A child abducted yet nobody thought to phone the police immediately?

[pegasus]

On drinks - don't some people also like to have a beer or wine before they go out??
On calling the police - plenty of employees knew, long before the call to GNR, that a child was missing, I think the reaction was to search first, then call police if not found in initial searches. 

[slartibartfast]

On drinks - don't some people also like to have a beer or wine before they go out??
On calling the police - plenty of employees knew, long before the call to GNR, that a child was missing, I think the reaction was to search first, then call police if not found in initial searches.

Much too sensible post....

[Miss Taken Identity]

On drinks - don't some people also like to have a beer or wine before they go out??
On calling the police - plenty of employees knew, long before the call to GNR, that a child was missing, I think the reaction was to search first, then call police if not found in initial searches.

Excellent post!

This is why I do not believe in a stranger abduction from the apartment.

If they thought instantly, as Kate said 'she knew right away' that Maddie was abducted (swooshing and jemmied stuff), why bother to search before calling the police? Unless....unless of course they suspected Maddie got out of the apartment and wandered off to look for them when she woke up again.

It is quite possible that little Maddie did go out of the apartment and had a fatal fall nearby OR was found by passing gypsies/burglars wandering around...

The Team Mc's created a noose for them selves and now hang in the wilderness - swinging to and fro...

...And maybe JT did see the person removing Maddie from the scene wearing horrible trousers (fgs) and maybe she knew exactly who that person was.. she tries so hard not to answer simple questions.

[sadie]

On drinks - don't some people also like to have a beer or wine before they go out??
On calling the police - plenty of employees knew, long before the call to GNR, that a child was missing, I think the reaction was to search first, then call police if not found in initial searches.

So what *  IF  * they had a drink at about 7 or 7.30, they still would not be inebriated 2 1/2 - 3 hours later.

And you dont even  know if they drank at night before the meals, anyway.

But *  IF  * they did, so what ?



In your efforts to paint The Mccanns as black as possible, sorry guys, but you are over egging it.

[pegasus]

The statements, and book, are clear re one pre-meal drink.
I don't think the delay from about 10pm (discovered apparantly missing) to 10:41pm (first phonecall to police) is anything suspicious - it is probably what I would do - search for child first, then phone police if not found.

[Alice Purjorick]

A blood alcohol content of 0.04% may cause impaired reasoning and lowering of caution. Loosely speaking that is about <2 units. Any more than that and judgement is definitely impaired.
Who knows how much the Tapas crowd drank? I don't. But anymore than 0.08% and you ain't fit to drive.
Unless of course you belong to that happy band who reckon they drive (or do anything) better with two or three beers inside them.

I would wait until I had had a good look around before calling the cops. But in the McCann case there is this anomaly of "They have taken her".

[pegasus]

A blood alcohol content of 0.04% may cause impaired reasoning and lowering of caution. Loosely speaking that is about <2 units. Any more than that and judgement is definitely impaired.
Who knows how much the Tapas crowd drank? I don't. But anymore than 0.08% and you ain't fit to drive.
Unless of course you belong to that happy band who reckon they drive (or do anything) better with two or three beers inside them.

I would wait until I had had a good look around before calling the cops. But in the McCann case there is this anomaly of "They have taken her".

Yes but for the resort company I think it was reasonable to take the actions they did, which were: immediately mobilising staff to search, and then phoning the police when those initial searches did not find the child.

[Miss Taken Identity]

A blood alcohol content of 0.04% may cause impaired reasoning and lowering of caution. Loosely speaking that is about <2 units. Any more than that and judgement is definitely impaired.
Who knows how much the Tapas crowd drank? I don't. But anymore than 0.08% and you ain't fit to drive.
Unless of course you belong to that happy band who reckon they drive (or do anything) better with two or three beers inside them.

I would wait until I had had a good look around before calling the cops. But in the McCann case there is this anomaly of "They have taken her".

Indeed Alice!

That is why I struggle with all that went on that evening and why I beleive a proper reconstruction would have cleared  a few situations up.

The PJ did make mistakes, I am happy to divulge where I believe they went wrong. But, I believe theya cted according to the phone message they received!

Kate Claims, She knew right away due to the window/door being open and the shutters jemmied- she knew that Maddie could not do this on her own. I concur that Maddie could not have 'jemmied' the window by herself or climbed out by herself. But then, I do not believe that is what happened and that the jemmied and whooshing are just 'red herrings'.

