Author Topic: "Innocents Betrayed " by Sandra Lean  (Read 683905 times)

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Offline faithlilly

Re: "Innocents Betrayed " by Sandra Lean
« Reply #3780 on: August 27, 2023, 08:43:29 PM »
You didn't know who his lawyer was last month so how is it now common knowledge?

The partial postcode wasn't SM's home or place of work so not common knowledge.

If you know it’s common knowledge.

I’ll have to take your word for that.
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline faithlilly

Re: "Innocents Betrayed " by Sandra Lean
« Reply #3781 on: August 27, 2023, 09:12:13 PM »
I looked at the gate previously on google earth and, from memory, it is just a few yards up a bit and across the road from where he would have emerged if he continued walking west down that woodland strip. I don't think he walked down the RDP west (to his left) after he murdered her and nor do I think he went on to that field north (to his right). Am I correct in thinking that if he did continue west down the woodland strip, he would've emerged where I said he would've emerged? I'm not familiar with the area and haven't visited the locus, and Google Earth doesn't show detailed pics of the locus and the rest of the woodland strip.

I don't know about that area where you suggest he could've hidden. Wouldn't he have had to cross the road to get to it? He had to cross that road and had no choice as he needed cover and out of those clothes that no doubt had some traces of incriminating dna on them. It would have been impossible for him to cross that road at that time of day without being noticed, and it proved to be a big part of his undoing.

I don't think any of those 'organisms' would've shown up. It was ,and still is, fresh water.

You are being unfair with your timings -- using the shortest possible timings. Nobody on the planet knows what the exact, precise times were.  I'm of the view that LM did what he did and that he times fit nicely.

The defensive wounds could've still happened. Maybe Jodi, while inapacitated, still managed to mover her arms.



RW & LF never saw him nearer the abbey. That is a very probably a misrepresentation that is in the defence papers. Once everything was looked at more carefully and fine-tuned, it was established that it was the gate further down the NB rd, on the left whilst driving north,  and not the gate at the abbey some 200 yards further up, on the right hand side of Walsh & Fleming .

I think you may have to look at the gate again. That being said why would Luke take the risk of walking to it, in full view of the passing traffic and standing at it long enough for someone to be able to describe him when there was a gap in the fence almost directly across from the entrance to RDP?

He would have had to cross the road at some point and of course that carried a risk of him being seen but the risk was greatly increased by walking to the gate and going into the woodland from there rather than the gap between the fencing and the wall almost opposite RDP. As no one seems to have seen the youth crossing the road if he had slipped into the gap already mentioned there would have been no sighting at all.

Freshwater ecosystems contain a great diversity of microbes, including bacteria, archaea, fungi and protists. There would certainly been some of these microorganisms on Luke’s hair and skin if he had washed in a stream.

I think that’s called confirmation bias. It’s true though that we don’t know the exact times of any of the events surrounding Jodi’s murder. Walsh and Fleming’s timings could have been out by 10 minutes, the cyclists could have seen Luke 5 minutes earlier, the ‘strangling’ sound Kelly heard could have simply been what he first claimed it was, the movement of trees and everything would have changed.

In what way do you think Jodi was incapacitated? Was she also gagged to stop her screaming?

The jogger is the key to where Walsh and Fleming’s sighting took place. The fact that in her first statement Fleming claimed that she left to go shopping around 6 also gives us reason to doubt her evidence in court.
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Kenmair

Re: "Innocents Betrayed " by Sandra Lean
« Reply #3782 on: August 27, 2023, 09:57:53 PM »
With the benefit of walking the route earlier this year, it would be unlikely LM exited at the RDP end, instead following the woodland strip down to just before the yellow gate but staying on the north side for about 50m following the wall until it stepped down to opposite the gate he was spotted at. Going directly across from RDP drops straight into a stream with a high drop and a very steep embankment on the other side so very highly unlikely someone would consider that route or exit RDP and walk down the pavement side.

I reckon he would have stayed hidden on the high bank on the woodland strip north side as the RDP was much too exposed and near the brow of the hill/road for oncoming motorists. Obviously that didn't quite work out.
« Last Edit: August 27, 2023, 10:02:14 PM by KenMore »

Offline Parky41

Re: "Innocents Betrayed " by Sandra Lean
« Reply #3783 on: August 27, 2023, 10:38:58 PM »
With the benefit of walking the route earlier this year, it would be unlikely LM exited at the RDP end, instead following the woodland strip down to just before the yellow gate but staying on the north side for about 50m following the wall until it stepped down to opposite the gate he was spotted at. Going directly across from RDP drops straight into a stream with a high drop and a very steep embankment on the other side so very highly unlikely someone would consider that route or exit RDP and walk down the pavement side.

I reckon he would have stayed hidden on the high bank on the woodland strip north side as the RDP was much too exposed and near the brow of the hill/road for oncoming motorists. Obviously that didn't quite work out.

They really do try paint that stupid image, but then according to the narrative, the killer/ accomplices were running up the middle of the road wielding the murder weapon. But heaven above someone of LM's intellect would dare try to cross that road when he thought clear.

He had little choices, he needed over that road, out of that clothing and seen to be waiting. This is reality. Only he knows the exact spot he chose, certainly not the path entrance, not over that V, zero forensic evidence. Only W and NW, then to combat the forensic evidence they invent the bleach and magic potions story. We know that LM was first upon the path, over that wall and he picked zero up upon the soles of his boots.

I believe he chose to cross and was caught because of that car coming over the brow of the hill. He wasn't just relaxing and having a nice time at the gate. Caught and stopping with his head down, trying not to be recognized, looking up as the car went past - Face seen. Again that is the reality, not diving to get out of sight, unable to keep head down, drawing more attention to himself.

LM was not forensically examined all over, another myth. Hair sample taken, finger nails and appearance noted. Gordo tried the nonsense with all sorts showing up from river water. And even IF, and that is a mighty IF, anything had been picked up, he was out and about in the woods, river with the boys for over an hour - Empty nonsense yet again.

Got to love the jogger/s nonsense - Passing LM standing at the wooden gate, rear view mirror and face clocked, then in front, in split seconds a jogger. Not according to the enablers. Swap wooden gate and standing from sitting on a stone wall, under shade to out in the open, and again they forget that book of clothing shown to witnesses, the nonsense that it could have been his bomber! But then see the jogger down from the entrance of the estate, no bridge - It really does beggar belief!

But they say he had walked up a little, not home, supposed to be at the entrance of the estate at both 5:32pm and 5:38pm. But still no bridge, no possibility with that sequence. Just making up the whole thing, fantasy and fallacy.

And as Mr Apples says, the further nonsense around the victim, almost instantly silenced, that was the evidence led, clear forensic evidence. Probably why they were rapidly silenced by the fiend, to stop anyone from hearing - Again trying to apply stupid at all times to the killer!

But fantasy and fallacy, the off the wall scenarios is what are abided by, rather than sense and reality.

Offline faithlilly

Re: "Innocents Betrayed " by Sandra Lean
« Reply #3784 on: August 27, 2023, 10:48:19 PM »
With the benefit of walking the route earlier this year, it would be unlikely LM exited at the RDP end, instead following the woodland strip down to just before the yellow gate but staying on the north side for about 50m following the wall until it stepped down to opposite the gate he was spotted at. Going directly across from RDP drops straight into a stream with a high drop and a very steep embankment on the other side so very highly unlikely someone would consider that route or exit RDP and walk down the pavement side.

I reckon he would have stayed hidden on the high bank on the woodland strip north side as the RDP was much too exposed and near the brow of the hill/road for oncoming motorists. Obviously that didn't quite work out.

All that planning to just stand nonchalantly at a gate as if he didn’t have a care in the world. Instead of ducking behind the gate and the cover he so craved, he stood long enough for someone to have a good luck at him. Odd that.
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline faithlilly

Re: "Innocents Betrayed " by Sandra Lean
« Reply #3785 on: August 27, 2023, 11:13:22 PM »
They really do try paint that stupid image, but then according to the narrative, the killer/ accomplices were running up the middle of the road wielding the murder weapon. But heaven above someone of LM's intellect would dare try to cross that road when he thought clear.

He had little choices, he needed over that road, out of that clothing and seen to be waiting. This is reality. Only he knows the exact spot he chose, certainly not the path entrance, not over that V, zero forensic evidence. Only W and NW, then to combat the forensic evidence they invent the bleach and magic potions story. We know that LM was first upon the path, over that wall and he picked zero up upon the soles of his boots.

I believe he chose to cross and was caught because of that car coming over the brow of the hill. He wasn't just relaxing and having a nice time at the gate. Caught and stopping with his head down, trying not to be recognized, looking up as the car went past - Face seen. Again that is the reality, not diving to get out of sight, unable to keep head down, drawing more attention to himself.

LM was not forensically examined all over, another myth. Hair sample taken, finger nails and appearance noted. Gordo tried the nonsense with all sorts showing up from river water. And even IF, and that is a mighty IF, anything had been picked up, he was out and about in the woods, river with the boys for over an hour - Empty nonsense yet again.

Got to love the jogger/s nonsense - Passing LM standing at the wooden gate, rear view mirror and face clocked, then in front, in split seconds a jogger. Not according to the enablers. Swap wooden gate and standing from sitting on a stone wall, under shade to out in the open, and again they forget that book of clothing shown to witnesses, the nonsense that it could have been his bomber! But then see the jogger down from the entrance of the estate, no bridge - It really does beggar belief!

