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[Myster]

I'm inclined to think it might belong to June but no firm evidence for this either.  It just strikes me as strange that it was a central exhibit at trial and appeal and yet it doesn't appear the defence were aware of whose blood was on it. 
 &%+((£

Aren't you inclined to think your avatar pic and text are argubably libellous?

[Holly Goodhead]

Other exhibits found in that area of the bedroom ie carpet and socks were blood tested and found to belong to June by way of her ABO grouping and 1 enzyme.  Do Caroline and David have any ideas about the bible by way of an exhibit number or blood since they seem to keen to advance various theories about it?  I think the bible must have had an exhibit number since it was exhibited at trial although I've been unable to find one (same for the socks).

DC Hammersely's trial testimony covers all exhibits he logged and removed from the bedroom including bedding, casings and rifle.  Does anyone have any explanation as to why this doesn't include the bible and socks?

Having read DC Hammersley's trial testimony again  I can see I overlooked the fact he collected and logged the bible on 9th Aug which was given the exhibit number DRH/44.

Blood staining to SC's hands:

DC Hammersley:

"Visual examination showed some slight blood staining on the back of Sheila Caffell's right hand, but apart from that the hands appeared clean and the nails in tact on both hands".

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=165.0;attach=211

Dr Vanezis from the autopsy:

"The palms and fingers were not contaminated with blood".

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=199.0;attach=668

As we know Dr V seems to contradict himself later about SC's hands/blood.

Blood staining to June's hands:

Dr Vanezis from the autopsy:

"There was blood staining also to both her hands and her head".

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=199.0;attach=684

It seems to me the blood staining on the bible most likely originated from June on the basis there's clear evidence her hands were blood stained and the bible was found on the floor in an area where other blood staining originated from June by way of blood stained socks and carpet.  The bible belonged to June and we know she was deeply religious. 

An aspect of the case against JB is that he planted the bible by staging it on or near SC.  He messed up first time around (as he did with shooting SC) and somehow caused the pages to become bloodied, opening and closing them to cause mirror staining.  And yet I can see far more evidence to suggest June carried the bible with her when she walked round the bed thus causing the blood staining from her gsw's.  As she started to lose consciousness she dropped the bible.  The perp then entered the main bedroom from the box room and as the door opened the bible concertinaed causing the blood staining to become mirrored.  We will probably never know for sure since it appears the bible either wasn't blood tested or if it was the results were withheld and JB's lawyers appeared oblivious to it. 

There's some evidence to suggest withholding by way of Paul Terzeon's letter as follows and DC Hammersley's COLP interview where he became emotional 

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=569.0;attach=1859

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=178.0;attach=431

[Holly Goodhead]

Aren't you inclined to think your avatar pic and text are argubably libellous?

Freedom of expression   

As far as I am concerned there's much evidence that GR and PT were incompetent and negligent.  Same applies to the appeal court judges but worse still they display arrogance on a breathtaking scale. 

You only have to read Mark Webster's report to witness this.  When he states in his opinion it was not a good move, or words to this effect, that EP destroyed exhibits due to advances made in forensic science they tell him quite forcibly it is not a matter for him.  And yet they want to railroad him into giving opinion where it's obvious he is not qualified.  A point he made over and over.  He beats the drum hard about setting up experiments but it all falls on deaf ears with the judges.  Instead they offer up their own opinions on matters which they were clearly not qualified in.  Frankly they sound complete dicks.

[Holly Goodhead]

Having read DC Hammersley's trial testimony again  I can see I overlooked the fact he collected and logged the bible on 9th Aug which was given the exhibit number DRH/44.

Blood staining to SC's hands:

DC Hammersley:

"Visual examination showed some slight blood staining on the back of Sheila Caffell's right hand, but apart from that the hands appeared clean and the nails in tact on both hands".

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=165.0;attach=211

Dr Vanezis from the autopsy:

"The palms and fingers were not contaminated with blood".

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=199.0;attach=668

As we know Dr V seems to contradict himself later about SC's hands/blood.

Blood staining to June's hands:

Dr Vanezis from the autopsy:

"There was blood staining also to both her hands and her head".

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=199.0;attach=684

It seems to me the blood staining on the bible most likely originated from June on the basis there's clear evidence her hands were blood stained and the bible was found on the floor in an area where other blood staining originated from June by way of blood stained socks and carpet.  The bible belonged to June and we know she was deeply religious. 

An aspect of the case against JB is that he planted the bible by staging it on or near SC.  He messed up first time around (as he did with shooting SC) and somehow caused the pages to become bloodied, opening and closing them to cause mirror staining.  And yet I can see far more evidence to suggest June carried the bible with her when she walked round the bed thus causing the blood staining from her gsw's.  As she started to lose consciousness she dropped the bible.  The perp then entered the main bedroom from the box room and as the door opened the bible concertinaed causing the blood staining to become mirrored.  We will probably never know for sure since it appears the bible either wasn't blood tested or if it was the results were withheld and JB's lawyers appeared oblivious to it. 

