White House Farm - ITV Drama Series - Part 4

[steve_trousers]

The hand of God is transparent and we all know it involved foul play.  The blood/silencer offers no such transparency and is still all very much to play for.  I believe I'm on the winning team.

The 2012 tests were opinion based.  I believe it is now possible to undertake tests that are irrefutable.

The silencer was discovered by a police officer, it's all totally transparent and above board. Nothing to see here.

By the way I thought the silencer no longer existed as an exhibit, post 1996? what kind of tests ?

[Holly Goodhead]

I bet Julie's testimony influenced the jury too-------rightly or wrongly.

What I do wonder about is this: there were two people who could have committed the murders. If Jeremy did it, it was down to wickedness and greed. If Sheila did it,  it was because she was very ill, and therefore, she cannot really be blamed.  I think that in a crime as ghastly as this one, people would want to see somebody actually brought to justice. I wonder how much this affected how the police, the relatives and friends, the jury etc viewed Jeremy , whose behaviour after the murders certainly did him no favours, and who appeared to be a rather unpleasant young man (IMO, anyway).  Just a thought.

This must have been a particularly unusual and appalling crime for EP to deal with, and I find it difficult to believe they messed it up. I would have thought they would have taken extra care, but who knows------.

Off out tonight---and NOT to celebrate Brexit!

Forgot to say White House Farm is the only peacetime mass shooting in UK unwitnessed by numerous others so yes all were out of their depths. 

And yes everyone had something to gain by JB's conviction whether emotionally, financially or absolving self of crimes.

[Holly Goodhead]

The silencer was discovered by a police officer, it's all totally transparent and above board. Nothing to see here.

By the way I thought the silencer no longer existed as an exhibit, post 1996? what kind of tests ?

No it wasn't discovered by a police officer.  It was discovered by JB's extended adoptive family who benefitted financially from his conviction.

I believe the only surviving exhibits are the silencer and rifle.  However the new tests do not require either. The new tests are my intellectual property. 

[steve_trousers]

sorry, that's correct. But nevertheless they had their suspicions and after understandably undertaking their own search, reported the silencer to the law at the earliest opportunity.

I still think you would be better off writing a letter to Julie Mugford but good luck with your tests

[Holly Goodhead]

sorry, that's correct. But nevertheless they had their suspicions and after understandably undertaking their own search, reported the silencer to the law at the earliest opportunity.

I still think you would be better off writing a letter to Julie Mugford but good luck with your tests

The  relatives did not report the silencer to the law at the earliest opportunity.  They found it on 10th August at WHF and took it to Oak Farm where they carried out an inspection and then reported it to the law on 11th Aug.  DS Jones then arrived at Oak Farm on 12th Aug without an exhibit bag.  Instead he improvised with the inner tube of a kitchen roll. Then instead of hurrying back to the station he spent some considerable time with Peter Eaton drinking whisky handing it in the following day. Even then DS Jones circumvented procedures by entering it in to to the wrong property book meaning the exhibit did not undergo the sort of scrutiny it would ordinarily have done due to the way in which it was found. 

[steve_trousers]

Naturally they wanted to ensure they were not wasting police time, so once they were sure they notified the police at the earliest opportunity.
It's unfair to smear DS Jones like that, procedures in the 80's were not as stringent as they are today and he did nothing out of the ordinary. Police officers are human and I don't see that he compromised the murder investigation by having a whiskey with Pete Eaton. He took care to wrap the exhibit in something and made a clerical error back at the station. Nothing to see here.

If I wanted to free Bamber, I really think the correct path is persuading Julie Mugford to recant.

[barrier]

What was the definition of target?

Five dead.

[Caroline]

Five dead.

Can't argue with that. Yes, there were wild shots but they all hit, it's like someone wanted to make us think, someone had gone crazy with a gun.

[Caroline]

The physical evidence by way of blood stains, casings, distance of shots, trajectories and wound tracks places NB downstairs with the perp going upstairs and opening fire on June in bed.  NB then went upstairs and sustained his facial gunshot wounds on the landing stairs.  He then turned and sustained two further gunshot wounds to his rear before returning to the kitchen with the perp in hot pursuit where he sustained 4 fatal gunshot wounds to the head.

Where has any of this been proven?

[barrier]

Can't argue with that. Yes, there were wild shots but they all hit, it's like someone wanted to make us think, someone had gone crazy with a gun.

Indeed,I don't pretend to know the ins and out,forensics etc,but from the little I know allows me to form the opinion the perpetrator is alive and serving his sentence.

[Holly Goodhead]

Naturally they wanted to ensure they were not wasting police time, so once they were sure they notified the police at the earliest opportunity.
It's unfair to smear DS Jones like that, procedures in the 80's were not as stringent as they are today and he did nothing out of the ordinary. Police officers are human and I don't see that he compromised the murder investigation by having a whiskey with Pete Eaton. He took care to wrap the exhibit in something and made a clerical error back at the station. Nothing to see here.

If I wanted to free Bamber, I really think the correct path is persuading Julie Mugford to recant.

Sure about what?

DS Jones' drinking alcohol on duty wasn't limited to that one occasion.

Who wants to free Bamber?

If JM retracted her testimony it's unlikely CoA would quash JB's conviction since the conviction is underpinned by the blood/silencer evidence.

[Holly Goodhead]

Five dead.

No then as non-fatal shots superceded fatal shots.

SC did not sustain any defense wounds indicative she struggled with anyone.  If she was that compliant JB would simply have popped the barrel in her mouth and shot through the roof to penetrate the brain.  The bullets were hollow nosed which expand upon impact and are described as mini food mixers tearing through muscle.

[Holly Goodhead]

Where has any of this been proven?

Where has any of this been disproved?

[Holly Goodhead]

Is this all from IA discussions?

It was discussed on IA but not before it was discussed here.

[steve_trousers]

Sure about what?

DS Jones' drinking alcohol on duty wasn't limited to that one occasion.

Who wants to free Bamber?

If JM retracted her testimony it's unlikely CoA would quash JB's conviction since the conviction is underpinned by the blood/silencer evidence.

Sure about the significance of what they had in their hands. I would have celebrated such a coup with a whiskey or two.

I disagree, all hell would break loose if JM admitted perjury on the witness stand. It would be massive. Would Bambers team ignore that and keep harping on about blood/silencer evidence. I should think they would jump on it and vigorously renew their efforts