So, she ran and announced 'they have taken her' or words to that effect, They did not phone the police at that precise moment...WHY? if she had been abducted? Why look in bins and drains and bushes if she had been abducted alive? who did they think abducted her?

The fact that they blamed the police for not searching and shutting down airports and Borders, and ports to catch an abductor is quite something, blame everyone else is 'soup of the day' in Team MC's Camp.

If Kate did not make the abduction claim then she would probably say Maddie is 'missing' we best go look for her...after a short period of time phone the police.
The police were looking for a 'missing' child- who probably wandered off they would have been shocked to find the children were left alone every night!  As are  a lot of people around the globe!

[John]

Indeed Alice!

That is why I struggle with all that went on that evening and why I beleive a proper reconstruction would have cleared  a few situations up.

The PJ did make mistakes, I am happy to divulge where I believe they went wrong. But, I believe theya cted according to the phone message they received!

Kate Claims, She knew right away due to the window/door being open and the shutters jemmied- she knew that Maddie could not do this on her own. I concur that Maddie could not have 'jemmied' the window by herself or climbed out by herself. But then, I do not believe that is what happened and that the jemmied and whooshing are just 'red herrings'.

So, she ran and announced 'they have taken her' or words to that effect, They did not phone the police at that precise moment...WHY? if she had been abducted? Why look in bins and drains and bushes if she had been abducted alive? who did they think abducted her?

The fact that they blamed the police for not searching and shutting down airports and Borders, and ports to catch an abductor is quite something, blame everyone else is 'soup of the day' in Team MC's Camp.

If Kate did not make the abduction claim then she would probably say Maddie is 'missing' we best go look for her...after a short period of time phone the police.
The police were looking for a 'missing' child- who probably wandered off they would have been shocked to find the children were left alone every night!  As are  a lot of people around the globe!

A good post Miss Taken Identity.  The puzzle is, why if they immediately knew Madeleine had been taken did they set off searching instead of getting on the ball with the police immediately?  The only answer I can see is that their thought processes were impaired.

[Brietta]

Yes but for the resort company I think it was reasonable to take the actions they did, which were: immediately mobilising staff to search, and then phoning the police when those initial searches did not find the child.

They put their procedures into action and if as everyone hoped Madeleine had wandered off, I suggest she would have been found, as one of the nannies said had happened before with wandered children.

In the immediate chaos of discovering her missing it is hardly surprising mistakes were made and posters here are posting with the benefit of hindsight with no thought given to the sheer panic, terror and disorientation of those involved at the time.

I think the MW procedures did not seem to take into consideration the immediate searches of the close vicinity undertaken by the parents and friends and while putting their procedures into play should have called the police too.

I wonder if they have since reviewed that ... easy enough to let the police know if a missing child has turned up ... if that doesn't happen as in Madeleine's case - some police investigation time will have been gained (eg. securing the scene, deciding on reinforcements etc.).

[John]

The Mark Warner procedure was aimed at children who had wandered off and got lost, it was not an anti abduction procedure.

The question remains, why if there was evidence of a break in, were police not contacted immediately using 112?

[sadie]

snipped -

Kate Claims, She knew right away due to the window/door being open and the shutters jemmied- she knew that Maddie could not do this on her own. I concur that Maddie could not have 'jemmied' the window by herself or climbed out by herself. But then, I do not believe that is what happened and that the jemmied and whooshing are just 'red herrings'.

So, she ran and announced 'they have taken her' or words to that effect, They did not phone the police at that precise moment...WHY? if she had been abducted? Why look in bins and drains and bushes if she had been abducted alive?

First of all those were NOT kates initial words. 

Why put false but suspicious sounding words into her mouth?   Seems you are really keen to condemn her.


Secondly, who do you think made the main decisions in that family?  I think Gerry did and he couldn't get his head around what had happened initially.  He wanted Madeleine to have wandered.

And he knew that you dont go calling the police the minute your child disappears when, say, out shopping.  Having had a quick look in the near vicinity, the realisation of what likely might have happened sunk in.

That was the stage when he was anxious to get the Police.



I remember sending our daughter to Tours in France by bus at the age of 16.  She spoke good French.  Before she left, we fixed that the people that she was staying with would phone us the minute she arrived.  National Express timetable said that she would arrive at 10 minutes past midnight to be dropped off by the main railway station in Tours, which meant that we should have heard by about 12.30am.

