Moving door - 9:05 check

[Eleanor]

No evidence of an open window or raised shutters at 9:30 so your abduction theory is not credible.

Nothing is credible, according to you, who actually has credibility..

[Robittybob1]

But I don't think that they did.  That was the whole point.  They didn't forget.

The next most simple one beyond forgetting where the door was left was Gerry's explanation was that Madeleine had got up and put herself back to bed.

[Robittybob1]

Their balcony is set back both from the road and the rear of the building.  The roof of 5A sticks out further as well.

Even if the Moyes stood, they couldn't see anyone passing the side of 5A, nor across 5A gate, nor up the steps.

Because of 6A hedge obstructing their view, neither could they see anyone, including Jane T,  who passed up that road on the westerly pavement unless, maybe, if the person was walking very near the kerb.

Maybe, maybe not, they could see Gerry and Jez talking on the edge of the Westerly pavement/in the gutter ... if they looked at the correct time.

If they looked at the right time, then they could see Jez before he crossed the road to chat with Gerry


The chances of either of the last things are quite remote.

To be quite frank, imo, they didn't see anyone from the Tapas group.  They couldn't, their line of vision being blocked even standing up

I appreciate that post Sadie.  I think the things you say are easily checked on the ground at PDL if we actually get there.  The timing aspect is most important, Gerry and Jez would have finished their conversation by 9:15 according to Gerry.  So Jez's idea that they kept talking for up to 15 minutes is not supported by the Moyes testimony.  If they did continue talking it wasn't in earshot of the Moyes couple.  There does seem to be time missing in Gerry's statement if you try to explain it fully.  Maybe 4 - 8 minutes of unexplained time.  I'll have to study this on a separate thread (Is Jez trying to give Gerry an alibi for this time too?)

[sadie]

No evidence of an open window or raised shutters at 9:30 so your abduction theory is not credible.

Matt commented that the room was lighter than he expected, so had it already happened? ... was Madeleine already gone? ...  a lull in the gusty weather so the curtains did not move?  Like the lull before the storm?

[Miss Taken Identity]

The next most simple one beyond forgetting where the door was left was Gerry's explanation was that Madeleine had got up and put herself back to bed.

She must have floated onto that bed because it just doesn't look like it had been slept in... from the pictures.

[Robittybob1]

She must have floated onto that bed because it just doesn't look like it had been slept in... from the pictures.

The police do describe an indentation I suppose consistent with someone lying there.  I agree it does look rather neat, but it happens sometimes.

[barrier]

Matt commented that the room was lighter than he expected, so had it already happened? ... was Madeleine already gone? ...  a lull in the gusty weather so the curtains did not move?  Like the lull before the storm?

How could he know what to expect?

[Brietta]

How could he know what to expect?

He described what he saw as he saw it.

[barrier]

He described what he saw as he saw it.

He thought there was more brightness in the room than his own daughters,not that he  expected to see it dark.

[Robittybob1]

Matt commented that the room was lighter than he expected, so had it already happened? ... was Madeleine already gone? ...  a lull in the gusty weather so the curtains did not move?  Like the lull before the storm?

Thinking about it, if the shutters raised up high enough for someone to attempt to climb through, and the drape curtains pushed back just leaving the net curtains covering the window that would not just be a little lighter than his own child's bedroom but massively lighter. 
Therefore IMO the attempted entry had not yet occurred.

The difference is definitely something that can be measured and compared.

[barrier]

Thinking about it, if the shutters raised up high enough for someone to attempt to climb through, and the drape curtains pushed back just leaving the net curtains covering the window that would not just be a little lighter than his own child's bedroom but massively lighter. 
Therefore IMO the attempted entry had not yet occurred.

The difference is definitely something that can be measured and compared.

Where and by whom is it stated that the shutters were partially or even raised.Matt Oldfield Rogatory 9/04/2008.

So I didn't specifically see the shutters and I couldn't say that they were definitely open, but certainly the curtains were shut and everything was quiet'.

[Robittybob1]

Where and by whom is it stated that the shutters were partially or even raised.Matt Oldfield Rogatory 9/04/2008.

I have 4 people who state they saw the shutters were up, Kate, Gerry, Amy, and Rachael.

[barrier]

I have 4 people who state they saw the shutters were up, Kate, Gerry, Amy, and Rachael.

That's after the alleged abduction ,you were replying to a post prior to the alleged event.

[Robittybob1]

That's after the alleged abduction ,you were replying to a post prior to the alleged event.

I was answering your question: "Where and by whom is it stated that the shutters were partially or even raised."

[Miss Taken Identity]

Where and by whom is it stated that the shutters were partially or even raised.Matt Oldfield Rogatory 9/04/2008.

So if the curtains were shut, they were not blowing ( and they are heavy curtains) then the shutters could not have been open.

Easy to dismiss the theory an abductor/ burglar entered the apartment by this method- on that apartment -on that night at that tiny time frame.