Did Eddie and Keela work as a team prior to the Madeleine McCann case?

[ferryman]

One of those mysterious 'I know a lot but can't tell' types.

Poacher certainly made better sense of Grime's trip to America than Grime himself did.

[mercury]

I can only go from what Grime says on his profile... I see two (Devon and Cornwall) cases in which he correctly identified what may well have been residual cadaver scent (or possibly residual blood or other scent within his parameters).

In the two others, there was human material present (one of unspecified nature and another of blood).

(I've left out New Mexico, as Eddie didn't alert even though there was a body as it had been wrapped in plastic and buried under concrete.)

- N. Ireland (ATTRACTA HARRON): Eddie reacted to the physical presence of "human material".
- Wiltshire (AMANDA EDWARDS): reacted to the physical presence of blood. Then identified a deposition site, where presumably a body was found.
- Devon (CHARLOTTE PINKNEY): the dog alerted to her button, and a confession followed to confirm.
- Cornwall (?): the dog alerted to a carpet, and a confession followed to confirm.



We know from the FOI on deployments between 2003 and 2007 that working on his own with Eddie, he found one body. Another four (including two bodies found together) were with Ellis / Frankie, so it's not clear which dog found them, or if they separately both corroborated the finds without the other handler / dog pair knowing in advance. If Eddie found them independently of Frankie,  it is still because there were bodies there.

We also know from the FOI that:

"Out of the twenty occasions where the dog teams were deployed together, two deployments were in the South Yorkshire Police Force area and the remainder were out of the force.

All seventeen deployments for Grime/Eddie working alone were to external forces."

And from whichever version of Grime's profile:

Northern Ireland, UK
A missing person, last seen returning from church, on foot, in N. Ireland. The
search of suspects 'burnt out vehicle' by forensic scientists did not reveal any
evidence. A search by the E.V.R.D. identified a position in the rear passenger
foot well where the dog alerted to the presence of human material. A sample
was taken and when analysed revealed the victims' DNA. The enquiry then
concentrated its efforts on the suspect and the E.V.R.D. located the body of
the woman in a river bank deposition site. Further searches identified a
Vol. IX p. 2482

location where the E.V.R.D. alerted in the front bedroom of the offenders
empty next door dwelling house. When interviewed the suspect admitted that
the body had lain in the room for 1 hour prior to disposal. Forensic teams
were unable to extract any forensic evidence despite being shown the exact
position.

Wiltshire, UK
A female was abducted by her ex-boyfriend. Intelligence suggested that her
ex-boy friend had taken her to his house. A search by the EVRD of the house
resulted in small blood stains being alert indicated and forensically confirmed
as her blood. The suspect, a builder, was in possession of a van. This was
searched and the EVRD dog alerted to a 'wacker plate', spirtit level, and
shovel. A site was identified where the suspect had been working. The EVRD
then located the body deposition site in an area of a garbage base that had
been prepared by the suspect. He had returned with the dead girl, dug a
grave in the centre, placed the body in the hole, replaced the spoil and then
used the shovel, wacker plate and spirit level to return the ground to its
original state.

Devon, UK
A female was abducted and her whereabouts were unknown. The suspect
was a bus driver. An initial search by the E.V.R.D. alerted at a location near
to a sighting of the suspect in suspicious circumstances. A forensic search at
the alert location revealed a small button off of the girls clothing in long grass.
The offender confessed to the murder and confirmed her body had been
initially temporarily placed at the dog's alert location.

Cornwall, UK
A woman was reported missing by her partner. A search of the suspects
house by the EVRD was conducted who indicated on the living room carpet.
No forensic evidence was recovered. Subsequently a diary written by the
suspect was alert indicated by the dog. The diary had written extracts that the
offender had laid the victim on the carpet whilst dead, the diary had in fact
been written by the suspect having handled the body. This was confirmed by
the offender in interview.

New Mexico, U.S.A.
A witness reported having seen two men walk off into brush land carrying a
spade and a corpse. The area was searched with the EVRD with no
indications being forthcoming. Other assets were utilised and the body was
found: buried at a depth of 8 feet, under the water table, 3 feet of cement and
5 feet of earth replaced on top the corpse that was wrapped in cling film.
There being no scent available to the dog to receive there was no forthcoming

These are examples relating to the most important member of the duo doggy team, not a full biographical profile of the history of both dogs' employment. Keela was much younger than Eddie so Eddie will have worked without her up until she was "approved". And Im not sure to what you are referring with "whichever version" of Grime's profile

[John]

Now you've gone and ruined it for him - he was working up to that line 

Thought I'd beat him to the draw this time. 

[Mr Gray]

Thought I'd beat him to the draw this time. 

I'm very glad to see that John as an ex policeman and with experience of police dogs...agrees with me

[John]

I'm very glad to see that John as an ex policeman and with experience of police dogs...agrees with me

No, not police dogs I'm afraid.

[Mr Gray]

No, not police dogs I'm afraid.

neither have I but the facts speak for themselves

[John]

neither have I but the facts speak for themselves

So you agree that the dog alerts were evidence of something, however that something is yet to be determined?

[Mr Gray]

So you agree that the dog alerts were evidence of something, however that something is yet to be determined?

that isn't what Grime said...so I don't agree

[John]

that isn't what Grime said...so I don't agree

I am asking what you think davel, not what Grime said.  To repeat, the dog alerts are evidence of something but that something is as yet undetermined, do you agree?

[Mr Gray]

I am asking what you think davel, not what Grime said.  To repeat, the dog alerts are evidence of something but that something is as yet undetermined, do you agree?

If you read my post you will see I have said I do not agree.....because Grime said they have no evidential reliability .... So how can they be evidence of anything

[mercury]

If you read my post you will see I have said I do not agree.....because Grime said they have no evidential reliability .... So how can they be evidence of anything

because the variety of reliability anywhere from 0-10 does not cancel out the existence of the evidence / sign / indication to begin with, it just is not reliable if not corroborated , and seeing as the existence of remnant cadaverscent contaminant can't be corroborated in itself with no other evidence, it's a bit difficult,  and dogs generally do not indicate for no reason, now do you get it?

[Mr Gray]

because the variety of reliability anywhere from 0-10 does not cancel out the existence of the evidence / sign / indication to begin with, it just is not reliable if not corroborated , and seeing as the existence of remnant cadaverscent contaminant can't be corroborated in itself with no other evidence, it's a bit difficult,  and dogs generally do not indicate for no reason, now do you get it?

I get it but you don't it seems....no evidential reliability is 100% clear...

[Mr Gray]

as I have said before the idea that remnant scent would remain outside in the flower bed for 3 months is ridiculous

[mercury]

I get it but you don't it seems....no evidential reliability is 100% clear...

Did my post just whoosh over your head? Oh well, I must learn.....
Matthew 7 : 6 is interesting I suppose for a recap

 &%+((£

[Mr Gray]

Did my post just whoosh over your head? Oh well, I must learn.....
Matthew 7 : 6 is interesting I suppose for a recap

 &%+((£

Your post didn't make any sense....please don't quote religion at me I have a wonderful riposte