Translations translations and then some...are they reliable or biased?

[AnneGuedes]

No the first version is translated into proper ENGLISH, that's the hallmark of a professional translation, they're generally a lot shorter. The second version is translated into something akin to Pigeon English.

The "McCann" paid translation (which isn't signed..) doesn't respect the original, and there's a mistranslation. It is no literature here, the point is to be the closest possible to the original.
BTW which translation do you use, Mrs. B, the McCann one or the one you're mocking ?

[AnneGuedes]

Where have you seen the McCann's one's, Anne?

I never saw it, of course, but Mrs. B suggested she did and finally sent an extract.

[Chinagirl]

Discussions about the quality of the translations undertaken by amateurs with a certain bias have already occurred on this forum.  Perhaps Guedes should refer to the relevant thread.

To suggest that Astro's rendering of the particular paragraph under discussion in this thread is superior to that done by a professional translator and published as part of a judgment by a senior justice of the UK High Court is arrant nonsense.  There is far more to an accurate translation than merely translating each word or phrase of the one language into the other.  Astro's work was fine enough for interested members of the various forums dedicated to this case, but nowhere near good enough, or accurate enough, for judicial purposes, or the Scotland Yard review team, or the McCanns themselves.

 

[Benice]

Discussions about the quality of the translations undertaken by amateurs with a certain bias have already occurred on this forum.  Perhaps Guedes should refer to the relevant thread.

To suggest that Astro's rendering of the particular paragraph under discussion in this thread is superior to that done by a professional translator and published as part of a judgment by a senior justice of the UK High Court is arrant nonsense.  There is far more to an accurate translation than merely translating each word or phrase of the one language into the other.   Astro's work was fine enough for interested members of the various forums dedicated to this case, but nowhere near good enough, or accurate enough, for judicial purposes, or the Scotland Yard review team, or the McCanns themselves.

This is true.  IMO There are examples of the wrong words being chosen by the interpreter  - which are not in themselves wrong per se, but which give the wrong impression.

I believe the word 'control' was chosen when 'monitor' should have been used.

Also I think the word 'staged' was chosen instead of 'arranged' - concerning the Rev. Hubbard.

Both have caused no end of contraversy.

I'm sure there must be many more.

[DCI]

Here's another lie from Ines

According to 'wonderful translator' Ines:

http://themaddiecasefiles.com/topic13549.html

Observations: The fingerprint traces collected are identified as being the left hand (3x) and forefinger of the left hand (2x), of the missing girl’s mother,

Really? Because that isn't what the original says.....




os dedos medio da mao esquerda (3x) e dedo indicador da mao esquerda (2x).

The middle and indicator FINGERS of Kate's left hand; not her whole left hand.

Changes the whole thing, doesn't it?

One of the central dogmas of the Amaral support groups is that Kate McCann's prints were 'all over' the bedroom window.

That is clearly demonstrated to be an outright LIE - one of many.

And Ines shows no sign of explaining why she is part of that group of people who have been most active in spreading lies.

http://.....2.forumotion.co.uk/t3420-so-much-for-the-wonderful-translators

[AnneGuedes]

Ines translated an enormous number of files for the sake of people like you and Portuguese isn't her mother language.
I reckon you suppressed this introduction :
VESTIGES COLLECTED
5….. Fingerprints….Inside interior window of the children’s bedroom…..DBT…..Suf
5 fingerprints, and not 18..
Now thanks for mentioning the medium finger omission, I'll e-mail Pamalam about that.

[DCI]

Ines translated an enormous number of files for the sake of people like you and Portuguese isn't her mother language.
I reckon you suppressed this introduction :
VESTIGES COLLECTED
5….. Fingerprints….Inside interior window of the children’s bedroom…..DBT…..Suf
5 fingerprints, and not 18..
Now thanks for mentioning the medium finger omission, I'll e-mail Pamalam about that.

And nobody thought to check the translation?

Observations: The fingerprint traces collected are identified as being the left hand (3x) and forefinger of the left hand (2x), of the missing girl’s mother,

Remarks: The fingerprint traces collected are identified with the middle fingers of the left hand (3x) and
forefinger of the left hand (2x), the child's mother

[AnneGuedes]

And nobody thought to check the translation?

Observations: The fingerprint traces collected are identified as being the left hand (3x) and forefinger of the left hand (2x), of the missing girl’s mother,

Remarks: The fingerprint traces collected are identified with the middle fingers of the left hand (3x) and
forefinger of the left hand (2x), the child's mother

DCI, as I said, I've already e-mailed Pamalam and she already answered me she had forwarded to Ines.
It's not the first time I see a mistake and every time I did it was immediately corrected.
I read the files in Portuguese, so the opportunity to compare the original with the translation can't be but fortuitous.

[Carana]

Here's another lie from Ines

According to 'wonderful translator' Ines:

http://themaddiecasefiles.com/topic13549.html

Observations: The fingerprint traces collected are identified as being the left hand (3x) and forefinger of the left hand (2x), of the missing girl’s mother,

Really? Because that isn't what the original says.....




os dedos medio da mao esquerda (3x) e dedo indicador da mao esquerda (2x).

