Author Topic: Was Gonçalo Amaral fair game given the content of his book?  (Read 205234 times)

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Offline Eleanor

Re: Was Gonçalo Amaral fair game given the content of his book?
« Reply #585 on: March 21, 2014, 04:51:01 PM »

I thought it was interesting that The Judge wanted to know if each of them were friends of Amaral.  Only one of them wasn't, and even he knew Amaral personally.

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: Was Gonçalo Amaral fair game given the content of his book?
« Reply #586 on: March 21, 2014, 04:56:10 PM »
http://www.mccannfiles.com/id344.html

It becomes tedious posting this every few days because no one reads it and as a consequence they make it up as they go along.
Like jassi says it will all come out eventually.

After having been notified of that decision [to grant the injunction], appeals were filed by:

Gonçalo de Sousa Amaral,

Guerra e Paz, Editores, SA

VC – Valentim de Carvalho – Filmes, Audiovisuais, SA and

TVI – Televisão Independente, SA

All of them based on the right of freedom of expression of thought that is constitutionally consecrated and furthermore the fact that the statements and facts that were published in the book are the mere reproduction of solid data that is part of the investigation that was started at due time, and that said statements and facts are even part of the investigation's archiving dispatch that was signed by a Prosecutor of the Republic.


The dispute over the injunction was about the right of free speech versus the right of citizens (or visitors!) to a good name.

The present dispute is about libel.

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Was Gonçalo Amaral fair game given the content of his book?
« Reply #587 on: March 21, 2014, 05:04:22 PM »
http://www.mccannfiles.com/id344.html

It becomes tedious posting this every few days because no one reads it and as a consequence they make it up as they go along.
Like jassi says it will all come out eventually.

I don't claim to understand the Portuguese justice system and I am sure you don't either.
First that link you posted contains some glaring errors...

Eddie the dog did not signal cadaver odour...that is stated as a fact and it isn't...confirmed by grime

From what I can see this case was about the book being banned.....it takes  a lot to ban a book in a free society and I am not surprised that the ban was overturned.

The present trial is about amongst other things libel..it has not yet been decided if the book is libellous...
the hearing you referred to was ex parte...the mccanns were not represented....the important trail is underway , although god knows when it will end. A Portuguese poster close to amaral says these delays are normal and the trial could drag on and on. Then there could be appeals.

The fact remains that all amarals assets are still held by the court...why would that be if he has already won the case?


Estuarine

  • Guest
Re: Was Gonçalo Amaral fair game given the content of his book?
« Reply #588 on: March 21, 2014, 05:26:46 PM »
We conclude that the applicants voluntarily decided to limit their right to the intimacy of private life, certainly envisaging higher values like the discovery of their daughter Madeleine's whereabouts, but upon voluntarily limiting that right, they opened the doors for other people to give their opinion about the case, in synchrony with what they were saying, but also possibly in contradiction with their directions, yet always within the bounds of a legitimate and constitutionally consecrated right to opinion and freedom of expression of thought.

We do not see that the right of the book's author, the defendant, can be limited by a right to the reservation of intimacy that suffered voluntary limitations by their holders, the applicants.

In the same way, concerning the applicants' right to image and a good name: upon placing the case in the public square and giving it worldwide notoriety, the applicants opened all doors to all opinions, even those that are adversarial to them.

In any case, we understand that the allegation of facts that are profusely contained in the judicial inquiry and that were even published through an initiative of the Republic's Attorney General’s Office, can in no way be seen as an offence against the right to image and a good name of the subjects in the process.

Finally, concerning the damage to the right to usufruct from the penal process’ guarantees, namely the right to a fair investigation and the right to freedom and safety, we still cannot understand how it is possible for said rights to be offended by the contents of a book that describes facts from the investigation, although it parts from the interpretation that the Public Ministry’s Magistrates made of those facts, yet offering based, solidly built and logical interpretations.

