Author Topic: Mrs Fenn and that crying child incident revisited.  (Read 143803 times)

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Offline G-Unit

Re: Mrs Fenn and that crying child incident revisited.
« Reply #495 on: September 11, 2019, 11:17:27 AM »
ROB/JT were diagonal to PF and one apartment removed so unlikely PF heard either of the OB girls. 

Does ROB or any of the others make ref to his absence on 1st May?

I wasn't suggesting that she did, I was replying to your post where you said you thought they were all present at dinner on Tuesday. They weren't. Yes they did mention it, that's how I know about it. Even Kate mentioned it in her book;

Only two minor aspects of that evening stand out as differing from the norm. The first was that Russell didn’t join us for dinner. Evie wasn’t well so he stayed with their girls in the apartment and Jane took his meal to him there. The second was that some time in the early hours Madeleine came through to our bedroom, complaining that Amelie was crying and had woken her up. Gerry checked on Amelie, who settled quickly, and we let Madeleine jump into bed with us. [madeleine]

She forgot all about winning the quiz, and her husband inviting Nouja to join them at the table.
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Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Mrs Fenn and that crying child incident revisited.
« Reply #496 on: September 11, 2019, 11:40:21 AM »
I wasn't suggesting that she did, I was replying to your post where you said you thought they were all present at dinner on Tuesday. They weren't. Yes they did mention it, that's how I know about it. Even Kate mentioned it in her book;

Only two minor aspects of that evening stand out as differing from the norm. The first was that Russell didn’t join us for dinner. Evie wasn’t well so he stayed with their girls in the apartment and Jane took his meal to him there. The second was that some time in the early hours Madeleine came through to our bedroom, complaining that Amelie was crying and had woken her up. Gerry checked on Amelie, who settled quickly, and we let Madeleine jump into bed with us. [madeleine]

She forgot all about winning the quiz, and her husband inviting Nouja to join them at the table.

Well according to ROB he thought he was it was the Mon eve on the basis he recalled the quiz night on Tue:

I know that on one of the evenings either Monday or Tuesday I stayed in the flat with Evie as she wasn’t well Jane brought my meals over to me this was mentioned in my first statement.  I feel that this is more likely to have been Monday as I feel that we were all together as a group on Tuesday- nine adults.  I believe that this was when the Trivia quiz had taken place.

Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline G-Unit

Re: Mrs Fenn and that crying child incident revisited.
« Reply #497 on: September 11, 2019, 05:57:27 PM »
Well according to ROB he thought he was it was the Mon eve on the basis he recalled the quiz night on Tue:

I know that on one of the evenings either Monday or Tuesday I stayed in the flat with Evie as she wasn’t well Jane brought my meals over to me this was mentioned in my first statement.  I feel that this is more likely to have been Monday as I feel that we were all together as a group on Tuesday- nine adults.  I believe that this was when the Trivia quiz had taken place.

Later he says;

I think it was Monday night because, erm, I have this recollection that on Tuesday it was the first night we’d all been together, the nine of us, actually, you know, present”.

1578    “Yes”.
 Reply    “However Jane actually thinks that it was, erm, Tuesday, it was probably Tuesday night, so we’re, we’re not entirely sure.  I don’t know if that’s going to be very relevant, but I thought it was Monday and Jane thinks it might have been Tuesday”.
https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/RUSSELL-OBRIEN_ROGATORY.htm

So Jane and Kate say Tuesday.
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Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Mrs Fenn and that crying child incident revisited.
« Reply #498 on: September 12, 2019, 08:02:28 AM »
Later he says;

I think it was Monday night because, erm, I have this recollection that on Tuesday it was the first night we’d all been together, the nine of us, actually, you know, present”.

1578    “Yes”.
 Reply    “However Jane actually thinks that it was, erm, Tuesday, it was probably Tuesday night, so we’re, we’re not entirely sure.  I don’t know if that’s going to be very relevant, but I thought it was Monday and Jane thinks it might have been Tuesday”.
https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/RUSSELL-OBRIEN_ROGATORY.htm

So Jane and Kate say Tuesday.

