Madeleine McCann - The locks to apartment 5a

[Eleanor]

I live on The Continent and I know these door locks.  They can all be opened from the inside.  It would be pretty disasterous if they couldn't, and you needed to get out in a hurry.

The same applies to Yale Locks in Angleterre.




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[gilet]

I live on The Continent and I know these door locks.  They can all be opened from the inside.  It would be pretty disasterous if they couldn't, and you needed to get out in a hurry.

The same applies to Yale Locks in Angleterre.

Yes, it's a safety issue. But then, I have seen locks in Switzerland, that can be locked only with a key. From inside, as well have to be locked with a key from outside.
I don't know those locks in Portugal.

I bet the Attorney General of Portugal, remember him, the man who stated that there was no evidence of any crime by the McCanns, knows about locks in Portugal though. And it is experts like him who matter not people on forums guessing about things.

[Luz]

I live on The Continent and I know these door locks.  They can all be opened from the inside.  It would be pretty disasterous if they couldn't, and you needed to get out in a hurry.

The same applies to Yale Locks in Angleterre.

Between my parents, brother, aunts,cousins and me there are 25 houses and we have at least 20 different systems of locks. How can you know those locks?

[gilet]

I live on The Continent and I know these door locks.  They can all be opened from the inside.  It would be pretty disasterous if they couldn't, and you needed to get out in a hurry.

The same applies to Yale Locks in Angleterre.

Between my parents, brother, aunts,cousins and me there are 25 houses and we have at least 20 different systems of locks. How can you know those locks?

But the Attorney General of Portugal knows those locks doesn't he?

[Luz]

Gilet,

are you implying that the ex-Attorney General (fortunately he was replaced) was a locksmith, or a locks expert?!

[gilet]

Gilet,

are you implying that the ex-Attorney General (fortunately he was replaced) was a locksmith, or a locks expert?!

Not at all. I am implying correctly he knows more about the case, including the locks than we do.

Having looked at all the evidence, locks, gates, eggs and all he stated that there was no evidence of any crime by the McCanns and yet clearly you do not have any faith whatsoever in that man's judgement because you clearly do not believe him do you?

It is you belittling the man with your total lack of faith in his judgement, not me.

I think he did the Attorney General did a good job after the investigation was tidied up by Rebelo who found total chaos from his predecessor Amaral.

[AnneGuedes]

Those locks are not in use in new buildings. I still have one in mine (about 30 years old), identical to the G5A lock. To lock and unlock, from inside or from outside, you need a key. It's a double lock, so the inside et outside keys are eventually different. If the door is just shut, not locked, you open it easily from inside and rather easily from outside with a bank card (some screw turned it impossible in the G5A door, as revealed by the PJ).

[gilet]

Those locks are not in use in new buildings. I still have one in mine (about 30 years old), identical to the G5A lock. To lock and unlock, from inside or from outside, you need a key. It's a double lock, so the inside et outside keys are eventually different. If the door is just shut, not locked, you open it easily from inside and rather easily from outside with a bank card (some screw turned it impossible in the G5A door, as revealed by the PJ).

Please show us the evidence you have of the type of lock which is on the front door of Apartment 5A.

It would be interesting to see this.  Until we see it we cannot really understand what type it really is.

[Luz]

Those locks are not in use in new buildings. I still have one in mine (about 30 years old), identical to the G5A lock. To lock and unlock, from inside or from outside, you need a key. It's a double lock, so the inside et outside keys are eventually different. If the door is just shut, not locked, you open it easily from inside and rather easily from outside with a bank card (some screw turned it impossible in the G5A door, as revealed by the PJ).

But as you all could see in the documentary issued by the portuguese TV, an expert demonstrated that in the particular case of this door that was not possible - the use of something like a credit card or else - as there was a screw that made it impossible.

[gilet]

Those locks are not in use in new buildings. I still have one in mine (about 30 years old), identical to the G5A lock. To lock and unlock, from inside or from outside, you need a key. It's a double lock, so the inside et outside keys are eventually different. If the door is just shut, not locked, you open it easily from inside and rather easily from outside with a bank card (some screw turned it impossible in the G5A door, as revealed by the PJ).

But as you all could see in the documentary issued by the portuguese TV, an expert demonstrated that in the particular case of this door that was not possible - the use of something like a credit card or else - as there was a screw that made it impossible.

Would that have been the documentary from Amaral's camp?

[gilet]

Those locks are not in use in new buildings. I still have one in mine (about 30 years old), identical to the G5A lock. To lock and unlock, from inside or from outside, you need a key. It's a double lock, so the inside et outside keys are eventually different. If the door is just shut, not locked, you open it easily from inside and rather easily from outside with a bank card (some screw turned it impossible in the G5A door, as revealed by the PJ).

Please show us the evidence you have of the type of lock which is on the front door of Apartment 5A.

