The inspection of the McCann's clothing by dogs Keela and Eddie in the gym.

[ferryman]

A basic principle of cross-contamination of a death scent is that if something with a death scent comes into contact with anything else (a surface or another object) cross-contamination of the scent is immediate.

Grime himself was asked that question in his rogatory interview and confirmed that was the case.

Clothes were transported from the villa to the gym in bulk standard cardboard boxes.

Not that that mattered, the inspection coming 3 months after the crime, with the clothes (in the meantime) put through washing machines, packed in suitcases, put away together on wardrobe shelves and heaven knows what else.

Cross contamination, if it was going to occur, would long since already have occurred, rendering utterly pointless both inspections at villa and gym.

That's why Mark Harrison disowned UK participation in both inspections; also (no doubt) why he issued PJ personnel with instructions on how to conduct searches in buildings after both inspections

From Grime's rogatory:

'How long does a cadaver have to be in contact with a surface or an object for the odour to be detected''?


Cross-contamination is immediate.

(Martin Grime)

[Redblossom]

Vol IX p.2481
FALSE ALERTS

'False' positives are always a possibility; to date Eddie has not so indicated
operationally or in training. In six years of operational deployment in over 200
criminal case searches the dog has never alerted to meat based and
specifically pork foodstuffs designed for human consumption. Similarly the
dog has never alerted to 'road kill', that is any other dead animal.
My experience as a trainer is that false alerts are normally caused by handler
cueing. All indications by the dog are preceded by a change in bahaviour.
This increased handler confidence in the response. This procedure also stops
handlers 'cueing' and indication. The dogs are allowed to 'free search' and
investigate areas of interest. The handler does not influence their behaviour
other than to direct the search.

[ferryman]

Context is always better, he is obviously not talking about hmself as his dog never made a false positive alert

Vol IX p.2481
FALSE ALERTS

'False' positives are always a possibility; to date Eddie has not so indicated
operationally or in training. In six years of operational deployment in over 200
criminal case searches the dog has never alerted to meat based and
specifically pork foodstuffs designed for human consumption. Similarly the
dog has never alerted to 'road kill', that is any other dead animal.
My experience as a trainer is that false alerts are normally caused by handler
cueing. All indications by the dog are preceded by a change in bahaviour.
This increased handler confidence in the response. This procedure also stops
handlers 'cueing' and indication. The dogs are allowed to 'free search' and
investigate areas of interest. The handler does not influence their behaviour
other than to direct the search.

Alerts in the gym were (most probably) false positives.

[Redblossom]

Alerts in the gym were (most probably) false positives.

In your opinion which doesnt matter......as you are not qualified to say so....over and above the professional

Eddie is trained to screen clothes...read the files!
 

[ferryman]

In your opinion which doesnt matter......as you are not qualified to say so....over and above the professional

Eddie is trained to screen clothes...read the files!
 

In my opinion?

Let's deal, strictly, with the facts.

All clothes laid out in the gym were present, earlier, in the villa, where the only recorded "reaction" was to cuddle-cat.

Then clothes (present in the villa during the inspection of the villa) were transported to the gym and laid out a second time.

Keela was deployed first but didn't react.

Then Eddie was deployed.

He picked stuff up in his mouth and he barked.

Why didn't he bark, also, in the villa as a reaction to any clothes?

[Redblossom]

In my opinion?

Let's deal, strictly, with the facts.

All clothes laid out in the gym were present, earlier, in the villa, where the only recorded "reaction" was to cuddle-cat.

Then clothes (present in the villa during the inspection of the villa) were transported to the gym and laid out a second time.

Keela was deployed first but didn't react.

Then Eddie was deployed.

He picked stuff up in his mouth and he barked.

Why didn't he bark, also, in the villa as a reaction to any clothes?

Either work it out for yourself or if you cant email mr grime, his email address is in the files.....cross contamination and all it means might be a clue...

[pathfinder73]

Eddie gave big bark alerts to the kids red top and Kate's trousers.

[Benice]

In my opinion?

Let's deal, strictly, with the facts.

All clothes laid out in the gym were present, earlier, in the villa, where the only recorded "reaction" was to cuddle-cat.

Then clothes (present in the villa during the inspection of the villa) were transported to the gym and laid out a second time.

Keela was deployed first but didn't react.

Then Eddie was deployed.

He picked stuff up in his mouth and he barked.

Why didn't he bark, also, in the villa as a reaction to any clothes?

A good question Ferryman.

Also - the clothes including CC were originally laid out at on the floor of other premises, but M. Harrison said the place was too dirty and so they were all collected up again, repacked into boxes and removed to the gym.

If the floor on which they had first been laid out was dirty - then contamination could have taken place during that episode.

Another anomaly i.e. - why didn't Eddie alert to CC at the gym?

