Does Eddie alert to Pork/Pig/Pig Blood? Martin Grime's Statements.

[Cariad]

Its ok Pegasus, I found reference to it though not the original source

From 24 secs

Sooo.....the dogs were alerting.....ground was dug......dumped meat found, dogs did not take interest... continued to alert...human remains found

That's remarkable!

Take a minute out of considering it in light of what it means for either MM or her parents and just marvel at the ability of these dogs.

Just amazing!

Edited to express wonder.

[Redblossom]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2051903/Lisa-Irwin-missing-Cadaver-police-dog-smells-scent-dead-body-parents-bedroom.html

A different incident but certainly worth a read Red !
Claimed abduction, window interfered with AND a cadaver dog scenting cadaver in the bedroom !

I know Pat ....Im still waiting for that list of people who have been found alive after cadaver dogs alerting to where the last place the missing  person was seen.....so far I have been given one example, a particular fluke

Thing is what is annoying about some arguments put forward is not really the idea that the dog could have been wrong or that it might not indicate the death of this child...its  the totally vehement opposition to the idea that it could be the case... that it most probably was or must have been something other than this, and hence we have had the dozen or so other possibilities offered, some so ridiculous and off the sensible scale its embarassing...... the dog was alerting to food, the dog was alerting to urine, bad breath, pigs buried under 5a, the dog was only alerting to please mr grime (courtesy of kate mccann that last one!!) etc etc

PS Wonderfulspam, ironically that is exactly what Kate Mccann wrote in her book, she too doesnt believe in coincidences....a man seen once or twice near the apartment but three times?
!

[Wonderfulspam]

I know Pat ....Im still waiting for that list of people who have been found alive after cadaver dogs alerting to where the last place the missing  person was seen.....so far I have been given one example

Thing is what is annoying about some arguments put forward is not really the idea that the dog could have been wrong or that it might not indicate the death of this child...its  the totally vehement opposition to the idea that it could be the case... that it most probably was or must have been something other than this, and hence we have had the dozen or so other possibilities offered, some so ridiculous and off the sensible scale its embarassing...... the dog was alerting to food, the dog was alerting to urine, bad breath, pigs buried under 5a, the dog was only alerting to please mr grime (courtesy of kate mccann that last one!!) etc etc

PS Wonderfulspam, ironically that is exactly what Kate Mccann wrote in her book, she too doesnt believe in coincidences....a man seen once or twice near the apartment but three times?
!

PS Wonderfulspam, ironically that is exactly what Kate Mccann wrote in her book,

Yes, I used her quote. It's one that sticks in the mind & seems very relevant to the whole case.

[Redblossom]

That's remarkable!

Take a minute out of considering it in light of what it means for either MM or her parents and just marvel at the ability of these dogs.

Just amazing!

Edited to express wonder.

I know.... Even more amazing when theycan detect the scent for ages after a body has been removed! All invaluable to LE.....

[Redblossom]

PS Wonderfulspam, ironically that is exactly what Kate Mccann wrote in her book,

Yes, I used her quote. It's one that sticks in the mind & seems very relevant to the whole case.

Oh LOL, it went right over my head, oops....very true though......

[Wonderfulspam]

Off topic conversation.

I set up this thread specifically to discuss the contradiction in Mr Grime's statement. There are other dog threads for general discussion.

I think it's quite appropriate myself, the thread is about cadaver dogs, we were talking about them.

[Albertini]

Why is it that supporters of the family are all so keen to dismiss the dogs when in actual fact it is entirely possible an abductor killed the child.

They all seem to think that they need to demean grimes and his dogs on the basis it implicates the McCann's.

The child may well have died there but the mccanns insistence the dogs were unreliable instead of being heartbroken that their daughter could have died in there at the hands of an abductor is in my opinion as suspicious as the alerts themselves.

...irrelevant removed ...

[Mr Gray]

Why is it that supporters of the family are all so keen to dismiss the dogs when in actual fact it is entirely possible an abductor killed the child.

They all seem to think that they need to demean grimes and his dogs on the basis it implicates the McCann's.

The child may well have died there but the mccanns insistence the dogs were unreliable instead of being heartbroken that their daughter could have died in there at the hands of an abductor is in my opinion as suspicious as the alerts themselves.

... irrelevant removed ...

 perhaps you have missed my posts...I totally support Grime and what he said about the dogs alerts

[Carana]

We must acknowledge the possible link between the child disappearing and the cadaver dog barking in the place where she was last seen alive

I don't have a problem with that. Dogs alerted. Fact. Fine.

- Is there any certainty as to what they alerted to? I can't see any. There's a possibility to be explored.
- What evidence did those alerts lead to? I can't see any either. 

[Mr Gray]

Had Madeleine been found alive,  then the relentless  questioning of the cadaver dog alert would make sense   ...  in those circumstances we might reasonably have asked ourselves    "So what  was he barking at then  ?  What could have happened to make a dog who barks when he detects the scent of a dead body,  bark in the McCanns' apartment ?" 

As it is,  the ongoing search  for evermore obscure explanations smacks of desperation

Madeleine was  not  found alive,  (  sadly ) ...  nor has has she ever  been seen since

Therefore, it remains the case that  a possible  (  or even likely )  explanation  for  a dog,  who barks when he detects the scent of a dead body,  barking in the very  place where she was last seen alive ,  is that the disappeared  child  died there 

That possibility cannot be dismissed

As I have said it is a possibility that maddie died in the appt...the dogs alert does not affect whether this is possible or not

[John]

I could understand dismissing 1 or 2 alerts from a cadaver dog as being potentially false or misinterpreted.

But when it is 3, 4 , 5 alerts to areas/objects associated with the child it is too much to ignore.

 “One coincidence, two coincidences – maybe they’re still coincidences. Any more than that and it stops being coincidence.

That's a very good point WS.  From everything we have been told about the way in which Eddie alerted surely the chances that four or even five alerts are pure coincidence are way beyond the bounds of possibility.

If Madeleine is eventually found alive and well it will be most interesting to see how the alerts are then explained.

[Rogerandout]

Why is it that supporters of the family are all so keen to dismiss the dogs when in actual fact it is entirely possible an abductor killed the child.

They all seem to think that they need to demean grimes and his dogs on the basis it implicates the McCann's.

The child may well have died there but the mccanns insistence the dogs were unreliable instead of being heartbroken that their daughter could have died in there at the hands of an abductor is in my opinion as suspicious as the alerts themselves.

...irrelevant removed ...

I am quite happy to accept that the McCanns harmed Madeleine if proof is found.

What I am not happy with is unscientific and ridiculous interpretation of dog alerts which are contrary to the serious published research on their reliability.

[Mr Gray]

I could understand dismissing 1 or 2 alerts from a cadaver dog as being potentially false or misinterpreted.

But when it is 3, 4 , 5 alerts to areas/objects associated with the child it is too much to ignore.

 “One coincidence, two coincidences – maybe they’re still coincidences. Any more than that and it stops being coincidence.

 I think there were eleven alerts in jersey and all that was found was a coconut and a letter to the tooth fairy

[Wonderfulspam]

I think there were eleven alerts in jersey and all that was found was a coconut and a letter to the tooth fairy

There were human remains there were there not?

[Redblossom]

I don't have a problem with that. Dogs alerted. Fact. Fine.

- Is there any certainty as to what they alerted to? I can't see any. There's a possibility to be explored.
- What evidence did those alerts lead to? I can't see any either.

What evidence would you have liked?