Wandering Off Topic

[Alfie]

Well, you know, if I'm honest, the country must be discredited. Portugal used to be seen as a sunny, safe, welcoming holiday destination for us Brits. Then a British child, left alone by her parents who were completely fooled by Portugal's presentation of itself as safe, disappeared.

Us Brits were horrified to learn that we can't expect to be able to leave our kids alone for just 30 minutes without them disappearing into thin air. We learned that Portugal has burglars, bogus charity collectors, people who stand in the streets in broad daylight spying on us and even child abusers! It has a border with Spain too, so these criminal types can escape easily! They can even reach Morocco!

Which begs the question - why are so many of us (myself excluded) still going there? Must be the cheap wine.

[G-Unit]

Which begs the question - why are so many of us (myself excluded) still going there? Must be the cheap wine.

Given our alleged fondness for alcohol, quite possibly.

[Alfie]

Given our alleged fondness for alcohol, quite possibly.

Speak for yourself. 

[Brietta]

Why are you so intent on Portugal's record ?

Slartibartfast asked "Is that the report from an organisation founded by the McCann's lawyer?" in reference to Amnesty International.

The founding father of which was influenced by outrage at the injustice of two students being jailed for toasting freedom.

That is a matter of historical record.

It is worthy of note that the incident took place under the fascist regime of Salazar and has nothing to do with the present day democratic republic which is Portugal.

Amazing that members here have totally misinterpreted an historical event in Portuguese history and its relation to the founding of Amnesty International.

Dictatorship and Revolution in Portugal – History of a Dream

Lisbon, December 1960. In a bar two students clink their glasses to freedom – “A Liberdade!” They are spied on, denounced and finally sentenced to seven years in prison.

Under the Portuguese military dictatorship the word ‘freedom’ is prohibited.

It was reading about this incident in the London Times which moved the lawyer, Peter Benenson, to found Amnesty International.

It would still be thirteen years to the end of the dictatorship in Portugal.

On April 25, 1974 left-leaning troops move into Lisbon and within hours take over all key strategic places in the country.

The head of state and secret service give up after a short resistance. Forty-eight years of dictatorship are over. The dream of socialism awakens.

http://terranovavoice.tamera.org/2014/04/forty-years-after-the-carnation-revolution/1722

[Alice Purjorick]

Which begs the question - why are so many of us (myself excluded) still going there? Must be the cheap wine.

That coupled with the less aggressive nature of the police than in other countries popular with the cheap booze honk-in-the-gutter Britset.

[G-Unit]

Speak for yourself. 

It is well documented how some of the British abuse alcohol both in their own country and elsewhere.

[Alice Purjorick]

Slartibartfast asked "Is that the report from an organisation founded by the McCann's lawyer?" in reference to Amnesty International.

The founding father of which was influenced by outrage at the injustice of two students being jailed for toasting freedom.

That is a matter of historical record.

It is worthy of note that the incident took place under the fascist regime of Salazar and has nothing to do with the present day democratic republic which is Portugal.

Amazing that members here have totally misinterpreted an historical event in Portuguese history and its relation to the founding of Amnesty International.

Dictatorship and Revolution in Portugal – History of a Dream

Lisbon, December 1960. In a bar two students clink their glasses to freedom – “A Liberdade!” They are spied on, denounced and finally sentenced to seven years in prison.

Under the Portuguese military dictatorship the word ‘freedom’ is prohibited.

It was reading about this incident in the London Times which moved the lawyer, Peter Benenson, to found Amnesty International.

It would still be thirteen years to the end of the dictatorship in Portugal.

On April 25, 1974 left-leaning troops move into Lisbon and within hours take over all key strategic places in the country.

The head of state and secret service give up after a short resistance. Forty-eight years of dictatorship are over. The dream of socialism awakens.

http://terranovavoice.tamera.org/2014/04/forty-years-after-the-carnation-revolution/1722

According to those on here who consider themselves well informed, 40 odd years on Portugal remains a fascist state which is presented as fact in argument.

[stephen25000]

According to those on here who consider themselves well informed, 40 odd years on Portugal remains a fascist state which is presemtedas as fact in argument.

Indeed Alice.

Ferryman in particular, regularly refers to Portugal as being a dictatorship or Fascist state, when it is clearly a democracy.

[Brietta]

According to those on here who consider themselves well informed, 40 odd years on Portugal remains a fascist state which is presemtedas as fact in argument.

          To coin a phrase ... "They haven't gone away, you know".  Perhaps in Portugal, they are back?

[stephen25000]

          To coin a phrase ... "They haven't gone away, you know".  Perhaps in Portugal, they are back?

Need I remind you Brietta, there are extreme fascists in the UK, as there are in most countries, and in the last year or so, increasingly visible.

So again Brietta, why pick out Portugal ?

[Brietta]

Need I remind you Brietta, there are extreme fascists in the UK, as there are in most countries, and in the last year or so, increasingly visible.

So again Brietta, why pick out Portugal ?

Your prejudice blinded you to the actual content of my post on the achievement of Peter Benenson in his role as founder of Amnesty International. Which very possibly had a resonance relating to the Carnation Revolution in Portugal a little more than a decade later.

You are the one with the problem regarding Portugal.  Your haste to jump in to defend your erroneous interpretation of what I said and which exists only in your perception is evidence of that.

I did not "pick out Portugal" ... only your defensive attitude has.  You might think about that.

[stephen25000]

Your prejudice blinded you to the actual content of my post on the achievement of Peter Benenson in his role as founder of Amnesty International. Which very possibly had a resonance relating to the Carnation Revolution in Portugal a little more than a decade later.

You are the one with the problem regarding Portugal.  Your haste to jump in to defend your erroneous interpretation of what I said and which exists only in your perception is evidence of that.

I did not "pick out Portugal" ... only your defensive attitude has.  You might think about that.

That tactic won't work we me Brietta.

What I pick out from you though is the questions you don't answer.

[stephen25000]

Your prejudice blinded you to the actual content of my post on the achievement of Peter Benenson in his role as founder of Amnesty International. Which very possibly had a resonance relating to the Carnation Revolution in Portugal a little more than a decade later.

You are the one with the problem regarding Portugal.  Your haste to jump in to defend your erroneous interpretation of what I said and which exists only in your perception is evidence of that.

I did not "pick out Portugal" ... only your defensive attitude has.  You might think about that.

Also, would you care to explain why you and other supporters do not contradict those like ferryman, who continue to denigrate Portugal and call it either a Fascist state or Dictatorship ?

Will this be another question you don't answer.

[Mr Gray]

Also, would you care to explain why you and other supporters do not contradict those like ferryman, who continue to denigrate Portugal and call it either a Fascist state or Dictatorship ?

Will this be another question you don't answer.

Portugal cartainly has fascist remnants from its fascist past
Particularly in the police force
Those things don't disappear overnights

[stephen25000]

Portugal cartainly has fascist remnants from its fascist past
Particularly in the police force
Those things don't disappear overnights

There are fascists in the UK.

So your point is....