Author Topic: Translated documents are prone to errors.  (Read 36051 times)

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Redblossom

  • Guest
Re: Translated documents are prone to errors.
« Reply #15 on: February 25, 2014, 08:50:56 PM »
I'll second that.

Just read Blacksmith's latest, and his praise of Anne for her sterling work.

Again, well done Anne.

Thirded!

And that latest article enough packs a very poweful punch! Oh dear.



Cariad

  • Guest
Re: Translated documents are prone to errors.
« Reply #16 on: February 25, 2014, 09:05:05 PM »
Thirded!

And that latest article enough packs a very poweful punch! Oh dear.

Forthed.. is that a word? Any way, me too. It was Anne's work that directed me here. I'm very grateful for it too, I think  8)--))

Apropos of nothing, Schadenfreude is my favourite word without a direct English translation. 

Redblossom

  • Guest
Re: Translated documents are prone to errors.
« Reply #17 on: February 25, 2014, 11:07:19 PM »
It goes without saying that there are words which sometimes do not translate into English, I know I found this when I first lived in Spain.  Naively, at the beginning I thought that all words can be translated but that isn't always the case.  The classic example of this in the McCann case is the Portuguese word arguido.  There is no equivalent word in English for this entity since such a designation does not exist in the United Kingdom.

The question raised in this thread simply is, can a mistranslated word make such a difference?  My own experience is that it certainy can.

I dont know if a single word can make that much difference to any meaning in translation unless its ablatant  and dramatic error stuck in somewhere. The arguido status isnt a very good example as to all intents and purposes it does mean suspect, way i understand it anyway

 The problem here is that some have said a whole sentence with definitive and indisputable words and syntax / context have been tried to be passed off as "mistranslations"....when it is so obvious it was taking he mickey in tryng to do so

One example is from Gerrys first statement here he says he entered via the front door on his 9pm or so check (as it was locked) with his key (as opposed to his second statement when he said he entered via the back door)


Some have tried to say this was a mistranslation,when its impossible it could have been

One excuse being well, they may have got the front and back and or side as its been called door, mixed up, when, no, there is only ONE door you enter with a key and thats the front door







« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 11:08:56 PM by Redblossom »

AnneGuedes

  • Guest
Re: Translated documents are prone to errors.
« Reply #18 on: February 25, 2014, 11:09:10 PM »
Forthed.. is that a word? Any way, me too. It was Anne's work that directed me here. I'm very grateful for it too, I think  8)--))

Apropos of nothing, Schadenfreude is my favourite word without a direct English translation.
Pityjoy ? There's another German one, Sehnsucht that has no equivalent neither in English nor in French but has in Portuguese : saudade, it's a kind of special nostalgia, you can have saudade of saudade..

AnneGuedes

  • Guest
Re: Translated documents are prone to errors.
« Reply #19 on: February 25, 2014, 11:48:06 PM »
I dont know if a single word can make that much difference to any meaning in translation unless its ablatant  and dramatic error stuck in somewhere. The arguido status isnt a very good example as to all intents and purposes it does mean suspect, way i understand it anyway

 The problem here is that some have said a whole sentence with definitive and indisputable words and syntax / context have been tried to be passed off as "mistranslations"....when it is so obvious it was taking he mickey in tryng to do so

One example is from Gerrys first statement here he says he entered via the front door on his 9pm or so check (as it was locked) with his key (as opposed to his second statement when he said he entered via the back door)


Some have tried to say this was a mistranslation,when its impossible it could have been

One excuse being well, they may have got the front and back and or side as its been called door, mixed up, when, no, there is only ONE door you enter with a key and thats the front door
Mistranslations originate usually from syntax, sometimes because the original text's syntax is somehow faulty or complex. Lexical errors are rare.

AnneGuedes

  • Guest
Re: Translated documents are prone to errors.
« Reply #20 on: February 25, 2014, 11:54:41 PM »
It was only Anne's stuff on McCannFiles that lured me in here. Anne you owe me many cases of Vinho Verde for luring me into this asylum :)
?{)(**
Thank you all ! I read Blacksmith a bit as I watch a David Lynch film, never able to foresee what next sentence will look like !
If by chance any of you come to Lisbon, let's have some vinho verde on my balcony over the Tagus river !

Redblossom

  • Guest
Re: Translated documents are prone to errors.
« Reply #21 on: February 25, 2014, 11:57:37 PM »
Mistranslations originate usually from syntax, sometimes because the original text's syntax is somehow faulty or complex. Lexical errors are rare.

Especially when they are in English to English too which so many posters have shouted "must have been a translation error " in their  blindness when talking around statements from the rogatories LOL, too funny!!



