Author Topic: Sandra's exit - The real reasons  (Read 118251 times)

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Offline faithlilly

Re: Sandra's exit - The real reasons
« Reply #225 on: July 14, 2021, 12:26:02 AM »
As I said..... And not just based on tonight's conversation but on all of our conversations. Shame on you.

Then it should be easy to find examples of where I’ve demeaned Jodi. Please post them.
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline rulesapply

Re: Sandra's exit - The real reasons
« Reply #226 on: July 14, 2021, 12:41:04 AM »
Then it should be easy to find examples of where I’ve demeaned Jodi. Please post them.

By targeting Jodi's family,  you demean poor Jodi, by implying the guilt of others without proof, you demean Jodi.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2021, 08:14:21 AM by mrswah »

Offline faithlilly

Re: Sandra's exit - The real reasons
« Reply #227 on: July 14, 2021, 06:13:18 AM »
By targeting Jodi's family,  you demean poor Jodi, by implying the guilt of others without proof, you demean Jodi. Always so angry,  faithlilly. As I said,  if you have no connection to SL.

Anyhooo back to the question originally asked.

You said that Leonard Kelly wasn’t the only evidence the prosecution must have had for TOD and I asked what other information was there?

Jodi wasn’t seen for over six and a half hours and could have been killed anytime in between. Even if temperatures were taken at the scene it could not have afforded the investigators such a precise time. So, IYO what other information could they have used for TOD?

And here’s the link to the Frontline Scotland video regarding the change of stories. You’ll find the relevant part around 21 minutes.

https://youtu.be/-m-zHEUOFR0

As I said if the BBC had implied that I had been dishonest I’d certainly have taken action,
« Last Edit: July 19, 2021, 02:53:46 PM by John »
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline mrswah

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Re: Sandra's exit - The real reasons
« Reply #228 on: July 14, 2021, 08:15:34 AM »
Please-------let's not make personal remarks about each other.  Not nice!

Thank you.

Offline mrswah

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Re: Sandra's exit - The real reasons
« Reply #229 on: July 14, 2021, 08:25:10 AM »
By targeting Jodi's family,  you demean poor Jodi, by implying the guilt of others without proof, you demean Jodi.


I don't see that anyone on this forum is targeting Jodi's family (You Tube is a different matter, and I find some of the comments on there quite appalling).

If one questions Luke's conviction, one is obviously going to consider who else might have done it. It is wrong (and libellous) to  accuse somebody without proof, but it isn't wrong to wonder----IMO.

We don't live in a perfect world, I'm afraid, and victims' families are not always whiter than white-------no, I am not accusing any family in particular, just stating a general fact. We read some dreadful things in the news.

Offline rulesapply

Re: Sandra's exit - The real reasons
« Reply #230 on: July 14, 2021, 09:59:11 AM »
I saw it this evening---a bit too long, but I didn't think it was awful!!

I watched it too. Still nothing new and far too long. IMO

Offline Natterjack

Re: Sandra's exit - The real reasons
« Reply #231 on: July 14, 2021, 10:01:46 AM »
The frontline documentary points out the change in statements about the dogs reaction. Excerpts are read out by actors of statements by JaJ and SK where they say this happened at the V break and that LM had said the same about the dog  “although he said after the V” Part of LM statement is then read and stated “just passed the V cut in the wall”

So the search party did not in the original statements say LM had walked beyond the V break?
And has it not been said that LM would have to have been some distance beyond this break to match his diagram of being parallel?

Offline rulesapply

Re: Sandra's exit - The real reasons
« Reply #232 on: July 14, 2021, 10:08:00 AM »
The frontline documentary points out the change in statements about the dogs reaction. Excerpts are read out by actors of statements by JaJ and SK where they say this happened at the V break and that LM had said the same about the dog  “although he said after the V” Part of LM statement is then read and stated “just passed the V cut in the wall”

So the search party did not in the original statements say LM had walked beyond the V break?
And has it not been said that LM would have to have been some distance beyond this break to match his diagram of being parallel?

I would like to see the statements themselves rather than rely on the documentary. I imagine that someone could suggest pretty much anything to people who had just found their dead family member though. Especially if they had no reason to doubt at the time.

Offline faithlilly

Re: Sandra's exit - The real reasons
« Reply #233 on: July 14, 2021, 10:28:08 AM »
I would like to see the statements themselves rather than rely on the documentary. I imagine that someone could suggest pretty much anything to people who had just found their dead family member though. Especially if they had no reason to doubt at the time.

To a certain point I agree but SK was not a family member and gave the same description. Three witnesses whose statements were taken and the three witnesses gave the very same account of the finding of the body. Surely even you most appreciate that that is beyond coincidence?
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline rulesapply

Re: Sandra's exit - The real reasons
« Reply #234 on: July 14, 2021, 10:36:10 AM »
To a certain point I agree but SK was not a family member and gave the same description. Three witnesses whose statements were taken and the three witnesses gave the very same account of the finding of the body. Surely even you most appreciate that that is beyond coincidence?

