Author Topic: CMTV Gonçalo Amaral - O Enigma - with English subtitles  (Read 230842 times)

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Offline Lace

Re: CMTV Gonçalo Amaral - O Enigma - with English subtitles
« Reply #570 on: June 12, 2017, 10:03:24 AM »
In the area of the wardrobe?

Dirty washing could have been piled up at the side of the wardrobe.

Offline barrier

Re: CMTV Gonçalo Amaral - O Enigma - with English subtitles
« Reply #571 on: June 12, 2017, 10:16:20 AM »
Dirty washing could have been piled up at the side of the wardrobe.

That's a new one.
This is my own private domicile and I shall not be harassed, biatch:Jesse Pinkman Character.

Offline Mr Gray

Re: CMTV Gonçalo Amaral - O Enigma - with English subtitles
« Reply #572 on: June 12, 2017, 10:16:40 AM »
Why were the dogs brought in
Because it was possible Maddie had died in the apartment
We knew this before the dogs
« Last Edit: July 09, 2017, 04:32:28 PM by John »

Offline Brietta

Re: CMTV Gonçalo Amaral - O Enigma - with English subtitles
« Reply #573 on: June 12, 2017, 01:33:45 PM »
In the area of the wardrobe?

I've read enough to know that scent pools.  Martin Grime described how.

Apparently there was one area at the sofa  which may have provided forensic explanation of why both dogs alerted; an area from which the the scent may also have pooled at the corner in the bedroom.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline misty

Re: CMTV Gonçalo Amaral - O Enigma - with English subtitles
« Reply #574 on: June 12, 2017, 01:51:25 PM »
I've read enough to know that scent pools.  Martin Grime described how.

Apparently there was one area at the sofa  which may have provided forensic explanation of why both dogs alerted; an area from which the the scent may also have pooled at the corner in the bedroom.

Nobody ever looked inside the sofa, though.

Offline Robittybob1

Re: CMTV Gonçalo Amaral - O Enigma - with English subtitles
« Reply #575 on: June 12, 2017, 08:39:29 PM »
Nobody ever looked inside the sofa, though.
What about down the back of the sofa?  It happens quite often someone sitting on a sofa will lose something out of their pocket and it may have slipped down the back of the sofa.
Moderation
John has instructed all moderators to take a very strong line with posters who constantly breach the rules of this forum.  This sniping, goading, name calling and other various forms of disruption will cease.

Offline Mr Gray

Re: CMTV Gonçalo Amaral - O Enigma - with English subtitles
« Reply #576 on: June 12, 2017, 08:43:40 PM »
There could be lots of reasons why teh dogs alerted...amaral seems to think there is only one so he is wrong to make that connection...he did get quite a bit wrong

Offline Eleanor

Re: CMTV Gonçalo Amaral - O Enigma - with English subtitles
« Reply #577 on: June 12, 2017, 08:46:05 PM »
There could be lots of reasons why teh dogs alerted...amaral seems to think there is only one so he is wrong to make that connection...he did get quite a bit wrong

A lot wrong?  In my opinion.  Actually all of it.

Offline Robittybob1

Re: CMTV Gonçalo Amaral - O Enigma - with English subtitles
« Reply #578 on: June 12, 2017, 08:48:42 PM »
A lot wrong?  In my opinion.  Actually all of it.
Not all of it; he got the date right.
Moderation
John has instructed all moderators to take a very strong line with posters who constantly breach the rules of this forum.  This sniping, goading, name calling and other various forms of disruption will cease.

Offline Brietta

Re: CMTV Gonçalo Amaral - O Enigma - with English subtitles
« Reply #579 on: June 12, 2017, 09:13:40 PM »
Nobody ever looked inside the sofa, though.

The precedent being the key fob in the Renault door pocket. An apparently legitimate alert by the cadaver dog ... but forensically determined to be cellular material from an identified living individual and not cadaver.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline pathfinder73

Re: CMTV Gonçalo Amaral - O Enigma - with English subtitles
« Reply #580 on: June 12, 2017, 11:19:16 PM »
Keela also alerted in the boot where in many other missing person cases a body has been. If you think investigators ignore boot alerts in missing person cases then you are seriously deluded.
Smithman carrying a child in his arms checked his watch after passing the Smith family and the time was 10:03. Both are still unidentified 10 years later.

