Why was JB's use of cannabis, producing and supplying not pursued by EP?

[Holly Goodhead]

JM makes various claims in her WS's about JB's long history of using, producing and supplying cannabis.  This includes:

- JB frequently using cannabis
- JB growing cannabis plants inbetween barns at WHF
- MM visiting JB's cottage to handover hemp seeds for producing cannabis and discussing ways and means of supplying
- JB purchasing equipment for growing cannabis
- JB maintaining the plants inside his cottage and transferring them to his garden
- JB sending parcels of cannabis to a hitchhiker in Scotland for £100 cash mailed to JB via a Mr Page at the local post office
- JB and JM packing cannabis in plastic money bags for JM to sell on campus
- JB, JM and BC visiting Amsterdam purchasing cannabis and smuggling it into the UK
- JM said JB received a tip off from a neighbour that the police or drug squad visited his cottage to look at the cannabis plants pre murders and as a result JB destroyed them

Reading WS's it appears that others connected with JB and JM were at the very least using cannabis if not supplying from JB's production.

- Why didn't EP pursue the cannabis with JB during his police interviews?
- Why didn't EP press charges against JB over the cannabis?  They pressed charges over Osea Caravan Park (OCP).
- No mention of the cannabis is made in the background section of the CoA document.  Although OCP and JM's cheque fraud are mentioned.
 

[Wonderfulspam]

JM makes various claims in her WS's about JB's long history of using, producing and supplying cannabis.  This includes:

- JB frequently using cannabis
- JB growing cannabis plants inbetween barns at WHF
- MM visiting JB's cottage to handover hemp seeds for producing cannabis and discussing ways and means of supplying
- JB purchasing equipment for growing cannabis
- JB maintaining the plants inside his cottage and transferring them to his garden
- JB sending parcels of cannabis to a hitchhiker in Scotland for £100 cash mailed to JB via a Mr Page at the local post office
- JB and JM packing cannabis in plastic money bags for JM to sell on campus
- JB, JM and BC visiting Amsterdam purchasing cannabis and smuggling it into the UK
- JM said JB received a tip off from a neighbour that the police or drug squad visited his cottage to look at the cannabis plants pre murders and as a result JB destroyed them

Reading WS's it appears that others connected with JB and JM were at the very least using cannabis if not supplying from JB's production.

- Why didn't EP pursue the cannabis with JB during his police interviews?
- Why didn't EP press charges against JB over the cannabis?  They pressed charges over OCP.
- No mention of the cannabis is made in the background section of the CoA document.  Although OCP and JM's cheque fraud are mentioned.
 

It's such a soft drug.

It was only recently upgraded to class B from C, against expert advice.

As far back as 1979 the Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs has recommended it be class C.

Not one recorded fatality in history from the use of cannabis.

JB's weed dealings are very, very petty crime, probably not worth the police paperwork, at a guess.

 


Police won't target pot smokers and small-scale growers, say commissioners

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2015/jul/22/police-wont-target-pot-smokers-small-scale-growers-commissioners

Cannabis: Derbyshire, Dorset and Surrey police will no longer seek to arrest pot growers and smokers


http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/cannabis-derbyshire-dorset-surrey-police-will-no-longer-seek-arrest-pot-growers-smokers-1513180

[scipio_usmc]

JM makes various claims in her WS's about JB's long history of using, producing and supplying cannabis.  This includes:

- JB frequently using cannabis
- JB growing cannabis plants inbetween barns at WHF
- MM visiting JB's cottage to handover hemp seeds for producing cannabis and discussing ways and means of supplying
- JB purchasing equipment for growing cannabis
- JB maintaining the plants inside his cottage and transferring them to his garden
- JB sending parcels of cannabis to a hitchhiker in Scotland for £100 cash mailed to JB via a Mr Page at the local post office
- JB and JM packing cannabis in plastic money bags for JM to sell on campus
- JB, JM and BC visiting Amsterdam purchasing cannabis and smuggling it into the UK
- JM said JB received a tip off from a neighbour that the police or drug squad visited his cottage to look at the cannabis plants pre murders and as a result JB destroyed them

Reading WS's it appears that others connected with JB and JM were at the very least using cannabis if not supplying from JB's production.

- Why didn't EP pursue the cannabis with JB during his police interviews?
- Why didn't EP press charges against JB over the cannabis?  They pressed charges over OCP.
- No mention of the cannabis is made in the background section of the CoA document.  Although OCP and JM's cheque fraud are mentioned.