I believe it would have been easy to suggest anything to all three given the circumstances. No coincidences if the same story had been suggested to the other members of the search party by LM. Maybe it wasn't until later they remembered what really happened. Just a suggestion.

Offline Parky41

Re: Sandra's exit - The real reasons
« Reply #235 on: July 14, 2021, 11:24:30 AM »
As I have already said, my post was not about Jodi’s mum but the search trio who it is beyond doubt lied under oath, I can post a link to the Frontline Scotland programme if that will help clarify my point? My heart goes out to all Jodi’s family for their loss and while I understand how easy their emotions must have been to manipulate at the time there is no excuse for lying under oath when an individual’s liberty is at stake.

I have said nothing to demean Jodi but please post my words if you feel I have. You do yourself and not me a discredit  when using that tragic girl as a tactic to unjustly smear me.

Quote
If Dr Lean had constantly told the public that I’d lied under oath I’d certainly be contacting lawyers yet not a word. In fact the BBC accused the search trio of the same thing and no retraction was sought and none made. That really does speak volumes.



What a lot of tosh. You are the one who is saying the search trio lied. That manipulation of half truths that Lean has always used. By using the dog as a smokescreen. To draw away from the evidence that LM himself gave. So for once, instead of spouting the usual, meaningless nonsense and trying to pass the buck to FS, away from Lean. Of which the programme was based upon. You are yet again kickstarting the dogsbodies work, for those with very little in the way of much upstairs. The point you were trying to make, was that Lean onto FS were saying Jodi's family lied. They are your words, the dogsbodies words. For the most part here, Leans alter ego. That using something from their statement at the end of July, infers they were lying on Oath? - Your are doing that, Leans intention in her case, is hoping the brainless will also do that - state they were lying. And the mugs just keep on giving, spouting the liable for her. That clear passing the buck, putting the onus of blame onto others. They had, as LM had, clarified their statements.

And only highlighting yet again the evidence that convicted LM. Of his special knowledge. The dog had absolutely nothing to do with Jodi being found. So instead of making this same predictive bleat - Put up the areas of those statements. In proper sequence with full sentences. Where anyone, who is actually looking at LM V HMA  instead of Lean V Others. Can see exactly what was said. I will refresh for you, yet again. Some torture that you love so much.

LM led the search party to RDP. There can be no doubt he was prepped and ready, that is no doubt. For Judith had barely lifted that phone to call the police and LM was all but on RDP. In less that 9mins. There was no getting ready, he was already suited and booted. And again that is due to special knowledge. He had lied about being home, he only arrived home, pretty much bang on 10pm, Jodi's curfew time. He was waiting on the call, he knew that Jodi would be known to be missing any moment. And he knew he would be that first port of call, for he knew her parents believed she had been with him that evening. And that is exactly what happened. They contacted him, telling their daughter to get home. (Judith)

Jodi was reported missing at 10.50, LM was on RDP pre 11pm. He was still on this path at 11.20pm. He made it clear to her mother that he was on the path, to claim to have a look before going to Jodi's house. He stayed on that path, drawing the members of Jodi's family there. And we are not interested in every other smoke screen in Lean V others. We are interested in LM V HMA. The nonsense of searching caravan parks and goodness knows what else. For again, those with just a fragment of intelligence, realise clearly there was not time for anything else, other than what was fed to them. Of Luke telling them that Jodi had not turned up in Newbattle, that he was going look on the path, that he stayed on this path. That he was actually on this path before the search trio had even left Mayfield.

That when they did meet, he had asked if they had brought anything of Jodi's with them, for he had asked them to bring something. They did not get a chance, as he was still on the path. - The dog and the smokescreen. LM, at the first opportunity, where the wall is broken along it's length, scaled it, and looked into the woodland with his torch. At the very next opportunity, where the wall was broken horizontally LM entered the woodland. - This is what the search trio always said. They did not change it. From the first they stated those two things, of the Gino spot, and of the V break. Upon arriving at both. They did mention the dog, of it pulling to the undergrowth of the wall, of it standing up at the V. Of pulling Luke. Of LM going into the woods, of turning to his left. Of Kelly and Janine then walking past the V, that they had barely walked ten feet when Mitchell shouted.

LM, never mentioned the Gino spot? LM then stated that "they" had walked past this break in the wall, some distance, not even 20yards when his dog alerted him to something. That the dog was standing up at the wall, air sniffing. That "he" backtracked to the V, where it was easy to climb over. That he had given the lead to AW to hold. Where he used words such as dog leading him to Jodi, dog finding Jodi. - Only him.

To then clarify further, same as with the search trio. But LM went one step better, he drew a map to show the police exactly where "they" were. Parallel to where Jodi lay in the woods. LM did this as he needed to explain why he knew exactly where to go when he went into the woods. But he also lied here, for LM claimed to have shone his torch around everywhere when he entered the woods. He attempted to show that the ground was unfamiliar. LM was a compulsive liar. For he was seen, and it was stated in those first accounts, as both JaJ and AW had saw LM go over and turn to his left, immediately to his left. Where JaJ mentions him looking around in the woods, is exactly what he was doing whilst they continued those 10steps or so. He was, as it appeared, searching in the woods when they continued their walk. Barely ten ft and he shouted.

