Author Topic: The question of the polygraph?  (Read 77505 times)

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Offline Carana

Re: The question of the polygraph?
« Reply #90 on: June 17, 2013, 07:04:43 PM »
The polygraph isn't admitted as evidence in France, Carana. Family members aren't (yet) officially suspected. As I said above, in the US, polygraph is used by family members, in case of a missing child, to contribute to the investigation, not letting the police lose time on them.

So why isn't it standard practice by police forces  in Europe, whatever the alleged crime?

stephen25000

  • Guest
Re: The question of the polygraph?
« Reply #91 on: June 17, 2013, 07:06:07 PM »
It was your assertion that ''You can't be found innocent of a crime unless you have been charged with one and found innocent.''    By that logic then everyone, including yourself, who hasn't been charged with a crime against Madeleine and found innocent of one  -still cannot be perceived to be innocent.   It's your theory not mine.   I prefer - Innocent until proved guilty - and so does the Law thank goodness, as it protects us from lynchmobs.     

In reply to your reply which incidentally had nothing to do with my post - the McCanns did no different to thousands of other parents who, whilst on holiday, leave their children asleep knowing they will be regularly checked. 

People who disagree with that particular baby listening arrangement are entitled to their opinion.   

However the constant attempts to pretend they were the only parents on the planet ever to mirror the Baby Listening Service legally offered by tour operators etc. is completely unfair.   IMO The McCanns are guilty of human error, for which they and their daughter have paid the most terrible price.    The abductor is the criminal here, in case you've forgotten.


(apols to all for going off topic)

You are making excuses,no more and no less.

The cliche, of many other people did what they did, doesn't wash,literally or metaphorically.

It wasn't an error, they did what they did for several nights in a row, leaving their children in an unlocked/locked apartment, in a country they did not know. They went out to wine and dine, and no matter what you say to divert attention, that was and is never acceptable behaviour.

They had left their children with people they did not know during the daytime, yet could not be bothered to pay for a babysitter.

As to an abductor, please provide proof, not rhetoric.

Offline Carana

Re: The question of the polygraph?
« Reply #92 on: June 17, 2013, 07:13:39 PM »
You are making excuses,no more and no less.

The cliche, of many other people did what they did, doesn't wash,literally or metaphorically.

It wasn't an error, they did what they did for several nights in a row, leaving their children in an unlocked/locked apartment, in a country they did not know. They went out to wine and dine, and no matter what you say to divert attention, that was and is never acceptable behaviour.

They had left their children with people they did not know during the daytime, yet could not be bothered to pay for a babysitter.

As to an abductor, please provide proof, not rhetoric.


Isn't there an existing moan thread for having dined outside of the apartment?


stephen25000

  • Guest
Re: The question of the polygraph?
« Reply #93 on: June 17, 2013, 07:19:07 PM »

Isn't there an existing moan thread for having dined outside of the apartment?

Add the drinking to that.

AnneGuedes

  • Guest
Re: The question of the polygraph?
« Reply #94 on: June 17, 2013, 07:32:59 PM »
So why isn't it standard practice by police forces  in Europe, whatever the alleged crime?
Why ? I suggest you ask the Commissaire Viviane Reding (she always answers) responsible for justice issues
http://ec.europa.eu/commission_2010-2014/reding/index_fr.htm

Offline Carana

Re: The question of the polygraph?
« Reply #95 on: June 17, 2013, 07:43:39 PM »
Why ? I suggest you ask the Commissaire Viviane Reding (she always answers) responsible for justice issues
http://ec.europa.eu/commission_2010-2014/reding/index_fr.htm



Thanks for that, Anne. Did you already ask about this? And if so what was the reply?

Redblossom

  • Guest
Re: The question of the polygraph?
« Reply #96 on: June 17, 2013, 07:44:28 PM »

Isn't there an existing moan thread for having dined outside of the apartment?

