Author Topic: What will be the impact on British farming post Brexit?  (Read 1529 times)

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Offline John

What will be the impact on British farming post Brexit?
« on: July 10, 2016, 01:06:40 AM »
What will be the impact on British farming post Brexit?

The impact as I see it depends on many factors, the size of the enterprise, its location within the UK and importantly, will the new PM be prepared to stand up for British farmers in future trade negotiations with the EU or further afield?

The question of farm subsidies is oft asked or what's currently known as the Single Farm Payment. This is a subsidy currently paid to active farmers on the basis of actual acreage farmed.  Currently it is worth around €329 per hectare.  Additional subsidies are also paid to young farmers and farmers who introduce new woodland or farm on a sustainable or organic basis.  Hill farmers used to attract an additional payment but I understand this has been phased out recently for British farmers.

These payments in one form or another have always been made to farmers. Incentives to build new barns and reclaim bogland were also available at one time but more recently British farmers have been excluded from such incentives.  Go across the border to the Irish Republic however and one can see that Irish farmers are receiving much more support than British farmers.  British farmers are in effect subsidizing their Irish neighbours, something which will now rightly come to an end.

It must also be remembered that the subsidies paid to British farmers are intended to keep the price of farm produce down and thus affordable to the public at large. If there were no subsidies the price of farm products like meats, grain, dairy products etc would increase significantly putting a strain on the budgets of those who can least afford it.

French farmers have consistently received the greatest share of the EU agricultural subsidies budget but they have now priced themselves out of the market. They are in big trouble and are having great difficulty selling their meat products since sanctions were imposed by the EU on Russia, their biggest market.



French farmers are in open revolt at Brussels and EU policy.

Indeed, the growing belligerence of farmers across Europe in their efforts to extract more money in the form of subsidies is perhaps the best reason yet to end this fatally flawed European project and its dysfunctional currency. Without the interference of Brussels, countries would be free to manage their own farming industries in the best interests of their own populations and trade agricultural produce more freely with developing markets where there is greater demand.
Uneconomic farming practices across Europe would then be replaced by successful farms, which are ultimately the best guarantee to food security.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/commodities/11858718/Only-French-farmers-will-save-us-from-the-madness-of-Europe.html

6
« Last Edit: July 10, 2016, 02:07:45 PM by John »
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Offline Davel

Re: What will be the impact on British farming post Brexit?
« Reply #1 on: July 10, 2016, 08:31:42 AM »
It will all change post Brexit for both the fishing and farming industries.

Reading back through the posts I have never seen so many apologists making excuses for the EU.  The EU has wrecked our fishing industry...end off!   There are no excuses for what they did.

French farmers have consistently received the greatest share of the EU agricultural subsidies budget but they have now priced themselves out of the market. They are in big trouble and are having great difficulty selling their meat products since sanctions were imposed by the EU on Russia, their biggest market.



French farmers are in open revolt at Brussels and EU policy.

Indeed, the growing belligerence of farmers across Europe in their efforts to extract more money in the form of subsidies is perhaps the best reason yet to end this fatally flawed European project and its dysfunctional currency. Without the interference of Brussels, countries would be free to manage their own farming industries in the best interests of their own populations and trade agricultural produce more freely with developing markets where there is greater demand.
Uneconomic farming practices across Europe would then be replaced by successful farms, which are ultimately the best guarantee to food security.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/commodities/11858718/Only-French-farmers-will-save-us-from-the-madness-of-Europe.html

I buy meat from our local Makro and i don't see any French meat there. the best value is Brazilian Rib eye...the price of that wont change post brexit
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Offline Carana

Re: What will be the impact on British farming post Brexit?
« Reply #2 on: July 10, 2016, 11:03:07 AM »
It will all change post Brexit for both the fishing and farming industries.

Reading back through the posts I have never seen so many apologists making excuses for the EU.  The EU has wrecked our fishing industry...end off!   There are no excuses for what they did.

French farmers have consistently received the greatest share of the EU agricultural subsidies budget but they have now priced themselves out of the market. They are in big trouble and are having great difficulty selling their meat products since sanctions were imposed by the EU on Russia, their biggest market.



French farmers are in open revolt at Brussels and EU policy.