We thus reach a point where it seems to be important to stress the following: the indicative facts that led to the applicants’ constitution as arguidos within the inquiry were later on not valued by the Public Ministry’s Magistrates in order to lead to a criminal accusation, but those very same facts, seen through another prism and with another base, may lead to a different conclusion from that which was attained by those same Magistrates – those are indications that were deemed to be insufficient in terms of evidence in a criminal investigation, but they can be appreciated in a different way, in an interpretation that is legitimate to be published as a literary work, as long as said interpretation does not offend any fundamental rights of anyone involved – and we have written above already why we understand that said interpretation does not offend the applicants’ rights.

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: Was Gonçalo Amaral fair game given the content of his book?
« Reply #589 on: March 21, 2014, 05:28:32 PM »
Has it crossed anybody's mind that the judge may have the decision made for her if there were to be any arrests?  That wouldn't half wrecked the case for the defence.

I remain mystified that Santos' plea that proceedings be in camera to protect Madeleine lest Madeleine be alive didn't wreck Amaral's defence, and I'm not wholly convinced that it didn't.

Offline jassi

Re: Was Gonçalo Amaral fair game given the content of his book?
« Reply #590 on: March 21, 2014, 05:29:18 PM »
Has it crossed anybody's mind that the judge may have the decision made for her if there were to be any arrests?  That wouldn't half wrecked the case for the defence.

Would a judge trying a civil case be influenced by criminal proceedings? That might depend upon how independent the Portuguese judiciary are.
I believe everything. And l believe nothing.
I suspect everyone. And l suspect no one.
I gather the facts, examine the clues... and before   you know it, the case is solved!"

Or maybe not -

OG have been pushed out by the Germans who have reserved all the deck chairs for the foreseeable future

Offline jassi

Re: Was Gonçalo Amaral fair game given the content of his book?
« Reply #591 on: March 21, 2014, 05:49:10 PM »
You're forgetting Jassi how this libel case arose in the first place.

Do feel free to expand further.
I believe everything. And l believe nothing.
I suspect everyone. And l suspect no one.
I gather the facts, examine the clues... and before   you know it, the case is solved!"

Or maybe not -

OG have been pushed out by the Germans who have reserved all the deck chairs for the foreseeable future

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: Was Gonçalo Amaral fair game given the content of his book?
« Reply #592 on: March 21, 2014, 05:51:49 PM »
We conclude that the applicants voluntarily decided to limit their right to the intimacy of private life, certainly envisaging higher values like the discovery of their daughter Madeleine's whereabouts, but upon voluntarily limiting that right, they opened the doors for other people to give their opinion about the case, in synchrony with what they were saying, but also possibly in contradiction with their directions, yet always within the bounds of a legitimate and constitutionally consecrated right to opinion and freedom of expression of thought.

We do not see that the right of the book's author, the defendant, can be limited by a right to the reservation of intimacy that suffered voluntary limitations by their holders, the applicants.

In the same way, concerning the applicants' right to image and a good name: upon placing the case in the public square and giving it worldwide notoriety, the applicants opened all doors to all opinions, even those that are adversarial to them.

In any case, we understand that the allegation of facts that are profusely contained in the judicial inquiry and that were even published through an initiative of the Republic's Attorney General’s Office, can in no way be seen as an offence against the right to image and a good name of the subjects in the process.

Finally, concerning the damage to the right to usufruct from the penal process’ guarantees, namely the right to a fair investigation and the right to freedom and safety, we still cannot understand how it is possible for said rights to be offended by the contents of a book that describes facts from the investigation, although it parts from the interpretation that the Public Ministry’s Magistrates made of those facts, yet offering based, solidly built and logical interpretations.

We thus reach a point where it seems to be important to stress the following: the indicative facts that led to the applicants’ constitution as arguidos within the inquiry were later on not valued by the Public Ministry’s Magistrates in order to lead to a criminal accusation, but those very same facts, seen through another prism and with another base, may lead to a different conclusion from that which was attained by those same Magistrates – those are indications that were deemed to be insufficient in terms of evidence in a criminal investigation, but they can be appreciated in a different way, in an interpretation that is legitimate to be published as a literary work, as long as said interpretation does not offend any fundamental rights of anyone involved – and we have written above already why we understand that said interpretation does not offend the applicants’ rights.

Confirmation that the dispute over the injunction had nothing to do with libel.

