Author Topic: Wandering Off Topic  (Read 381579 times)

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Online G-Unit

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5760 on: May 31, 2019, 10:22:36 PM »
Can you remind me what you are talking about please?

I was replying to Carana;

snip

So do you think they orchestrated a session at the European Parliament to justify how "mean" the PJ were? Just at the time that Rebelo was away?

Who had access to the McCann arguido interviews?
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Online G-Unit

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5761 on: May 31, 2019, 10:32:27 PM »
IMO - There is no doubt this did happen.   Kate and Gerry made a list of people they wanted interviewed and wrote up a list of questions.  No doubt with the agreement of the PJ.

They did indeed; the T7 were asked questions raised by both the PJ and the McCanns. The PJ questions were asked first, however. They were designed to try to uncover the truth.
« Last Edit: June 01, 2019, 08:24:37 PM by Brietta »
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Offline Robittybob1

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Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5762 on: June 01, 2019, 03:25:18 AM »
From what I remember of the 'files', pretty sure  the McCann questions were  tagged on the end of those of the PJ
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MCCANNS-WANTED.htm which is a "LIST OF PEOPLE MCCANN'S WANTED INTERVIEWED"   
later in the same file "Faxed copy of Letter with questions to ask persons whom McCanns want interviewed (in English and Portuguese"
So it seems pretty well organised.
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Offline Carana

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5763 on: June 01, 2019, 06:38:45 AM »
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MCCANNS-WANTED.htm which is a "LIST OF PEOPLE MCCANN'S WANTED INTERVIEWED"   
later in the same file "Faxed copy of Letter with questions to ask persons whom McCanns want interviewed (in English and Portuguese"
So it seems pretty well organised.


Thanks, Rob. I hadn't reread that in a while. Aside from who they had questions for, upon rereading it, I find the rationale quite interesting...

1 - Since the applicants stopped being considered witnesses, moving to suspects of the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, witnesses central to the discovery of truth were not questioned, or re-questioned.

2 - With the recent investigations, witness interviews and interrogations of the applicants, new questions were raised and doubts aroused, broadening, in this way, the object of the investigation, as well as matters of fact considered relevant to the investigations.

3 - Indeed, the Investigation departed from confining itself to the disappearance of the minor, proceeding to embrace other matters, allegedly connected with her.

4 - It is therefore essential to hear these witnesses who can explain facts now very relevant, such as the way the couple treated their children, their personality and routine and, even, the reactions manifested by them after the disappearance and the consequent psychological and emotional state.

5 - So, and because it is believed essential and indispensable for the establishment of the facts and consequent discovery of the truth, they come to request the hearing of the following groups of witnesses, all present and with direct knowledge of the facts:
(...)

6 - It is certain that some of these witnesses have already been heard, at least once, in the investigation.

7 - But, at that time, the direction of the investigation was apparently different, [that being] the reason why some of these witnesses were not heard on the matters mentioned above, currently considered relevant to the prosecution of the investigation and who already were, furthermore, the object of actual proceedings, namely the questioning and the interrogations of the applicants.

We submit that, their testimony [being] essential to the discovery of the truth...


Offline Robittybob1

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Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5764 on: June 01, 2019, 12:55:22 PM »

Thanks, Rob. I hadn't reread that in a while. Aside from who they had questions for, upon rereading it, I find the rationale quite interesting...

1 - Since the applicants stopped being considered witnesses, moving to suspects of the disappearance of Madeleine McCann, witnesses central to the discovery of truth were not questioned, or re-questioned.

2 - With the recent investigations, witness interviews and interrogations of the applicants, new questions were raised and doubts aroused, broadening, in this way, the object of the investigation, as well as matters of fact considered relevant to the investigations.

3 - Indeed, the Investigation departed from confining itself to the disappearance of the minor, proceeding to embrace other matters, allegedly connected with her.

4 - It is therefore essential to hear these witnesses who can explain facts now very relevant, such as the way the couple treated their children, their personality and routine and, even, the reactions manifested by them after the disappearance and the consequent psychological and emotional state.

5 - So, and because it is believed essential and indispensable for the establishment of the facts and consequent discovery of the truth, they come to request the hearing of the following groups of witnesses, all present and with direct knowledge of the facts:
(...)

6 - It is certain that some of these witnesses have already been heard, at least once, in the investigation.

7 - But, at that time, the direction of the investigation was apparently different, [that being] the reason why some of these witnesses were not heard on the matters mentioned above, currently considered relevant to the prosecution of the investigation and who already were, furthermore, the object of actual proceedings, namely the questioning and the interrogations of the applicants.