Jeremy could have been lying to Julie about how much drugs he was growing and selling.  All they had was his own admissions to her which could have been built up. In the meantime that amount he claimed to was small.  It would result in little penalty.  Why would they bother trying to get him on a minor crime that would be difficult to prove when they had him for murder?

If he had some massive drug operation with suppliers who were higher up who they could pursue and lots of employees he had who could be pursued that would be something different but that is not even close to what was claimed.

[Wonderfulspam]

 

[Opal]

EP went into JB's background with a fine toothcomb.  I believe RB also carried out his own enquires.  All they turned up was:

- use of cannabis, growing and selling small quantities for profit
- breaking into OCP and stealing a few hundred pounds 

Those that knew him independently such as the landlord of his local pub, manager at Burnham country club, employers at Little Chef, neighbours, either spoke highly of him or had nothing adverse to say. 


Holly, above is your reply to my post about JB and drugs.  So having found this out EP were more concerned in getting a murder confession from JB when taking his statements.

SB and JM were best friends having had rooms next to each other at different colleges before moving into Caterham Road.  JM eventually had to share the info she had on the murders for her own peace of mind....JM confided in SB....just like JB did to JM.  EP didn't turn up enough evidence to prosecute anyone on the drugs situation, so could hardly frame prosecution witnesses with a drug prosecution.

[Caroline]

EP went into JB's background with a fine toothcomb.  I believe RB also carried out his own enquires.  All they turned up was:

- use of cannabis, growing and selling small quantities for profit
- breaking into OCP and stealing a few hundred pounds 

Those that knew him independently such as the landlord of his local pub, manager at Burnham country club, employers at Little Chef, neighbours, either spoke highly of him or had nothing adverse to say. 




Holly, above is your reply to my post about JB and drugs.  So having found this out EP were more concerned in getting a murder confession from JB when taking his statements.

SB and JM were best friends having had rooms next to each other at different colleges before moving into Caterham Road.  JM eventually had to share the info she had on the murders for her own peace of mind....JM confided in SB....just like JB did to JM.  EP didn't turn up enough evidence to prosecute anyone on the drugs situation, so could hardly frame prosecution witnesses with a drug prosecution.

I agree Opal, it's also inevitable that they would speak about what Julie had told Susan, given that they shared a house. Julie saying they didn't is either that she being a DQ or, she didn't want it to sound as though they had colluded - which she would be accused of no matter what she did (and has been).

[Holly Goodhead]

EP went into JB's background with a fine toothcomb.  I believe RB also carried out his own enquires.  All they turned up was:

- use of cannabis, growing and selling small quantities for profit
- breaking into OCP and stealing a few hundred pounds 

Those that knew him independently such as the landlord of his local pub, manager at Burnham country club, employers at Little Chef, neighbours, either spoke highly of him or had nothing adverse to say. 


Holly, above is your reply to my post about JB and drugs.  So having found this out EP were more concerned in getting a murder confession from JB when taking his statements.

SB and JM were best friends having had rooms next to each other at different colleges before moving into Caterham Road.  JM eventually had to share the info she had on the murders for her own peace of mind....JM confided in SB....just like JB did to JM.  EP didn't turn up enough evidence to prosecute anyone on the drugs situation, so could hardly frame prosecution witnesses with a drug prosecution.

EP questioned JB over OCP.  He admitted liability.  He subsequently appeared at magistrates court over it.  Why not question JB over the cannabis and look to press charges?  He may have admitted it straight away as he did with OCP.  If not EP would surely have enough evidence anyway as according to JM the police or drug squad called at his property pre murders to look at the cannabis plants.  Why would JM say this if it wasn't true?  If it is true why were EP wasting resources sending officers/drug squad to look at cannabis plants without taking the appropriate action? 

[Opal]

As you say Holly, JM was speaking of before the murders when the police called to Bourtree Cottage, EP found nothing there as a neighbour had pre-warned JB that they were coming. JM also states that JB was really angry as he had to pull all the plants up before hand, plus the rats had eaten the plants JB planted at WHF.  So no charges could be bought.

JM gives the time of the police visit as Summer 1984.

JM statement 10th September 1985.Page 4/5

[Holly Goodhead]

 

Lol 

[Holly Goodhead]

As you say Holly, JM was speaking of before the murders when the police called to Bourtree Cottage, EP found nothing there as a neighbour had pre-warned JB that they were coming. JM also states that JB was really angry as he had to pull all the plants up before hand, plus the rats had eaten the plants JB planted at WHF.  So no charges could be bought.

JM gives the time of the police visit as Summer 1984.

