Was there ever any evidence of criminality against the McCanns?

[debunker]

Please don't encourage a debate on this subject. It is one of my specialties.

Enough about YOU

reply to the post kindly

Please don't call me 'kindly'

[registrar]

sorry 'Hero Member'

that's your official title I take it?

[Angelo222]

The basic evidence against the McCanns is Means and Opportunity.

Right - so you have said earlier.  So let's be having these means and opportunity.  And what happened to motive?

You don't need all three.

For instance, motive is totally missing from offences such as Manslaughter as there is no necessity to prove mens rea.

Means and opportunity are two pillars of evidence. There is such evidence against the McCanns.

Spell it out then...where?

_{listens for the ruffle of dictionary pages}   

[debunker]

sorry 'Hero Member'

that's your official title I take it?

Yes, as yours in Junior member. Should you hit 1000 posts I am sure that you too will see that pop up by your name- 500 I think for full member.

Stop being silly!

[debunker]

The basic evidence against the McCanns is Means and Opportunity.

Right - so you have said earlier.  So let's be having these means and opportunity.  And what happened to motive?

You don't need all three.

For instance, motive is totally missing from offences such as Manslaughter as there is no necessity to prove mens rea.

Means and opportunity are two pillars of evidence. There is such evidence against the McCanns.

Spell it out then...where?

Do you not understand simple English words.

Means- they were physically able to either kill or dispose of Madeleine- they had the means.

Opportunity- they were in contact with her long enough to do so.

I don't believe for one moment that any of the above happens, but having means and opportunity are basic elements of EVIDENCE when that word is used properly.

There is EVIDENCE of means and Opportunity against them as they were capable and present in a way there is no evidence of means and opportunity against me because I can prove that I was in Scotland all of the first five months of 2007.

[Angelo222]

What evidence Debunker???

[debunker]

What evidence Debunker???

That they had the means and opportunity.

You really don't get this dictionary thing, do you?

[Angelo222]

Wise up for heavens sake....everyone in the Ocean club had the same means and opportunity.  I want to see your evidence which sets the McCanns apart from the rest.

You wouldnt make a very good lawyer would you debunker??   

[debunker]

Apologies for using Wikipedia but it is at least clear and concise:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Means,_motive,_and_opportunity

"In US Criminal law, means, motive, and opportunity is a popular cultural summation of the three aspects of a crime that must be established before guilt can be determined in a criminal proceeding. Respectively, they refer to: the ability of the defendant to commit the crime (means), the reason the defendant felt the need to commit the crime (motive), and whether or not the defendant had the chance to commit the crime (opportunity). Opportunity is most often disproved by use of an alibi, which can prove the accused was not able to commit the crime as he or she did not have the correct set of circumstances to commit the crime as it occurred. Motive is not an element of many crimes, but proving motive can often make it easier to convince a jury of the elements that must be proved for a conviction.
Establishing the presence of these three elements is not, in and of itself, sufficient to convict beyond a reasonable doubt; the evidence must prove that an opportunity presented was indeed taken by the accused and for the crime with which he or she is charged."

Evidence equals facts

Evidence against means any facts that might be used to try to prove guilt

If the evidence is good enough, it becaomes proof; if it is not, it remains evidence.

[Admin]

Naughty Angello... hook and worm?

Portugal isn't in the USA last time we looked Debunker.

[debunker]

Wise up for heavens sake....everyone in the Ocean club had the same means and opportunity.  I want to see your evidence which sets the McCanns apart from the rest.

You wouldnt make a very good lawyer would you debunker??   

No, but I have taught law affecting the Mental Health Act, and various other aspects of the Law necessary for people treating people with mental illness.

Yes, they all had means and opportunity as I have stated above. That is evidence against them. The same can be said of the McCanns.

Evidence does not have to be proof. Evidence is merely facts or allegations that may be used to attempt to prove something.

That is what the dictionaries say.

[Angelo222]

Naughty Angello... hook and worm?

Portugal isn't in the USA last time we looked Debunker.

Sorry 

Debunker has totally failed to provide any evidence against the McCanns so I propose making this a myth.

Last time I looked it was a court of law which these issue relate to and not a mental hospital.

[ferryman]

I did suggest a possible compromise on another thread that got lost, I think, a semantic distinction between evidence and suspicion.

Can we, perhaps, concede that there is evidence that doesn't lead to suspicion?

[registrar]

Naughty Angello... hook and worm?

Portugal isn't in the USA last time we looked Debunker.

Sorry 

Debunker has totally failed to provide any evidence against the McCanns so I propose making this a myth.

Last time I looked it was a court of law which these issue relate to and not a mental hospital.

That's got my vote

a little knowledge is a dangerous thing

[debunker]

Naughty Angello... hook and worm?

Portugal isn't in the USA last time we looked Debunker.

All of these three concepts occur in English and Welsh Law and in Continental Law.

In order for someone to be found guilty of a criome they necessarily need to have the ability to do so, the time span to do it; this goes back beyond Roman Law to Classical Greece, Eygyptian Laws and even to Hammurabi.

If the prosecution cannot prove ability and opportunity, no crime exists. Therefore facts about means and opportunity are evidence (as defined in the dictionaries and in Law!)