But they say he had walked up a little, not home, supposed to be at the entrance of the estate at both 5:32pm and 5:38pm. But still no bridge, no possibility with that sequence. Just making up the whole thing, fantasy and fallacy.

And as Mr Apples says, the further nonsense around the victim, almost instantly silenced, that was the evidence led, clear forensic evidence. Probably why they were rapidly silenced by the fiend, to stop anyone from hearing - Again trying to apply stupid at all times to the killer!

But fantasy and fallacy, the off the wall scenarios is what are abided by, rather than sense and reality.

The point is not that Luke could have given a credible excuse for microorganisms from fresh water being in his hair or on his skin but that there was no microorganisms on his hair or skin. Luke had not washed himself in any sort of stream that night as there is absolutely no evidence for it.

The jogger is problematic for you, isn’t she? By her own account, and she had reason to know exactly the time, she couldn’t have been where Fleming/Walsh said she was at the time they claimed and if they saw her mere seconds after seeing Luke then he couldn’t have been at the gate.
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Nicholas

Re: "Innocents Betrayed " by Sandra Lean
« Reply #3786 on: August 28, 2023, 05:58:06 PM »
LM was not forensically examined all over, another myth. Hair sample taken, finger nails and appearance noted.

There Were & Still Are DNA Profiles Which Link Violent Rapist, Parasitic Predator & Convicted Fraudster Andrew Malkinson To His Victim
👇
http://theerrorsthatplaguethemiscarriageofjusticemovement.home.blog/2023/08/27/there-were-still-are-dna-profiles-which-fit-violent-rapist-parasitic-predator-convicted-fraudster-andrew-malkinsons-dna-profile-part-41/

Similarly to how there were and still are dna profiles which link sadistic killer Luke Mitchell to his murder
« Last Edit: August 28, 2023, 06:15:36 PM by Nicholas »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: "Innocents Betrayed " by Sandra Lean
« Reply #3787 on: August 28, 2023, 06:22:20 PM »
The point is not that Luke could have given a credible excuse for microorganisms from fresh water being in his hair

Was sadistic killer Luke Mitchell wearing his balaclava?

Was it ever seized during police searches of his mother and father Corinne and Philip Mitchell’s houses?

He wore it in May when he attacked Kara Van Null with a knife at army cadets

The knife threat on Kara VN by LM was witnessed by other cadets

What happened to his balaclava?

Around the same time of his knife threat on Kara Van Null, sadistic killer Luke Mitchell told Michelle Tierney “…could just imagine himself going out and getting stoned and killing somebody and how funny it would be”

Intimate Partner Femicide TIMELINE: Innocence Fraud Killer Luke Mitchell & Scammer Sandra Lean’s Psychological Manipulation - ‘Boiling You Like A Frog’ (Part 168)
👇
http://theerrorsthatplaguethemiscarriageofjusticemovement.home.blog/2023/02/26/innocence-fraud-killer-luke-mitchell-confidence-trickster-sandra-leans-psychological-manipulation-boiling-you-like-a-frog-part-168/
« Last Edit: August 28, 2023, 06:48:05 PM by Nicholas »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline faithlilly

Re: "Innocents Betrayed " by Sandra Lean
« Reply #3788 on: August 28, 2023, 06:40:23 PM »
Was sadistic killer Luke Mitchell wearing his balaclava?

Was it ever seized during police searches of his mother and father Corinne and Philip Mitchell’s houses?

He wore it in May/June (?) when he attacked Kara Van Null with a knife at army cadets

The knife threat on Kara VN by LM was witnessed by other cadets

Intimate Partner Femicide TIMELINE: Innocence Fraud Killer Luke Mitchell & Scammer Sandra Lean’s Psychological Manipulation - ‘Boiling You Like A Frog’ (Part 168)
👇
http://theerrorsthatplaguethemiscarriageofjusticemovement.home.blog/2023/02/26/innocence-fraud-killer-luke-mitchell-confidence-trickster-sandra-leans-psychological-manipulation-boiling-you-like-a-frog-part-168/

Is this the same Miss Null who, although able to allegedly provide first hand evidence of Luke threatening a female with a knife barely weeks before Jodi’s murder, was never called as a witness by the prosecution? That Miss Null?
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Nicholas

Re: "Innocents Betrayed " by Sandra Lean
« Reply #3789 on: August 28, 2023, 06:45:47 PM »
Is this the same Miss Null who, although able to allegedly provide first hand evidence of Luke threatening a female with a knife barely weeks before Jodi’s murder, was never called as a witness by the prosecution? That Miss Null?

Were any of Kara Van Null’s statements read out during the trial?

Or did any of the cadets who witnessed sadistic killer Luke Mitchell’s attack on KVN give evidence during the trial and comment on his attack of her in the cadet hut?

https://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=506.msg14701#msg14701

Why didn’t Donald Findlay want Kara Van Null’s evidence about killer Luke Mitchell’s attack on Kara Van Null scrutinised during the trial?