JM statement 10th September 1985.Page 4/5

JM doesn't make it clear exactly when the claimed visit from the police/drug squad took place.  I don't believe it was the summer of 1984? 

In the following WS JM states "This year Jeremy again grew cannabis plants".  As JM got together with JB shortly before Christmas 1983 I'm assuming she is referring to 1985 when she states "This year Jeremy again..."

After she explains about rats at WHF eating the cannabis plants and JB destroying the plants in his garden she states BC arrived from New Zealand.  I think she must be referring to 1985

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=283.0;attach=1060

According to JM, EP did in fact observe the cannabis plants growing in JB's garden.  JM also claims JB received a phone call from a neighbour advising him that the police/drug squad had visited and looked at his cannabis plants.  As a result of this JB destroyed the plants.  This clearly makes no sense.  If the police decided the situation warranted a visit by either police officers or the drug squad and found cannabis plants they would clearly pursue the matter with JB.  They would take photographic evidence along with plant samples and possibly soil too.  They would then surely wait for JB to arrive home to arrest him or establish his whereabouts and go and arrest him for interview.  Meanwhile an officer would stand guard over the plants.

We only have a fraction of the available docs on this forum.  I've had a flick through CAL's book and it appears when DI Miller interviewed BC he was quizzed about his and JB's involvement with drugs.  When JB was arrested at Morsehead Mansions on 8th Sept JB immediately handed over cannabis in his possession. 

EP were keen to establish the exact nature of BC's relationship with JB asking whether there was anything sexual to it.  They also asked JM about her sex life with JB.  Given that none of the crimes JB was charged with were of a sexual nature why would they want to go down this avenue but not bother even asking him about the cannabis?

Many of the witnesses at trial were involved with JB's drugs from Matthew MacDonald supplying hemp seeds to JM's claims of the police/drug squad visiting. 

As Wonderfulspam said it's a bit of a grey area as many police forces don't bother pursuing.  Plus at times cannabis has been downgraded from Cat B to Cat C.  Although legally the penalties can be stiff by way of a custodial sentence and/or a monetary fine for Cat B and Cat C.  In JB's case I believe EP used it to put the frighteners on various witnesses AFTER they convinced all concerned JB was guilty.   

https://www.gov.uk/penalties-drug-possession-dealing

[Holly Goodhead]

JM doesn't make it clear exactly when the claimed visit from the police/drug squad took place.  I don't believe it was the summer of 1984? 

In the following WS JM states "This year Jeremy again grew cannabis plants".  As JM got together with JB shortly before Christmas 1983 I'm assuming she is referring to 1985 when she states "This year Jeremy again..."

After she explains about rats at WHF eating the cannabis plants and JB destroying the plants in his garden she states BC arrived from New Zealand.  I think she must be referring to 1985

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=283.0;attach=1061;image

According to JM, EP did in fact observe the cannabis plants growing in JB's garden.  JM also claims JB received a phone call from a neighbour advising him that the police/drug squad had visited and looked at his cannabis plants.  As a result of this JB destroyed the plants.  This clearly makes no sense.  If the police decided the situation warranted a visit by either police officers or the drug squad and found cannabis plants they would clearly pursue the matter with JB.  They would take photographic evidence along with plant samples and possibly soil too.  They would then surely wait for JB to arrive home to arrest him or establish his whereabouts and go and arrest him for interview. Meanwhile an officer would stand guard over the plants.

We only have a fraction of the available docs on this forum.  I've had a flick through CAL's book and it appears when DI Miller interviewed BC he was quizzed about his and JB's involvement with drugs.  When JB was arrested at Morsehead Mansions on 8th Sept JB immediately handed over cannabis in his possession. 

EP were keen to establish the exact nature of BC's relationship with JB asking whether there was anything sexual to it.  They also asked JM about her sex life with JB.  Given that none of the crimes JB was charged with were of a sexual nature why would they want to go down this avenue but not bother even asking him about the cannabis?

Many of the witnesses at trial were involved with JB's drugs from Matthew MacDonald supplying hemp seeds to JM's claims of the police/drug squad visiting. 

As Wonderfulspam said it's a bit of a grey area as many police forces don't bother pursuing.  Plus at times cannabis has been downgraded from Cat B to Cat C.  Although legally the penalties can be stiff by way of a custodial sentence and/or a monetary fine for Cat B and Cat C.  In JB's case I believe EP used it to put the frighteners on various witnesses AFTER they convinced all concerned JB was guilty.   

https://www.gov.uk/penalties-drug-possession-dealing

Lol you couldn't make it up  *&*%£

[Myster]

Your JM statement attachment above is only a thumbnail... can you correct it?

