MADELEINE'S DNA - definitive study.

[Robittybob1]

Martin Brunt’s transcript:

“I’ve learnt some important detail of the forensic test results and they rather explain perhaps why the Portuguese Police are so confident in their theory that Madeleine’s parents one or other of them, played a part in their daughter’s death. The details are these that the samples that came back last week after a British test in the UK, the samples produced 3 matches of Madeleine’s DNA. Now in the apartment, Police found 1 full match on a window seal, a full match of Madeleine’s DNA. That’s perhaps not so important because Madeleine of course had been staying there for the best part of a fortnight with her parents. Now in the hire car which was hired 5 weeks after Madeleine’s disappearance, the tests have shown a partial match of Madeleine’s DNA, which might be explained by transfer onto clothes or other paraphernalia that the family were still using 5 weeks on, but this is the crucial thing, In the car the scientists have also found another, a second full match and Police say that is the most damning evidence that’s been returned by these forensic test results and It shows as far as they are concerned, the presence of Madeleine’s body in the hire car 5 weeks, at least 5 weeks after she disappeared. And as I said, this begins to explain I think why the Police are so adamant about their theory and this of course is part of the evidence that the Prosecutor here will start considering we think in the morning”.

https://youtu.be/u3HQ74Rfdbk

What does it say in the Lowe report about the DNA found on the window seal? (where was this seal?)

The words window seal don't come up in the right context in the report. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/JOHN_LOWE.htm

[Mr Gray]

Martin Brunt’s transcript:

“I’ve learnt some important detail of the forensic test results and they rather explain perhaps why the Portuguese Police are so confident in their theory that Madeleine’s parents one or other of them, played a part in their daughter’s death. The details are these that the samples that came back last week after a British test in the UK, the samples produced 3 matches of Madeleine’s DNA. Now in the apartment, Police found 1 full match on a window seal, a full match of Madeleine’s DNA. That’s perhaps not so important because Madeleine of course had been staying there for the best part of a fortnight with her parents. Now in the hire car which was hired 5 weeks after Madeleine’s disappearance, the tests have shown a partial match of Madeleine’s DNA, which might be explained by transfer onto clothes or other paraphernalia that the family were still using 5 weeks on, but this is the crucial thing, In the car the scientists have also found another, a second full match and Police say that is the most damning evidence that’s been returned by these forensic test results and It shows as far as they are concerned, the presence of Madeleine’s body in the hire car 5 weeks, at least 5 weeks after she disappeared. And as I said, this begins to explain I think why the Police are so adamant about their theory and this of course is part of the evidence that the Prosecutor here will start considering we think in the morning”.

https://youtu.be/u3HQ74Rfdbk

What does it say in the Lowe report about the DNA found on the window seal? (where was this seal?)

The words window seal don't come up in the right context in the report. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/JOHN_LOWE.htm

window sill

[Robittybob1]

window sill

The words "window sill"  or sill on its own are not in the Lowe report either.

[Carana]

The words "window sill"  or sill on its own are not in the Lowe report either.

No. Brunt was given given inaccurate information.

I didn't see it personally, but the BBC apparently reported the same information on the news at the time.

[Mr Gray]

No. Brunt was given given inaccurate information.

I didn't see it personally, but the BBC apparently reported the same information on the news at the time.

quite simply where did brunt get his information from

[sadie]

quite simply where did brunt get his information from

Good question.  Was someone feeding false info to Brunt ?

[Carana]

Picking up on a previous post of mine as I think I may have just had a eureka moment. lol

The person interviewed calls them "markers". Some do, but others call the individual components alleles. I've stuck to markers to mean the locations where they look to identify the 2 alleles. In the UK, they look at 10 markers (20 alleles).

The person interviewed wouldn't have known that the so-called "damning" evidence was a mixed soup - she was just answering in general terms.

ETA: The question seems to have been whether the DNA could have belonged to one of the siblings - hence her answer.

There's nothing more in that than we've discussed in this thread.


This quote of GA's has mystified me for years. I couldn't even work out what it was that he seems to have misunderstood... He apparently didn't understand that it was a mixed sample.

