Author Topic: Did the PJ do a reconstitution after Joana Cipriano disappeared?  (Read 21353 times)

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Offline Carana

Re: Did the PJ do a reconstitution after Joana Cipriano disappeared?
« Reply #120 on: July 14, 2015, 06:44:28 PM »
That café was their regular shop for groceries I believe and Joana liked to go there, because the owners daughter was her friend.
Witnesses said that the streets were empty because everyone was at the cockle fair. The only traffic that seems to have been noticed was a large black car that was cruising around the area on that day. Also the tow truck and a red car that Leandro was dealing with for his parents.

Hang on... the Pasteleria wasn't the same as the little supermarket.

NN is the bar / mini shop person:
A testemunha NN, proprietária da "Pastelaria ...", declarou que no dia 12 de Setembro a CC apareceu na pastelaria, pelas 8h 20m / 8 h 30m, a comprar um pacote de leite e duas latas de atum.

This is the "bolos" shop person:
A testemunha AA8, que à data era proprietária de uma fábrica de bolos na Figueira, 

The supermarket lady appears to have been someone else again:
A testemunha BB3, proprietária de um supermercado na Figueira, declarou conhecer muito bem a CC, de quem era amiga, tendo sido a testemunha que levou a menor à escola no primeiro dia de aulas na Figueira.



Offline Carana

Re: Did the PJ do a reconstitution after Joana Cipriano disappeared?
« Reply #121 on: July 14, 2015, 06:47:50 PM »
If my daughter had gone missing,  I would not be waiting for the following morning.

How old was she by the way ?

She met with the police that night, but they told her to go make a formal report the next morning.

Offline Anna

Re: Did the PJ do a reconstitution after Joana Cipriano disappeared?
« Reply #122 on: July 14, 2015, 06:50:41 PM »
I don't know Anna. I suspect that the video confession was well after the initial "confessions", i.e., on or around 7 October - that seems to be the only reliable reference for the moment.

Leandro doesn't mention a date (but if he was the only one to have a key, it was presumably after Leonor had been held on remand). The SC ruling doesn't appear to mention a date, either.

This info is already on here somewhere, but this is a data collection from sep on to may. I haven't got a link sorry. If I can find more already on here I will add.

Day 12: Joana Cipriano, eight years ago, is seen, for the last time, near the church of Figueira, Portimao. GNR starts searching.

Day 16: the Disappearance of the child is participated to Interpol. PJ the puts the chance of crime and strengthens the means in the field.

Day 22: Forensic Laboratory collects blood and hair of Joanna in the house. IS interrogated John Cipriano, uncle of the child. Mother and uncle are arrested on charges of murder. On day 24, the Court of Portimao ordains the preventive detention for Leonor and loose John Cyprian. Mother confesses to having killed the daughter accidentally.

Day 26: John Cyprian confesses to having been him to kill Joana. Is remanded in custody.

OCTOBER

Day 21: PJ passes eight hours rummaging among the casa Da Figueira, where collected objects and clothing of Joana.

NOVEMBER

Day 11: Exams made to traces of blood found in the house of Joana reveal themselves inconclusive.



Day 21: are found pieces of fabric and hair in a pigsty. PJ puts the hypothesis of the body of joana have been thrown to the site.

January 2005

Leonor says-if damaged by PJ. Antonio Leandro, stepfather of joana, consists accused.

MARCH

Day 12: Six months after the disappearance of Joana prevails the thesis of murder.

MAY Day 2005

3: MP deduces the indictment against Leonor and John Cyprian by crimes of murder qualified,
desecration and concealment of corpse.
“You should not honour men more than truth.”
― Plato

stephen25000

  • Guest
Re: Did the PJ do a reconstitution after Joana Cipriano disappeared?
« Reply #123 on: July 14, 2015, 06:55:19 PM »
She met with the police that night, but they told her to go make a formal report the next morning.

Did she search for her daughter that night ?

Offline Carana

Re: Did the PJ do a reconstitution after Joana Cipriano disappeared?
« Reply #124 on: July 14, 2015, 07:02:15 PM »
I've seen several timelines by various media and they don't always correspond.

I haven't found anything to dispute that she disappeared on the evening of 12 September 2004. So that's one date that seems reliable.

Offline Carana

Re: Did the PJ do a reconstitution after Joana Cipriano disappeared?
« Reply #125 on: July 14, 2015, 07:03:05 PM »
Did she search for her daughter that night ?

