Tavares Report wrongly claims EVRD Eddie alerted within the boot of the hire car

[sadie]

No it doesn't have to be blood because there could be blood in other vehicles. It could have been cadaver scent which he was trained to find i.e. the enhanced meaning.

you are thinking in an inverted way Pfinder.  you seem to be so keen [ edited out ] that you cant accept that the most likely thing is that Eddie *IF* alerted to a scent thru a distorted seal, then it is most likely to be blood (as on Gerrys keyring or unwashed clothing in the boot area.)

Dunno, but I keep thinking that eddie sniffed a little away from the actual seal.  I haven't got the energy to check, but one of you almost certainly is looking at the doggie / car video some time in the next 24 hours

[ferryman]

No it doesn't have to be blood because there could be blood in other vehicles. It could have been cadaver scent which he was trained to find i.e. the enhanced meaning.

What?

Gerry is alive.

Eddie never reacted to the boot of the car.

[sadie]

No it doesn't have to be blood because there could be blood in other vehicles. It could have been cadaver scent which he was trained to find i.e. the enhanced meaning.

Come on, PFinder, even you must admit that Eddie whizzed around the other cars in a tizz,  but was ordered back to the Mccann car over and over again ... was it five times or four times?  And very strictly made to sniff the one car only; that car being the Mccann car.

Eddie is not daft; he would know where he had to be sensible cos Grime indicated it to him sternly and repeatedly.  Strange that it was the drivers door that was rapped repeatedly, Gerrys key would have been just inside.  Strange that the boot was rapped repeatedly; Keela found blood in there.

Just a co-incidence, I suppose ... but strange never the less.



Now, a question for you.
Why do you think that Eddie wasn't put inside the car?

[Brietta]

No it doesn't have to be blood because there could be blood in other vehicles. It could have been cadaver scent which he was trained to find i.e. the enhanced meaning.

• Both dogs alerted to the key fob hidden in the bucket of sand ~ I've always found that an extraordinary action to take which may have risked contaminating or destroying evidence ~ but, however ...
• Both dogs were trained to alert to blood ... which probably explains that the cellular material recorded in the FSS report was blood.
• The cellular material was confirmed as having been deposited by a living breathing person.
• If the key fob had carried ... the scent of death ... that would have been transferred to the area inside the car where the key fob had been.
• That Eddie did not then alert inside the car proves that there was no cadaver contaminate either from the key fob or anything else.
• Therefore Eddie DID NOT alert to cadaver scent from the McCann hire car ... despite the rather spectacular display of barking outside the door.

[misty]

• Both dogs alerted to the key fob hidden in the bucket of sand ~ I've always found that an extraordinary action to take which may have risked contaminating or destroying evidence ~ but, however ...
• Both dogs were trained to alert to blood ... which probably explains that the cellular material recorded in the FSS report was blood.
• The cellular material was confirmed as having been deposited by a living breathing person.
• If the key fob had carried ... the scent of death ... that would have been transferred to the area inside the car where the key fob had been.
• That Eddie did not then alert inside the car proves that there was no cadaver contaminate either from the key fob or anything else.
• Therefore Eddie DID NOT alert to cadaver scent from the McCann hire car ... despite the rather spectacular display of barking outside the door.

Somewhere in those PJ files is a translation which says the key fob was placed UNDER the fire sand bucket, not inside it.

[pathfinder73]

Come on, PFinder, even you must admit that Eddie whizzed around the other cars in a tizz,  but was ordered back to the Mccann car over and over again ... was it five times or four times?  And very strictly made to sniff the one car only; that car being the Mccann car.

Eddie is not daft; he would know where he had to be sensible cos Grime indicated it to him sternly and repeatedly.  Strange that it was the drivers door that was rapped repeatedly, Gerrys key would have been just inside.  Strange that the boot was rapped repeatedly; Keela found blood in there.

Just a co-incidence, I suppose ... but strange never the less.



Now, a question for you.
Why do you think that Eddie wasn't put inside the car?

It could be both because in other Eddie alerts blood was not detected. Eddie was not put inside the car because Keela was searching for blood DNA evidence. A body was not in the car.

[Brietta]

Somewhere in those PJ files is a translation which says the key fob was placed UNDER the fire sand bucket, not inside it.

I think you are correct, Misty, certainly a more sensible course of action ~ if they remembered to protect  it from the garage floor.

