Author Topic: AG said he couldn't explain how the McCanns could be responsible - Can you?  (Read 26352 times)

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AnneGuedes

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If you agree with Mo Stache's rectification, Mrs B., I'll edit my posts.

Offline Mo Stache

I'm not sure anyone is capable to do a "better job", because Magalhaes e Menezes did no job on that respect. He doesn't say "he was unable", he says "if, hypothetically, one...., it would still have to be explained how, etc.".
This is an extremely delicate issue, and I wonder whether you'll get answers, Mrs B.
He says that no one (which I understand as being the police and forensics) has provided the explanation as "to how, where through, when, with what means, with the help of whom and how they freed themselves of the body within the restricted time frame" while being watched 24/7. And because no one has provided answers to the above questions, it is his finding that the McCann's cannot be implicated in the assumption that they killed and disposed of Madeleine's body.
In short - He has ruled out the fact that Madeleine's parents are complicit in murdering and concealing of her body, because there is no evidence to support that assumption.
You're interpreting Magalhães e Menezes. Why do you "rewrite" him ? He clearly says that no evidence of any crime was found as no evidence was found the arguidos had committed any crime.
I realise that language is a barrier here; I didn't "rewrite" what he said, I explained it so that it was easily understood. You are correct in saying he did say no evidence of any crime, that is why Mrs B. is inviting those who believe that the McCann's had some part to play in Madeleine's death, to come forward and provide the answers to the questions the Attorney General has said could not be answered.


Offline Mrs. B

OK Anne, what DO you think they're responsible for, what type of crime, if any, do you think they committed?

Offline Mo Stache

Anne
Mrs B. is inviting those who do believe the McCann's are guilty of murdering Madeleine and concealing her body to provide the answers the Attorney General has asked. To explain -  means, motive and opportunity.
I didn't understand that Mrs B. invited those who believe in murder. If so, then I'll erase my posts, because this is not my opinion.
Sorry let me rephrase that - Inviting those who believe the McCann's are responsible for Madeleine's death.
Again I don't agree ! I certainly wouldn't say they're responsible for her death. I'm not in a superior position allowing me to make such a claim.
If you don't believe the McCann's are responsible for her death then this thread is not directed at you. There is no need to edit your posts either. You have demonstrated that you are not one of the posters who believe the parents had anything to do with her death therefore the thread is open to those who do.

AnneGuedes

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OK Anne, what DO you think they're responsible for, what type of crime, if any, do you think they committed?
Something terrible happened, an enormous disaster, I don't know of which kind though I have some ideas. Mr Salcedas can't have invented the scream.
I'm not here to attribute responsibilities, but to understand, more than the McCanns, human nature. You could have observed this, Mrs B., through my answers to Shona yesterday.

Offline Mrs. B

Anne
Mrs B. is inviting those who do believe the McCann's are guilty of murdering Madeleine and concealing her body to provide the answers the Attorney General has asked. To explain -  means, motive and opportunity.
I didn't understand that Mrs B. invited those who believe in murder. If so, then I'll erase my posts, because this is not my opinion.
Sorry let me rephrase that - Inviting those who believe the McCann's are responsible for Madeleine's death.
Again I don't agree ! I certainly wouldn't say they're responsible for her death. I'm not in a superior position allowing me to make such a claim.
If you don't believe the McCann's are responsible for her death then this thread is not directed at you. There is no need to edit your posts either. You have demonstrated that you are not one of the posters who believe the parents had anything to do with her death therefore the thread is open to those who do.

Or concealment of her body, if that's more "acceptable" scenario to some (for lack of a better word, of course).

AnneGuedes

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I realise that language is a barrier here; I didn't "rewrite" what he said, I explained it so that it was easily understood. You are correct in saying he did say no evidence of any crime, that is why Mrs B. is inviting those who believe that the McCann's had some part to play in Madeleine's death, to come forward and provide the answers to the questions the Attorney General has said could not be answered.
No, Mo Stache, no language barrier here. Explaining is rewriting, unless you're the author !

Offline Mrs. B

OK Anne, what DO you think they're responsible for, what type of crime, if any, do you think they committed?
Something terrible happened, an enormous disaster, I don't know of which kind though I have some ideas. Mr Salcedas can't have invented the scream.
I'm not here to attribute responsibilities, but to understand, more than the McCanns, human nature. You could have observed this, Mrs B., through my answers to Shona yesterday.

OK, and then what? What happened after the "disaster"?

ETA With respect to the terrible screaming - which was heard AFTER the alarm was raised, I find it utterly natural. If I just realized my child had been abducted, chances are I'd scream like a wounded animal myself or I'd go catatonic. There are no rules on how to behave in moments of extreme panic & despair.
« Last Edit: May 14, 2013, 12:23:39 PM by Mrs. B »

Offline Mo Stache


I realise that language is a barrier here; I didn't "rewrite" what he said, I explained it so that it was easily understood. You are correct in saying he did say no evidence of any crime, that is why Mrs B. is inviting those who believe that the McCann's had some part to play in Madeleine's death, to come forward and provide the answers to the questions the Attorney General has said could not be answered.
No, Mo Stache, no language barrier here. Explaining is rewriting, unless you're the author !
With respect Anne there is a huge language barrier here.