It would be interesting to see this.  Until we see it we cannot really understand what type it really is.

Watch the documentary, or are you forbidden by your religious leaders?

Which documentary? There are many.

[AnneGuedes]

What is  it the window\shutter, or was it the door

Look at the possibilities  The shutter was open, the window was open (apparently not locked - read Beyond the Smears)  The curtains in the forensic photos are behind the bed to the left and behind the chair to the right.  The net curtains were quite full and would have added to the difficulty in trying to exit carrying a child \ although passing to another perhaps not, but no evidence of a second person.  Forget forensics at this point is nothing is really conclusive.  This must have happened whilst Mr McCann stood chatting outside.

The front main door   Nothing to suggest it was deadlocked thus securing EXIT  Worthy to note that JT deadlocked her front door, so her daughter same age as M and not in cot, could not LEAVE.  Assuming therefore that the alleged abductor could not of  actually entered via the front door (only exit) had he not got in via the window\shutter.  Then the only other conclusion must be he entered via the unlocked patio door ahead of Mr McCann, and was therefore in the apartment with him.

Two things spring immediately to mind, being that the front of the apartment which was the far side of the Tapas Bar was the car park, why didn't he\he\it use a car\vehicle.  If you ponder that thought it to can lead to other conclusions.....  but you have to curtail your thoughts somewhere.

Next up for grabs, since you can't view the cluster f*** at 9.10 - 10pm without mention of the check that took place at 9.25pm approx by MO.  Who noticed nothing untoward:
no flapping curtains
no open window
no open shutter
Although M's bed was not in the line of sight, there was the unoccupied second bed under the window.   50% of the beds\cots in a room the size of a postage stamp were empty.

Much really would point to the abduction taking place AFTER MO's check at about 9.30 or later, thus supporting the Smiths sighting, but leaves the earlier sighting by JT at 9.20 ish impossible.   Equally could both sightings have been the abductor with Madeleine but then why would he be running around for some 40  minutes carrying a child.

Much rests now with the METS review, perhaps details were missed in the translations, the spontaneity taken from the police techniques, who knows.  Could there really be a witness left with some information just to 'turn the final stone'

Somebody, who knew I wasn't searching for Madeleine but for you..., told me you could be "my" Meadow. Well, there's no doubt about it and I'm glad to read you again.
I don't think there's any witness left and any final stone. That's what the public from the very beginning has been made to think. As a collective belief this case is exemplary but the most interesting phenomenon is the so-called victims feeding Leveson's conclusions and  now threatening freedom of speech (after having a Portuguese book banned in Portugal where this never occurred since the end of dictatorship).

[AnneGuedes]

Those locks are not in use in new buildings. I still have one in mine (about 30 years old), identical to the G5A lock. To lock and unlock, from inside or from outside, you need a key. It's a double lock, so the inside et outside keys are eventually different. If the door is just shut, not locked, you open it easily from inside and rather easily from outside with a bank card (some screw turned it impossible in the G5A door, as revealed by the PJ).

Please show us the evidence you have of the type of lock which is on the front door of Apartment 5A.

It would be interesting to see this.  Until we see it we cannot really understand what type it really is.

Watch the documentary, or are you forbidden by your religious leaders?

Which documentary? There are many.

Buy yourself a ticket to Praia da Luz, have a look at the lock, and ask the person at the reception to show you the key with the cross section ! One year back, they hadn't changed the lock.

[Luz]

  EXACTLY!

Those locks are not in use in new buildings. I still have one in mine (about 30 years old), identical to the G5A lock. To lock and unlock, from inside or from outside, you need a key. It's a double lock, so the inside et outside keys are eventually different. If the door is just shut, not locked, you open it easily from inside and rather easily from outside with a bank card (some screw turned it impossible in the G5A door, as revealed by the PJ).

Please show us the evidence you have of the type of lock which is on the front door of Apartment 5A.

It would be interesting to see this.  Until we see it we cannot really understand what type it really is.

Watch the documentary, or are you forbidden by your religious leaders?

Which documentary? There are many.

Buy yourself a ticket to Praia da Luz, have a look at the lock, and ask the person at the reception to show you the key with the cross section ! One year back, they hadn't changed the lock.

[Carana]

Those locks are not in use in new buildings. I still have one in mine (about 30 years old), identical to the G5A lock. To lock and unlock, from inside or from outside, you need a key. It's a double lock, so the inside et outside keys are eventually different. If the door is just shut, not locked, you open it easily from inside and rather easily from outside with a bank card (some screw turned it impossible in the G5A door, as revealed by the PJ).

Please show us the evidence you have of the type of lock which is on the front door of Apartment 5A.

It would be interesting to see this.  Until we see it we cannot really understand what type it really is.

Watch the documentary, or are you forbidden by your religious leaders?

Luz, what is not clear to me - amongst other things - is whether a duplicate key (borrowed or copied) was formally excluded as a possibility.