The phone call

[Caroline]

And mention of her medication -wasn't it only Haloperidol?- being responsible for why decomposition had occurred so quickly.

No need to mention it as it didn't happen.

[Holly Goodhead]

Has there been a paper published that on the balance of probabilities this would the case here? and which way did it find with the particular medication Sheila was on?

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/14947773/

[Holly Goodhead]

And besides, I think Venezis would know the difference between blood and purge and he might have noticed that he body was decomposing. I think it might have warranted a mention.

This is Vanezis you choose to believe when it suits but when his theories don't suit ie SC's hands uncontaminated by blood you choose to ignore him  as it fits your bible theory!

Do you now accept SC's palms were uncontaminated by blood thus rendering your palm print theory obsolete?

[Caroline]

This is Vanezis you choose to believe when it suits but when his theories don't suit ie SC's hands uncontaminated by blood you choose to ignore him  as it fits your bible theory!

Do you now accept SC's palms were uncontaminated by blood thus rendering your palm print theory obsolete?

The that makes two of us but the evidence doesn't support Sheila's head being propped up.

I do still believe that Sheila's hands were contaminated with blood because that is what he initially said.

[Holly Goodhead]

The that makes two of us but the evidence doesn't support Sheila's head being propped up.

What evidence supports her head flat to the floor?

still believe that Sheila's hands were contaminated with blood because that is what he initially said.

He said as much in his handwritten notes but at trial he was quite clear that her hands were uncontaminated.  Do you believe he perjued himself at trial?

[Caroline]

What evidence supports her head flat to the floor?

He said as much in his handwritten notes but at trial he was quite clear that her hands were uncontaminated.  Do you believe he perjued himself at trial?

The blood trails on her face support her head being flat to the floor, the same blood trails described by Woodcock.

I don't believe he perjured himself but this is what he says now about that very discrepency;

"Asked to address the discrepancy today, Vanezis muses: ‘I’m not sure whether I said that after the blood had been washed from her hands.’ Regarding his courtroom statement about the stain on her nightdress, he reflects: ‘The smear in the blood on her neck wounds is obviously from putting her hand up to it. Her fingers could then have made the marks on her nightdress because there are three streaks forming the stain – two together and one slightly apart. The marks could be from her wrist, but the thickness of them definitely resembles fingers and she certainly has some blood on the side of her hand. There’s also a line through the streaks where the material has folded, giving a slightly distorted pattern.’ The blood trails evident on Sheila’s lower right arm, together with substantial blood staining on the right side of the nightdress in the armpit area and below, reinforced the probability that she had raised her hand to her neck. The lower wound on the right"

Lee, Carol Ann. The Murders at White House Farm: Jeremy Bamber and the killing of his family. The definitive investigation. (pp. 194-195). Pan Macmillan. Kindle Edition.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

Jeremy said that Nevill called around 03:10, the 03:25 call is supposed to be when Nevill called the police. This is a recent claim, prior to the notion of Nevill calling the police 03:25 was when Jeremy argued that he himself called the police. Now he's claiming he called them at 03:36.

Thank you, I made a mistake on the timings

So Jeremy didn’t phone the police for 15 minutes after the alleged call from Nevill who supposedly sounded terrified and asked Jeremy to come over?

We all know that had Nevill really phoned JB, the first thing he’d have done was call 999 to go to the farm urgently, then quickly pulled his jeans/top on, and tore off in his car to the farm. He’d have got there in about five minutes

His lies are ridiculous

[barrier]

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/14947773/

Ok thanks for that,a paper from 1952,hardly up to date.

So secondly did the pathologist at the post mortem of Sheila make any reference to her body seemingly decomposing faster than the others,if not you're using reasons beyond reason itself to try and convince that the child killer Bamber is innocent.

[APRIL]

Thank you, I made a mistake on the timings

So Jeremy didn’t phone the police for 15 minutes after the alleged call from Nevill who supposedly sounded terrified and asked Jeremy to come over?