Ok thanks.  As I said I'm only just reading them.  I wonder if the authorities ever dissected them in terms of amalgamating them and then placing them all into some sort of chronological and thematic order?  This seems to me the way to go and get the max out of them.  Clearly some aspects are more important than others.  It seems to me much is surplus to requirements and/or some aspects are clearly far more important than others eg the breakfast, lunch, arrangements probably of little or no relevance but dinner at tapas, the checking and nighttime security of apartments very relevant. 
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline G-Unit

Re: Mrs Fenn and that crying child incident revisited.
« Reply #499 on: September 12, 2019, 10:23:02 AM »
Ok thanks.  As I said I'm only just reading them.  I wonder if the authorities ever dissected them in terms of amalgamating them and then placing them all into some sort of chronological and thematic order?  This seems to me the way to go and get the max out of them.  Clearly some aspects are more important than others.  It seems to me much is surplus to requirements and/or some aspects are clearly far more important than others eg the breakfast, lunch, arrangements probably of little or no relevance but dinner at tapas, the checking and nighttime security of apartments very relevant.

The most revealing imo are the rog interviews. Unsurprisingly they were wary; particularly one of them who took refuge in remembering nothing in particular. We also have evidence in those interviews that they were discussed with the police before being recorded. Finally, two had to be re-done, apparently due to equipment failure. Even so, I found interesting snippets in them. I think all aspects are important because of what they tell us about interactions between the witnesses over time. Dianne's amazing recovered memory of seeing Matthew, for example.
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Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: Mrs Fenn and that crying child incident revisited.
« Reply #500 on: September 12, 2019, 10:35:11 AM »
The most revealing imo are the rog interviews. Unsurprisingly they were wary; particularly one of them who took refuge in remembering nothing in particular. We also have evidence in those interviews that they were discussed with the police before being recorded. Finally, two had to be re-done, apparently due to equipment failure. Even so, I found interesting snippets in them. I think all aspects are important because of what they tell us about interactions between the witnesses over time. Dianne's amazing recovered memory of seeing Matthew, for example.
What do they tell us about the interactions between the witnesses over time?  What exactly do the rogs reveal to you that has any bearing on what happened to Madeleine?
"You can't reason with the unreasonable".

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Mrs Fenn and that crying child incident revisited.
« Reply #501 on: September 12, 2019, 11:06:01 AM »
The most revealing imo are the rog interviews. Unsurprisingly they were wary; particularly one of them who took refuge in remembering nothing in particular. We also have evidence in those interviews that they were discussed with the police before being recorded. Finally, two had to be re-done, apparently due to equipment failure. Even so, I found interesting snippets in them. I think all aspects are important because of what they tell us about interactions between the witnesses over time. Dianne's amazing recovered memory of seeing Matthew, for example.

People interpret things differently but for me they are just a bunch of people on a week's break having an uneventful time: breakfast, creche, lunch, creche, all interspersed with tennis lessons, water sports and jogs followed by a jolly up in the evening at tapas. 

I would be more concerned if they were all in perfect synch or anything close.  No reason why people would have perfect recall over the minutiae. 

At most I think some may be reticent with the extent of the checks and the security of the apartments.  Eg KM makes clear the patio doors were always unlocked in the evening and yet GM said the opposite initially.  If they were attempting to cover something up you would think the pair would get this part of their story right.  Imo GM is just trying to deflect blame as with the benefit of hindsight he came to understand the decision to leave the children in the unlocked apartment was absolute madness.  This is key imo.  The abductor knew MM was in the apartment without adult supervision/baby monitor AND knew it was unlocked both of which only a finite number of people knew about. 

One thing that does stand out for me in all the wit stats and rogs is that I haven't seen any mention of cars in the car park or immediate vicinity.  T9 didn't raise nor does it seem they were asked?