So those clear contrasts, Luke - No Gino, no JaJ and SK being at the V also when Mitchell went over. And the police saw those stark contrasts. For they knew that SK could not have seen the dogs head level with the V, that JaJ could not have seen the dog pulling to the V, that she could not have seen LM in the woods and turning left. If they had been and done what Mitchell claimed. That is those first accounts. Of using a handful of words and omitting the rest - the whole context is missing. It means absolutely nothing on it's own. When LM said past the V he was asked how far past and he gave how far past.

Four people and only one similarity - the dog standing up on the wall. One account was the dog some 40ft (not even 20yrds) past this V, the other directly at the V. Pulling. One account some 40ft past, the other to the V (break) on approaching it from the East end of the path. The clarifications were - that it was LM leading his dog on approaching the V. Luke's was that the dog, the search party were all passed the V, parallel to where Jodi lay.

And the time factors. 10.38pm text telling Jodi to get home. 10.49, Mitchells offer to go to Jodi's to look on the path. 10.50pm call to the police. 10.59pm LM tells Judith he is on/at the path. 11.18pm search trio coming out complex. Police in attendance at Jodi's house. 11.34pm first call to the emergency services.

And it is here, when you actually know the context, of what was said in reality in those first accounts, the clear reason why the dog is used as a smokescreen. For to actually show you those statements, one would see clearly why the police were suspicious. It is and has always been desperation in the case of Lean V Others. To draw away from the clear events of that evening. To attempt to cast dispersion upon the search trio, to draw away from Mitchell, of that clear specialist knowledge that only the killer knew. The killer being LM.

And he just kept on lying to Lean, sucking her right in when first relating all this to her. Of that clear confirmation bias when she started learning those accounts he gave in those statements, of air brushing them over. Of scouring over everything to do with the search trio, scraping for anything to use, to distract away from Mitchell. Those smokescreens. The dog, the searching "up here" and the blatant lies. Of walking past YW's, going backwards to add time. Of coming from the top of Mayfield, to add time. Of an ancient arthritic gran, to add time. In this Lean V Others. For in LM V HMA it could not be clearer, that only the killer of Jodi Jones could have did what Mitchell did - for he was. And Lean has tried her damnedest to fit Mitchells version around those others. They do not fit, for there was no time for any of what Mitchell claimed, And that is why there is that desperation, in attempting to add time onto the search trio.

And more of Lean V Others. The police. To draw away again from Mitchell. LM was NOT segregated immediately from others. He was asked to show the police where, he then joined the others near the high school. He was with them for ages. Sitting with his mobile phone and cadging fags. When he was eventually taken to Dalkeith police station, it was for easy access for his mother. She had been drinking and could not drive. The police were not in possession of his phone when she was attempting to get hold of him. LM was ignoring his mother. He still had his phone on him, fiddling about with it in the back of the police car. In his hand when the car stopped to speak with his mother. Who asked the police "is he under arrest?". CM arrived at Dalkeith police station just minutes behind her son. The station was only a few minutes walk from her house. Luke Mitchell had fed Leans head full of nonsense in that calm before the storm period of time, that seven months before his arrest. - And she soaked every single word up. Did Lean end up feeling the proverbial fool? Perhaps this also, has that need, that drive. To get others to think the same, so it can't just be her he made a complete tit of ?

These are only a fraction of the clear factors in LM V HMA - that have been drowned in the new version of Lean V Others. For the gullible who readily soak it up?
« Last Edit: July 14, 2021, 11:28:43 AM by Parky41 »

Offline Nicholas

Re: Sandra's exit - The real reasons
« Reply #236 on: July 14, 2021, 11:59:32 AM »


LM led the search party to RDP.

We’ve still not seen his police witness statements/transcripts of his police interviews in full

Nor the transcripts of what he said to the 999 operator

Did killer Luke Mitchell specifically tell the operator they were on Roans dyke path (RDP) and mention the V in the wall he’d climbed over?
« Last Edit: July 14, 2021, 02:46:25 PM by Nicholas »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: Sandra's exit - The real reasons
« Reply #237 on: July 14, 2021, 12:04:06 PM »
The dog had absolutely nothing to do with Jodi being found.


Did the police ask killer Luke Mitchell during any of his interviews whether or not he had revisited the crime scene when he was with Mia the dog when he took her out for a walk to allegedly ‘save his mums legs’ ?
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline rulesapply

Re: Sandra's exit - The real reasons
« Reply #238 on: July 14, 2021, 12:05:28 PM »
And if you listen to Sandra Leans live from just the week before - she said she wouldn’t be stepping down  *&^^&

Hi. Do you know if the Shaun Attwood video was live or pre recorded?

Offline Nicholas

Re: Sandra's exit - The real reasons
« Reply #239 on: July 14, 2021, 12:07:27 PM »
Hi. Do you know if the Shaun Attwood video was live or pre recorded?

I’ve no idea. Possibly pre recorded and edited?

I’ve not yet listened to it in full.

I’ve only managed a few minutes here and there
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation