Author Topic: Did the burglaries at Ocean Club have some relevance to Madeleine?  (Read 60593 times)

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Offline pegasus

Re: Did the burglaries at Ocean Club have some relevance to Madeleine?
« Reply #330 on: April 06, 2014, 12:27:21 AM »
One of many cases of an attempted burglary happening while a child is left home alone.
Location: Humboldt County, California, USA.
A 9-year-old girl is home alone while the adults go out for a jog.
Thinking everyone is out, a burglar enters the residence.
But as soon as he realises there is someone home (the child), the burglar flees.
http://lostcoastoutpost.com/2013/sep/27/9-year-old/
« Last Edit: April 06, 2014, 10:27:39 PM by pegasus »

Offline pegasus

Re: Did the burglaries at Ocean Club have some relevance to Madeleine?
« Reply #331 on: April 06, 2014, 12:36:29 AM »
Another of the many cases of attempted burglary while a child is home alone.
Location: Troutdale, Oregon, USA:
A 12-year-old girl is home alone
Burglar thinks no-one is home, so burglar enters residence.
The girl hides in a bedroom.
http://www.aolnews.com/2010/05/27/home-alone-12-year-old-thwarts-burglary/
« Last Edit: April 06, 2014, 10:26:59 PM by pegasus »

Offline pegasus

Re: Did the burglaries at Ocean Club have some relevance to Madeleine?
« Reply #332 on: April 06, 2014, 12:49:26 AM »
And another attempted burglary while child home alone.
Location: Camas, Washington State, USA.
A 10-year-old girl is home (off school sick), and parent goes out briefly.
A burglar thinks everyone is out, and enters residence.
The girl hides in the pantry.
http://www.columbian.com/news/2012/oct/17/Camas-10-year-old-home-alone-when-burglars-strike/
« Last Edit: April 06, 2014, 10:27:20 PM by pegasus »

Offline pegasus

Re: Did the burglaries at Ocean Club have some relevance to Madeleine?
« Reply #333 on: April 06, 2014, 10:44:26 PM »
In cases of attempted burglary, where it turns out that a child is home alone, the general pattern IMO is:

1. Often an adult/adults have just left the residence.
2. The residence looks like no-one is home.
3. The burglar thinks no-one is home.
4. The burglar typically takes the further precaution of first knocking/ringing the door to confirm no-one is home.
5. Typically the child does not answer the door (sometimes because parent has told child not to answer door).
6. If the burglar sees the child, the burglar immediately abandons the burglary and flees without harming the child.
7. Sometimes the child hides.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2014, 02:41:11 AM by pegasus »

icabodcrane

  • Guest
Re: Did the burglaries at Ocean Club have some relevance to Madeleine?
« Reply #334 on: April 08, 2014, 12:33:42 AM »
In cases of attempted burglary, where it turns out that a child is home alone, the general pattern IMO is:

1. Often an adult/adults have just left the residence.
2. The residence looks like no-one is home.
3. The burglar thinks no-one is home.
4. The burglar typically takes the further precaution of first knocking/ringing the door to confirm no-one is home.
5. Typically the child does not answer the door (sometimes because parent has told child not to answer door).
6. If the burglar sees the child, the burglar immediately abandons the burglary and flees without harming the child.
7. Sometimes the child hides.

I  don't have the statistics but my guess is that there are very,  very,  few instances of burglaries where a child is  'Home Alone'   ...  outside of Kevin McAllister  movies   


Offline pegasus

Re: Did the burglaries at Ocean Club have some relevance to Madeleine?
« Reply #335 on: April 08, 2014, 01:32:34 AM »
I  don't have the statistics but my guess is that there are very,  very,  few instances of burglaries where a child is  'Home Alone'   ...  outside of Kevin McAllister  movies
Agreed, t is rare to leave a young child home alone. 
But if one does, the risk of attempted burglary is present, just the same as if no-one is home, equal chance.

If a burglar sees adult leave, low-light inside, no sound at window, and no-one answers the precautionary knock on door, that is confirmation to burglar, certainly everyone is out, proceed.

BTW I will give a PDL example of the precautionary knock on door soon.
« Last Edit: April 08, 2014, 01:35:05 AM by pegasus »

Offline John

Re: Did the burglaries at Ocean Club have some relevance to Madeleine?
« Reply #336 on: April 08, 2014, 09:46:54 AM »
As has been stated previously, burglars are not in the habit of stealing children. I find the burglary gone wrong theory to be very unlikely.  If Madeleine was abducted it was done as a well planned and organised exercise.  The distraction of the GNR patrol well away from the scene was in my opinion part of that plan.
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. An exposé of egregious malfeasance by public officials.
Indeed, the truth never changes with the passage of time.

Offline Brietta

Re: Did the burglaries at Ocean Club have some relevance to Madeleine?
« Reply #337 on: April 08, 2014, 01:26:52 PM »
As has been stated previously, burglars are not in the habit of stealing children. I find the burglary gone wrong theory to be very unlikely.  If Madeleine was abducted it was done as a well planned and organised exercise.  The distraction of the GNR patrol well away from the scene was in my opinion part of that plan.

Like you, John, I don’t think it was a burglary gone wrong. 
I think it was pre-planned and we will only get the answer to what happened when the investigation is allowed to proceed. 

For example, we know that a written request has been submitted to the Portuguese authorities asking for NSY access to the bank accounts of named individuals.
Things have been very quiet on that front so we have no idea if the request letters are being actioned or if they are still being considered.

Until the red tape is cut it is going to be a frustrating wait for any progress to be made.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Cariad

  • Guest
Re: Did the burglaries at Ocean Club have some relevance to Madeleine?
« Reply #338 on: April 08, 2014, 01:46:15 PM »
Like you, John, I don’t think it was a burglary gone wrong. 
I think it was pre-planned and we will only get the answer to what happened when the investigation is allowed to proceed. 

For example, we know that a written request has been submitted to the Portuguese authorities asking for NSY access to the bank accounts of named individuals.
Things have been very quiet on that front so we have no idea if the request letters are being actioned or if they are still being considered.

Until the red tape is cut it is going to be a frustrating wait for any progress to be made.

Did the PJ ever receive the bank account info they requested back in 2007? Maybe they're waiting for that to come through first?

Offline jassi

Re: Did the burglaries at Ocean Club have some relevance to Madeleine?
« Reply #339 on: April 08, 2014, 01:49:11 PM »
Like you, John, I don’t think it was a burglary gone wrong. 
I think it was pre-planned and we will only get the answer to what happened when the investigation is allowed to proceed. 

For example, we know that a written request has been submitted to the Portuguese authorities asking for NSY access to the bank accounts of named individuals.
Things have been very quiet on that front so we have no idea if the request letters are being actioned or if they are still being considered.

Until the red tape is cut it is going to be a frustrating wait for any progress to be made.



It's called procedure. I'm sure you wouldn't want anyone to be taking short cuts, would you?
I believe everything. And l believe nothing.
I suspect everyone. And l suspect no one.
I gather the facts, examine the clues... and before   you know it, the case is solved!"

Or maybe not -

OG have been pushed out by the Germans who have reserved all the deck chairs for the foreseeable future

Offline Brietta

Re: Did the burglaries at Ocean Club have some relevance to Madeleine?
« Reply #340 on: April 08, 2014, 02:11:31 PM »
It's called procedure. I'm sure you wouldn't want anyone to be taking short cuts, would you?

Nope.

But I would like the police to be allowed to proceed with the job as urgently as possible. 

The seventh anniversary of Madeleine McCann's disappearance is approaching - so absolutely no shortcuts - but a bit of professional diligence would IMO not be amiss.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline pegasus

Re: Did the burglaries at Ocean Club have some relevance to Madeleine?
« Reply #341 on: April 09, 2014, 12:43:41 AM »
As has been stated previously, burglars are not in the habit of stealing children...
Agreed 100%. I think burglar opened window+shutter but then was immediately disturbed and fled emptyhanded.

