Channel Five documentary - "Murder in a Small Town"

[WakeyWakey]

Surely the things to note in Kim's statement isn't the number of girlfriends LM had, but that she mentions the parka, and that he carried knives in it?

exactly this. she testified this in court, as did several of his friends. shed been at his family home boxing day to newyear a few months earlier, seen it then

the parka as ive said no pics?

not impossible there might have been a pic around, but digital cameras still pretty new tech in 2003. a few had them but not really 14 year olds. i got my first one early 2003 but i was older, had own money at this time, and way ahead of curve, most pals werent getting one until after 2005. it doesnt seem odd to me that a photo might not exist of someone wearing one of their items of clothing from that era

[John]

Did you think Simon Hall was innocent?

I worked on that basis initially but ultimately changed my position.

[Nicholas]

jeez he was 14 so what if he had 10 girlfriends, nothing sinister about that, and why no pics of Luke in said parka if he always wore it? did no one have cameras back then or was he just unlucky that every photo taken didnt include the parka he allegedly always wore? ever thought these young girls couldve been scorned having found out they were being 2/3 timed? oh I forgot theyre only kids, not at all like Luke was.

Typical misogynistic comment and telling too

You may consider it ‘normal’ for a 12 year old boy to hold a knife to throat of an 11 year old girl for a kiss- it’s not

It’s a warning sign and displays sexual aggression

[Nicholas]

From an old timeline

10.39pm Judy sends a text to Lukes phone, Right Toad, say goodnight toLuke. Thats you grounded for another week.
10.40pm Luke phones Judy to say he hasnt seen Jodi all night. Judy says she will call round Jodis friends. Luke returns to the house and tells his mother what Judy has said.
10.49pm Judy calls back to say Jodi is nowhere to be found, and she is calling the police. Luke says he will go up the path to look for Jodi, and if he doesnt find her, he will make his way to Judys house to decide what to do next. (This story was later changed to claim that Luke had agreed to meet the other members of the search party at the path.)


Luke returns to the house?

Where did the ‘Luke returns to the house’ come from John do you recall? (source: Shirley McKie)

[faithlilly]

I worked on that basis initially but ultimately changed my position.

What made you change your position this time?

[faithlilly]

Typical misogynistic comment and telling too

You may consider it ‘normal’ for a 12 year old boy to hold a knife to throat of an 11 year old girl for a kiss- it’s not

It’s a warning sign and displays sexual aggression

It’s normal for an 11 year old girl who has had that happen to her to tell her parents who, in turn, should have called the police and had Luke questioned. Did any of that happen?

[Vertigo Swirl]

It’s normal for an 11 year old girl who has had that happen to her to tell her parents who, in turn, should have called the police and had Luke questioned. Did any of that happen?

They were family friends weren’t they?  Bit awkward that.  Probably decided as no actual physical harm was done it was just Mitchell being a (rather unpleasant) 12 year old boy and left it at that.

[Vertigo Swirl]

If Mitchell never had a Parka what sort of outer garment did he wear and where are the photos of him wearing it?

[interested]

They were family friends weren’t they?  Bit awkward that.  Probably decided as no actual physical harm was done it was just Mitchell being a (rather unpleasant) 12 year old boy and left it at that.

not unpleasant enough to warrant a call to the police? Friends or not if that were my 11 year old daughter who was in bed and a boy climbed in and held a knife to her throat i wouldve phoned the police. The reasons for not phoning the police because it was nothing more than "unpleasant" however the act itself is quite sinister?

[interested]

These were 14 year olds going through an awkward goth phase and smoking weed. Some 14 year old girls are probably attracted to the "bad boy" thing.

Notice she isn't actually saying Luke is guilty, she is just perplexed to see Corinne denying something that she knows existed. I completely believe her.

so everyone else were just 14 year olds going through an awkward phase, but Luke himself smoking weed and dressing like a goth is disturbing? which has been suggested time and time again by a member of this forum.

[interested]

Typical misogynistic comment and telling too

You may consider it ‘normal’ for a 12 year old boy to hold a knife to throat of an 11 year old girl for a kiss- it’s not

It’s a warning sign and displays sexual aggression

i agree which is why it shouldve been reported to the police, would you report it if it was your child?

[jixy]

They were family friends weren’t they?  Bit awkward that.  Probably decided as no actual physical harm was done it was just Mitchell being a (rather unpleasant) 12 year old boy and left it at that.

Ifs and buts and maybes always acceptable when explaining his guilt

[Vertigo Swirl]

not unpleasant enough to warrant a call to the police? Friends or not if that were my 11 year old daughter who was in bed and a boy climbed in and held a knife to her throat i wouldve phoned the police. The reasons for not phoning the police because it was nothing more than "unpleasant" however the act itself is quite sinister?

Well either that is what happened or the girl made it up,  if you’re truly open minded you will accept both explanations are possible.

[Vertigo Swirl]

Ifs and buts and maybes always acceptable when explaining his guilt

Are you saying that the girl who was attacked in her bed was not a member of a family group that was friendly with the Mitchells?  I was putting forward an explanation for why they chose not to report it, if you find this unacceptable by all means explain why.

[Vertigo Swirl]

A lot to take in from court docs given to me, thanks all

Having read through quite a few of the threads, I can't help but notice that some of the older posters (forum not age) seem to have changed from not guilty to guilty, Why?

Interesting post for me was about AR alleged confession, if he knew things that weren't in the public domain about the crime, does that not suggest that this is even more of an unsafe conviction?

It's certainly one of the grounds I have been advised on that the police will use to look at an alleged confession, otherwise the confession won't be taken seriously as there are too many false confessions.

To sum up, why the change from innocent to guilty?
Does AR really have crime info not in public domain?

I am new to this case, having only vague knowledge of it from the time it was in the papers to watching the documentary which convinced me that a miscarriage of justice had occurred.  I since discovered from reading threads on here how very one sided the documentary was, leaving out or glossing over relevant dertails, and that instantly put my back up.  I also think SL's judgment is demonstrably questionable as evidenced by the other cases of so-called miscarriages of justice that she has doggedly supported which turned out to be the opposite.  Nevertheless the lack of tangible forensic evidence is troubling IMO.