There is no record of anyone outside the tapas bunch leaving their babies unattended whilst they went out for the evening....common sense should have told them there was a reason there was no baby listening service in PDL, not as if thy were stupid and couldnt figure it out, quite staggering how so many people support what they did or rather excuse it,....the criticism as you well  know had not been about them dining outside the apartment, but not taking their children with them as plenty of other holidaymakers managed to do, or arranging suitable childcare but taking risks, and yes, they took many risks IMO...and as for gerry mccann saying thousands of people wrote to him saying ey had done the same or would do, well, a porky IMO and you also have no idea because any other resort offered baby listening, how many parents actually did leave their babies and toddlers alone

i feel another spin off thread coming up


Offline Carana

Re: The question of the polygraph?
« Reply #97 on: June 17, 2013, 07:58:52 PM »
There is no record of anyone outside the tapas bunch leaving their babies unattended whilst they went out for the evening....common sense should have told them there was a reason there was no baby listening service in PDL, not as if thy were stupid and couldnt figure it out, quite staggering how so many people support what they did or rather excuse it,....the criticism as you well  know had not been about them dining outside the apartment, but not taking their children with them as plenty of other holidaymakers managed to do, or arranging suitable childcare but taking risks, and yes, they took many risks IMO...and as for gerry mccann saying thousands of people wrote to him saying ey had done the same or would do, well, a porky IMO and you also have no idea because any other resort offered baby listening, how many parents actually did leave their babies and toddlers alone

i feel another spin off thread coming up


The connection to a polygraph test by a service provider to a chav TV show being?

Redblossom

  • Guest
Re: The question of the polygraph?
« Reply #98 on: June 17, 2013, 08:04:16 PM »

The connection to a polygraph test by a service provider to a chav TV show being?

You asked a question, which was misleading in itself, i answered

Offline Angelo222

Re: The question of the polygraph?
« Reply #99 on: June 17, 2013, 08:11:44 PM »
The only use a polygraph or lie detector has is to scare suspects into making a confession as happened to Adrian Prout.  In the US they use it as often as they use the coffee maker is routinely.

It has been shown on many occasions that the polygraph cannot be trusted.  In fact in some places the polygraph has become known as the lie creator.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2013, 10:31:41 PM by Angelo222 »
De troothe has the annoying habit of coming to the surface just when you least expect it!!

Je ne regrette rien!!

Offline Outlook

Re: The question of the polygraph?
« Reply #100 on: June 17, 2013, 10:56:52 PM »
The only use a polygraph or lie detector has is to scare suspects into making a confession as happened to Adrian Prout.  In the US they use it as often as they use the coffee maker is routinely.

It has been shown on many occasions that the polygraph cannot be trusted.  In fact in some places the polygraph has become known as the lie creator.
Agreed, the polygraph in all its forms is rubbish and is only any use on "Shock-Jock TV".  You get more sense out of playing with Tarot Cards.  Same goes for "Truth-Drugs" and torture for that matter, (sorry enhanced interrogation techniques).

Guilty people normally use it as a way of claiming innocence but there is no legal or scientific process of using it to prove guilt or innocence.

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: The question of the polygraph?
« Reply #101 on: June 17, 2013, 11:02:30 PM »
Agreed, the polygraph in all its forms is rubbish and is only any use on "Shock-Jock TV".  You get more sense out of playing with Tarot Cards.  Same goes for "Truth-Drugs" and torture for that matter, (sorry enhanced interrogation techniques).

Guilty people normally use it as a way of claiming innocence but there is no legal or scientific process of using it to prove guilt or innocence.

Aren't they supposed to work by measuring increased heart beat in someone likely not to be telling the truth?

AnneGuedes

  • Guest
Re: The question of the polygraph?
« Reply #102 on: June 17, 2013, 11:08:05 PM »
The only use a polygraph or lie detector has is to scare suspects into making a confession
Yes, but lie detectors have to be furbished like dissuasive weapons in the Cold War.

AnneGuedes

  • Guest
Re: The question of the polygraph?
« Reply #103 on: June 17, 2013, 11:22:56 PM »
Agreed, the polygraph in all its forms is rubbish and is only any use on "Shock-Jock TV".  You get more sense out of playing with Tarot Cards.  Same goes for "Truth-Drugs" and torture for that matter, (sorry enhanced interrogation techniques).
What about the GHB (toiffies) or Fantasy, flunitrazépam (better known as Rohypnol3), Zolpidem4 and sometimes kétamine ?

AnneGuedes

  • Guest
Re: The question of the polygraph?
« Reply #104 on: June 17, 2013, 11:28:18 PM »


Thanks for that, Anne. Did you already ask about this? And if so what was the reply?
I wrote to Viviane Reding many years ago, not on that topic but on a practice among teenagers that ends up with death (about 4 a month in the UK) called the fainting lark.