea. Is it relevant?

How much did McCann private detectives receive?  Again does it matter?

[Holly Goodhead]

Wouldn't we all like to know that.

 Martin Grime was paid 96,000 Pounds for the Jersey Case, plus expenses and free accommodation.

I'm beginning to get a bad smell about this 

[Holly Goodhead]

fees received - No idea. Is it relevant?

How much did McCann private detectives receive?  Again does it matter?

I've worked in a fee charging environment and best practice is transparency to avoid any sorts of claims about conflicts of interest etc.

You will find many have to register any sort of freebies say a modest lunch to avoid any claims of conflict of interest eg police, MP's. 
 
I don't see that its important with the McCanns.  They are private individuals paying for services to find MM.  But you will recall the various outfits received a lot of criticism for fees charged with little or no benefit.  They're hardly likely to turn work away?

[Mr Gray]

as i understand grime was employed when he carried out the searches and retired immediately afterwords.

I have constantly raised the point that grime has  a commercial interest in the promotion of the abilities of cadaver dogs

[jassi]

Transparency may have importance if the UK taxpayer is footing the bill, otherwise it is none of their business.

[Holly Goodhead]

Transparency may have importance if the UK taxpayer is footing the bill, otherwise it is none of their business.

In reality that it is not the case with organisations that have good corporate governance. 

For 2.5 decades I worked in financial services.  During the late 80's/90's I, along with others, would experience 'corporate days out' at the expense of blue chip organisations whose products needed selling!  These days involved limo pick ups, champagne from early in the morning as much as you could drink, free entry to whatever the event was, money for bets at the races, fine dining and for those inclined late night experiences 

By the time I left I would need to register a cheap bottle of plonk at Christmas or risk getting struck off.

Certainly defence lawyers at trial would have a field day with MG over this sort of thing.

[jassi]

In reality that it is not the case with organisations that have good corporate governance. 

For 2.5 decades I worked in financial services.  During the late 80's/90's I, along with others, would experience 'corporate days out' at the expense of blue chip organisations whose products needed selling!  These days involved limo pick ups, champagne from early in the morning as much as you could drink, free entry to whatever the event was, money for bets at the races, fine dining and for those inclined late night experiences 

By the time I left I would need to register a cheap bottle of plonk at Christmas or risk getting struck off.

Certainly defence lawyers at trial would have a field day with MG over this sort of thing.

Isn't going to happen so don't worry about it.

[Eleanor]

I'm beginning to get a bad smell about this 

You are not alone.  But we are not allowed to slag off  Martin Grime, so we have to be a bit careful about what we say.

[Billy Whizz Fan Club]

There's a debate about the science and the efficacy of dogs detecting cadaveric volatile organic compounds (VOCs) on another thread. The forensic science shows us just how useful these dogs can be.... quick let's start a new thread and try to discredit the dog handler instead.

In the Matthews case the dog alerted correctly to the presence of VOCs, and as Grime rightly points out it is then up to forensic science to tell us when, why and how a death occurred.

Grime and his dogs have an excellent record in operations. Why else would they be so highly regarded by the FBI?

[Eleanor]

There has been a lot of discussion about the exact date of Martin Grime's Retirement, especially as he was entitled to some Retirement Leave.

The important thing for me is who got paid for The Praia de Luz Job.  And I don't think it was The South Yorkshire Police.

He also used The Dog Video taken in Praia de Luz to land The Jersey Job.

[Holly Goodhead]

You are not alone.  But we are not allowed to slag off  Martin Grime, so we have to be a bit careful about what we say.

My intention is not to slag off anyone.