Author Topic: Opium Poppies Grown at WHF?  (Read 95672 times)

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Offline Holly Goodhead

Opium Poppies Grown at WHF?
« on: June 14, 2016, 03:38:13 PM »
On 7th Aug Dr Craig asked Chief Sup Harris if WHF was licenced to grow the opium poppy which the Dr observed in a field.  Chief Sup said he wasn't.  As a result the pair went and looked at a small area in a field where the poppies were growing.

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=157.0;attach=106

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=157.0;attach=108

Was WHF licenced?  From my very limited research it seems the UK gov issued the first licences in 2006.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Papaver_somniferum

Medical cultivation in the UK

"In late 2006, the British government permitted the pharmaceutical company Macfarlan Smith (a Johnson Matthey company, FTSE 100) to cultivate opium poppies in England for medicinal reasons[39] after Macfarlan Smith's primary source, India, decided to increase the price of export opium latex. This move is well received by British farmers,[citation needed] with a major opium poppy field based in Didcot, England. As of 2012, they were growing in Dorset, Hampshire, Oxfordshire and Lincolnshire as a spring-sown breakcrop recognised under the single payment scheme farm subsidy.[40] The Office of Fair Trading has alerted the government to their monopoly position on growing in the UK and worldwide production of diamorphine and recommended consideration.[39] The government's response advocated the status quo, being concerned interference might cause the company to stop production.[41]"

Although the above seems to contradict with the following:

It seems the first crop authorised by UK Gov/Home Office was 2002.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/4183331/Poppy-farmers-bring-in-morphine-harvest.html

I think they might be saying slightly different things.  Anyway whether the date was 2002 or 2006 both are years away from 1985. 

I want to know:

1. Were they definitely opium poppies?
2. If so why were they being grown and for what purpose?
3. Who else knew about this, assuming they were opium poppies?
4. Was it legal? 
5. The location and area of the field doesn't seem hidden?  See Chief Sup Harris' WS above for description of field.
6. Would others such as family members and farm workers be aware they were opium poppies?  I would probably just think they were a pretty flower and wonder why the farm was growing flowers instead of crops.  Perhaps thinking they were flowers for market.  See images in DM article:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2667253/Not-Afghanistan-Hampshire-How-opium-poppies-grown-UK-make-morphine-NHS.html


313
« Last Edit: August 31, 2016, 07:23:15 PM by John »
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline scipio_usmc

Re: Opium Poppies Grown at WHF?
« Reply #1 on: June 14, 2016, 04:24:50 PM »
1) There is no way WHF was licensed to grow opium poppies.

2) processing poppies into opium is an expensive process

3) The small field in question wound not be able to produce enough poppies to make it worthwhile they must be grown in large quantities for someone to actually want to buy from you and get a price that is decent.

4) They could have been weed poppies that were mistaken for opium poppies.

« Last Edit: June 17, 2016, 08:38:39 PM by John »
“...there are three classes of intellects: one which comprehends by itself; another which appreciates what others comprehend; and a third which neither comprehends by itself nor by the showing of others; the first is the most excellent, the second is good, the third is useless.”  Niccolò Machiavelli

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Opium Poppies Grown at WHF?
« Reply #2 on: June 14, 2016, 04:51:50 PM »
1) There is no way WHF was licensed to grow opium poppies.

2) processing poppies into opium is an expensive process

3) The small field in question wound not be able to produce enough poppies to make it worthwhile they must be frown in large quantity for someone to actually want to buy from you and get a price that is decent.

4) They could have been weed poppies that were mistaken for opium poppies.

I think Dr Craig a police surgeon with 30 years experience in 1985 would recognise opium poppies since he would be familiar with morphine.

We don't how many poppies were growing only that Dr Craig and Chief Sup Harris looked at a small area in a field.  This could mean they simply looked at a small area in a field although the poppies were spread over a much wider area of the field.  Or it could mean the poppies were confined to a small area of a field.

It appears harvesting and processing is not as complex as originally thought:

"Crude laboratories in the field are capable of refining opium into morphine base by a simple acid-base extraction. A sticky, brown paste, morphine base is pressed into bricks and sun-dried, and can either be smoked, prepared into other forms or processed into heroin."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opium#Harvesting_and_processing
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Wonderfulspam

Re: Opium Poppies Grown at WHF?
« Reply #3 on: June 14, 2016, 04:59:55 PM »
Opium poppies aren't uncommon, at least not where I am.

I live in the south east and they grow in my garden every year.
Christian Brueckner Fan Club

Offline APRIL

Re: Opium Poppies Grown at WHF?
« Reply #4 on: June 14, 2016, 05:02:53 PM »
1) There is no way WHF was licensed to grow opium poppies.

2) processing poppies into opium is an expensive process

3) The small field in question wound not be able to produce enough poppies to make it worthwhile they must be frown in large quantity for someone to actually want to buy from you and get a price that is decent.

4) They could have been weed poppies that were mistaken for opium poppies.