GA: The reports from the English labs… the English reports arrive shortly before the questionings that were scheduled. And it contained certain conclusions, if they thought they were inconclusive they shouldn’t have mentioned it, the question of the 15 alleles in a profile of 19 from the little girl, stating that they match Madeleine McCann, but they also say that it could have been a construction let’s say from various donors, from other persons, a contamination could have produced Madeleine McCann’s profile by coincidence. But there are no excuses for saying that it is not from Madeleine McCann because they held the profiles of the father, the mother, the siblings, therefore there are no doubts that at least within that family they only matched Madeleine McCann’s.
http://madeleinemccann.org/blog/2014/04/20/goncalo-amaral-the-interviews-july-08/

[Mr Gray]

Picking up on a previous post of mine as I think I may have just had a eureka moment. lol

The person interviewed calls them "markers". Some do, but others call the individual components alleles. I've stuck to markers to mean the locations where they look to identify the 2 alleles. In the UK, they look at 10 markers (20 alleles).

The person interviewed wouldn't have known that the so-called "damning" evidence was a mixed soup - she was just answering in general terms.

ETA: The question seems to have been whether the DNA could have belonged to one of the siblings - hence her answer.

There's nothing more in that than we've discussed in this thread.


This quote of GA's has mystified me for years. I couldn't even work out what it was that he seems to have misunderstood... He apparently didn't understand that it was a mixed sample.

GA: The reports from the English labs… the English reports arrive shortly before the questionings that were scheduled. And it contained certain conclusions, if they thought they were inconclusive they shouldn’t have mentioned it, the question of the 15 alleles in a profile of 19 from the little girl, stating that they match Madeleine McCann, but they also say that it could have been a construction let’s say from various donors, from other persons, a contamination could have produced Madeleine McCann’s profile by coincidence. But there are no excuses for saying that it is not from Madeleine McCann because they held the profiles of the father, the mother, the siblings, therefore there are no doubts that at least within that family they only matched Madeleine McCann’s.
http://madeleinemccann.org/blog/2014/04/20/goncalo-amaral-the-interviews-july-08/

Which is proof amaral misunderstood the dna and based his theories on a misunderstanding of the evidence

[slartibartfast]

Which is proof amaral misunderstood the dna and based his theories on a misunderstanding of the evidence

IMO the PJ would have been in touch with FSS to clarify.

[Mr Gray]

IMO the PJ would have been in touch with FSS to clarify.

from memory the results were explained to amaral by someone from the portuguese forensic servives...Carana has posted this before...amaral it seems chose to ignore the explanation and reach his own conclusions. I will check with Carana for the cite.

The results from the FSS are quite clear and easily understood

[Carana]

IMO the PJ would have been in touch with FSS to clarify.

Erm, I wouldn't be too sure about that.

For the FSS, LP was the client and therefore results and emails went via LP (Stuart Prior, presumably).

Later, once Rebelo had taken over, Corte Real, Paiva and the two PJ forensic guys went over to the FSS (from memory, November 07).

(Not related, except to an earlier post on this thread, I did manage to confirm from the Op Task* strategy debrief paper that LP did indeed pay for the FSS tests - I'd thought so, but wasn't certain.)

*Correction.

[Mr Gray]

Amaral should realise now he was wrong so why is he still spouting the same inaccuracies

[Carana]

from memory the results were explained to amaral by someone from the portuguese forensic servives...Carana has posted this before...amaral it seems chose to ignore the explanation and reach his own conclusions. I will check with Carana for the cite.

The results from the FSS are quite clear and easily understood

Actually, I don't know about that.

What I do know is that Corte Real said the same basic thing as Lowe (although in a more complicated way) in GA's "documentary".

Otherwise, there's his "we, policemen, experts..." quote about a thawing body being speculation but the only explanation, which I don't find terribly reassuring.

[Mr Gray]

Actually, I don't know about that.

What I do know is that Corte Real said the same basic thing as Lowe (although in a more complicated way) in GA's "documentary".

Otherwise, there's his "we, policemen, experts..." quote about a thawing body being speculation but the only explanation, which I don't find terribly reassuring.

That's what I was referring to...so Corte Real understood which confirms the Portuguese were told the correct results it's just that amaral did not understand them...when the explanation really was quite simple

[barrier]

Erm, I wouldn't be too sure about that.

For the FSS, LP was the client and therefore results and emails went via LP (Stuart Prior, presumably).

Later, once Rebelo had taken over, Corte Real, Paiva and the two PJ forensic guys went over to the FSS (from memory, November 07).

(Not related, except to an earlier post on this thread, I did manage to confirm from the Op Grange strategy debrief paper that LP did indeed pay for the FSS tests - I'd thought so, but wasn't certain.)

Do you mean Op Task debrief?