Quote from Amaral
The soft toy and all the clothes from the house are placed into boxes specially made to preserve evidence. These objects are then conveyed to the decontaminated premises. They are placed on the ground, a good distance apart for the dogs to examine.

At 8pm, Tavares de Almeida calls me to let me know that Mark Harrison requires another place because this one is not sufficiently clean.
Unquote

[John]

An extract from Gonçalo Amaral's book contains the following comments in relation to the deployment of dogs Eddie and Keela in the gym.

It should be pointed out that Amaral was the officer in charge of this exercise.


The soft toy and all the clothes from the house are placed into boxes specially made to preserve evidence. These objects are then conveyed to the decontaminated premises. They are placed on the ground, a good distance apart for the dogs to examine.

At 8pm, Tavares de Almeida calls me to let me know that Mark Harrison requires another place because this one is not sufficiently clean.

- How do I find a place at this kind of time?

- Sort it out!

Julio Barroso offers us the new sports hall in Lagos which, finally, meets the required standards. The objects are once again laid out on the ground and the dogs can start. Eddie alerts us to a strong cadaver odour on some of Kate's clothes, but the CSI dog doesn't detect the slightest trace of blood.


It has been claimed that this extract is in error, that the clothes were not laid out twice. 

For those who feel this to be the case I offer you an opportunity to discuss this claim and provide supporting evidence.

[Benice]

An extract from Gonçalo Amaral's book contains the following comment in relation to the deployment of dogs Eddie and Keela in the gym.

The soft toy and all the clothes from the house are placed into boxes specially made to preserve evidence. These objects are then conveyed to the decontaminated premises. They are placed on the ground, a good distance apart for the dogs to examine.

At 8pm, Tavares de Almeida calls me to let me know that Mark Harrison requires another place because this one is not sufficiently clean.

- How do I find a place at this kind of time?

- Sort it out!

Julio Barroso offers us the new sports hall in Lagos which, finally, meets the required standards. The objects are once again laid out on the ground and the dogs can start. Eddie alerts us to a strong cadaver odour on some of Kate's clothes, but the CSI dog doesn't detect the slightest trace of blood.


It has been claimed that this extract is in error, that the clothes were not laid out twice. 

Please discuss with supporting evidence.

Where and by whom has this claim been made please John? 

[John]

Where and by whom has this claim been made please John?

It is up to members to challenge the claim by Gonçalo Amaral.  If they are correct he is either mistaken or lied about events in his book, alternatively, the book in English has been misinterpreted.  I for one want to get to the bottom of this.

My own view on the inspection of the clothes exercise is that it was a complete mess. Clothing was transported in such a way that cross contamination was inevitable.  The clothes were initially laid out on a dirty floor and then reboxed only to be laid out again once a cleaner, more suitable premises had been found.  These occurrences were nothing less than tawdry and fell well short of best practice. They effectively rendered the tests null and void in my opinion.

[Benice]

It is up to members to challenge the claim by Gonçalo Amaral.  If they are correct he is either mistaken or lied about events in his book, alternatively, the book in English has been misinterpreted. I for one want to get to the bottom of this.

Me too  -  but have to dash off now.   

I look forward to the evidence -  as to why Amaral's claim is erroneous.

[ferryman]

An extract from Gonçalo Amaral's book contains the following comments in relation to the deployment of dogs Eddie and Keela in the gym.

It should be pointed out that Amaral was the officer in charge of this exercise.


The soft toy and all the clothes from the house are placed into boxes specially made to preserve evidence. These objects are then conveyed to the decontaminated premises. They are placed on the ground, a good distance apart for the dogs to examine.

At 8pm, Tavares de Almeida calls me to let me know that Mark Harrison requires another place because this one is not sufficiently clean.

- How do I find a place at this kind of time?

- Sort it out!

Julio Barroso offers us the new sports hall in Lagos which, finally, meets the required standards. The objects are once again laid out on the ground and the dogs can start. Eddie alerts us to a strong cadaver odour on some of Kate's clothes, but the CSI dog doesn't detect the slightest trace of blood.


It has been claimed that this extract is in error, that the clothes were not laid out twice. 

For those who feel this to be the case I offer you an opportunity to discuss this claim and provide supporting evidence.

Given that Harrison, in his summary of all searches, summarised the inspection at the gym as a "pj exercise", I don't think Harrison had anything whatever to do with the inspection in the gym.

[John]

Some of the original videos have been removed from the internet but here is a full length one taken from the original Duarte Levy version showing most of the searches.  It includes footage of the perimeter search in the dark and a reminder of the dog deployment in the gym.  View from 0.58.03

[Carana]

Personally, I can't make any sense of those clothes alerts.

What is the correct alert in responding to clothes supposed to be?

Picking clothes up in his jaws? Barking near them? Both? Either?

How do the various alerts noted by the PJ correspond to those alerts?

ETA: typo corrected.