It COULD have been a trial field? No one would go to the expense of ordering them grown in vast numbers which had to be processed if it turned out they weren't suitable.

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Opium Poppies Grown at WHF?
« Reply #5 on: June 14, 2016, 05:18:54 PM »

It COULD have been a trial field? No one would go to the expense of ordering them grown in vast numbers which had to be processed if it turned out they weren't suitable.

Yes it Could be a trial field but who for?
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Myster

Re: Opium Poppies Grown at WHF?
« Reply #6 on: June 14, 2016, 05:38:59 PM »
In my early teens, when I had acute diarrhea my GP prescribed kaolin and morphine mixture. It was a bright pink colour, tasted really good and I finished the bottle, so much so that I asked my mum to get the doctor to make out another prescription even though it had cured the runs... I was hooked!

Needless to say the doctor gave me an alternative remedy without the morphine.
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline Myster

Re: Opium Poppies Grown at WHF?
« Reply #7 on: June 14, 2016, 05:39:58 PM »
Yes it Could be a trial field but who for?

For a pharmaceutical perhaps, with government approval but not publicized?

It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline scipio_usmc

Re: Opium Poppies Grown at WHF?
« Reply #8 on: June 14, 2016, 06:13:38 PM »
I think Dr Craig a police surgeon with 30 years experience in 1985 would recognise opium poppies since he would be familiar with morphine.

We don't how many poppies were growing only that Dr Craig and Chief Sup Harris looked at a small area in a field.  This could mean they simply looked at a small area in a field although the poppies were spread over a much wider area of the field.  Or it could mean the poppies were confined to a small area of a field.

It appears harvesting and processing is not as complex as originally thought:

"Crude laboratories in the field are capable of refining opium into morphine base by a simple acid-base extraction. A sticky, brown paste, morphine base is pressed into bricks and sun-dried, and can either be smoked, prepared into other forms or processed into heroin."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opium#Harvesting_and_processing

How does being a doctor make him a plant expert?

First you have to harvest the opium gum from the pods which is a pain in the butt.  Then you have to process it into morphine base then into Heroin base and finally prep it for use.

Transforming morphine bricks to heroin base requires a controlled substance- acetic anhydride,.  It in controlled precisely because it is used in heroin production.  How pure it will be depends on how you cook it and what else you use. Farmers don't bother going through the time and expense they just sell Opium gum or morphine bricks.

There is nothing to suggest that Jeremy or anyone else was buying chemicals and experimenting with opium poppy in order to make their own heroin.

How big was the field? Cultivating 2.5 acres of poppies year round will require 3 pounds of seeds.  You can get 3 pods a plant maximum during a single year. There will be 60-125,000 pods each cycle X 3 cycles=275,000 pods max. This will yield as much as 28 2/3 pounds of opium if you do everything right by taking care of the crop and losing nothing while harvesting the opium gum.  This can be processed into a 3lb brick of Morphine which in turn can be processed into maybe 2 pounds of Heroin.

Obviously a field cultivated only for months would not produce as much. If you do only 1 growing cycle instead of 3 you get 1/3 as much. Who the hell wants to hand harvest 60,000-125,000 pods?  You think Jeremy was going to do it himself?  There is a limited time to harvest it all so you need a number of people doing it.

Aside from it being too labor intensive for Jeremy to bother with, planting it along a main road instead of an interior hidden field would be extraordinarily stupid.




“...there are three classes of intellects: one which comprehends by itself; another which appreciates what others comprehend; and a third which neither comprehends by itself nor by the showing of others; the first is the most excellent, the second is good, the third is useless.”  Niccolò Machiavelli

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Opium Poppies Grown at WHF?
« Reply #9 on: June 14, 2016, 06:25:13 PM »
How does being a doctor make him a plant expert?

First you have to harvest the opium gum from the pods which is a pain in the butt.  Then you have to process it into morphine base then into Heroin base and finally prep it for use.

Transforming morphine bricks to heroin base requires a controlled substance- acetic anhydride,.  It in controlled precisely because it is used in heroin production.  How pure it will be depends on how you cook it and what else you use. Farmers don't bother going through the time and expense they just sell Opium gum or morphine bricks.

There is nothing to suggest that Jeremy or anyone else was buying chemicals and experimenting with opium poppy in order to make their own heroin.

How big was the field? Cultivating 2.5 acres of poppies year round will require 3 pounds of seeds.  You can get 3 pods a plant maximum during a single year. There will be 60-125,000 pods each cycle X 3 cycles=275,000 pods max. This will yield as much as 28 2/3 pounds of opium if you do everything right by taking care of the crop and losing nothing while harvesting the opium gum.  This can be processed into a 3lb brick of Morphine which in turn can be processed into maybe 2 pounds of Heroin.

Obviously a field cultivated only for months would not produce as much. If you do only 1 growing cycle instead of 3 you get 1/3 as much. Who the hell wants to hand harvest 60,000-125,000 pods?  You think Jeremy was going to do it himself?  There is a limited time to harvest it all so you need a number of people doing it.

