Author Topic: Is It Possible To Work Out Time Of Death ?  (Read 804 times)

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Offline mrswah

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Re: Is It Possible To Work Out Time Of Death ?
« Reply #15 on: May 27, 2017, 12:14:55 PM »
Since Joanna WAS murdered, it cannot be ruled out that she DID retrace her steps, went into one or more bars in the hope of getting "picked up", and met her killer that way. She may even have bought the pizza AFTER having a conversation with him, and AFTER having agreed to meet him again later.

Cant believe , for a moment, that Joanna was even thinking about "being picked up", although I wouldn't rule out the possibility that she might have gone into other bars looking for someone she knew, with whom to spend the evening, or part of the following day----and I do mean platonically, just in case you're wondering!

Offline Leonora

Re: Is It Possible To Work Out Time Of Death ?
« Reply #16 on: May 27, 2017, 12:40:25 PM »
Cant believe , for a moment, that Joanna was even thinking about "being picked up", although I wouldn't rule out the possibility that she might have gone into other bars looking for someone she knew, with whom to spend the evening, or part of the following day----and I do mean platonically, just in case you're wondering!
I think you are going to need to explain yourself. Isn't "being picked up" the right terminology? We are told that Joanna had exhausted the possibilities of meeting the few men whom she already knew in Bristol, so what phrase would you use to describe going into a bar in the hope of meeting someone new whom she didn't know? Why should it be platonic? Her mother stated that Joanna had had other boyfriends before Greg. Just because Rebecca Scott was her best friend doesn't mean that Joanna would necessarily have confided to her if she and Greg were no longer "the real deal".

Joanna and Greg were not married. Why do you think looking for a new boyfriend should reflect badly on her? Nine's discovery of other venues than the jury were told about whose CCTV the police checked has opened up the possibility that her walk through Bristol was not as straightforward as I had so firmly believed.

Offline AerialHunter

Re: Is It Possible To Work Out Time Of Death ?
« Reply #17 on: May 27, 2017, 06:00:44 PM »
Journey home ..Part 2....

So now I believe I have established a more likely route home.... The  timings now become very different... That's why I wanted to start with what we have known from the "Tesco's CCTv.. That she leaves Tesco's at 8:40pm..

This is the only Time Stamp in all of the CCTV's that we have been made aware of....

So her Journey will start from Tesco's....

* Tesco's .... 8:40 pm

* Bargain Booze... 8 42pm...

She has to be in "Bargain Booze for at least 5 mins... and my reasoning for this is because she gets one bottle of cider , then looks at her phone... which her mother said in a "Documentary".. because her mother expressed how it made her smile when she went back to get the other bottle of cider... Then she needs to go to the counter and pay...
One thing we don't consider is did she get served straight away???? Or was there another customer before her??? We don't know??? But I'll stay with her being served straight after she has got the second bottle of Cider.. for now...

* Leaves "Bargain Booze at 8:47 pm

Journey from Bargain Booze home...  10 mins to Canygne square walking ....

* Reaches Canygne Square at 8:57 pm

Then she is a couple of mins if that to Canygne Road.... This is where The Priest meets her in the street... If they pass pleasantaries.. that would be another couple of minutes..

*Canygne Road 8:59 pm

After talking to the priest for two minutes we could gauge....

 she reached her front door at 9:02pm


That makes a huge difference already....  because of the time that is left for Dr Vincent Tabak to commit this crime...

She then needs to take off her coat... put shopping in Kitchen... Put her "Rusksack" on dining room Table..Open a bottle of cider..... Take Pizza out of packaging and put in the oven...

* To do these actions will take time... 5 mins roughly

This will now bring us to:9:07 pm She has to put the TV on..  be next in the kitchen.. Where she can see Dr Vincent Tabak passing Kitchen window.. At what must be 9:09 pm .. when she opens the door to Dr Vincent Tabak....

I haven't at this point even added the change of  Clothes she was found wearing when discovered around Longwood Lane .. which differ from the clothes she has on in the "Ram"..!!

Where he has to take his coat off... and go into the kitchen for his 10 minutes flirty chat..... I'll stop there for a minute... Now whether we believe Dr Vincent Tabak's version of how these events played out.... He at that time on entering the flat... would have had NO IDEA.. as to what Joanna Yeates Journey home was like .. Or at what time she had arrived home... "A Vital detail..  (IMO).. So 9:09 pm has to be the earliest Dr Vincent Tabak comes into contact with Joanna yeates ... (IMO).. Because she has put things away etc....

If The Prosecution has Dr Vincent Tabak in his Fat for an hour before he went to ASDA... That means he has to be in his own flat at 9:13 pm as the Defence say he ultimatley went to Asda at 10:13 pm

That would leave Dr Vincent Tabak; Approx 4 MINUTES to Flirt.. Kill.. move from Kitchen to bedroom.. go home come back... move her to his flat... get his car off the street... put her in the boot and leave for ASDA at 10:13pm

But is that what the Defence mean when they say he Utimatley went to ASDA at 10:13pm... Is that the actual time he arrives at ASDA??? I say this ...Because he go in and out of ASDA Twice....

