Was the PJ's biggest mistake not testing the twins straight away?

[faithlilly]

Fiona mentioned Kate checking the twins,  did Kate actually say to Fiona that she thought they might be drugged?

It could be that it was only Kate who was thinking that.   Fiona said she told Kate they were fine. 

It was Kate who was remembering the stain on Madeleine's pyjama's and thinking the abductor could have tried to sedate Madeleine the night before.   

Could be Gerry didn't think they were drugged,  they were fine afterwards weren't they.

Fiona was with Kate from 10pm onwards, how could she have avoided hearing Kate's frantic entreaties to the police to take her children to hospital ?  And Silvia Batista ? And the GNR and PJ officers ? Do you really believe that not one of them would have remembered her frantic pleas ?

[pathfinder73]

Cops were there. They carried them up to Payne's apartment and they were still asleep instead of demanding they be taken to hospital for testing.

[faithlilly]

Ha ha, great minds and all that!

 

[faithlilly]

The statements typed up by the PJ are based on a summary of answers to questions.

And ?

[Lace]

So if Kate says she asked it's definitely true? I wonder why those she asked forgot to mention it? I wonder why the lady translating forgot to mention it? Perhaps she just thinks she asked. After all she was traumatised and desperate and perhaps mis-remembered. She seems to have forgotten her request by the following morning when she was interviewed. She should have complained, shouldn't she; made a fuss; demanded to know why no-one listened.

You seem very good at imaginative thinking actually. You are able to imagine what two people unknown to you were thinking and feeling.

So if Amaral says something in his book it's definitely true?   coming from someone who lied about torture?

If it was just Kate who thought the twins had been drugged and she was in a state of hysteria it could be that the Police officer didn't take much of what she was saying as meaningful.

It depends on what she was asked in her statement the following day.    The twins were ok maybe she thought she was over reacting.

I am good at putting myself in someone's else's shoes if that is what you are saying about imaginative thinking, I have empathy too.    Maybe you should try it yourself.   After all you weren't there either so all of what we  say apart from what is said in the Police files  has to be what we imagine happened doesn't it or there wouldn't be debate.

[Lace]

Are you laughing at the 'great' bit,  me too.

[Lace]

Fiona was with Kate from 10pm onwards, how could she have avoided hearing Kate's frantic entreaties to the police to take her children to hospital ?  And Silvia Batista ? And the GNR and PJ officers ? Do you really believe that not one of them would have remembered her frantic pleas ?

So Fiona was glued to Kate all night was she?    maybe she was looking after the twins when Kate went to speak to the Officer.

Well one of the officers described the McCann's as behaving oddly,   so maybe he thought it was odd in what whe was asking,  bearing in mind they thought Madeleine had woke and wandered.

[faithlilly]

So Fiona was glued to Kate all night was she?    maybe she was looking after the twins when Kate went to speak to the Officer.

Well one of the officers described the McCann's as behaving oddly,   so maybe he thought it was odd in what whe was asking,  bearing in mind they thought Madeleine had woke and wandered.

I'll ask again Lace do you really believe that no one would have remembered Kate's frantic pleas ?

[Alfred R Jones]

I'll ask again Lace do you really believe that no one would have remembered Kate's frantic pleas ?

No one thought to mention it at the time - the FLOs took nearly a year to remember the remark about the possibility of the children's sedation.  Did anyone ask Fiona about this?  Do you not think Kate said and did lots of things on the evening of the 3rd of May that weren't actually recalled in any detail by the other witnesses?

[G-Unit]

No one thought to mention it at the time - the FLOs took nearly a year to remember the remark about the possibility of the children's sedation.  Did anyone ask Fiona about this?  Do you not think Kate said and did lots of things on the evening of the 3rd of May that weren't actually recalled in any detail by the other witnesses?

I think you'll find it took nearly a year for anyone to take statements from the FLO's, which doesn't mean they had forgotten anything. The question asked was if there was evidence of sedation.

[Lace]

I'll ask again Lace do you really believe that no one would have remembered Kate's frantic pleas ?

If they did they chose not to mention it,    Kate could have just said could you test the twins for drugs and the Officer thought what is she talking about drugs?   the child has just wandered out.

[Alfred R Jones]

I think you'll find it took nearly a year for anyone to take statements from the FLO's, which doesn't mean they had forgotten anything. The question asked was if there was evidence of sedation.

What does this mean then?

"According to the Portuguese PJ Letter of Request, I was asked to respond to the following question:

 Was there anything done or said by Kate or Gerry McCann in your presence or during your various meetings that could raise any suspicion that they had any knowledge about what could have happened to Madeleine, beyond the circumstances described to the Portuguese investigators?

 My reply to the question was: No.

 However, in relation to the above, I would like to add the following..."

[faithlilly]

If they did they chose not to mention it,    Kate could have just said could you test the twins for drugs and the Officer thought what is she talking about drugs?   the child has just wandered out.

Why in heaven's name would Kate ask the officer to test her children for drugs ? What she should have been doing is pleading with anyone who would listen is to get an ambulance and get her children to a hospital as possible as this level of unconsciousness was unusual for them. 

[G-Unit]

What does this mean then?

"According to the Portuguese PJ Letter of Request, I was asked to respond to the following question:

 Was there anything done or said by Kate or Gerry McCann in your presence or during your various meetings that could raise any suspicion that they had any knowledge about what could have happened to Madeleine, beyond the circumstances described to the Portuguese investigators?

 My reply to the question was: No.

 However, in relation to the above, I would like to add the following..."

What do you mean? It means what it says. I'll provide the cites and the relevant parts of the statements;

They also wanted to know whether the PJ had any evidence that would suggest that the person who took Madeleine had used any substance to facilitate the abduction.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/STEPHEN_MARKLEY.htm

and the other statement;

Gerry and Kate also questioned whether there was any suggestion that pointed to the use of drugs to facilitate Madeleine's abduction.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/JIM_McGARVEY.htm

[Brietta]

One of the shortest threads on the forum must surely be the one started by Carana asking what the PJ got right in the investigation into Madeleine McCann's disappearance.
Where to start with analysing mistakes ... ???

In my opinion it would have been a good idea to have had the twins tested for drugs in the immediate aftermath of Madeleine's disappearance even if only for elimination purposes.  But I think it probably comes in pretty far down the list of perceived errors made in the initial stages.

I think the parents' concern at the time would be for the twins' well being and not necessarily giving much if any thought to evidential purposes ... who could have imagined how big the 'calpol' lie was to become shortly thereafter?