Aside from it being too labor intensive for Jeremy to bother with, planting it along a main road instead of an interior hidden field would be extraordinarily stupid.

Most medical doctors will be offay with plants/medicines.

The field was on a private road within the farm.  It would only be visible to those visiting the farm and venturing beyond the farmhouse.

NB crashed his plane in WW2 and sustained a serious back injury.  At one time it was thought he wouldn't walk again.  I don't know whether he was given morphone for any pain.  If he was it is possible he may have become addicted and grew the poppies to produce morphine for own use.  Or he may have been troubled by back pain or some other pain (other than JB!).   Although I have to say this is simply a theory which I have no evidence for. 
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline APRIL

Re: Opium Poppies Grown at WHF?
« Reply #10 on: June 14, 2016, 06:25:27 PM »
How does being a doctor make him a plant expert?

First you have to harvest the opium gum from the pods which is a pain in the butt.  Then you have to process it into morphine base then into Heroin base and finally prep it for use.

Transforming morphine bricks to heroin base requires a controlled substance- acetic anhydride,.  It in controlled precisely because it is used in heroin production.  How pure it will be depends on how you cook it and what else you use. Farmers don't bother going through the time and expense they just sell Opium gum or morphine bricks.

There is nothing to suggest that Jeremy or anyone else was buying chemicals and experimenting with opium poppy in order to make their own heroin.

How big was the field? Cultivating 2.5 acres of poppies year round will require 3 pounds of seeds.  You can get 3 pods a plant maximum during a single year. There will be 60-125,000 pods each cycle X 3 cycles=275,000 pods max. This will yield as much as 28 2/3 pounds of opium if you do everything right by taking care of the crop and losing nothing while harvesting the opium gum.  This can be processed into a 3lb brick of Morphine which in turn can be processed into maybe 2 pounds of Heroin.

Obviously a field cultivated only for months would not produce as much. If you do only 1 growing cycle instead of 3 you get 1/3 as much. Who the hell wants to hand harvest 60,000-125,000 pods?  You think Jeremy was going to do it himself?  There is a limited time to harvest it all so you need a number of people doing it.

Aside from it being too labor intensive for Jeremy to bother with, planting it along a main road instead of an interior hidden field would be extraordinarily stupid.


I'm not sure that anyone is suggesting that any part of it was Jeremy's "baby". How would he have been granted a license? Nevill, however, MAY have been, but aren't you taking all this a stage too far? Might there not have been the possibility that Nevill, because he would have been considered a safe bet, was ONLY part of a trial phase?

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Opium Poppies Grown at WHF?
« Reply #11 on: June 14, 2016, 06:56:25 PM »

I'm not sure that anyone is suggesting that any part of it was Jeremy's "baby". How would he have been granted a license? Nevill, however, MAY have been, but aren't you taking all this a stage too far? Might there not have been the possibility that Nevill, because he would have been considered a safe bet, was ONLY part of a trial phase?

The first licences don't seem to have been issued until 2002 which is some 17 years after Dr Craig spotted what he thought were opium poppies in a field.   &%+((£

CAL Page 179:

"He [JB] was carrying a small bunch of opium poppies when Dr Craig caught up with him.  Explaining that the farm had a special licence to grow them for the pharmaceutical industry..."
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline APRIL

Re: Opium Poppies Grown at WHF?
« Reply #12 on: June 14, 2016, 07:00:13 PM »
The first licences don't seem to have been issued until 2002 which is some 17 years after Dr Craig spotted what he thought were opium poppies in a field.   &%+((£

CAL Page 179:

"He [JB] was carrying a small bunch of opium poppies when Dr Craig caught up with him.  Explaining that the farm had a special licence to grow them for the pharmaceutical industry..."


Are we to assume, from that, that it was a well known secret within the confines of the farm?

Offline scipio_usmc

Re: Opium Poppies Grown at WHF?
« Reply #13 on: June 14, 2016, 07:18:47 PM »

I'm not sure that anyone is suggesting that any part of it was Jeremy's "baby". How would he have been granted a license? Nevill, however, MAY have been, but aren't you taking all this a stage too far? Might there not have been the possibility that Nevill, because he would have been considered a safe bet, was ONLY part of a trial phase?

In a small area in a field on the right hand side of Pages Lane 1.4 mile beyond the farmhouse there was what Craig thought to be opium plants. Surely that means far less than an acre. It makes zero sense to grow so little. What would be tested by growing a few plants?

In the meantime who would they sell to?  A program was created in 2002 to sell to pharmaceutical companies so obviously no program existed prior for such. A license to grow a small amount for schools?  hey could buy a small amount from anywhere they would not need to pay local growers.

I doubt it was heroin poppy and even if it were it would not mean a thing so why are we even discussing it?
“...there are three classes of intellects: one which comprehends by itself; another which appreciates what others comprehend; and a third which neither comprehends by itself nor by the showing of others; the first is the most excellent, the second is good, the third is useless.”  Niccolò Machiavelli

Offline Holly Goodhead

Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?