So if a Journey to Bedminster is around 10 mins... Dr Vincent Tabak was last in his house at 10:03pm

Lets go back a minute... If Dr Vincent Tabak is in his house for 1 hour before he goes to ASDA... then the time an hour before is .... 9:03 pm

By My Calculations.. Joanna Yeates has only just reached her home at 9:02pm... so how was it possible for Dr Vincent Tabak to kill her ???

Playing devils advocate.. If we say he saw her outside her house... dragged her into his flat killed her there .... he still would need to know where she puts her rucksack when she comes home.... Maybe pour out some beer if you want to add that... But why bother.. why not just take all her shopping and Put it in a BIN.... He could have got her keys and returned them to her flat with her belongings.. but he didn't need to take the shopping back if we believe this scenario.. And you would still need the reason for attacking her in the first place...

So if we go with what the DEFENCE Said... she let him in.. they chatted and was flirty for 10 mins... he made an advance on her... he screamed and he attacks her....

The time is not available for this (IMO)... Also all the "Screams that were heard" are before 9:00pm I think... Which would mean that she screamed in the street before actually reaching home...And Dr Vincent Tabak would not have seen her in her kitchen window ...(IMO)..

So we still haven't established the time of death... but i believe we are getting a little closer.....

If I take you back to... 9:07 pm... when her shopping is put in kitchen.. and before we think she has seen Dr Vincent Tabak... we need the time to change her clothes...say that takes 5 mins ... The earliest time that Dr Vincent Tabak could possibly see Joanna Yeates in her kitchen window is.. 9:12pm... Back to the Prosecution of Dr Vincent Tabak was in his house for 1 hour before he went to ASDA....

If he either sets of to ASDA at 10:13pm or is Actually at ASDA at 10:13 pm.... he literally cannot have come across Joanna Yeates at all..... (IMO)...

Well argued and very well put together. Impressed.
There is none so noble or in receipt of his fellows unbridled adulation as that police officer who willingly deceives to protect one of his own kind and, by virtue of birthright, extends that privilege to his family.

Offline mrswah

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Re: Is It Possible To Work Out Time Of Death ?
« Reply #18 on: May 27, 2017, 08:55:28 PM »
I am referring to Leonora's post: for some reason, my laptop will not let me "quote" at the moment!

I agree that there is no way of knowing how close Joanna and Greg really were, but there is no evidence to suggest that they were not, or that she would be looking for a "pick up"  as soon as his back was turned.

She was, by all accounts, an outgoing and popular girl, and she might well have dropped into other bars looking for a platonic friend with whom to have supper/spend part of the weekend. She might even have known that one or more of her friends/acquaintances were going to be in a certain bar at the time she left the Ram. Seems perfectly plausible to me. it's all speculation anyway, and I reckon this theory is as good as any other!

Offline mrswah

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Re: Is It Possible To Work Out Time Of Death ?
« Reply #19 on: May 27, 2017, 08:58:33 PM »
From what my daughters tell me, if you are living with a bloke, and you go out looking for another one when your live in partner is away for the weekend, that is bad!!  Doesn't matter whether or not you are married, apparently, not these days. Living with a partner is seen as a real commitment!

Offline nina

Re: Is It Possible To Work Out Time Of Death ?
« Reply #20 on: May 27, 2017, 10:16:09 PM »
Nine on the second picture of Joanna at the Ram pub, I don't think that the "time stamp" is missing. It looks to me as though it was to the right of the date stamp and it's been pixilated out. Mind you my eyes are not what they were.

Offline ......

Re: Is It Possible To Work Out Time Of Death ?
« Reply #21 on: May 28, 2017, 12:12:19 AM »
Nine on the second picture of Joanna at the Ram pub, I don't think that the "time stamp" is missing. It looks to me as though it was to the right of the date stamp and it's been pixilated out. Mind you my eyes are not what they were.

Hi Nina... When I say missing... what I really mean is exactly what you have just said... Pixeled out... They all have on all the Timestamps... So no-one can accuratly state what time what event took place... Why would they need to hide these time stamps??

Think one of my favourite Missing Time stamps has to be ASDA... because I cannot tell what two times Dr Vincent Tabak was supposed to have arrived... they gave the impression that it was about 5 minutes apart... But...

I believe it is quite possible that they were miles apart... he enters on one Visit wearing all black... Next visit he is wearing a RED top... go figure... they must think we are all blind as well... as well as Gullible ....  8)--))

Offline nina

Re: Is It Possible To Work Out Time Of Death ?
« Reply #22 on: May 28, 2017, 09:56:15 AM »
Nine where are the pictures of VT in ASDA?

Offline mrswah

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Re: Is It Possible To Work Out Time Of Death ?
« Reply #23 on: May 28, 2017, 10:19:49 AM »
Nine where are the pictures of VT in ASDA?

If you google "Vincent Tabak CCTV in ASDA" you will find them. I think they are on You Tube too.