[Holly Goodhead]

Your JM statement attachment above is only a thumbnail... can you correct it?

Certainly sir.  Take it as done.    All this talk of cannabis is making me feel quite smokey 

[Myster]

Certainly sir.  Take it as done.    All this talk of cannabis is making me feel quite smokey 

... and spaced-out just like Julie or one of her friends said Jeremy was, but I think that was because he popped Valium to cope with the stress of his dreams of a wealthy future falling apart.
Wonder if Sluis still contains hemp seeds, and why he wasted time picking them out?  &%+((£

http://hamzter.blogg.no/1289762422_anbefalig_sluis_hamst.html

Perhaps they weren't as widely sold loose in the 80's as they are now...

https://www.buywholefoodsonline.co.uk/organic-hemp-seeds-1kg.html?gclid=CJfis4nXr80CFcG6GwodkZ4OCg

Thanks for the correction.

[Opal]

JM doesn't make it clear exactly when the claimed visit from the police/drug squad took place.  I don't believe it was the summer of 1984? My understand from JM's statement 10 September 1985 page 1 was that JM was speaking about Summer 1984. It could well have been 1985...but whatever year it was the cannabis plants were
destroyed before police got any evidence....only notes taken by the policeman that attended, so no good for prosecution without evidence.
In the following WS JM states "This year Jeremy again grew cannabis plants".  As JM got together with JB shortly before Christmas 1983 I'm assuming she is referring to 1985 when she states "This year Jeremy again..."

Yes could be, MM first met JM in 1983 dropping off cannabis seeds to JB at WHF a couple of times, therefore JB had been growing cannabis for some time.

After she explains about rats at WHF eating the cannabis plants and JB destroying the plants in his garden she states BC arrived from New Zealand.  I think she must be referring to 1985See above, JM's statement 1984 or 1985. JB had known BC for a few years. The point is JM was correct in saying JB was growing cannabis plants

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=283.0;attach=1060

According to JM, EP did in fact observe the cannabis plants growing in JB's garden.  JM also claims JB received a phone call from a neighbour advising him that the police/drug squad had visited and looked at his cannabis plants.  As a result of this JB destroyed the plants.  This clearly makes no sense.  If the police decided the situation warranted a visit by either police officers or the drug squad and found cannabis plants they would clearly pursue the matter with JB. No Evidence.  JB could have lied again and said he didn't realise they were cannabis plants and had destroyed them when he realised. 

They would take photographic evidence along with plant samples and possibly soil too.  They would then surely wait for JB to arrive home to arrest him or establish his whereabouts and go and arrest him for interview.  Meanwhile an officer would stand guard over the plants. It wasn't a big drug bust, someone had grassed...oops!  him up so a police officer checked it out. They could have even rang JB and told him to destroy the plants. Remember this was before the murders and in the 1980's

We only have a fraction of the available docs on this forum.  I've had a flick through CAL's book and it appears when DI Miller interviewed BC he was quizzed about his and JB's involvement with drugs.
Rightly so, as BC had form regarding drugs...page 75 CAL's book, of course this interview is after the murders.

When JB was arrested at Morsehead Mansions on 8th Sept JB immediately handed over cannabis in his possession.

Think I would have too. Just personal use. 

EP were keen to establish the exact nature of BC's relationship with JB asking whether there was anything sexual to it.  They also asked JM about her sex life with JB.

 Could be to see if BC and JB were close enough to commit murder together. Hence why they asked JM of her sex life with JB! Given that none of the crimes JB was charged with were of a sexual nature why would they want to go down this avenue but not bother even asking him about the cannabis? No concrete evidence to prosecute.

Many of the witnesses at trial were involved with JB's drugs from Matthew MacDonald supplying hemp seeds to JM's claims of the police/drug squad visiting. 

For witnesses personal use only not dealing! Not worth the effort of EP bringing charges, and both witnesses and EP  knew this!

As Wonderfulspam said it's a bit of a grey area as many police forces don't bother pursuing.  Plus at times cannabis has been downgraded from Cat B to Cat C.  Although legally the penalties can be stiff by way of a custodial sentence and/or a monetary fine for Cat B and Cat C.  In JB's case I believe EP used it to put the frighteners on various witnesses AFTER they convinced all concerned JB was guilty.  No, are you seriously saying that the witnesses would be frightened, so lie and put a friend, relative away for life for murder when at most all they could get was a fine for personal use of drugs for first offence? 

https://www.gov.uk/penalties-drug-possession-dealing