The Carpenters - Calling out of Madelene Madeleine

[sadie]

Route home from restuarant is out through the little reception building, cross road, through the carpark south of block 6, then across to the other side of the big grass area.

Are you absolutely certain of that Pegasus, because when I read about their route home, I was unable to make sense of the description.

I actually think that you are probably right, but am not sure enough to state that in black and white.

[misty]

Are you absolutely certain of that Pegasus, because when I read about their route home, I was unable to make sense of the description.

I actually think that you are probably right, but am not sure enough to state that in black and white.

Their apartment was immediately adjacent to the back garden of Casa Liliana.

[Brietta]

Their apartment was immediately adjacent to the back garden of Casa Liliana.

Aha ... the conversation with Robert Murat through the hedge leading to Mr Carpenter accompanying him and introducing him to Gerry McCann (have I got that right?).

[sadie]

Their apartment was immediately adjacent to the back garden of Casa Liliana.

Yep, I knew that, but there is more than one way of getting there.

I do think that Pegasus is most likely right, but it worries me that it should be taken as fact, when we dont know for sure.

[pegasus]

Yep, I knew that, but there is more than one way of getting there.

I do think that Pegasus is most likely right, but it worries me that it should be taken as fact, when we dont know for sure.

Read SC rog statement and then locate on a map.

[misty]

Read SC rog statement and then locate on a map.

It's easiest if you do a satellite image on Google Earth, working across from the Tapas pool, heading right & over the grassy area with the solitary palm tree, then over the top of Casa Liliana. 

[pegasus]

It's easiest if you do a satellite image on Google Earth, working across from the Tapas pool, heading right & over the grassy area with the solitary palm tree, then over the top of Casa Liliana.

How many minutes walk do you think?

[misty]

How many minutes walk do you think?

For an adult walking an average pace, maybe 2 minutes or less from the Tapas door. With wife & child/pushchair, a little longer.

[pegasus]

For an adult walking an average pace, maybe 2 minutes or less from the Tapas door. With wife & child/pushchair, a little longer.

If they left Tapas "shortly after" the T7 started arriving at Tapas, they would be home about 9.15? 9.30?

[misty]

If they left Tapas "shortly after" the T7 started arriving at Tapas, they would be home about 9.15? 9.30?

Anytime from 8.35 to 9.10 I would say. It would depend on how many of the group had arrived when the Carpenters left and which couples they were familiar with.

[pegasus]

If Mrs C's vague recollection on way home of hearing someone calling "Madeleine Madeleine" is correct, it is difficult to make it as late as 21.50 or 22.00.

[misty]

If Mrs C's vague recollection on way home of hearing someone calling "Madeleine Madeleine" is correct, it is difficult to make it as late as 21.50 or 22.00.

Yes. I agree. It's a waste of time speculating without having access to her statement.
Problem is, SC makes reference in his rogatory to seeing around 10 members of the group at the table & people leaving to go & check the children.  If we accept that he witnessed at least the 9pm check, then he probably didn't leave until 9.05 - but before Gerry left to carry out his check.

[pegasus]

Yes. I agree. It's a waste of time speculating without having access to her statement.
Problem is, SC makes reference in his rogatory to seeing around 10 members of the group at the table & people leaving to go & check the children.  If we accept that he witnessed at least the 9pm check, then he probably didn't leave until 9.05 - but before Gerry left to carry out his check.

He gives various estimates of time for example
"Between approximately a quarter past nine and half past nine we left the Tapas bar to go home"
Which would be after GM check and chat finished ?

[G-Unit]

He gives various estimates of time for example
"Between approximately a quarter past nine and half past nine we left the Tapas bar to go home"
Which would be after GM check and chat finished ?

Carpenter mentions cars parked in the road, but they were approx. 6 metres from the tapas entrance. According to head chef Pelega he arrived at the Tapas at 21,10H and he parked next to a blue car, but he doesn't specify exactly where.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/STEPHEN-CARPENTER.htm

[pegasus]

Let's assume Mrs C, just before she got home from tapas, did hear the very first searching.
The only way to make that work is:

M returns to tapas
G leaves tapas
J leaves tapas
G returns to tapas
J returns to tapas
M and R leave tapas
M returns to tapas
J leaves tapas
R returns to tapas
C family leave tapas ???
K leaves tapas
K returns to tapas
G K R M R D F leave tapas
G K R M R D F arrive at 5A garden gate
Searches begin
Mrs C hears searcher calling girl's name ???
C family arrive home ???

IMO it's impossible to make it work if the C family left tapas any earlier than that.