The middle and indicator FINGERS of Kate's left hand; not her whole left hand.

Changes the whole thing, doesn't it?

One of the central dogmas of the Amaral support groups is that Kate McCann's prints were 'all over' the bedroom window.

That is clearly demonstrated to be an outright LIE - one of many.

And Ines shows no sign of explaining why she is part of that group of people who have been most active in spreading lies.

http://.....2.forumotion.co.uk/t3420-so-much-for-the-wonderful-translators

There would seem to be an error in the translation: a few words are missing which would have specified that the prints concerned the middle finger of her left hand as opposed to what may be assumed to be handprints.

[Redblossom]

Unsure what all the fuss is about here, whether it was 5 prints (duplicate) from a few fingers or 5 prints from a whole hand, whats the difference? Making mountains out of molehills comes to mind.

When the files were released and voluntary translators set to work on them, spending thousands of unpaid hours, they did as best they could, Portuguese is a language with so many nuances, not every iota is going to be 100% correct, but to suggest Ines or others deliberately mistranslated things from an agenda to lie  is ludicrous at the very very  best.
if anyone with ingratitude thinks this is the case, then frankly theydont have the right to quote any part of the translated files and use them in their arguments,imo

Another question is WHY did the Brit police have to get the files translated if the mccanns had already had them professionally translated? Any ideas?

Lastly if the outside prints on the shutters which were insufficient belonged to an abductor it means they didnt wear gloves and if they didnt, their prints would have been on the window as well, when they opened it, but none were found, apart from Kates, so that means the entry via the window is a no go

[sadie]

Unsure what all the fuss is about here, whether it was 5 prints (duplicate) from a few fingers or 5 prints from a whole hand, whats the difference? Making mountains out of molehills comes to mind.

When the files were released and voluntary translators set to work on them, spending thousands of unpaid hours, they did as best they could, Portuguese is a language with so many nuances, not every iota is going to be 100% correct, but to suggest Ines or others deliberately mistranslated things from an agenda to lie  is ludicrous at the very very  best.
if anyone with ingratitude thinks this is the case, then frankly theydont have the right to quote any part of the translated files and use them in their arguments,imo

Another question is WHY did the Brit police have to get the files translated if the mccanns had already had them professionally translated? Any ideas?

To the contrary Red

The detail is of absolute importance. 

You have to have things that are true to build from.  In Engineering we called it a datum line.  You cannot build on foundations that are not solid, and untruths are just that ... totally wobbly.

Of course the Brit police will get the files translated themselves.  They may be able to find out lots about the peeps intentions who did the original translations.  They are probably genuine mistakes, but some might not be. 

The police will be very interested in these people, to find out if the mistakes were genuine, just sloppiness, or whether the translators had an agenda.

[sadie]

So the Mccanns own professional translators that they used  years before SY got involves to get the files  translated were sloppy, biased and with an agenda at 100k? And the police are interested in them? Fine. LOL. Dont divert the question, it was why didnt SY use the professional translations the Mccanns had procured. Any answer to that simple question? oh and PS you are allowed to atrempt to reply to that but after that dont address me again as I have requested umpteen times, not interested.

No questions diverted.  The Mccanns have been conned before, they might have been again.  The police would of course have to get independent translations. 

As I suspect you know ,but predfer to be contray about it, I am particularly talking about some of the suspect translations that we have seen before the Mccanns people got involved.  Translations by PT peeps who spoke brilliant English.   I personally know of, and have prints of proving it, of one translation that was changed to suit their agenda after, I mentioned it on forums.  About 3 years ago it was subtly changed, but it altered the meaning totally.

And NO, I am NOT going to share it.

SY are aware.


....moderated ...

[Redblossom]

I hadn't noticed that.

The original:

Refere também um episódio em que o Gerry falou com um Polícia, desconhece a força Policial, alegando que era necessário mais agentes de autoridade par efectuaram a busca.

Another molehill made into a mountain and accusations of volunteer translators deliberately  lying..... It is clear from bothtranslations that Gerry asked for more officers to help in the search,  it is clear from one that he asked for more senior authorities to be involved ie the PJ, that is all, he was not happy with just the gnr there as they were not an investigative force, laughable

Perhaps all those complaining can go try translate some of the tapas groups shambolic rogatoryinterviews as even english people have trouble reading them and trying to understand what they mean and they have the brass neck to complain about minor  translation issues and making them out tobe somethinf they are not, as I said before, if you think that youhave no right to quote anything from the files and your ingratitude is pathetic

[faithlilly]

Take it up with mccann files, they posted it, from the Express 

The Express 

[Carana]

Personally, I find that the volunteer translators have made a huge effort. Without them many of us wouldn't have had a clue as to the content of the files.

There are, however, some mistakes and possibly more than one questionable instances of interpretation.