Offline John

Re: Translated documents are prone to errors.
« Reply #22 on: February 26, 2014, 06:14:18 AM »
The English language is extremely complex and more so than the Latins. I have seen it time and time again where the wrong words have been used in translations.

Another example which I came across some years ago when I had reason to have Spanish legal documents translated was in the use of the very basic Spanish word 'uno'.  You might well ask yourself how could one possibly go wrong with such a simple word.  I can assure you that you can and a wrongful translation can alter the entire meaning of a document.  Without going into great detail, this word can be translated as 'a' or 'one''.  The particular document concerned was translated by the Crown Office but by sheer chance it was translated a second time by a registered translator engaged by my lawyers and the error identified, an error which by the way changed the meaning of the entire paragraph it was found in. 
« Last Edit: February 26, 2014, 06:23:44 AM by John »
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. An exposé of egregious malfeasance by public officials.
Indeed, the truth never changes with the passage of time.

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Translated documents are prone to errors.
« Reply #23 on: February 26, 2014, 07:41:08 AM »
The English language is extremely complex and more so than the Latins. I have seen it time and time again where the wrong words have been used in translations.

Another example which I came across some years ago when I had reason to have Spanish legal documents translated was in the use of the very basic Spanish word 'uno'.  You might well ask yourself how could one possibly go wrong with such a simple word.  I can assure you that you can and a wrongful translation can alter the entire meaning of a document.  Without going into great detail, this word can be translated as 'a' or 'one''.  The particular document concerned was translated by the Crown Office but by sheer chance it was translated a second time by a registered translator engaged by my lawyers and the error identified, an error which by the way changed the meaning of the entire paragraph it was found in.

Posters don't want to admit that there ARE errors in translations but there has to be.

Offline peter claridge

Re: Translated documents are prone to errors.
« Reply #24 on: February 26, 2014, 11:44:12 AM »
These http://www.mccannfiles.com/id261.html#tap19 didn't require translating!

Offline John

Re: Translated documents are prone to errors.
« Reply #25 on: March 02, 2014, 04:37:24 PM »
Off topic but just noticed in the files that daughter Aoife had her nationality translated as English in the mccannpjfiles.co.uk website and Irish on the mccannfiles.com site.   Just what some posters were saying the other day about translations.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2014, 04:50:33 PM by John »
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. An exposé of egregious malfeasance by public officials.
Indeed, the truth never changes with the passage of time.

Offline Carana

Re: Translated documents are prone to errors.
« Reply #26 on: March 03, 2014, 08:24:19 AM »
Off topic but just noticed in the files that daughter Aoife had her nationality translated as English in the mccannpjfilesk.co.uk website and Irish on the mccannfiles.com site.   Just what some posters were saying the other day about translations.

Well spotted, John. Not strictly speaking a translation issue, though - more of an absent-minded mistake by the PJ, I would think. At the top of the page in the PT original it states her nationality as Irish (this detail got left out in the online translation for some reason), but then goes on to state "being an English citizen" at the beginning of the actual statement. ("Por ser uma cidadã inglesa...")

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/P6/06_VOLUME_VIa_Page_1611.jpg
« Last Edit: March 03, 2014, 09:27:39 AM by Carana »

Redblossom

  • Guest
Re: Translated documents are prone to errors.
« Reply #27 on: March 03, 2014, 10:48:25 PM »
Well spotted, John. Not strictly speaking a translation issue, though - more of an absent-minded mistake by the PJ, I would think. At the top of the page in the PT original it states her nationality as Irish (this detail got left out in the online translation for some reason), but then goes on to state "being an English citizen" at the beginning of the actual statement. ("Por ser uma cidadã inglesa...")

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/P6/06_VOLUME_VIa_Page_1611.jpg

None of the online translations included all the blurb at the top of the page before the statements, so its not true it was left out for some reason in this particular  case


Offline Carana

Re: Translated documents are prone to errors.
« Reply #28 on: March 04, 2014, 09:29:07 AM »
None of the online translations included all the blurb at the top of the page before the statements, so its not true it was left out for some reason in this particular  case

I wasn't suggesting that leaving it out was unique to this statement, nor that there was anything untoward in doing so.

The point is that some people have been insisting on various threads that there aren't any mistakes in the PJ statements / documents. There were and it is more obvious when reading the original as the nationality appears just above.

Redblossom

  • Guest
Re: Translated documents are prone to errors.
« Reply #29 on: March 04, 2014, 11:07:47 AM »
I wasn't suggesting that leaving it out was unique to this statement, nor that there was anything untoward in doing so.

The point is that some people have been insisting on various threads that there aren't any mistakes in the PJ statements / documents. There were and it is more obvious when reading the original as the nationality appears just above.

So why did you say:

At the top of the page in the PT original it states her nationality as Irish (this detail got left out in the online translation for some reason)

?