Yes.

Offline Anna

Re: Did the PJ do a reconstitution after Joana Cipriano disappeared?
« Reply #126 on: July 14, 2015, 07:07:01 PM »
Did she search for her daughter that night ?

Yes she did, Stephen. All night.
“You should not honour men more than truth.”
― Plato

stephen25000

  • Guest
Re: Did the PJ do a reconstitution after Joana Cipriano disappeared?
« Reply #127 on: July 14, 2015, 07:14:55 PM »
Yes.

When, and for how long ?

A cite would be, rather than hearsay.

stephen25000

  • Guest
Re: Did the PJ do a reconstitution after Joana Cipriano disappeared?
« Reply #128 on: July 14, 2015, 07:15:29 PM »
Yes she did, Stephen. All night.

You can prove that she did ?
« Last Edit: July 14, 2015, 07:20:31 PM by stephen25000 »

Offline Carana

Re: Did the PJ do a reconstitution after Joana Cipriano disappeared?
« Reply #129 on: July 14, 2015, 07:29:37 PM »
When, and for how long ?

A cite would be, rather than hearsay.

Here you go, the Supreme Court ruling if that's good enough.

http://www.dgsi.pt/jstj.nsf/954f0ce6ad9dd8b980256b5f003fa814/bfaf1cea93ab75fb8025716200388d89?OpenDocument&Highlight=0,cipriano

stephen25000

  • Guest
Re: Did the PJ do a reconstitution after Joana Cipriano disappeared?
« Reply #130 on: July 14, 2015, 07:35:07 PM »
Here you go, the Supreme Court ruling if that's good enough.

http://www.dgsi.pt/jstj.nsf/954f0ce6ad9dd8b980256b5f003fa814/bfaf1cea93ab75fb8025716200388d89?OpenDocument&Highlight=0,cipriano

The translation is little short of gibberish.

Is there any independent verification she searched through the night for her daughter ?

Offline Carana

Re: Did the PJ do a reconstitution after Joana Cipriano disappeared?
« Reply #131 on: July 14, 2015, 07:40:25 PM »
The translation is little short of gibberish.

Is there any independent verification she searched through the night for her daughter ?

Do you mean aside from witness testimonies in a court of law? What would you be looking for?

She didn't go out immediately as she had the toddlers at home, but sent her brother out when she didn't get back home. The brother alerted the other two men (her partner and  the other guy who iived with them). They checked back home that she hadn't returned and went back out to search. When they still hadn't found her, she went out. Witnesses: the bar / shop lady, various other people, the police that night...

stephen25000

  • Guest
Re: Did the PJ do a reconstitution after Joana Cipriano disappeared?
« Reply #132 on: July 14, 2015, 07:43:09 PM »
Do you mean aside from witness testimonies in a court of law? What would you be looking for?

She didn't go out immediately as she had the toddlers at home, but sent her brother out when she didn't get back home. The brother alerted the other two men (her partner and  the other guy who iived with them). They checked back home that she hadn't returned and went back out to search. When they still hadn't found her, she went out. Witnesses: the bar / shop lady, various other people, the police that night...

In the middle of the night ?

and her brother is hardly a reliable witness, is he.

How do we know that she, her brother and this other man told the truth ?

Offline Carana

Re: Did the PJ do a reconstitution after Joana Cipriano disappeared?
« Reply #133 on: July 14, 2015, 07:48:17 PM »
In the middle of the night ?

and her brother is hardly a reliable witness, is he.

How do we know that she, her brother and this other man told the truth ?

I've posted a summary on the other recent thread on here.

Are you saying that the cafe / shop lady was lying? That the GNR cop was lying?

There's no cctv evidence, Stephen, so all there is to go on is witness statements.

Aside, seemingly, from amateur footage of the festival that showed Leandro (her partner) away from home during the supposed fateful home event time.

stephen25000

  • Guest
Re: Did the PJ do a reconstitution after Joana Cipriano disappeared?
« Reply #134 on: July 14, 2015, 07:51:52 PM »
I've posted a summary on the other recent thread on here.

Are you saying that the cafe / shop lady was lying? That the GNR cop was lying?

There's no cctv evidence, Stephen, so all there is to go on is witness statements.

Aside, seemingly, from amateur footage of the festival that showed Leandro (her partner) away from home during the supposed fateful home event time.

Were they with her when she searched ?