The listening service available at other MW resorts is completely different in that a MW member of staff patrols locked apartments by listening for any disturbance.  If a would be abductor wanted to enter they would need to force entry and this would act as a significant deterrent as most would realise the noise made and time taken would be high risk in that in all probability they would get caught.  In this case all the abductor needed to do was to sneak in the patio door, stage the window and shutter, scoop up MM, exit via the front door and drive off.  Could all be done in well under 2 minutes.
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline misty

Re: Mrs Fenn and that crying child incident revisited.
« Reply #502 on: September 15, 2019, 01:39:04 AM »
In this video Gerry McCann can be seen sliding the patio door of 5A. After listening to the level of sound it made, do posters believe Mrs Fenn could possibly have heard it though the noise of the alleged crying? IMO the noise from the door is minimal.


https://youtu.be/atfDV7imHHY?t=769

Offline Myster

Re: Mrs Fenn and that crying child incident revisited.
« Reply #503 on: September 15, 2019, 07:45:33 AM »
In this video Gerry McCann can be seen sliding the patio door of 5A. After listening to the level of sound it made, do posters believe Mrs Fenn could possibly have heard it though the noise of the alleged crying? IMO the noise from the door is minimal.


https://youtu.be/atfDV7imHHY?t=769
Listening to an audio recording of a sliding door with background din from a narrator on computer speakers is totally different to listening live in situ from the flat above 5a.
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: Mrs Fenn and that crying child incident revisited.
« Reply #504 on: September 15, 2019, 08:39:25 AM »
Listening to an audio recording of a sliding door with background din from a narrator on computer speakers is totally different to listening live in situ from the flat above 5a.
Sliding glass doors tend by their nature not to be very noisy, especially if you don’t have to unlock them first.
"You can't reason with the unreasonable".

Offline Brietta

Re: Mrs Fenn and that crying child incident revisited.
« Reply #505 on: September 15, 2019, 08:44:55 AM »
Listening to an audio recording of a sliding door with background din from a narrator on computer speakers is totally different to listening live in situ from the flat above 5a.

What a shame we don't have an audio or a video recording of Mrs Fenn's statement, or anyone else's for that matter, to enable us to judge the accuracy and quality of the internet copies of the files and their translation.

Has Mrs Fenn's friend confirmed the phone call with crying child in the background?
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline G-Unit

Re: Mrs Fenn and that crying child incident revisited.
« Reply #506 on: September 15, 2019, 08:48:04 AM »
In this video Gerry McCann can be seen sliding the patio door of 5A. After listening to the level of sound it made, do posters believe Mrs Fenn could possibly have heard it though the noise of the alleged crying? IMO the noise from the door is minimal.


https://youtu.be/atfDV7imHHY?t=769

Are you assuming? She may well have turned her TV off and gone out onto her balcony to pinpoint the source of the crying. If she then left the door open it's possible she could hear more than you think.


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Offline Brietta

Re: Mrs Fenn and that crying child incident revisited.
« Reply #507 on: September 15, 2019, 08:50:20 AM »
Sliding glass doors tend by their nature not to be very noisy, especially if you don’t have to unlock them first.

Mine certainly aren't noisy at all and they are quite substantial ones.  There is also a video of Amaral opening the sliding doors of 5A with fingertip ease.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: Mrs Fenn and that crying child incident revisited.
« Reply #508 on: September 15, 2019, 08:54:16 AM »
Are you assuming? She may well have turned her TV off and gone out onto her balcony to pinpoint the source of the crying. If she then left the door open it's possible she could hear more than you think.
Did she say she did any of those things or are you assuming?
"You can't reason with the unreasonable".

Offline Myster

Re: Mrs Fenn and that crying child incident revisited.
« Reply #509 on: September 15, 2019, 09:55:50 AM »
Mine certainly aren't noisy at all and they are quite substantial ones.  There is also a video of Amaral opening the sliding doors of 5A with fingertip ease.
Mine are noisy, heavy aluminium (Fit the best... Everest).  But this is 5A's door, sounding louder than in the earlier video...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxUdEnQ_r9M&feature=youtu.be&t=612
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.