We all know that had Nevill really phoned JB, the first thing he’d have done was call 999 to go to the farm urgently, then quickly pulled his jeans/top on, and tore off in his car to the farm. He’d have got there in about five minutes

His lies are ridiculous

Because Jeremy was working from a script, cold, he failed to realize that our subsequent actions are frequently prompted by the person we're in conversation with, ie we respond to their mood. Ergo, if the person with whom we're in conversation sounds terrified/panicked, we pick up on the mood and act quickly to alleviate it.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

I wondered why you brought him into the discussion. His evidence showed that Nevill couldn't have used the phone after the first four shots into him, but as you now accept, that has no bearing on my suggestion; which is that Nevill could have used the phone before anyone was shot.

Your suggestion is wrong, though, so why on earth do think I’ve accepted your ridiculous assumptions?

Nevill never phoned anyone: his bedroom phone was downstairs which Jeremy put there after hiding the kitchen phone under a pile of magazines

Nevill was shot UPSTAIRS

So your suggestion is ludicrous

And the reason I brought Vanezis into the conversation was to try to get through to you the findings, which you’re unable to assimilate

[ISpyWithMyEye]

There were plenty of assumptions in this case then. How Nevill behaved depends on what he thought was happening. If he thought Sheila was likely to harm herself he would behave differently than if he thought she was going to harm others.

That has to be the most ridiculous comment I’ve read

[ISpyWithMyEye]

No, it doesn't!  It means the jury and the appeal judges believed him to be guilty.

Rightly so

Who else could convict him?

[ISpyWithMyEye]

Decomposition is not a one size fits all, many factors influence it, and you do not know what effect, if any, SC's pharmacology had on it.

Martyn Ismail is clear that upon infliction of the second gsw SC's head fell back against the bedside cabinet.  At circa 7.30 pm A/PS Woodcock also observed SC's head propped up against the bedside cabinet.  At circa 10.30 pm soc images show her head flat to the floor.  What happened between 7.30 pm to 10.30 pm?  It certainly wasn't JB who staged soc as he was outside with EP. 

MI's evidence explains why those first at soc who also left early report seeing one gsw ie when her head was propped up against the bedside cabinet it concealed the upper gsw.  Those who arrived and/or left later report seeing two gsw's because when she was pulled by her feet and her head fell flat to the floor the upper gsw was revealed.

It also explains that the large blood stain on the carpet under the bible in the soc image doesn't correspond with the blood staining under SC's armpit.  Whereas it would if her head was propped up against the bedside cabinet.  Same for the blood staining on the bible ie the large stain should correspond with the large stain on the carpet which no doubt it did before it was moved around by EP.

Every single thing you’ve said goes against what the highly regarded Consultant Pathologist said when revealing his findings

He said Sheila died where she [/b]fell

Sheila had severe mottling of the skin in her left arm which meant she died in the position she was found. Jeremy clearly pulled her along a little, as her nightdress proves: he did that so as to position the gun on her lap in which he thought would appear like she’d shot herself

All these conspiracy theories that Essex Police moved her body from the bed, or further from the bedside cabinet is ridiculous

Why on Earth would the police DO that?

They had no reason to, not to mention it was teaming with police and you can’t tell me if one of them suddenly thought he’d move her body for some strange reason, the other police there would have thought he’d gone mad himself

[ISpyWithMyEye]

No he didn't given by his own admission he did not know the sequence of shootings.

To date a reconstruction hasn't taken place.  When it does imo it will show NB was shot on the landing stairs meaning he could have made the call to JB before he was shot.

No he couldn’t have made any calls from upstairs — Jeremy had already disabled the line

So although the highly experienced pathologist obviously couldn’t give an exact sequence of shootings, due to his vast knowledge and experience, including being privy to all the FACTS, he was able to determine that Nevill could NOT have spoken after being shot in mouth.

Thus, as Jeremy had disabled the telephone line prior to creeping upstairs to shoot all his family dead, it would have been impossible for Nevill to have made any telephone call

As for suggesting they should do a reconstruction almost 35 years later, when not just the victims but many of the witnesses/police are possibly dead too; not forgetting the fact Jeremy was found guilty; has lost all appeals, attempts for leave to appeal, lost his appeal in the European Court of Human Rights, and has told lie after lie after lie making out he’s found new evidence which is all rubbish, why would anyone in their right mind do a reconstruction?

Even if they DID it wouldn’t prove a thing: it would all be conjecture

[ISpyWithMyEye]

Putrefication isn't a one size fits all and if someone is taking prescribed medication this can speed up or slow down the process.

But Vanezis never noted Putrefication

So why even mention it?