Abduction ... what is the evidence ?

[debunker]

I must admit that I am left in utter amazement about the recent trial of Leonor Cipriano. 
Two Courts have accepted proof of Torture of this woman while in Police Custody.  Two PJ Officers have been convicted of Perjury and Falsifying Evidence.  Three PJ Officer were Acquitted of the actual Torture, which wasn't all that surprising as Leonor couldn't identify them due to having a bag over her head.  But she is then convicted of False Accusation.

This is indeed a disgrace.

The PJ Hierarchy are currently pursuing all five PJ and Ex PJ Officers for removal of their Pensions.

1970s Britain was as bad. It took years to prove who beat up the Birmingham 6.

Agreed.  But that was over 40 years ago.  And they weren't charged or convicted of making false allegations.

They were convicted by popular opinion, paranoia, misinterpreted forensic science, determ inflation to pin it on someone, police prejudice  and [ censored word ].

RIng any bells?

THis sort of case is why I am such a skeptic about police methods and ill founded suspicions.

[faithlilly]

@ Eleanor

Perhaps that is because no serving police officer in the UK was ever charged with a single offence in relation to their maltreatment of the men they had in custody.

[xtina]

Hi

a fewthings i would like to pick up on in the previous posts regarding the sightings [smith and j/t]

1....the j/t sighting gives credability to the abduction..

2...the smith sighting gives credability to g mcc being involved...or the so called abductor resembling g mcc

3...either way why would this meticulous planned [not one shread of evidence]...abductor walk the  streets for 45 min's with maddie in his arms in different positions yet she did not wake....[why did he/she take the older chid and not one of the younger one's]

would anyone seriously  also leave the twins back in the creche thinking it safe [when this abductor could have been staff or any one in the complex etc] and even travel out of Portugal....IMO...they did know it was safe ..because there was no abduction in the first place

[Heriberto Janosch]

Hello,

Maybe you find this two links of any help regarding the abduction theories.

No physical evidence. Yes eyewitness independent testimonies evidence. Abduction by stranger to the McCanns and their vacation group are the only plausible theories.

http://espacioexterior.blogspot.com.es/2013/04/could-madeleine-mccann-be-abducted-in.html

http://espacioexterior.blogspot.com.es/2012/10/the-abduction-of-madeleine-mccann-report.html

Heri.

[stephen25000]

Xtina.  Thank you for your post, please introduce yourself in the new members section.

In relation to your post, lets be clear, the sighting by Mr Smith at 10pm has been proven to have nothing to do with Mr McCann as he could not have been in two places at the same time.  Mr McCann was eating his main course at the Tapas Bar at 10pm when Mr Smith made the sighting of a man carrying a child in his arms some distance away.

Is there independent verification G. Mccann was at the tapas bar at that time, i.e. by waiters or other people there ?

[debunker]

Xtina.  Thank you for your post, please introduce yourself in the new members section.

In relation to your post, lets be clear, the sighting by Mr Smith at 10pm has been proven to have nothing to do with Mr McCann as he could not have been in two places at the same time.  Mr McCann was eating his main course at the Tapas Bar at 10pm when Mr Smith made the sighting of a man carrying a child in his arms some distance away.

Is there independent verification G. Mccann was at the tapas bar at that time, i.e. by waiters or other people there ?

The prosecutor summary accepts that independent witnesses gave Gerry an alibi.

[stephen25000]

Xtina.  Thank you for your post, please introduce yourself in the new members section.

In relation to your post, lets be clear, the sighting by Mr Smith at 10pm has been proven to have nothing to do with Mr McCann as he could not have been in two places at the same time.  Mr McCann was eating his main course at the Tapas Bar at 10pm when Mr Smith made the sighting of a man carrying a child in his arms some distance away.

Is there independent verification G. Mccann was at the tapas bar at that time, i.e. by waiters or other people there ?

The prosecutor summary accepts that independent witnesses gave Gerry an alibi.

Which ones ?

I would not include the Mccanns associates as independent.

[debunker]

Xtina.  Thank you for your post, please introduce yourself in the new members section.

In relation to your post, lets be clear, the sighting by Mr Smith at 10pm has been proven to have nothing to do with Mr McCann as he could not have been in two places at the same time.  Mr McCann was eating his main course at the Tapas Bar at 10pm when Mr Smith made the sighting of a man carrying a child in his arms some distance away.

Is there independent verification G. Mccann was at the tapas bar at that time, i.e. by waiters or other people there ?

The prosecutor summary accepts that independent witnesses gave Gerry an alibi.

Which ones ?

I would not include the Mccanns associates as independent.

If it was good enough for the prosecution, it is good enough for me.

[icabodcrane]

Xtina.  Thank you for your post, please introduce yourself in the new members section.

In relation to your post, lets be clear, the sighting by Mr Smith at 10pm has been proven to have nothing to do with Mr McCann as he could not have been in two places at the same time.  Mr McCann was eating his main course at the Tapas Bar at 10pm when Mr Smith made the sighting of a man carrying a child in his arms some distance away.

Is there independent verification G. Mccann was at the tapas bar at that time, i.e. by waiters or other people there ?

The prosecutor summary accepts that independent witnesses gave Gerry an alibi.

Which ones ?

I would not include the Mccanns associates as independent.

If it was good enough for the prosecution, it is good enough for me.

That's a fair question,  and you have not answered it

You stated that  'independent witnesses'  placed Gerry McCann at the table at 10pm

...  who were they  ?

[debunker]

That's a fair question,  and you have not answered it

You stated that  'independent witnesses'  placed Gerry McCann at the table at 10pm



...  who were they  ?

I did not say that. Go check.

[icabodcrane]

I did not say that. Go check.

When you say that Gerry McCann's presence at the table, at 10pm,  was confirmed by  'independant witnesses'  ...  do you mean his mates  ? 

It's a simple question ...  yes or no will do

[debunker]

I did not say that independent witnesses saw Gerry (although there is no evidence placingGerry away from the table at the supposed time of thesighting by the Smiths.)

I said the prosecutor was happy that Gerry was alibied.

[John]

Mates?   Are they his mates?

His presence has been verified by everyone who was sat there at 10pm and the waiters and the Club nanny.  Not even a NASA satellite can help with this one!   

[John]

So when Kate came running back to the Tapas Bar at 10pm howling  "Gerry...Madeleine's' gone or words to that effect",  was she speaking to a ghost.   Come on guys ...get real!

Gerry was at the bar and Mr Smith is mistaken...end off!

[debunker]

So when Kate came running back to the Tapas Bar at 10pm howling  "Gerry...Madeleine's' gone or words to that effect",  was she speaking to a ghost.   Come on guys ...get real!

Gerry was at the bar and Mr Smith is mistaken...end off!

UNless Smith was wrong about the time.