There's some evidence to suggest withholding by way of Paul Terzeon's letter as follows and DC Hammersley's COLP interview where he became emotional 

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=569.0;attach=1859

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=178.0;attach=431

Is there any evidence that the open pages of the bible hold any relevance to the soc?  Or are more relevant to SC than to June:

"Have mercy upon me, O God"
"Deliver me from bloodguiltiness O God, thou God of my salvation"
"My heart is sore pained within me: and the terrors of death are fallen upon me"

Could it be said that one could open any page of the bible and find 'meaning' with soc akin to horoscopes?

[Myster]

Is there any evidence that the open pages of the bible hold any relevance to the soc?  Or are more relevant to SC than to June:

"Have mercy upon me, O God"
"Deliver me from bloodguiltiness O God, thou God of my salvation"
"My heart is sore pained within me: and the terrors of death are fallen upon me"

Could it be said that one could open any page of the bible and find 'meaning' with soc akin to horoscopes?

They've no relevance.  It isn't a handwritten suicide note.

[Holly Goodhead]

They've no relevance.  It isn't a handwritten suicide note.

I think it's unlikely the open pages have any relevance at all.  I don't believe the pages represent a suicide note of sorts or the handwritten note inside is a suicide note. 

[scipio_usmc]

Having read DC Hammersley's trial testimony again  I can see I overlooked the fact he collected and logged the bible on 9th Aug which was given the exhibit number DRH/44.

Blood staining to SC's hands:

DC Hammersley:

"Visual examination showed some slight blood staining on the back of Sheila Caffell's right hand, but apart from that the hands appeared clean and the nails in tact on both hands".

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=165.0;attach=211

Dr Vanezis from the autopsy:

"The palms and fingers were not contaminated with blood".

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=199.0;attach=668

As we know Dr V seems to contradict himself later about SC's hands/blood.

Blood staining to June's hands:

Dr Vanezis from the autopsy:

"There was blood staining also to both her hands and her head".

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=199.0;attach=684

It seems to me the blood staining on the bible most likely originated from June on the basis there's clear evidence her hands were blood stained and the bible was found on the floor in an area where other blood staining originated from June by way of blood stained socks and carpet.  The bible belonged to June and we know she was deeply religious. 

An aspect of the case against JB is that he planted the bible by staging it on or near SC.  He messed up first time around (as he did with shooting SC) and somehow caused the pages to become bloodied, opening and closing them to cause mirror staining.  And yet I can see far more evidence to suggest June carried the bible with her when she walked round the bed thus causing the blood staining from her gsw's.  As she started to lose consciousness she dropped the bible.  The perp then entered the main bedroom from the box room and as the door opened the bible concertinaed causing the blood staining to become mirrored.  We will probably never know for sure since it appears the bible either wasn't blood tested or if it was the results were withheld and JB's lawyers appeared oblivious to it. 

There's some evidence to suggest withholding by way of Paul Terzeon's letter as follows and DC Hammersley's COLP interview where he became emotional 

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=569.0;attach=1859

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=178.0;attach=431

You ignore the mirror blood stains.  For your claim to be true June would have to have handled the book with her bloody hands without getting any blood on the pages except a few drips, for it to have closed, to reopen it to the same page again not getting any blood on the outside of the Bible but then finally getting a palm print on the pages.  Why would June carry it to the other side and put it face down?  Worse still how could it fall face down and then Sheila's blood leak underneath it?  It was placed on top of the pool of Sheila's blood.


The most simple answer is Jeremy stuck this in th epool of her blood and that is where the largest stain came from.

[Holly Goodhead]

You ignore the mirror blood stains.  For your claim to be true June would have to have handled the book with her bloody hands without getting any blood on the pages except a few drips, for it to have closed, to reopen it to the same page again not getting any blood on the outside of the Bible but then finally getting a palm print on the pages.  Why would June carry it to the other side and put it face down?  Worse still how could it fall face down and then Sheila's blood leak underneath it?  It was placed on top of the pool of Sheila's blood.

The most simple answer is Jeremy stuck this in th epool of her blood and that is where the largest stain came from.

Blood staining exists all over the bible.  The largest stain is on page 656.  Some claim this stain represents a palm print.  If June carried her bible with her when she walked round the bed and dropped it I've no idea exactly how she held it.  Do you know?  I don't believe June put it face down.  I believe she dropped it and it fell haphazardly.

You don't know whose blood was on the bible since none of it was tested, or if it was the blood test results appear to be unknown, and this in itself should set the alarm bells ringing.