We submit that, their testimony [being] essential to the discovery of the truth...

That all being claimed by the McCann's lawyer IIRC.
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Online G-Unit

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5765 on: June 01, 2019, 02:40:14 PM »
That all being claimed by the McCann's lawyer IIRC.

With defensive intentions obviously. The people and the questions are listed here;

https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MCCANNS-WANTED.htm

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Offline Brietta

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5766 on: June 01, 2019, 05:29:21 PM »
I found this interesting;

You’ll recall that, back in October, we had supplied the Portuguese public prosecutor with a list of people from whom we felt statements should have been taken. In response the Portuguese police had decided to come to Leicester to be present while the police interviewed Fiona, Dave, Russ, Jane, Matt, Rachael and Dianne, as well as many other individuals whose testimony had never been sought.

The questions to be asked were those Gerry and I had suggested to the prosecutor (obvious and pertinent ones, I hasten to add), with a few additions from the PJ.
[madeleine. Kate McCann]

I thought the McCanns asked for their questions to be added to the PJ questions. Kate makes it soound like they instigated the rogatory questions and the PJ tagged theirs on at the end.

I think you may be misinterpreting what Kate said in her book. 

From reading http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MCCANNS-WANTED.htm it is self evident that the initiative came from Kate, Gerry and their legal team.

Snip
We submit that, their testimony [being] essential to the discovery of the truth, and given that the witnesses designated above actually live in the United Kingdom, where they will be found, (except Dan Smith and Emma Knights who will be found in Portugal), it is requested further, under Arts. 229 and following of CPP, 145 and following of Law 14-4/99 of 31 August (Law of International Legal Assistance in Criminal Matters) and 3 and following of the European Convention on Mutual Legal Support in Criminal Matters, that a Rogatory Letter be expedited for them to be heard in the United Kingdom.

They ask that the request be granted
The remit of Operation Grange is to investigate ...  "(as if the abduction occurred in the UK)"

Offline Robittybob1

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Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5767 on: June 01, 2019, 07:26:00 PM »
With defensive intentions obviously. The people and the questions are listed here;

https://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MCCANNS-WANTED.htm
Wouldn't anyone want to show themselves as being of good character?
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Offline jassi

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5768 on: June 01, 2019, 07:27:47 PM »
Wouldn't anyone want to show themselves as being of good character?


Most people wouldn't need to - IMO
I believe everything. And l believe nothing.
I suspect everyone. And l suspect no one.
I gather the facts, examine the clues... and before   you know it, the case is solved!"

Or maybe not -   Into year 13 and still no solution.

Offline Robittybob1

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Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5769 on: June 01, 2019, 08:03:09 PM »

Most people wouldn't need to - IMO
These two in particular were called arguidos in this case.
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Online G-Unit

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5770 on: June 01, 2019, 08:37:30 PM »
Wouldn't anyone want to show themselves as being of good character?

Well it worked. They come across as perfect in every way.
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Offline Miss Taken Identity

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5771 on: June 02, 2019, 03:30:28 PM »
Well it worked. They come across as perfect in every way.

A cross between Mary Poppins and Sound of Music- Maria
They tried this at their'trial' the one where Amaral was going to hung from the neck till  he be dead - yeah that one.

Dragging in 'friends' to say how they were wonderful and how unwell they had been blah blah blah. They tried to control that event as well but the canny judge told Gerry to shut up in a Portuguese kind of way.

That was just priceless.  erm, was the same one where the judge asked what was worse -losing daughter or the book... You will not believe the reply to that one.



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Online G-Unit

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5772 on: June 02, 2019, 06:46:11 PM »
A cross between Mary Poppins and Sound of Music- Maria
They tried this at their'trial' the one where Amaral was going to hung from the neck till  he be dead - yeah that one.

Dragging in 'friends' to say how they were wonderful and how unwell they had been blah blah blah. They tried to control that event as well but the canny judge told Gerry to shut up in a Portuguese kind of way.

That was just priceless.  erm, was the same one where the judge asked what was worse -losing daughter or the book... You will not believe the reply to that one.

Practically perfect in every way.
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Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5773 on: June 02, 2019, 08:24:45 PM »
Practically perfect in every way.
A bit like yourselves then, you perfect models of parenting and morality.
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Online G-Unit

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #5774 on: June 02, 2019, 08:34:13 PM »
A bit like yourselves then, you perfect models of parenting and morality.

Really? I thought the best parents took their kids on busmen's holidays and left them home alone every night. I never did that.
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