Author Topic: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.  (Read 30844 times)

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Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #465 on: April 05, 2019, 08:46:12 AM »
Hi Holly,

There are many different prints you can see from some of the photos, some have been identified in some detail outside of the police reports.. but there dooesn't appear to be too much focus from them about the importance of the different tyre tracks as if conveniently swept under the carpet.. unless of course there is a bundle of information undisclosed that was not deemed important to the prosecution..

Sorry I was referring to tyre prints above when I meant tyre tracks!  I wonder if initially officers were not particularly motivated in bringing the perps to justice on the basis of the victims' backgrounds?  Maybe they underestimated press attention which then resulted in government/police hierarchy putting pressure on the 'foot soldiers' by which time a lot of evidence that could potentially have been captured was lost.

We know Donna Jagger gave a press conference on 8th Dec appealing for info:

https://www.theguardian.com/fromthearchive/story/0,,1715361,00.html

It is obvious the police would interview those close to the murdered trio in an attempt to find out what they were up to.  They would also look through their phone records.  If Steele/Whomes were suspected in the early days they would have been taken in for questioning and have their vehicles, homes, possessions examined.  The prosecution claim Steele travelled in the Range Rover and that Steele/Whomes left the soc by the VW Passat and yet no soil forensics linking Steele/Whomes?!

https://www.huttonltd.com/services/soil-forensics

The Range Rover and Passat were forensically examined.  Steele from Great Bentley where apparently he spent a lot of time at his mother's in Point Clear.  These areas will be very geologically different to South Essex.  Where's the soil forensics linking Steele to Range Rover?  Where's the soil forensics from soc in the Passat?  It is claimed Whomes was lying in wait in the bushes/hedges where's the plant dna from soc in the Passat?
Setting the pussy among the pigeons!

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #466 on: April 05, 2019, 01:14:45 PM »
Furthermore, Nicholls alleges that the gun Mick is carrying falls to pieces in "TV Bloopers" style during the hit.. Police forensics confirm only one gun used.. If they weren't dead already they would of surely moved from the relaxed position during this gun failure if they were taking it in turns to shoot them to share the responsibility. Nicholls uses this tactic in nearly of all his statements, he adds detail to the event which are designed to add a level of credence to the story but under scrutiny don't stack up. In my opinion to carry out a hit this clinically apart from being an expert you'd at least need to have some confidence the weapons were serviced correctly and fit for purpose.

Imo the police wanted to see Steele and Whomes go down for the murders hence DN's testimony of the pair partaking.

The experts description is VERY revealing:

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=6020.msg510061#msg510061

"He said from the relaxed positions of the deceased three it appeared to have happened very rapidly. There was not time for special movement or something to move them from their comfortable positions".

The above imo rules out Steele/Whomes and many silly theories emanating from the likes of Billy Jasper about a Mr D. 

The perp(s) were clearly able to orchestrate the whole thing from the location to knowing they could get Tate sitting near side.  If Tate was sitting off side it would have made shooting Rolfe and Tucker through the rear off side open door impossible without Tate knowing what was about to take place.  And shooting through the near side open door wasn't an option as the perp needed some distance which wasn't available that side with the hedges.

The perp(s) were clearly known and trusted by the murdered trio hence their "comfortable positions".  3 gang members murdered in one episode by other gang members would be a first? for the UK if this is what happened?!   

The CoA doc states:

"He said that he would be giving information about the illegal activities of police officers but that he had not said anything so far to Detective Constables Brown and Winstone because he did not know if he could trust them. Detective Superintendent Barrington assured him that they were trustworthy".

According to the above DN does not restrict his revelations to DC Bird who the police and courts acknowledge had a corrupt relationship with DN.  Who were the "police officers"?

We know DN was a police informant and had a corrupt relationship with at least one police officer, DC Bird.  We know DN's mobile was the only mobile whereby a call was routed through the Rettendon tower at a time it is thought the murders took place.  It has been said Tate was also a police informant.  We know Tate told Sarah Saunders he was "with some people" when she last spoke with him on his mobile at 18.44.  We know Nicholls and Tate were associates/friends.  We know someone was calling Tate, Tucker and Nicholls from call boxes on the day of the murders.  If Whomes and Steele were making these calls there was no need for them to call Nicholls from a call box when all the other calls made to Nicholls on that day from Steele/Whomes were mobile to mobile.  Were the "some people" corrupt police officers involved in "illegal activities"?  Did police officers murder the trio? 