ETA: I already posted a real verifiable example of a child home alone, and a burglar who commences entry thinking no-one is home.

And what does the burglar do as soon as he sees the child?  He runs away empty handed.

Here it is :  9-yr old girl is left home alone while the two adults go out (for a jog in that case, but could equally be dinner), burglar thinks no-one is home, enters, but as soon as he sees the child, he runs away emptyhanded.

Quote
"he immediately fled the residence"
http://lostcoastoutpost.com/2013/sep/27/9-year-old/
« Last Edit: April 09, 2014, 01:09:13 AM by pegasus »

Offline sadie

Re: Did the burglaries at Ocean Club have some relevance to Madeleine?
« Reply #342 on: April 09, 2014, 01:38:24 AM »
Agreed 100%. I think burglar opened window+shutter but then was immediately disturbed and fled emptyhanded.

ETA: I already posted a real verifiable example of a child home alone, and a burglar who commences entry thinking no-one is home.

And what does the burglar do as soon as he sees the child?  He runs away empty handed.

Here it is :  9-yr old girl is left home alone while the two adults go out (for a jog in that case, but could equally be dinner), burglar thinks no-one is home, enters, but as soon as he sees the child, he runs away emptyhanded.
http://lostcoastoutpost.com/2013/sep/27/9-year-old/
And I personally know of a child who very recently was alone in his bedroom when he realised that burglars were in the house.  He was from quite a wealthy family and had his own en suite in which he locked himself.  I guess the phone line had been cut, or there wasn't a line near his bedroom.

He heard the burglars searching his room.  I have no idea whether they tried the bathroom door or were aware that he was in there, but they searched every room and I cant think that they wouldn't have tried that door.

He is older .  I should think 13 or 14 ... and the experience has understandably left him a nervous wreck.  I will try, Pegasus, to find out more, if you wish

Offline pegasus

Re: Did the burglaries at Ocean Club have some relevance to Madeleine?
« Reply #343 on: April 09, 2014, 01:45:02 AM »
"When she exited her bedroom into the hallway she saw a man standing in the entryway of the home. She had never seen the man before. Upon making eye contact with the man he immediately fled the residence without saying anything. The nine year old girl called her mother’s cellphone and told her what happened."
http://lostcoastoutpost.com/2013/sep/27/9-year-old/

What would have happened in that case if the child did not have a cellphone and was too young to use one?
Would the child have hidden somewhere in the residence?

I already gave two examples of cases where a child, home alone in a burglary, hides (one in a bedroom, and one in a pantry). And thanks Sadie for your example (bathroom).
« Last Edit: April 09, 2014, 01:50:13 AM by pegasus »

Offline John

Re: Did the burglaries at Ocean Club have some relevance to Madeleine?
« Reply #344 on: April 10, 2014, 02:17:30 PM »
"When she exited her bedroom into the hallway she saw a man standing in the entryway of the home. She had never seen the man before. Upon making eye contact with the man he immediately fled the residence without saying anything. The nine year old girl called her mother’s cellphone and told her what happened."
http://lostcoastoutpost.com/2013/sep/27/9-year-old/

What would have happened in that case if the child did not have a cellphone and was too young to use one?
Would the child have hidden somewhere in the residence?

I already gave two examples of cases where a child, home alone in a burglary, hides (one in a bedroom, and one in a pantry). And thanks Sadie for your example (bathroom).

Burglars are by nature cowards and tend to flee rather than give any witness the opportunity to identify them.  I find it very hard to believe that any burglar would have broken into apartment 5a with a view to robbing it and left empty handed unless one chooses to believe he took Madeleine as a consolation prize?

 
« Last Edit: April 10, 2014, 06:48:16 PM by John »
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. An exposé of egregious malfeasance by public officials.
Indeed, the truth never changes with the passage of time.