Amaral's body in a fridge theory common to both Joana and Madeleine?

[pegasus]

From GA interview: "people who say that they were seen entering an apartment block".
The relevant DCCB letter says that it was only one person who was seen.

[Miro]

If anyone comes across the freezer blog, reported as deleted from Gerry's site, I would like to read please..............

[pathfinder73]

[ im curious to know the size of the fridge in 5a ...would be greatful for any help finding a pic of the fridge ]

Pic of 5A fridge freezer from files 4 May 07

[Redblossom]

[ im curious to know the size of the fridge in 5a ...would be greatful for any help finding a pic of the fridge ]

Pic of 5A fridge freezer from files 4 May 07

Seems like a normal luxury fridge, about a foot lower than the door height, say  perhaps  about 80cm wide? Max? You have a pic there......why ask for another?

Oh well .anyway.....i doubt Madeleines bodywas stuffed in there...police looked inside it that night.....gone >>>>

[pathfinder73]

That pic was in response to someone else - I wasn't replying to myself 

You have two choices if you've got a dead body on your hands and you want to cover it up.

1. You remove the body from the crime scene asap.

2. You wait until it's dark, cold and quiet to do it. So where do you store the body? In the wardrobe or is that fridge a possibility at 7pm not 10pm. The child was seen wearing long sleeves by the Smith family not short sleeves.

[Carana]

I pointed out to you that you overlooked what was actually said in the report about blood being found in several places in the freezer which you felt was ok to describe as a speck of blood...you ignored this observation/comment of mine and dashed off to talk about whose blood it was...thats all....

I answered on here:

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=3050.msg114356#msg114356

[Redblossom]

That pic was in response to someone else - I wasn't replying to myself 

You have two choices if you've got a dead body on your hands and you want to cover it up.

1. You remove the body from the crime scene asap.

2. You wait until it's dark, cold and quiet to do it. So where do you store the body? In the wardrobe or is that fridge a possibility at 7pm not 10pm. The child was seen wearing long sleeves by the Smith family not short sleeves.

Oops, sorry, I didn't realise.

Well, I suppose if that was the case the cadaver dog will have alerted there, unless a cold icy atmosphere destroys the scent? I don't know. I just can't envisage these parents doing such a thing.

PS What has child seen by the Smiths wearing long sleeves got to do with this?

[Redblossom]

I answered on here:

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=3050.msg114356#msg114356

Oh, that's sent me back six weeks or so.....well, I dont understand why you brought this up again now...you already answered that post of mine here...agreeing with what I said.....and your answer on the other forum is now putting the question back? perhaps for balance you should also copy my post and your response on this thread over there then?
Up to you...but Ive more or less left the Cipriano thread discussions...

[Carana]

Oh, that's sent me back six weeks or so.....well, I dont understand why you brought this up again now...you already answered that post of mine here...agreeing with what I said.....and your answer on the other forum is now putting the question back? perhaps for balance you should also copy my post and your response on this thread over there then?
Up to you...but Ive more or less left the Cipriano thread discussions...

At that time, I hadn't read the coordinator's statement, which only mentions one trace of blood.

But it's OT in terms of this thread, which is why I responded in the Cipriano sub-forum.

[Redblossom]

At that time, I hadn't read the coordinator's statement, which only mentions one trace of blood.

But it's OT in terms of this thread, which is why I responded in the Cipriano sub-forum.

OK then....

[colombosstogey]

That pic was in response to someone else - I wasn't replying to myself 

You have two choices if you've got a dead body on your hands and you want to cover it up.

1. You remove the body from the crime scene asap.

2. You wait until it's dark, cold and quiet to do it. So where do you store the body? In the wardrobe or is that fridge a possibility at 7pm not 10pm. The child was seen wearing long sleeves by the Smith family not short sleeves.

I would think a bag would suffice sadly if that was necessary.

That young girl has just been found 17 years old in a grave yard in someone elses grave. Her killer took her there in a suitcase. So if you can put a 17 year old in a suitcase a tiny 3 year old would fit in a small place if that is what happened.

Not sure about the long sleeve smithman in your post what has it to do with fridge?

[pathfinder73]

I'm just throwing some things out in the open. Red makes a good point: would an refrigerated body give of cadaver scent? Dressed in long sleeves if the child was in a cold state. I'm inclined to agree with the hypothesis of stored in bag in the wardrobe (that pile of clothes dumped on that shelf still intrigues me) and Eddie's strong bark alert but the scent at the bottom of the garden is interesting. This is possibly far fetched to some but could the child be hidden there at 8.30pm for the scenario of getting out of the apartment and falling from the balcony. That's a very high risk strategy IMO but if found would explain the death. Moved from the back garden at 9ish to bin. Is there any footage of Grime going back the next day in the daylight with the dogs searching the back garden?

[Carana]

I'm just throwing some things out in the open. Red makes a good point: would an refrigerated body give of cadaver scent? Dressed in long sleeves if the child was in a cold state but that's not important because you would think a blanket would be used. I'm inclined to agree with the hypothesis of bag in the wardrobe (that pile of clothes dumped on that shelf still intrigues me) and Eddie's strong bark alert but the scent at the bottom of the garden is interesting. This is far fetched but could the child be hidden there for the scenario of getting out of the apartment and falling from the balcony. That's a very high risk strategy IMO but if found could explain a death. Is there any footage of Grime going back the next day in the daylight with the dogs searching the back garden?

I don't think that falling-over-balcony theory is that far fetched. However, I haven't found anything to substantiate it. Rebelo seems to have checked that out and the results didn't lead anywhere.

No one has yet explained to me how this child-in-fridge theory was supposed to work in view of the timelines and people (members of T9, OC staff, GNR, PJ, checking wherever a child might have been that night.

Neither have I found anything besides this "reconstruction" that could be construed as any kind of probative evidence that Joana had been stuffed in one.

[pathfinder73]

If the child was in the fridge it wouldn't for a long time so I think stored in bag in wardrobe where Eddie barked is most probable in this scenario. The child would be hidden at 8.30 in the garden (balcony fall if found) and moved to bin around 30 minutes later once all the tapas friends are safely at the table (you don't want to run into one of them at 8.30 carrying a child). The child would be away from the crime scene by 9-9.10pm. Still a very risky operation without using a bag IMO.

[AnneGuedes]

If the child was in the fridge it wouldn't for a long time so I think stored in bag in wardrobe where Eddie barked is most probable in this scenario. The child would be hidden at 8.30 in the garden (balcony fall if found) and moved to bin around 30 minutes later once all the tapas friends are safely at the table (you don't want to run into one of them at 8.30 carrying a child). The child would be away from the crime scene by 9-9.10pm.

Pathfinder, may I remind you that "the child" was their beloved Madeleine and that they hardly would "store" then "hide" and "move" her body ? Carrying once is already too much.