Offline Mr Gray

Re: CMTV Gonçalo Amaral - O Enigma - with English subtitles
« Reply #581 on: June 12, 2017, 11:22:55 PM »
Keela also alerted in the boot where in many other missing person cases a body has been. If you think investigators ignore boot alerts in missing person cases then you are seriously deluded.

they dont ignore them they investigate them...in this case there was no corroborating evidence so the alerts do not point to cadaver odour...it really is taht simple...there are a lot of deluded people but those that understand that these alerts have no evidential value are not part of that group.

its probably a mistake by you to start referring to posters as deluded

Offline Brietta

Re: CMTV Gonçalo Amaral - O Enigma - with English subtitles
« Reply #582 on: June 13, 2017, 02:15:40 AM »
Keela also alerted in the boot where in many other missing person cases a body has been. If you think investigators ignore boot alerts in missing person cases then you are seriously deluded.

Was anything of any forensic import found anywhere in the hire car?  No-one seems particularly sure, particularly the Portuguese investigators tasked with collecting the evidence.

There was absolutely no blood found inside the car ... and what Keela pointed at in the boot area appears shrouded in mystery.

I think there is an inherent dishonesty in promoting videos of the dogs allegedly alerting to a vehicle which contained absolutely no trace of Madeleine apart from shared characteristics with her parents and siblings.  Not forgetting the key fob contaminated with cellular material definitely not Madeleine's.

Snip
The Renault Scenic vehicle ? number plate 59-DA-27 was removed to the third floor of the underground car park and was subjected to a forensic search by officers from the Scientific Police Laboratory and another sniffer dog inspection that began at 03.49 on 7th August by the dog KEELA, which detected human blood remains, the following results were noted:

03.53 ? the dog ?marked? a zone on the right inferior side of the inside of the luggage compartment of the vehicle;


Snip
Finally, a minutely detailed search was made for eventual blood vestiges and any other biological vestiges in the interior of the vehicle.

From the observations made inside the vehicle several areas were detected containing stains that appeared to be of haematic origin, they were subjected to tests looking for peroxide existing in blood using the Kastle-Mayer test, all of them reacted negatively.

A general search was also made looking for blood vestiges from more expectable parts of the interior of the vehicle (the jack, accelerator pedal, hand break, door handles, car key, vehicles controls etc) which underwent the same test looking for peroxide by the Kastle-Mayer test, all reacted negatively.

No blood or biological vestiges were found in this test.


Snip
After the examination of the vehicle was complete the human blood specialist sniffer dog was introduced along with Martin Grime of the British police who coordinated the dog?s movements. After a few moments Mr Grime informed the team that they should collect the key and other materials from zone M or from the interior of the luggage compartment given the fact that the dog in reference had identified these materials as places where eventual blood vestiges existed. The undersigned gathered these materials placing them in paper envelopes with the following references:

10. Parts of the vehicle luggage area.
12. Vehicle ignition key.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/59-DA-27.htm


Snip
A mixed, low-level DNA result, that appeared to be from at least two persons, was obtained from a second area of the baggage compartment plastic (286C/2007-CRL /10(2)). This sample was submitted for tests to obtain DNA profiles through LCN.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/JOHN_LOWE.htm


So nothing from the boot area worth writing home about ... it is also instructive to take note of the number of individuals who hired the vehicle and the number of passengers they carried from the spring of 2007 until the McCanns hired it twenty three weeks down the line.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline pathfinder73

Re: CMTV Gonçalo Amaral - O Enigma - with English subtitles
« Reply #583 on: June 13, 2017, 09:04:55 AM »
Forensics concluded that 3-5 persons could have made up the DNA. Bottom line - Keela alerted to one person's blood so nothing is ruled out.
Smithman carrying a child in his arms checked his watch after passing the Smith family and the time was 10:03. Both are still unidentified 10 years later.

Offline Innominate

Re: CMTV Gonçalo Amaral - O Enigma - with English subtitles
« Reply #584 on: June 13, 2017, 09:25:10 AM »
The precedent being the key fob in the Renault door pocket. An apparently legitimate alert by the cadaver dog ... but forensically determined to be cellular material from an identified living individual and not cadaver.

Would you expect to find cellular material from a cadaver on the key fob?

I'm not up to speed on the dog alerts, but, if my understanding is correct, the cadaver 'scent' are compounds given off from a decomposing body. These adhere to surfaces and may be transferred from place to place.

It does not appear that these VOCs and DNA have to be in the same place.

If this is correct then the VOCs could transfer to somebody's hand and then transfer to the key fob. Any DNA found could be from the person who transferred the VOCs.

By the same token if Madeleine's DNA had been found in the apartment I do not see how that would prove the cadaver scent, if it existed, belonged to Madeleine, because you would expect to find Madeleine's DNA in the apartment.

The dogs appear to be a tool to raise 'suspicions' to be investigated, but can do little more than that.