Translations translations and then some...are they reliable or biased?

[DCI]

Anne, who translated the files from Portuguese to English, for the DVD's, we have?

I take it, you are not going to answer this Anne? Why?

[Redblossom]

That figure comes from Time's online - I think. Though in many other places it is referred to as 100,000 PAGES, I don't know if there's some type of mix up - but £1 per page seems AWFULLY cheap to me, at least I've never used any professional translator who charged that measly sum for a page.

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id237.html

Also, NSY received documents from various sources in various countries, e.g. I think lots came from Spanish Police. Those documents would be needing translating separately. If you are to use documents in any legal circumstances, they'd HAVE to be from an accredited agency or professional.

The figure of 100k is correct, according to Kate Mccann who said so in their documentary. The number of pages is 30 or 40,000 not 100,000.

3.40

[Mrs. B]

I think the 100,000 pages refers to the Operation Grange documents, not the PJ files.

Scotland Yard launched a shadow investigation called Operation Grange to examine more than 100,000 pages of investigative documents.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/05/04/six-years-later-still-no-sign-of-madeleine-mccann.html

[Redblossom]

I think the 100,000 pages refers to the Operation Grange documents, not the PJ files.

Scotland Yard launched a shadow investigation called Operation Grange to examine more than 100,000 pages of investigative documents.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/05/04/six-years-later-still-no-sign-of-madeleine-mccann.html

Thanks.

[Carana]

Quote from: AnneGuedes on June 26, 2013, 11:24:48 PM

    Mrs. B, I don't know who and under which conditions the translations financed by the Fund were done, but all I can tell is that the extract you sent is worse than Astro's translation. Seing only that extract I'll not risk saying it is biased, but I confirm Astro's translation is the only rigorous one.
    The non-involvement of Madeleine's arguido "person of interest" is missing parents  in any criminally the original says "penally"* significant action is apparent this is wrong : seems to result (I admit the PGR is not well at ease and his syntax betrays it) from the fact that they were not in the apartment at the time of her disappearance, their normal behaviour up to that moment and afterwards, as witnessed by the statements of the witnesses, the analysis of the telephone communications and the conclusions of the experts reports…namely the Reports from the FSS and from the National Institute for Legal Medicine (missing ?)
    * For instance, if they concealed their daughter's body, it is not penally relevant, whereas if they'd killed their daughter, that would be "criminal".
    I just hope that the SY's translations are better than the McCann's ones.


Why wouldn't concealing a corpse not be relevant in terms of the penal code?


 Page 128
cr2_128

Section 254

Profaning a corpse or a burial ground

1. Whoever :

a) without the entitled person's consent, removes, destroys or conceals a corpse or part of it, or the ashes of a deceased person ;

shall be punished with imprisonment up to 2 years or with a Fine, up to 240 days.

2. The attempt is punishable

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/RESPONSE-ROGATORY.htm

[Mrs. B]

 

Thanks Carana, that is what we have been saying all along. Hiding or destroying a corpse is a criminal offence in Portugal. I.e. "criminally significant".

ETA Which is probably why the offence is listed under the PORTUGUESE CRIMINAL CODE

[John]

Redblossom.   You have a remarkable ability go find comments within videos, do you keep an index if some sort?

PS Kate said 30,000 files costing some £100,000 to translate.

[Eleanor]

Redblossom.   You have a remarkable ability go find comments within videos, do you keep an index if some sort?

PS Kate said 30,000 files costing some £100,000 to translate.

Thought so.  That sounds pretty professional to me.

[sadie]

Redblossom.   You have a remarkable ability go find comments within videos, do you keep an index if some sort?

PS Kate said 30,000 files costing some £100,000 to translate.

Nah, John

Everything is too rapid and instant.  she has a back up team feeding her stuff much of the time

Only my opinion.

[faithlilly]

Nah, John

Everything is too rapid and instant.  she has a back up team feeding her stuff much of the time

Only my opinion.

 

[sadie]

That's OK   

He who laughs last laughs longest

[Chinagirl]

Guedes:
There's a mistranslation in the second, and this is serious since the translation was used by the court that judged Mr Bennett.

The unsigned translation, paid (I guess by the fund) and used by the UK Court, remarkably manages to include :
1 omission
1 inaccuracy
1 mistranslation

As requested, please detail the omission, inaccuracy, and in particular, the mistranslation that is so serious it affects the Bennett judgment.  This is the paragraph in question:

The non-involvement of Madeleine's parents in any criminally significant action is apparent from the fact that they were not in the apartment at the time of her disappearance, their normal behaviour up to that moment and afterwards, as witnessed by the statements of the witnesses, the analysis of the telephone communications and the conclusions of the experts reports…

[AnneGuedes]

I explained already and I'm not treating you "girl" etc.
And I never said the biased translation had effect on McCann vs Bennett on which I know nothing.

[DCI]

I explained already and I'm not treating you "girl" etc.
And I never said the biased translation had effect on McCann vs Bennett on which I know nothing.

Whats this you said Anne?

This translation issue is basically a question of confidence.
Mrs B believes the Fund paid translation of the final report is better than Astro's. Why ? She doesn't know Portuguese. Ah, those who did it are "professionals" (not identified).
I compared the two translation : Astro's and the paid one. There's a mistranslation in the second, and this is serious since the translation was used by the court that judged Mr Bennett.I beg from now on that whoever cites a translation made by Astro, Ines, or any other to be aware he/she uses the work of someone who generously did it to inform and to indicate the name of the translator.
Please.

[AnneGuedes]

This anecdote shows a UK Court, when an official foreign document is produced by the accusation in a "professional translation", should have it double checked (it might be a right of the defence, but were they prepared to spend money on this ?).
It is yet possible that the translation was ordered by the Court. If one knows, I'd welcome information.
I don't think this particular short extract affected Mr Bennett's position, I think it rather likely comforted Mr and Mrs McCann's one. But what about the rest of the translation ?
Far to suspect UK justice to be corrupted, as John suggested yesterday, I think it happens translators make mistakes. Me too !