Kara Van Null stated;
“We never met anywhere but cadets, so I only saw him on Monday and Wednesday nights - I suppose because he was going out with Jodi”

“Miss van Nuil, now 17, met Mitchell at the Army Cadet HQ in Bonnyrigg, Midlothian, when she joined his cadet unit in February, 2002.
They started dating a few weeks later, even though Mitchell was already going out with Jodi and seeing another girl, Kimberley Thomson, in Perthshire.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2023, 06:53:22 PM by Nicholas »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline faithlilly

Re: "Innocents Betrayed " by Sandra Lean
« Reply #3790 on: August 28, 2023, 06:56:40 PM »
Were any of Kara Van Null’s statements read out during the trial?

Or did any of the cadets who witnessed sadistic killer Luke Mitchell’s attack on KVN give evidence during the trial and comment on his attack of her in the cadet hut?

https://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=506.msg14701#msg14701

From your own link.

“They came around and took hours of statements but I was never called to court”

Odd that she was never called to court. Her testimony would have been dynamite in Turnbull’s hands. Could it be that she came across as a less than credible witness?

And if Miss Null’s evidence was not heard in court why on earth do you think that the evidence of anyone who saw the alleged attack would be?

You really are a stranger to logical thinking, aren’t you?
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Nicholas

Re: "Innocents Betrayed " by Sandra Lean
« Reply #3791 on: August 28, 2023, 06:58:35 PM »
Kara Van Null stated;
“We never met anywhere but cadets, so I only saw him on Monday and Wednesday nights - I suppose because he was going out with Jodi”

“Miss van Nuil, now 17, met Mitchell at the Army Cadet HQ in Bonnyrigg, Midlothian, when she joined his cadet unit in February, 2002.
They started dating a few weeks later, even though Mitchell was already going out with Jodi and seeing another girl, Kimberley Thomson, in Perthshire.


Sadistic killer Luke Mitchell started dating Kara Van Null a few weeks after he started dating Jodi Jones

Jodi Jones only met with up with killer Luke Mitchell a couple of times a week when she first started dating him at/around the end of March 2003

Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: "Innocents Betrayed " by Sandra Lean
« Reply #3792 on: August 28, 2023, 09:46:40 PM »
From your own link.

“They came around and took hours of statements but I was never called to court

Neither was Laura Wightman

Where did the evidence of her having an “intimate” relationship with sadistic killer Luke Mitchell not long after he had committed his murder come from?

The verdict: Luke was a dark and dangerous character.. he was irresistible to teenage girls; BUT TEEN TURNED EVIL WHEN TOLD 'NO' By Maggie Barry

Within days of Jodi's murder he had replaced her with another girl.

https://www.thefreelibrary.com/Jodi+Jones%3A+The+verdict%3A+Luke+was+a+dark+and+dangerous+character..+he...-a0127488179

This 👆🏽was Laura Wightman
« Last Edit: August 28, 2023, 09:53:14 PM by Nicholas »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: "Innocents Betrayed " by Sandra Lean
« Reply #3793 on: August 28, 2023, 10:07:15 PM »
And if Miss Null’s evidence was not heard in court why on earth do you think that the evidence of anyone who saw the alleged attack would be?

‘During one army cadet exercise, acquaintances remember the youngster approaching a girl from behind in a balaclava, and warning “it would be so easy to kill you.”
https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/12401673.a-truly-evil-murder-you-will-rightly-be-regarded-as-wicked-lucy-bannerman-finds-how-a-teenage-love-of-music-and-rebellion-ended-with-a-walk-to-a-horrific-death/

What were the names of the witnesses who told the jury about sadistic killer Luke Mitchell’s balaclava?

Another fling ended on a more threatening note, with another West Lothian girl Kimberly Tait, claiming Mitchell once pulled a knife on her after she refused to sleep with him. Mitchell claimed the knife incident was only a joke”
« Last Edit: August 28, 2023, 10:20:12 PM by Nicholas »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline faithlilly

Re: "Innocents Betrayed " by Sandra Lean
« Reply #3794 on: August 28, 2023, 11:09:07 PM »
Neither was Laura Wightman

Where did the evidence of her having an “intimate” relationship with sadistic killer Luke Mitchell not long after he had committed his murder come from?

This 👆🏽was Laura Wightman

The grubby mind of the journalist?

And some of his ‘fictional facts’.

“ He introduced her ( Jodi ) to cannabis” No he didn’t. Jodi was smoking cannabis before she met Luke.
“ Mitchell lived with his mother, Corinne, who split from his dad, Philip, a caravan salesman” No he wasn’t. He was an electrician.

And not one named contributor…a police source…one pal…a friend of Jodi’s.

Churnalism at its worst.


Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?