Offline Mo Stache

OK Anne, what DO you think they're responsible for, what type of crime, if any, do you think they committed?
Something terrible happened, an enormous disaster, I don't know of which kind though I have some ideas. Mr Salcedas can't have invented the scream.
I'm not here to attribute responsibilities, but to understand, more than the McCanns, human nature. You could have observed this, Mrs B., through my answers to Shona yesterday.
Who in your opinion was responsible for the "enormous disaster"?

AnneGuedes

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With respect to the terrible screaming - which was heard AFTER the alarm was raised, I find it utterly natural.
Just before the alarm was raised, or rather when discovering, would make more sense to me.
Of course Mr Salcedas' varying testimonies  turn difficult to know when the scream occurred.

AnneGuedes

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With respect Anne there is a huge language barrier here.
Well, if you call it "barrier", then put it in the plural, because you're explaining a sentence that was translated, so you're interpreting, not the author, but the translator.

AnneGuedes

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Who in your opinion was responsible for the "enormous disaster"?
I don't know, Mo Stache, and can't actually. A conjunction of factors likely.

Offline DCI

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With respect to the terrible screaming - which was heard AFTER the alarm was raised, I find it utterly natural.
Just before the alarm was raised, or rather when discovering, would make more sense to me.
Of course Mr Salcedas' varying testimonies  turn difficult to know when the scream occurred.

Where do they vary, Anne?

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/J-T-R-Salcedas.htm

At that time, at about 22.20 - 22.30 he noticed that there was only one person sitting at the group's table, the oldest of them and he asked her jokingly whether they had left her alone.

The person in question said that the others had gone to the apartment to look for a girl who had disappeared. Seconds later Madeleine's father appeared, greatly agitated, looking for his daughter everywhere, obviously and immediately heading towards the pool and surrounding areas.

Shortly afterwards Luz Ocean Club was in a state of absolute commotion. Everyone was trying to help in the search for Madeleine which was multiplied in numerous search actions over a large perimeter. The witness immediately perceived the seriousness of the situation. Madeleine's mother was shouting desperately for her daughter. The witness told another chef at the Millenium restaurant so that he would also help in the searches.


http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/JERONIMO-SALCEDAS.htm

On the night Madeleine disappeared, everything appeared normal. I remember that when I took notice of the disappearance, I had been in the restaurant speaking with my two colleagues?Ze and Ricardo who were on break. I returned to the restaurant and noticed that the table of nine was empty with the exception of the older woman. I went over to the table and joked with her: ?They've left you alone?? She responded more of less with these words: ?No, they went to see if the little girl was there.? I responded that I hoped they would find her somewhere in the apartment. At saying this, I saw the man. Who I knew later to be Madeleines father, running to the pool and to the childrens play area in the Tapas zone as if looking for someone. It immediately hit me that after talking to the older woman, that the little girl had not been found. I offered to alert the workers at the Milenium Restaurant and the man agreed. He then left again running to continue searching. I believe that this was between 21H30 and 22H00 but do not remember with certainty.

I went to find Ze and Ricardo to give them the news and to get their help in searching for the missing girl. I saw the head of the Milenium Restaurant in the Tapas and asked him to telephone the restaurant.

I ran out of the Tapas and noticed that some of the childcare works of the Mark Warner had begun to arrive. At the point I left the Tapas I heard a scream from a woman I did not know. I do not know who screamed, but I had never heard a similar cry. I cannot even describe it but thought it had come from the child's mother.
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AnneGuedes

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At that time, at about 22.20 - 22.30 he noticed that there was only one person sitting at the group's table, the oldest of them and he asked her jokingly whether they had left her alone.

The person in question said that the others had gone to the apartment to look for a girl who had disappeared. Seconds later Madeleine's father appeared, greatly agitated, looking for his daughter everywhere, obviously and immediately heading towards the pool and surrounding areas.

Shortly afterwards Luz Ocean Club was in a state of absolute commotion. Everyone was trying to help in the search for Madeleine which was multiplied in numerous search actions over a large perimeter. The witness immediately perceived the seriousness of the situation. Madeleine's mother was shouting desperately for her daughter. The witness told another chef at the Millenium restaurant so that he would also help in the searches.


http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/JERONIMO-SALCEDAS.htm

On the night Madeleine disappeared, everything appeared normal. I remember that when I took notice of the disappearance, I had been in the restaurant speaking with my two colleagues?Ze and Ricardo who were on break. I returned to the restaurant and noticed that the table of nine was empty with the exception of the older woman. I went over to the table and joked with her: ?They've left you alone?? She responded more of less with these words: ?No, they went to see if the little girl was there.? I responded that I hoped they would find her somewhere in the apartment. At saying this, I saw the man. Who I knew later to be Madeleines father, running to the pool and to the childrens play area in the Tapas zone as if looking for someone. It immediately hit me that after talking to the older woman, that the little girl had not been found. I offered to alert the workers at the Milenium Restaurant and the man agreed. He then left again running to continue searching. I believe that this was between 21H30 and 22H00 but do not remember with certainty.

I went to find Ze and Ricardo to give them the news and to get their help in searching for the missing girl. I saw the head of the Milenium Restaurant in the Tapas and asked him to telephone the restaurant.