What was the extent of the "illegal activities"?  Were corrupt police officers seizing drugs from one gang and selling all or part of the haul to other gangs?  Or dealing on behalf of other criminals?  Or officers taking drugs/inducements in exchange for turning a blind eye and/or providing police intelligence enabling the gangs to stay ahead?  Maybe the murdered trio were becoming a liability to corrupt officers and putting them in compromising positions with other criminals and/or the vast majority of honest police officers?   

Nicholls, Rolfe, Steele, Tate, Tucker and Whomes were all criminals involved in various forms of criminality including drug dealing.  The police (and most of the public) have no respect for any of these people especially on the back of the death of Leah Betts whether or not they were directly, indirectly involved or not involved. 

Imo corrupt police officers were responsible for the murders.  You can hear about such a case in Oz : Roger Rogerson:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VSJzCdxCQMs

I'm not suggesting DC Bird was responsible but he may well have been working with other corrupt officers and not necessarily from Essex Police either. 

Corrupt police officers tick all the boxes:

- Trained in ambush techniques/marksman/sniper
- May well have honed their skills at Peter Theobald's shooting range or at least be aware of such a facility and how it would afford the ideal location for the murders.
- Would have been trusted by trio in terms of not suspecting them of pulling firearms
- Would understand how not to leave forensic evidence at soc
- Working with the likes of Nicholls and Tate enabling the murders
- Phone calls from phone boxes to Nicholls, Tate and Tucker on day of murders
Setting the pussy among the pigeons!

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #467 on: April 05, 2019, 03:03:34 PM »
Just watched the following re Roger Rogerson bent Oz cop now serving life imprisonment for murder, drug trafficking and perverting the course of justice:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEf3GHIBj4s



 
Setting the pussy among the pigeons!

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #468 on: April 10, 2019, 12:39:27 PM »
Chud do you know if jurors were taken to soc?  I can't see that they were?

There doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason with cases involving shooting incidents.  At the trials of Tony Martin and Barry George jurors were taken to soc.  At Jeremy Bamber's trial jurors were not taken to soc. 



Setting the pussy among the pigeons!

Offline Chud

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #469 on: April 13, 2019, 11:18:27 AM »
Chud do you know if jurors were taken to soc?  I can't see that they were?

There doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason with cases involving shooting incidents.  At the trials of Tony Martin and Barry George jurors were taken to soc.  At Jeremy Bamber's trial jurors were not taken to soc.

Hi Holly,

Very good question that, I am not aware from any of the reading of documents that this happened. I think this opportunity was missed and at the same time it could of been put to good use in explaining the difficult logistics of carrying out the crime without any tangible forensics in the official narrative. From what I can see, the defence spent most of the time trying to undermine Nicholls character rather than looking at this scientifically.. For example how do you extract yourself from the scene without leaving any trace etc.. I'll see if I can get a definitive answer..

Offline Chud

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #470 on: April 13, 2019, 11:29:48 PM »
After a good search the only thing the jurors were shown relating to the SOC is photos at the trial.. In the summing up when referring to the evidence there are only mentions of the photos they have seen..

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #471 on: April 29, 2019, 01:11:40 PM »
After a good search the only thing the jurors were shown relating to the SOC is photos at the trial.. In the summing up when referring to the evidence there are only mentions of the photos they have seen..

Thanks Chud.  I would have thought it was relevant for jurors to be taken to soc?

There doesn't appear to be any standard format for trials.  Sometimes jurors are taken to soc sometimes not. 
Setting the pussy among the pigeons!

Offline Chud

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #472 on: April 30, 2019, 02:33:22 PM »
Considering the length of the trial, I'm wondering if the defense presented their case with more focus on the logistics of the hit, the lack of forensics at the SOC and other elements which to this day still cause doubt then maybe a visit would of been viable.. I know they visited the Bamber scene (I believe?) , was that at the request of the prosecution, the defense or the judge? tks

Offline Myster

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Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #473 on: April 30, 2019, 06:59:06 PM »
Considering the length of the trial, I'm wondering if the defense presented their case with more focus on the logistics of the hit, the lack of forensics at the SOC and other elements which to this day still cause doubt then maybe a visit would of been viable.. I know they visited the Bamber scene (I believe?) , was that at the request of the prosecution, the defense or the judge? tks
No Chud, the jury only visited Fingringhoe firing range to see a demonstration by Malcolm Fletcher of the actual Anschutz 525 rifle.  A junior counsel representing Bamber, Edmund Lawson QC, drove himself there rather than travelling by coach with the barristers and jury, but he got lost on the way and missed the demo.  A life cut short in his prime unfortunately...

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/obituaries/law-obituaries/5309767/Edmund-Lawson-QC.html

Offline Chud

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #474 on: May 01, 2019, 12:54:13 PM »
Thanks Myster, appreciate the correction, very interesting, I'll have a read of that article Tks..