Offline John

Re: Was Gonçalo Amaral fair game given the content of his book?
« Reply #593 on: March 21, 2014, 08:54:09 PM »


I said that Amaral has the habit of putting libellous statements into the mouths of others that others never said.

Here is a classic example (though far from the only one).

The penultimate sentence and paragraph of Harrison's third and final report:

I am currently of the opinion on the available information and statistical datasets that if death has occurred, that it is possible that Madeleine McCann’s body has been disposed into the sea at Praia da Luz. (See my second report entitled “NPIA OP TASK Search Doc Beach and Marine”).


And what Amaral claims Harrison said in his book:



After a week of intense work, Harrison presents the results of his study to my coordinating group. Even if we were expecting it, his conclusions confirm our worst fears. The most plausible scenario is the following: there is no doubt that Madeleine is dead, and her body is hidden somewhere in the area around Praia da Luz. He praises the quality of the work carried out by the Portuguese authorities in trying to find the little girl alive. According to him, the time has come to redirect the searches in order to find, this time, a body hidden in the surrounding area. 


So which is it?

Madeleine definitely dead and her concealed remains in and around Praia da Luz?

Or Madeleine possibly dead, and if dead, her body most likely jettisoned into the sea?



You have to remember that Dr Amaral and Professor Harrison will have discussed the case at length, the formers comments are not limited by what the latter wrote in his Reports.

If what Amaral stated was false then Harrison had every right to challenge it...by the looks of it he didn't.

What does that tell you ferryman?

A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. An exposé of egregious malfeasance by public officials.
Indeed, the truth never changes with the passage of time.

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Was Gonçalo Amaral fair game given the content of his book?
« Reply #594 on: March 21, 2014, 09:09:52 PM »
You have to remember that Dr Amaral and Professor Harrison will have discussed the case at length, the formers comments are not limited by what the latter wrote in his Reports.

If what Amaral stated was false then Harrison had every right to challenge it...by the looks of it he didn't.

What does that tell you ferryman?

it merely tells us what your opinion is john

Offline John

Re: Was Gonçalo Amaral fair game given the content of his book?
« Reply #595 on: March 21, 2014, 09:30:36 PM »
it merely tells us what your opinion is john

Are you claiming that Amaral and Harrison never discussed the case?
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. An exposé of egregious malfeasance by public officials.
Indeed, the truth never changes with the passage of time.

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Was Gonçalo Amaral fair game given the content of his book?
« Reply #596 on: March 21, 2014, 09:39:03 PM »
Are you claiming that Amaral and Harrison never discussed the case?

no but I would say that Harrison would not criticise or contradict amaral in public

Offline Eleanor

Re: Was Gonçalo Amaral fair game given the content of his book?
« Reply #597 on: March 21, 2014, 09:54:36 PM »
no but I would say that Harrison would not criticise or contradict amaral in public

My thoughts exactly.  Harrison wouldn't be that bad mannered.

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: Was Gonçalo Amaral fair game given the content of his book?
« Reply #598 on: March 21, 2014, 10:12:03 PM »
You have to remember that Dr Amaral and Professor Harrison will have discussed the case at length, the formers comments are not limited by what the latter wrote in his Reports.

If what Amaral stated was false then Harrison had every right to challenge it...by the looks of it he didn't.

What does that tell you ferryman?

Not so much what it tells me as what it directs me to: Harrison's terms of reference.

He was instructed to consider that Madeleine was dead and to try to find her concealed remains.

He even says in his report that it considers, solely, that Madeleine has been murdered and that her concealed remains are somewhere nearby.

He offers to consider other scenarios on request.

Either he was never invited or, if he was invited, we don't read what he wrote on line.

icabodcrane

  • Guest
Re: Was Gonçalo Amaral fair game given the content of his book?
« Reply #599 on: March 21, 2014, 10:14:16 PM »
Has it crossed anybody's mind that the judge may have the decision made for her if there were to be any arrests?  That wouldn't half wrecked the case for the defence.

By the same token, what about  the announcement by Scotland Yard,  following their three year investigation,  that they think Madeleine might have died in the apartment  ?

Could that be said to be somewhat damaging to case for the prosecution  ?