Indeed, the growing belligerence of farmers across Europe in their efforts to extract more money in the form of subsidies is perhaps the best reason yet to end this fatally flawed European project and its dysfunctional currency. Without the interference of Brussels, countries would be free to manage their own farming industries in the best interests of their own populations and trade agricultural produce more freely with developing markets where there is greater demand.
Uneconomic farming practices across Europe would then be replaced by successful farms, which are ultimately the best guarantee to food security.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/commodities/11858718/Only-French-farmers-will-save-us-from-the-madness-of-Europe.html

Lots of bodies (and countries) imposed sanctions against Russia, not just the EU. I haven't been able to verify how much the export market to Russia represented, but even if France were outside the EU... wouldn't France have imposed its own sanctions anyway?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_sanctions_during_the_Ukrainian_crisis

French farmers seem to be faced with quite a few problems, one of which is cited as being European and more global overproduction, but there have been quite a few others, including managing disease outbreaks.

At least in this article, they've been calling on the French government for help. One of the measures taken appears to have been to reduce their social security contributions and taxes to help tide them over.

http://www.lemonde.fr/economie/article/2016/01/22/le-gouvernement-face-aux-multiples-crises-de-l-elevage-en-france_4851819_3234.html


Sooo.... I don't quite get the Brexit argument on that point, John.

Offline John

Re: What will be the impact on British farming post Brexit?
« Reply #3 on: July 10, 2016, 12:35:40 PM »
I buy meat from our local Makro and i don't see any French meat there. the best value is Brazilian Rib eye...the price of that wont change post brexit

You do realise that the Brazilians have to pay a customs tariff in order to export meat to the EU?  If all goes to plan you should see a drop in the price of your Rib Eye steak in the future.
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. John Lamberton exposes malfeasance by public officials.
Check out my website >   http://johnlamberton.webs.com/index.htm?no_redirect=true     The truth never changes with the passage of time.

Offline John

Re: What will be the impact on British farming post Brexit?
« Reply #4 on: July 10, 2016, 01:03:02 PM »
Lots of bodies (and countries) imposed sanctions against Russia, not just the EU. I haven't been able to verify how much the export market to Russia represented, but even if France were outside the EU... wouldn't France have imposed its own sanctions anyway?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_sanctions_during_the_Ukrainian_crisis

French farmers seem to be faced with quite a few problems, one of which is cited as being European and more global overproduction, but there have been quite a few others, including managing disease outbreaks.

At least in this article, they've been calling on the French government for help. One of the measures taken appears to have been to reduce their social security contributions and taxes to help tide them over.

http://www.lemonde.fr/economie/article/2016/01/22/le-gouvernement-face-aux-multiples-crises-de-l-elevage-en-france_4851819_3234.html


Sooo.... I don't quite get the Brexit argument on that point, John.

The point is very simple, the French farmers have been loving it up on lavish EU grants since the beginning and now that things have taken a downturn they are beginning to squirm.
« Last Edit: July 10, 2016, 02:07:28 PM by John »
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. John Lamberton exposes malfeasance by public officials.
Check out my website >   http://johnlamberton.webs.com/index.htm?no_redirect=true     The truth never changes with the passage of time.

stephen25000

  • Guest
Re: What will be the impact on British farming post Brexit?
« Reply #5 on: July 10, 2016, 01:47:52 PM »
The point is very simple, the French farmers have been loving it up on lavish EU grants since the beginning and now that things have taken a downturn they are beginning to squirm.

In case you aren't aware of it, UK farmers have benefited as well from EU grants.

Now they will have to get the money elsewhere, or go bust.

Offline John

Re: What will be the impact on British farming post Brexit?
« Reply #6 on: July 10, 2016, 02:05:41 PM »
In case you aren't aware of it, UK farmers have benefited as well from EU grants.

Now they will have to get the money elsewhere, or go bust.

Do read the OP Stephen.    The UK Gov pays the EU who pay the farmers.  Always best to lose the middleman.
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. John Lamberton exposes malfeasance by public officials.
Check out my website >   http://johnlamberton.webs.com/index.htm?no_redirect=true     The truth never changes with the passage of time.

