Could Angus Symington have been mistaken for Robert Murat?

[Admin]

Could it be mistaken identity?

Witnesses may have mistaken suspect Robert Murat for his British 'double'



_{Lookalikes: Robert Murat (left) and Angus Symington (right) are the same build and height, both British and both working in property in Praia da Luz.}

Eight key witnesses who told police they saw Robert Murat on the night Madeleine McCann vanished could have named the wrong man, it was revealed yesterday.

A British businessman with access to the Ocean Club complex where she disappeared looks so similar to the police suspect that even Mr Murat admitted: "It could be me."

His lawyer is now set to investigate whether the eight witnesses who said they saw Mr Murat on May 3 could have mistaken the other British expat, Angus Symington, for him.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-510083/Madeleine-Witnesses-mistaken-suspect-Robert-Murat-British-double.html#ixzz2Tlv5KpKh

[AnneGuedes]

Could it be mistaken identity Anne?

I think it was, but I don't want to exhibit Adriaan Jacobus Van Marais' picture here. You can see it in Pamalam's site. He went close to the G5 many times as he was searching, wears glasses, is about Robert M's age, brown hair and, main detail, speaks fluent Portuguese (he's SouthAfrican).

[sadie]

Which Symington are we on about? 

Personally as a portrait and figure artist I dont think Angus is very like Robert Murat.  I saw Angus in 2010 and he is altogether different in style as well as features and hair colour.  Murats defining features after dark, would be his hairline [pale against dark] and his creased forehead.  Also his wavy hair

The other guy, Adriaan Jacobus Van Marais, is an absolute non runner, imo.

[Redblossom]

Which Symington are we on about? 

Personally as a portrait and figure artist I dont think Angus is very like Robert Murat.  I saw Angus in 2010 and he is altogether different in style as well as features and hair colour.  Murats defining features after dark, would be his hairline [pale against dark] and his creased forehead.  Also his wavy hair

The other guy, Adriaan Jacobus Van Marais, is an absolute non runner, imo.

I have no idea, nothing to do with me

[DCI]

David Symington, the father of Angus Symington, was the owner of the Ocean club. I can't remember when he sold it, but he was still the owner in 2008. Supposedly a friend of John Major.  .

Apparently Robert Murat is a descendent of Beatrice Atkinson's first Aunt, Maragret Atkinson who married the Oporto Wine Magnate, Henry Murat in the mid-to-late1800s (both Henry and Queriol Murat were grandson and great-grandson of Peter Murat, one of the earliest Port Shipping Merchants in Oporto

[Carana]

From perhaps a more down-to-earth perspective...

When Murat was made arguido, it seems quite likely that people had what may well have been a WTF flashback moment. Debunker has posted several cites concerning memory and its potential for manipulation. I've also posted articles / interviews on the sensibility effect.

I find it totally plausible that, in low lighting and in the general chaos, different people saw various people who vaguely resembled Murat at the time and were influenced by the fact that he'd been made arguido.

The T3 had had a very long night and they may in fact have confused someone else there that night (early hours of the morning) with RM who appeared later that morning.

- The Tapas lot wouldn't have mistaken David Payne, obviously, but others who didn't know him may have done.

- There was John Hill who also wears glasses (although I don't think he was fluent in Portuguese).

- There could also be some unidentified helpful person who doesn't appear in the files.

[AnneGuedes]

Does one know whether Mr Symington speaks fluent Portuguese and whether he was in PDL on that night ?
The fluency both in Portuguese and English is obviously, imo, what stroke the TP3. And the glasses. John Hill doesn't speak fluent Portuguese.
Recognizing him (before RM was made an arguido) and making a confusion with meeting him the following morning is a thing, maintaining this categorically (only ROB had a vague doubt) 2 months after is another. They haven't hesitated during 3 days like Martin Smith who carefully indicated only 60/80%.

[sadie]

Does one know whether Mr Symington speaks fluent Portuguese and whether he was in PDL on that night ?
The fluency both in Portuguese and English is obviously, imo, what stroke the TP3. And the glasses. John Hill doesn't speak fluent Portuguese.
Recognizing him (before RM was made an arguido) and making a confusion with meeting him the following morning is a thing, maintaining this categorically (only ROB had a vague doubt) 2 months after is another. They haven't hesitated during 3 days like Martin Smith who carefully indicated only 60/80%.

Dont know about the PdL Syms, but I imagine they are the same as the Porto Syms.  All part of the same big family.  Born and raised in PT.  Generally Prep school at the Oporto British School.  Prepared for the Common Entrance Exam, then off as a boarder to a RC public school at the age of about 12/13.  Tertiary education initially at British Unis, followed by a stint travelling the world, experiencing others cultures, learning about the commerce and wine growing in other countries.  Maybe a stint in business in the UK and another University course in another Country.

Brilliant education.  One that in a limited way, (costs money) we have tried to give our daughter

So completely bilingual and probably multi lingual. 

http://www.agoodnose.com/index.php?action=page&p=symington



I have my own copy of this book and it is most interesting.  Seems the Brits see themselves as the elite of Porto and keep themselves very much to their own sort.  There are extracts from the book at the website below.

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=7qadNvWQXOoC&pg=PA185&lpg=PA185&dq=Elites+oporto+british+school+Oporto+cricket+club&source=bl&ots=e0nlliSuR1&sig=1dUSINJgLmfzGhwNefNnxPCbOzc&hl=en&sa=X&ei=BkGaUa3jDaSH4gS3zYDoDQ&ved=0CDQQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=Elites%20oporto%20british%20school%20Oporto%20cricket%20club&f=false


Hope this helps, Anne

[AnneGuedes]

Does one know whether Mr Symington speaks fluent Portuguese and whether he was in PDL on that night ?
The fluency both in Portuguese and English is obviously, imo, what stroke the TP3. And the glasses. John Hill doesn't speak fluent Portuguese.
Recognizing him (before RM was made an arguido) and making a confusion with meeting him the following morning is a thing, maintaining this categorically (only ROB had a vague doubt) 2 months after is another. They haven't hesitated during 3 days like Martin Smith who carefully indicated only 60/80%.

I am sorry, but I am going to keep on pointing out flaws in your colloquial English as you claim you have command of the language.

You should use 'struck' rather than 'stroke'. Struck means hit forcibly (as a metaphor here) and stroke means to gently touch while moving ones hand. Two different words.

As I said I would not normally comment on usage except you have claimed to be an expert. If you were translating a piece and said that what someone had done was to strike someone rather than to stroke them, it would be false.

Such strong verbs that exist still in English cause even native users problems.

Thanks for correcting me.

[Redblossom]

But Mr Murat's hopes that the likeness could help him clear his name were dealt a blow last night when Mr Symington said he left Praia da Luz at 6pm on May 3 and was seven miles away at the time of the witness sightings, between 10pm and midnight.

He said:

"I categorically wasn't around on the night she vanished. I was at home with my family."

"I left Praia da Luz at 6pm on May 3 to go home. I live 10km away from here, so I was not in or around Luz that night. It couldn't have been me."

The Mail told earlier this month how detectives believed the witnesses could also have mistaken a friend of the McCanns, David Payne, for Mr Murat.

*** From the article in the OP, I suppose thats that then here


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-510083/Madeleine-Witnesses-mistaken-suspect-Robert-Murat-British-double.html