[misty]

I think you are correct, Misty, certainly a more sensible course of action ~ if they remembered to protect  it from the garage floor.

I doubt they would have gone as far as to protect it from the floor if the key fob was offered no protection from contamination by the driver of the Scenic en route to the underground car park.
It always puzzled me why the fob would be buried in sand - perhaps some kind soul would scan through the doggie documents & find the relevant wording in Portuguese & the correct translation. So much is taken for granted as being 100% accurately translated,

[Brietta]

It could be both because in other Eddie alerts blood was not detected. Eddie was not put inside the car because Keela was searching for blood DNA evidence. A body was not in the car.

No body ... neither was there cadaver scent contaminant inside the car.

We have seen Eddie 'alerting' outside the car and to this day many still believe he alerted as a result of Madeleine's defrosting remains having been conveyed in the non-existent wheel well in the boot of the Renault.

We have seen Eddie Alerting inside Haute de la Garenne in Jersey.  Some samples were recovered which justified his alerts ... but milk teeth do not evidence of mass murder make ... and that was the evidence that Lenny Harper was looking for.

We have seen Eddie 'alerting' in Luz ... and despite his handler's warning otherwise ... there are those who believe he was alerting to death.  Which without corroboration is untenable.  He may have alerted behind the couch and in the garage to a confirmed substance ... whatever else he barked at in Luz remains a mystery.

Perhaps more official effort should have been put into a Portuguese replication of the inquiry conducted into the failed Jersey inquiry which devoted a large part of its findings into the efforts of the cadaver dog and his handler.
The reluctance to sort it out may have been the ramifications of reviewing the conduct of the case in Luz and ignoring Figueira ... who knows?

However I think you have hit the nail on the head when you say "A body was not in the car."
Nor was there anything other than a key fob to which Eddie could react as per his early training to blood. 

[ferryman]

Somewhere in those PJ files is a translation which says the key fob was placed UNDER the fire sand bucket, not inside it.

04.11 ? the dog ?marked? the compartment on the driver?s side, which was seen to contain the vehicle?s key, of a plastic electronic card type, with a key ring from the Budget car rental agency.

With the aim of confirming whether the dog had effectively ?marked? the vehicle?s key, which was inside the compartment on the driver?s side, at 04.13 the key in question was removed from the vehicle and hidden in a place far from the vehicle on the third floor of the underground car park.

At about 04.14 it was observed that the dog ?marked? the area of a box containing sand from the Fire Service, underneath which, effectively, the vehicle?s key had been hidden.

At approximately 04.50 a new sniffer dog inspection was carried out using the dog EDDY which detects cadaver odour, using the vehicle key which for this purpose was hidden on the fourth floor of the underground car park, far away from the vehicle.

At about 04.51, it was observed that the dog ?marked? the area of the box containing sand from the Fire Service, underneath which the key had been hidden.

[misty]

Thanks, Ferryman. My laziness has no bounds today.

[pegasus]

Scent was escaping from the driver's door where he alerted. The source of the scent he was alerting to could be anywhere inside the vehicle.

"This then produced an alert indication at the lower part of the drivers door where the dog was biting and barking. I recognise this behaviour as the dog indicating scent emitting from the inside of the vehicle through the seal around the door." Martin Grime

The door has a drain hole so that any water that gets into the door interior can drain out.
Obviously the drain hole is exterior to the door seal otherwise it would not drain.
The Scenic driver door drain hole is located at the exact point where Eddie sniffed and alerted.

[mercury]

It could mean the key was hidden under the sand

Someone who understands  portuguese might want to help here

[Robittybob1]

No body ... neither was there cadaver scent contaminant inside the car.

We have seen Eddie 'alerting' outside the car and to this day many still believe he alerted as a result of Madeleine's defrosting remains having been conveyed in the non-existent wheel well in the boot of the Renault.

.....

However I think you have hit the nail on the head when you say "A body was not in the car."
Nor was there anything other than a key fob to which Eddie could react as per his early training to blood.

Eddie's purpose was to alert to the possibility that there had been a cadaver in that car.  They found some evidence of DNA which came from someone, but it wasn't Madeleine, it wasn't a match.

[ferryman]

Eddie's purpose was to alert to the possibility that there had been a cadaver in that car.  They found some evidence of DNA which came from someone, but it wasn't Madeleine, it wasn't a match.

Eddie alerted to spots of Gerry's blood on the ignition key.

Eddie ignored the boot.