Offline Carana

Re: What will be the impact on British farming post Brexit?
« Reply #7 on: July 10, 2016, 02:23:40 PM »
The point is very simple, the French farmers have been loving it up on lavish EU grants since the beginning and now that things have taken a downturn they are beginning to squirm.

Any reliable statistics for that, John?

Offline John

Re: What will be the impact on British farming post Brexit?
« Reply #8 on: July 10, 2016, 02:27:22 PM »
Any reliable statistics for that, John?

Not off hand but it is well documented that the French farmers get the largest share of the EU handouts.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/commodities/11858718/Only-French-farmers-will-save-us-from-the-madness-of-Europe.html
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. John Lamberton exposes malfeasance by public officials.
Check out my website >   http://johnlamberton.webs.com/index.htm?no_redirect=true     The truth never changes with the passage of time.

stephen25000

  • Guest
Re: What will be the impact on British farming post Brexit?
« Reply #9 on: July 10, 2016, 02:30:20 PM »
Do read the OP Stephen.    The UK Gov pays the EU who pay the farmers.  Always best to lose the middleman.


No guarantee for UK farmers.

Offline Carana

Re: What will be the impact on British farming post Brexit?
« Reply #10 on: July 10, 2016, 03:01:40 PM »
Not off hand but it is well documented that the French farmers get the largest share of the EU handouts.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/commodities/11858718/Only-French-farmers-will-save-us-from-the-madness-of-Europe.html

Thanks for that...

This has been caused by a slump in demand from China, Europe’s diplomatic war with Russia and the biggest fundamental problem of all: the European Union itself.

In or out of the EU, the diplomatic war with Russia doesn't concern just the EU.

I haven't examined what the slump in demand from China might be about.


Offline Carana

Re: What will be the impact on British farming post Brexit?
« Reply #11 on: July 11, 2016, 09:17:21 AM »
Historically, it seems that the main reason Thatcher managed to argue (successfully) for a rebate was because the UK had relatively few farms and therefore got less of the EU farming subsidy pie.

In theory, some of that rebate money could have been allocated to assist British farmers as needed. Perhaps there are already domestic assistance schemes - I haven't looked into it.




WHY DOES THE REBATE EXIST?

The UK won the rebate in 1984, after the then prime minister Margaret Thatcher threatened to halt payments to the EU budget.

Margaret Thatcher
Margaret Thatcher is misquoted as saying: 'I want my money back!'
"We are not asking the Community or anyone else for money," she said at a summit in Fontainebleau. "We are simply asking to have our own money back".

The UK was then the third poorest member of the Community but was on course to become the biggest net contributor to the EU budget.

This was mainly because the UK had relatively few farms, so it got a relatively small share of farm subsidies, which at the time made up 70% of Community expenditure.


The formula for determining how much a country paid into the Community budget was also unfavourable to the UK. It was in effect penalised for raising more revenue from VAT than most other member states and importing more goods from countries outside the Community.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4721307.stm

Offline Carana

Re: What will be the impact on British farming post Brexit?
« Reply #12 on: July 11, 2016, 09:21:48 AM »
You do realise that the Brazilians have to pay a customs tariff in order to export meat to the EU?  If all goes to plan you should see a drop in the price of your Rib Eye steak in the future.

Are you saying that trading under WTO or even EFTA terms, that there wouldn't be an import tariff?

If somehow a tariff-free deal could be made (which seems unlikely), how would UK cattle farmers compete with cheaper Brazilian beef?

Alfie

  • Guest
Re: What will be the impact on British farming post Brexit?
« Reply #13 on: July 11, 2016, 10:06:41 AM »
I buy meat from our local Makro and i don't see any French meat there. the best value is Brazilian Rib eye...the price of that wont change post brexit
A weak pound means that most imports will go up in price.

Offline Carana

Re: What will be the impact on British farming post Brexit?
« Reply #14 on: July 11, 2016, 11:05:52 AM »
A weak pound means that most imports will go up in price.

Indeed. And I can't imagine that changing for quite some time.

On the other hand, the weak pound could stimulate more exports for some businesses. A weak pound may well stimulate increased tourism, for example.

However, some businesses relying on third country "imports" (the use of overseas specialised labour, necessary components, or whatever) as part of the process involved in the finished export product / service may find that the extra costs cancel out, or even make the business unviable.