Where's the evidence SC's blood leaked underneath the bible or it was placed on a pool of SC's blood?  Have you seen an image of the carpet without SC's body and bible present?

[Holly Goodhead]

Blood staining exists all over the bible.  The largest stain is on page 657.  Some claim this stain represents a palm print.  If June carried her bible with her when she walked round the bed and dropped it I've no idea exactly how she held it.  Do you know?  I don't believe June put it face down.  I believe she dropped it and it fell haphazardly.

You don't know whose blood was on the bible since none of it was tested, or if it was the blood test results appear to be unknown, and this in itself should set the alarm bells ringing.

Where's the evidence SC's blood leaked underneath the bible or it was placed on a pool of SC's blood?  Have you seen an image of the carpet without SC's body and bible present?

I just realised Scipio I misread your post above.  I thought you said "You ignore the minor stains".  I realise now you said "You ignore the mirror stains".  I haven't ignored the mirror stains I've given one explanation above. 

[rotti]

Blood staining exists all over the bible.  The largest stain is on page 657.  Some claim this stain represents a palm print.  If June carried her bible with her when she walked round the bed and dropped it I've no idea exactly how she held it.  Do you know?  I don't believe June put it face down.  I believe she dropped it and it fell haphazardly.

You don't know whose blood was on the bible since none of it was tested, or if it was the blood test results appear to be unknown, and this in itself should set the alarm bells ringing.

Where's the evidence SC's blood leaked underneath the bible or it was placed on a pool of SC's blood?  Have you seen an image of the carpet without SC's body and bible present?

is there an image of it

[scipio_usmc]

I just realised Scipio I misread your post above.  I thought you said "You ignore the minor stains".  I realise now you said "You ignore the mirror stains".  I haven't ignored the mirror stains I've given one explanation above.

where?  Or was the comment June dropped it how you are saying it closed and then she reopened it to the same page?


Scenario:  June's hands are covered in blood.  She somehow opens the Bible without getting any blood on the outside despite her hands covered in blood.  She just gets a few drips and then it closes.  She reopens it to the same page again getting no blood on the outside yet after it is open and the mirror blood stains are formed she gets a palm print.


This doesn't sound right there should have been blood on the outside well before the closing if handled by blood covered hands.   

[Caroline]

I think it's unlikely the open pages have any relevance at all.  I don't believe the pages represent a suicide note of sorts or the handwritten note inside is a suicide note.

Neither do I but the handwritten note has been confirmed to be June's handwriting.

[Holly Goodhead]

is there an image of it

If there is I haven't seen it.

[Holly Goodhead]

where?  Or was the comment June dropped it how you are saying it closed and then she reopened it to the same page?

Scenario:  June's hands are covered in blood.  She somehow opens the Bible without getting any blood on the outside despite her hands covered in blood.  She just gets a few drips and then it closes.  She reopens it to the same page again getting no blood on the outside yet after it is open and the mirror blood stains are formed she gets a palm print.

This doesn't sound right there should have been blood on the outside well before the closing if handled by blood covered hands.

From my post up thread about the mirror staining:

"And yet I can see far more evidence to suggest June carried the bible with her when she walked round the bed thus causing the blood staining from her gsw's.  As she started to lose consciousness she dropped the bible. The perp then entered the main bedroom from the box room and as the door opened the bible concertinaed causing the blood staining to become mirrored.  We will probably never know for sure since it appears the bible either wasn't blood tested or if it was the results were withheld and JB's lawyers appeared oblivious to it".

June sustained a gsw to her right forearm where the bullet exited meaning she had two gsw's to her arm.  In addition to these gsw's she sustained 6 other gsw's where 2 of the bullets exited.  In total she sustained 10 gsw's to her body/head by way of entry and exit wounds.  At what stage her hands became bloodied I've no idea but at autopsy the pathologist confirms they were bloody.  Jean Boutell provided testimony confirming the bible in question was kept on June's bedside cabinet.  RB provided testimony confirming June read the bible in bed.  I don't know the exact location of the bible when June fell asleep on 6th/7th Aug eg bedside cabinet or her bed or whether or not it was open or closed and if open on which page.  It is a well know fact June was a deeply religious person to the extent that she required psychiatric treatment due to a distortion of her strong religious beliefs.  It's plausible that when she walked round the bed she did so clutching her bible believing that God would comfort and help her.  The bible holds much significance for individuals and institutions.  It is the reason swearing of oaths whilst holding the bible takes place in English courts:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-24588854

The oath, still sworn by witnesses and defendants as they hold a holy book, has given the English language one of its most familiar sentences.

"I swear by Almighty God [to tell] the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth."

[Holly Goodhead]

You can just about see the bible in the following image in relation to the half open door.  Imo it is plausible that the perp entered the main bedroom from the box room and when they opened the door it caused the bible to concertina up and this is what caused the mirroring of the blood.