My hubby was getting anxiuos well before that time and I kept saying, stay calm, the channel crossing boat could have been late etc etc.  Suddenly at about 1am I panicked along with my hubby and we rang the family to be told that they were in bed,  She hadn't come.  No bus had come and they had waited over 20 minutes. - so they returned home.

Please get back there quickly I said ... and, bless them, they did to find her waiting with a public schoolboy who hadn't paid his fare and had been thrown off the bus (thank goodness for our daughter having male company in that rather dubiuos spot!)

Turned out that National Express hadn't warned about the hour difference change and had given us the winter schedule rather than the new summer one


Now the point of this is.  One parent panicked almost too soon, whilst the other kept calm almost too long

I guess that hubby listened to me and on this occasion, and unusually so, I was the leader.



You guys are seeing things in this small delay that you shouldn't be.

[John]

First of all those were NOT kates initial words. 

Why put false but suspicious sounding words into her mouth?   Seems you are really keen to condemn her.


Secondly, who do you think made the main decisions in that family?  I think Gerry did and he couldn't get his head around what had happened initially.  He wanted Madeleine to have wandered.

And he knew that you don't go calling the police the minute your child disappears when, say, out shopping.  Having had a quick look in the near vicinity, the realisation of what likely might have happened sunk in.

That was the stage when he was anxious to get the Police.



I remember sending our daughter to Tours in France by bus at the age of 16.  She spoke good French.  Before she left, we fixed that the people that she was staying with would phone us the minute she arrived.  National Express timetable said that she would arrive at 10 minutes past midnight to be dropped off by the main railway station in Tours, which meant that we should have heard by about 12.30am.

My hubby was getting anxiuos well before that time and I kept saying, stay calm, the channel crossing boat could have been late etc etc.  Suddenly at about 1am I panicked along with my hubby and we rang the family to be told that they were in bed,  She hadn't come.  No bus had come and they had waited over 20 minutes. - so they returned home.

Please get back there quickly I said ... and, bless them, they did to find her waiting with a public schoolboy who hadn't paid his fare and had been thrown off the bus (thank goodness for our daughter having male company in that rather dubious spot!)

Turned out that National Express hadn't warned about the hour difference change and had given us the winter schedule rather than the new summer one


Now the point of this is.  One parent panicked almost too soon, whilst the other kept calm almost too long

I guess that hubby listened to me and on this occasion, and unusually so, I was the leader.



You guys are seeing things in this small delay that you shouldn't be.

You're still making excuses Sadie.  What were the words Kate used by the way after she was heard to SCREAM from the balcony by one of the waiters?

A child disappearing while out shopping or the experience with your daughter you mention have no relevance to Madeleine.  Miss TI is quite correct when she asserts that they found a window open and a shutter up with a child missing and they didn't immediately contact the proper authorities...WHY?

Why piddle about outside in the dark looking in bins ffs?

[Brietta]

You're still making excuses Sadie.  What were the words Kate used by the way after she was heard to SCREAM from the balcony by one of the waiters?

A child disappearing while out shopping or the experience with your daughter you mention have no relevance to Madeleine.  Miss TI is quite correct when she asserts that they found a window open and a shutter up with a child missing and they didn't immediately contact the proper authorities...WHY?

Why piddle about outside in the dark looking in bins ffs?

That anonymous waiter’s alleged account of events raises questions.

The first being did he exist?

If he did exist where is his version of events mentioned in the files?

If he did exist where was he and what was he doing when he allegedly heard the shouting that no one else has reported hearing.  Other witnesses have corroborated Dr Kate McCann’s statement of the manner in which she raised the alarm.

I think this person is a figment of someone’s fertile imagination; possibly even the same person who invented the Irish teen having a surreptitious smoke who witnessed two men meeting and talking in the street but who certainly not see Jane Tanner or the man carrying a child.

Seems to me scenarios and characters have been invented as the need arose to promulgate discrediting the Drs McCann and their friends  ... and these are two rather obvious ones.

Makes one wonder what other depths have been plumbed which were not quite so obvious but equally if not more productive in the propaganda war obviously being waged to mould public opinion against Madeleine McCann's parents.

[Eleanor]

Kate is constantly being castigated because she didn't shout from the balcony.  Another myth then.